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Qtec
11-11-2003, 09:44 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Israel barrier 'will cause harm'
Israel's West Bank security barrier will cause serious human suffering, the UN has said in a report.
The report says that the barrier will separate almost 700,000 Palestinians from their farms, jobs and schools.

Israel rejects the report - which is says is inaccurate - and argues that the barrier is necessary to prevent suicide bombers from entering Israel.

The BBC's David Chazan in Jerusalem says the route, not the barrier itself, is the cause of controversy.

Route dispute

The UN Office for the Co-Ordination of Humanitarian Affairs - the agency that wrote the report - and Israel disagree about how much Palestinian land will be separated from the bulk of the West Bank by the barrier.


The UN says it will carve off 14.5% of the West Bank and affect 680,000 Palestinians.
But a senior Israeli Foreign Ministry official told the Reuters news agency it will cut off no more than 4%, leaving only 14,000 Palestinians west of the barrier.

Critics charge that the barrier - which is to be a combination of fence and wall - does not follow the existing border between Israel and the West Bank, known as the Green Line.

They say it represents a land grab by Israel, designed to influence future political boundaries.

Israel rejects the allegation, saying it is for security only. They say a similar barrier has prevented any suicide bombers from entering Israel from the Gaza Strip.

'Inaccurate'

The government says the new UN report is based on an inaccurate idea of the route of the fence, and does not take into account that it will have gates so Palestinians can get to and from their homes.


An earlier UN report in September condemned the barrier as a land grab, and the UN General Assembly has criticised it.
Israel says the General Assembly has an anti-Israel bias due to its large Muslim and Arab membership.

The barrier, which is not yet completed, is expected to be about 700 kilometres long.

Tuesday's report makes no mention of suicide bombings or the Palestinian uprising that has been going on for more than three years.


<hr /></blockquote>

This is ironic.


As long as there is a wall there will be no peace.

Its strange that considering all the money the US gives to Isreal they have no say in what they do with it.

I would also like to say that most Isrealis do not agree with whats happening . The Army has taken over the power and this is the result. A Palestinian [ they are not all terrorists] cant visit his wife/ mother without permission.
The wall is also being built in Jerusalem, the first time for a thousand years.
They [ the Military] only have to shout 'Security'or ' War on Terrorism" and they can do anything they want.

The frightening thing is , its going the same way in the USA.

Q

Qtec
11-11-2003, 09:51 AM
I wasnt going to post this but in the light of GW,s hard stance on the nuclear proliferation issue, here goes.

[ QUOTE ]
Israel deploys nuclear arms in submarines

Peter Beaumont in London and Conal Urquhart in Jerusalem
Sunday October 12, 2003
The Observer

Israeli and American officials have admitted collaborating to deploy US-supplied Harpoon cruise missiles armed with nuclear warheads in Israel's fleet of Dolphin-class submarines, giving the Middle East's only nuclear power the ability to strike at any of its Arab neighbours.
The unprecedented disclosure came as Israel announced that states 'harbouring terrorists' are legitimate targets, responding to Syria's declaration of its right to self-defence should Israel bomb its territory again.

According to Israeli and Bush administration officials interviewed by the Los Angeles Times, the sea-launch capability gives Israel the ability to target Iran more easily should the Iranians develop their own nuclear weapons.

Although it has been long suspected that Israel bought three German diesel-electric submarines with the specific aim of arming them with nuclear cruise missiles, the admission that the two countries had collaborated in arming the fleet with a nuclear-capable weapons system is significant at a time of growing crisis between Israel and its neighbours.

According to the paper, the disclosure by two US officials is designed to discourage Israel's enemies from against launching an attack amid rapidly escalating tensions in the region following a raid by Israeli jets on an alleged terrorist training camp near the Syrian capital, Damascus.


<hr /></blockquote>

web page (http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,1061381,00.html)

eg8r
11-11-2003, 10:29 AM
I don't see the homicide bombers stopping anytime soon. If we had a bunch of Mexicans constantly homicide bombing Texas wanting their land back, you can be sure we would do something about it.

[ QUOTE ]
I would also like to say that most Isrealis do not agree with whats happening . <hr /></blockquote> So, where did you get this information?

[ QUOTE ]
A Palestinian [ they are not all terrorists] cant visit his wife/ mother without permission.
<hr /></blockquote> Eventhough not all Palestinians are terrorists, all the terrorists have been Palestinian. And until the Palestinian "authorities" can control their people, I think there should be even tougher restrictions.

[ QUOTE ]
The frightening thing is , its going the same way in the USA.
<hr /></blockquote> I would do my part in helping build a wall. What a blessing it would be for our tax system if we did not have all those illegal Mexicans and Cubans running around eating for free and getting pregnant. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

eg8r &lt;~~~Probably guess Q and the rest will not read the word illegal and guess I am referring to all cubans and Mexicans

eg8r
11-11-2003, 10:31 AM
Interesting.

eg8r

11-11-2003, 10:38 AM
Certainly what the Palestinian people need is 24 hr curfew. Israel should also be doing more to destroy the Palestinian infrastructure. I mean, if the Police in Gaza and the west bank can't stop terrorism, than Israel should blow up their police stations. If we have so many "homicide" bombings now when people aren't even allowed to leave there homes, imagine what would happen if Israel let Palestinians have some sort of freedom!

I also agree with the targeted killings commited by Israel on suspected terrorists. I mean, you can't waste time with sending these barbarians to trial. You just got to take them out. If you kill an innocent Palestinian here and there, so be it. That's the price they pay for being in close relation to terrorist organizations.

The methods used by Israel to stop Palestinian terrorism is obviously working, just like the U.S.'s war on drugs is stopping the use of drugs. Both of the wars should be continued until the enemy is completely defeated.

Qtec
11-11-2003, 10:49 AM
[ QUOTE ]
if Israel let them have some sort of freedom!
<hr /></blockquote>

Ever thought WHY people are prepared to die, to leave their families,their children?

IMO you have to be pretty desperate to do such a thing.

Imagine if GW asked the US soldiers in Iraq to do the same thing.

Tell me, how many volenteers do you think you would get.

Its a given fact, a man who defends his home is worth 20 attackers. He,s got nothing to lose.

This is whats happening to the Palestinians, they are losing hope.

You beat a dog long enough he will turn on you.Put it in a cage and poke it with a sharp stick every day and it will attack anybody the first chance it gets.

Q

Wally_in_Cincy
11-11-2003, 10:55 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> You beat a dog long enough he will turn on you.Put it in a cage and poke it with a sharp stick every day and it will attack anybody the first chance it gets.

Q

<hr /></blockquote>

like fast larry

eg8r
11-11-2003, 10:59 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Imagine if GW asked the US soldiers in Iraq to do the same thing.

Tell me, how many volenteers do you think you would get.

Its a given fact, a man who defends his home is worth 20 attackers. He,s got nothing to lose.
<hr /></blockquote> Was the question asked theoretical, because I somehow feel it does not apply. The US soldiers are not in Iraq defending their homes. Now if you would like to revisit the Revolutionary War then that would make more sense. At which point I will note, those men did everything they could to defeat the english.

eg8r

11-11-2003, 11:04 AM
[ QUOTE ]
like fast larry <hr /></blockquote>

With the exception of myself, fast larry guninger is the closest thing to God that a human being can ever hope to see.

cheesemouse
11-11-2003, 11:19 AM
Hello Fast...I knew there was a simple explaination to your lunacy....you are omni present...and nuts to boot......Hehehehe /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Wally_in_Cincy
11-11-2003, 11:38 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote thenewmessiah:</font><hr> With the exception of myself, fast larry guninger is the closest thing to God that a human being can ever hope to see. <hr /></blockquote>

Then the Apocalypse is surely just over the horizon.

http://www.americainprophecy.com/images/armageddon.jpg

I feel a terrible storm brewing. An ill wind......

Qtec
11-11-2003, 11:50 AM
Exactly. You would do the same if it was your home, your family, your childrens future.

Q

11-12-2003, 11:47 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly. You would do the same if it was your home, your family, your childrens future. <hr /></blockquote>

First of all Eg8r is a noble christian, and would not perform any such barbaric acts.

Second of all, As long as the Palestinian Authority fails to curb homicide bombings Israel has the right to attack anything or anyone within Palestinian territory.

Thirdly, Your more sentimental than a woman. You need to stop worrying about the lives of Palestinians. If they get fenced in, or put under 24 hr curfew so be it. Giving freedom to people who blow themselves up is a truly absurd idea.

Qtec
11-12-2003, 03:24 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote thenewmessiah:</font><hr> &lt;/font&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;font class="small"&gt;Quote:&lt;/font&gt;&lt;hr /&gt;
Exactly. You would do the same if it was your home, your family, your childrens future. <hr /></blockquote>

First of all Eg8r is a noble christian, and would not perform any such barbaric acts. <font color="red"> ??? </font color>

Second of all, As long as the Palestinian Authority fails to curb homicide bombings Israel has the right to attack anything or anyone within Palestinian territory. <font color="red"> Or. 'So long as Israel continues to attack anything or anyone inside Palestinian territory, there will contine to be suicide bombings'.Tit for tat gets you nowhere. IMO its the fanatics on both sides that are the problem. </font color>

Thirdly, Your more sentimental than a woman. You need to stop worrying about the lives of Palestinians. <font color="red"> Well thats a very Christian attitude I must say!</font color> If they get fenced in, or put under 24 hr curfew so be it. <font color="red"> If you keep building fences eventually you fence yourself in. </font color> Giving freedom to people who blow themselves up is a truly absurd idea. <hr /></blockquote> <font color="red"> Maybe if they had freedom they wouldnt be blowing themselves up. /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif </font color>

Q

11-12-2003, 04:05 PM
[ QUOTE ]
IMO its the fanatics on both sides that are the problem. <hr /></blockquote>

There are no fanatics on the side of Israel. Israel is simply protecting THEIR country, just as we are protecting our national security by going to war with Iraq. The Iraqi war, I might add, has been incredibly successful in reducing terrorism, and has also greatly increased the quality of life for the iraqi people.

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe if they had freedom they wouldnt be blowing themselves up. <hr /></blockquote>

Here you are simply wrong. Arab's love blowing themselves up.
The only solution is to make the security fence taller, and stronger. Look at how successful the Berlin wall was; the palestinian threat could easily be eliminated with a simple piece of architecture.

eg8r
11-12-2003, 04:41 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Or. 'So long as Israel continues to attack anything or anyone inside Palestinian territory, there will contine to be suicide bombings'.Tit for tat gets you nowhere. IMO its the fanatics on both sides that are the problem <hr /></blockquote> Who came first the chicken or the egg?

eg8r &lt;~~~A noble Christian

11-12-2003, 04:44 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Who came first the chicken or the egg? <hr /></blockquote>

Obviously the chicken.

11-12-2003, 05:06 PM
Violence against Palestinians may give a lot of people trouble unless they know what was going on. The people in the land of Palestine are very wicked. They are given over to idolatry; they sacrifice their children; they have all kinds of abominable sex practices; they are having sex, apparently, with animals; they are having sex men with men, and women with women; they are committing adultery, fornication; they are worshipping idols, offering their children up; and they are forsaking God.

If the Palestinians stay in Israel and reproduce, in 30 or 40 or 50 or 60 or 100 more years, 10,000 would go to a 100,000 -- 100,000 could conceivably go to a million. And then, there would be a million people who would have to spend eternity in Hell! And it's far more merciful to take away a few than to see in the future a 100 years down the road, and say, 'Well, I have to take away a million people that would forever be apart from God, ' because the abomination is there like a contagion.

Qtec
11-13-2003, 07:43 AM
Do you have any facts to support your ranting?

[ QUOTE ]
And then, there would be a million people who would have to spend eternity in Hell! <hr /></blockquote>

What makes you think that you wont be there with them?


You call yourself a Christian, dont you? This means that you believe in Jesus Christ, or not? This might blow your mind but did you know the Iraelis[ people of the Jewish faith] do not believe that Jesus was the Messiah.

This makes Jesus a false prophet!!!!!

The Catholics see the Pope as G-ds representative on earth.

The Hindus have many G-ds.

Isnt Religion all about doing the right things and not doing the wrong things?

Unlike you, I believe we should all concentrate on what we have in common, not the differences otherwise you can argue forever.
Moslims, Protestants, Christians, Catholics and Jews all believe in the same G-d, dont they?

Q