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View Full Version : LIGHT GRIP...FOLLOW-THRU...STAY DOWN!!



JimS
11-08-2003, 07:05 PM
If you are at all interested in building a firm foundation for your game then the cover of the new Inside Pool ought to say a lot to you, or at least it did to me.

Check out Jeremy's position. The cue ball is almost out of the picture and where is Jeremy? Why he's still down on the shot with only his eyes following the cb. He ain't movin!! Not till the ob is down and/or the cb has stopped rollin.

And his grip hand? I'd say that it's just about the right pressure for holding a small bird....which is how I've heard correct grip pressure expressed...."Master..how tightly should I grip the cue? Well Grasshopper you hold the cue just about as tightly as you would hold a small bird".
/ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Billy
11-08-2003, 07:19 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JimS:</font><hr> If you are at all interested in building a firm foundation for your game then the cover of the new Inside Pool ought to say a lot to you, or at least it did to me.

Check out Jeremy's position. The cue ball is almost out of the picture and where is Jeremy? Why he's still down on the shot with only his eyes following the cb. He ain't movin!! Not till the ob is down and/or the cb has stopped rollin.

And his grip hand? I'd say that it's just about the right pressure for holding a small bird....which is how I've heard correct grip pressure expressed...."Master..how tightly should I grip the cue? Well Grasshopper you hold the cue just about as tightly as you would hold a small bird".
/ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif <hr /></blockquote>

good advice

you don't want to hurt the little bird just tight enough to hold him secure

and just to take your signature line a bit further ... it is not enough to aim,you must hit

jmo

Rick the stick
11-08-2003, 08:01 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JimS:</font><hr>

Oh hell, fl has been teaching and preaching that one for a decade, nothing new dude. Where have you been, eveyone steals his stuff and then say's, look what I came up with.
Lookie Lookie, what a good boy am I? /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

bluewolf
11-09-2003, 06:37 AM
SET-PAUSE-FINISH=FREEZE Randy G

JimS
11-09-2003, 07:34 AM
What is the "set" part of his formula? I'm not clear on that and....

When is the pause recommended...right before the actual stroke or at the back of the actual stroke......like Buddy?

bluewolf
11-09-2003, 07:54 AM
The SET is the pause at the cueball before the final stroke and follow. The pause is at the backswing before the final follow. Allison Fisher has a long one of these. Some people have a short one. Scott Lee teaches the set but not the pause, perse. If I am paraprasing Scott correctly, he said there is a slight pause when you change/move muscle groups in the upper arm(not muscleing the ball just movement of those muscles).

The set pause finish freeze is on my tshirt I got from Randy gs poolschool.

Just repeating what I learned from these instructors to the best of my ability. Maybe one of them will chime in with more specifics or if I did not say it quite right.

Laura

JimS
11-09-2003, 08:02 AM
Thanks. I understand what you are trying to communicate.

Take practice strokes. Set (take a pause for final aim), back stroke, pause, stroke the cb.

Thanks, Jim....been doing that just like CC told me to!

randyg
11-09-2003, 10:51 AM
For only a decade?....randyg

randyg
11-09-2003, 11:00 AM
Hi Jim:

SET-PAUSE-FINISH are the three terms describing the non-moving positions of your cue. Very easy to learn the stroke this way.

SET at the cueball to aim.

PAUSE at the final backstroke to transfer direction smoothly. By the way, all pool players have to pause at the back stroke, some just smoother than others.

FINISH your stroke to your "home" position which insures that you accelerate through the cue ball in a straight line.

Pool School makes it sound way too easy......randyg

Sid_Vicious
11-09-2003, 11:15 AM
I've adopted both Buddy's and Scott's pauses, one at the CB, a brief but deliberate set and pause, and the back pause like Buddy's, very deliberate and longer, allowing the sensations of the feelings of well planted feet plus the well seated feeling of my overall foundation. It's then a matter of trusting my stroke, which has been welded into my memory due to a relentless Kinnister drill. It helps to watch both Buddy and Allison stroke and individualize the length of the back pause to your own style. Force longer pauses, count 1-thousand-o-n-e-e, 1-thousand-t-w-o-o-o AFTER YOU'RE COCKED AND READY, let the stroke flow on t-o-o-o. It sounds hoaky but I've found that it lets the cue travel smoothly through the swing. You don't have to keep the mantra forever, but it helps to revisit that method when your timing starts to suck...sid~~~doesn't teacup grip, has found a pressure at the thumb and forefinger only that works quite well, NOW if I can just learn to stay down :-(

bluewolf
11-09-2003, 01:14 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote randyg:</font><hr> Hi Jim:

SET-PAUSE-FINISH are the three terms describing the non-moving positions of your cue. Very easy to learn the stroke this way.

SET at the cueball to aim.

PAUSE at the final backstroke to transfer direction smoothly. By the way, all pool players have to pause at the back stroke, some just smoother than others.

FINISH your stroke to your "home" position which insures that you accelerate through the cue ball in a straight line.

Pool School makes it sound way too easy......randyg <hr /></blockquote>

The FREEZE has helped me too a lot, more specifically to not bob up in the middle of the stroke or move the head. When you have had this drilled into you for three straight days like I did in pool school, It is very hard to not freeze.

I see a lot of pretty good players miss shots because they do not freeze. Such a 'simple' thing, which I imagine could make them quite a bit better if they did it.

Laura

pooltchr
11-09-2003, 04:20 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_ViciousNOW if I can just learn to stay down :-( [/quote:</font><hr>

Sid, That's the "Freeze" part of Set Pause Finish Freeze

Rick the stick
11-10-2003, 12:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote randyg:</font><hr> Hi Jim:

SET-PAUSE-FINISH are the three terms describing the non-moving positions of your cue. Very easy to learn the stroke this way.

SET at the cueball to aim.

PAUSE at the final backstroke to transfer direction smoothly. By the way, all pool players have to pause at the back stroke, some just smoother than others.

FINISH your stroke to your "home" position which insures that you accelerate through the cue ball in a straight line.

Pool School makes it sound way too easy......randyg <hr /></blockquote>

Randy, there is no pause on the backswing of 99% of the pro golfers and there was no pause on the backswing of HOPPE, Greenleaf or Mosconi, I'll be happy to send you films of their swings so you can see this first hand. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

dmgwalsh
11-10-2003, 05:48 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> It's then a matter of trusting my stroke, which has been welded into my memory due to a relentless Kinnister drill. <hr /></blockquote>

Which Kinister drill? Shot number one? number two? Thanks. Dennis

bluewolf
11-10-2003, 06:05 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rick the stick:</font><hr>
Randy, there is no pause on the backswing of 99% of the pro golfers and there was no pause on the backswing of HOPPE, Greenleaf or Mosconi, I'll be happy to send you films of their swings so you can see this first hand. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

The pause, imo, is an individual style thing,as far as how long of a pause. ww likes a good pause at this backswing while I do not use a perceptable one because this allows my brain to screw up my stroke. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif. A significant pause is just long enough for my thinking brain to go into gear and screw up the shot.


If I am paraprasing randy correctly from poolschool, there is a transfer of muscle groups which will produce an imperceptable pause (even Scott admits this, just does not advocate a long one), Even in those who dont do this intentionally. Perhaps this happens with each preshot stroke.

Both Allison Fisher and Karen Corr have a very long pause.But then, all of the snooker players who are now playing nine ball that I have watched appear to have this pause. Most of the men pros (not counting those who started in snooker) appear to not have adiscernable pause,but a few do, although I cannot recollect their names.

Now snooker folks, I stand to be corrected. I only know what I have observed since I have not seen all of you play.

Sorry to disagree-just call me a randy g groupie. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Laura

TomBrooklyn
11-10-2003, 06:06 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JimS:</font><hr>"...you hold the cue about as tightly as you would hold a small bird".<blockquote><font class="small">Quote rick the stick:</font><hr>Oh hell, fl has been teaching and preaching that one for a decade, nothing new dude. <blockquote><font class="small">Quote randyg:</font><hr> For only a decade?<hr /></blockquote>I got some instruction from the talented virtuoso Fast Larry, and sure enough, he did say that to me. However, that was only about a year ago. Who was the first person to teach this principle?

TomBk

pooltchr
11-10-2003, 07:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rick the stick:</font><hr> Randy, there is no pause on the backswing of 99% of the pro golfers and there was no pause on the backswing of HOPPE, Greenleaf or Mosconi, I'll be happy to send you films of their swings so you can see this first hand. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Just a little physics here...I recall learning somewhere that any moving object that is reversing direction will have to come to a complete stop first. It can't be moving forward and backward at the same time. It's just a matter of how long that stop (pause) is. It DOES exist. This is true for a golf swing, a pool stroke, or any object that is changing direction 180 degrees.

randyg
11-10-2003, 05:15 PM
Rick: You and I apparently have a different meaning of the phrase "Pause". The Instructor's meaning is quite simple. To "pause" is the transfer or the transition of your weapon and your muscles from one direction to 180 degrees in the other direction. Found in "Newtons Laws of Physics". All poolplayers &amp; golfers that I have watched still fall under those laws......randyg

randyg
11-10-2003, 05:20 PM
I can only go back to 1965. My Instructor taught that to me and we have had it in our Pool School ever since. Probably dates back to the original pool origins....randyg

Steve - Detroit
11-10-2003, 08:08 PM
You have me beat by about 5 years Randy. First time I heard that expression was on a golf course though. An oldtimer that we were playing with noticed the death grip I held on the putter and used that exact analogy. He could easily have been a pool player however, the two games seem to appeal to the same type of people.

randyg
11-10-2003, 08:45 PM
Hi Steve. I think that it applies to both sports also. You seem to be very right. In our circle, most pool players are golfers also. I have had and continue to have several PGA golf Pros come through Pool School....randyg

JimS
11-11-2003, 06:52 AM
Our local municipal coursePGA pro is best known around here for being an ex road pool player. He won't even pick up a stick these days. We're friends from when I was obsessed with golf and he will NOT play any pool. ?????? Must have gotten his thumbs broke or sumthun. /ccboard/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Fred Agnir
11-11-2003, 10:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rick the stick:</font><hr>

Oh hell, fl has been teaching and preaching that one for a decade, nothing new dude. Where have you been, eveyone steals his stuff and then say's, look what I came up with.
Lookie Lookie, what a good boy am I? /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
<hr /></blockquote> Only a decade? Must mean he took the idea from someone else, right? Thought so.

Fred

CarolNYC
11-12-2003, 05:54 AM
[ QUOTE ]
still down on the shot with only his eyes following the cb. He ain't movin!! Not till the ob is down and/or the cb has stopped rollin <hr /></blockquote>
Hi Jim,
Im training with Tony Robles at this time and would get frustrated because every time I would start running a rack, I'd get anxious and wind up missing the 7,8 or 9-why-jumped up-staying down on that shot and waiting for balls to stop is so very important!
Have a great day!
Carol:)