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myselfofcourse
11-17-2003, 09:36 AM
I'm doing research for my college speech class. I need feedback on whether or not 8 ball is a better game than 9 ball. I also need a few reasons why, which ever game is better than the other. Thanks.

pooltchr
11-17-2003, 10:21 AM
You are going to get a lot of opinions on this question, but probably not an answer. Players have different reasons for preferring one over the other. The amount of luck involved, different strategies, even different reasons for playing. I would thing tournament players probably lean toward 9-ball since most tournaments are 9 ball. People who play on leagues might prefer 8-ball because that is what they play most of the time. Some are going to say that 14.1 is the best game. The truth is there is no "better" game. Both are completely different, but one is not better than the other. Personally, I like 9-ball better, but I REALLY would rather see it changed to 10-ball.

Cueless Joey
11-17-2003, 11:18 AM
9 ball is a better game because both players play the same layout.
9 ball requires more skill because the shooter has to play shape for the next and only ball. In 8-ball, a player can be "off-line" for the ball he played shape for, turn around 180 degrees and play another ball in his group.
Not on 9-ball. If you are off-line, you either play safe or shoot a tough shot to get to the next ball.
9-ball can also be easily handicapped between two players with varying skills. For example, a weaker player can be given "money balls" like the 7 ball or the 8 ball. Meaning if he pockets his money ball, he wins. This is not practical in 8-ball.
More people play 8-ball than 9-ball b/c due to the popularity of coin-operated bar boxes.
My 2 cents.

UWPoolGod
11-17-2003, 11:35 AM
Seems to me that I have two different worlds in pool. When I play in Seattle it is 9ball on 9footers. When I am in Vancouver it is 8ball on bar-boxes. Not many 9footers in Vancouver (i.e. poolhalls), so the players are in the bars. And we don't put up $0.50 each rack of 9ball around here, that would get expensive.

I like them both for their due challenge. Esp. 8ball on a 7footer...what a mess. But also like the ease of playing 9ball on a 9footer. Can move the cueball without interference.

cycopath
11-17-2003, 12:12 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr>Personally, I like 9-ball better, but I REALLY would rather see it changed to 10-ball. <hr /></blockquote>

Why is that? Just curious.

RedHell
11-17-2003, 12:16 PM
[ QUOTE ]
9 ball is a better game because both players play the same layout. <hr /></blockquote>

I have never played the same layout as my opponent in any game. Every time I get to the table my opponent has always made at least one ball move wich creates a different layout !!!

[ QUOTE ]
9 ball requires more skill because the shooter has to play shape for the next and only ball. <hr /></blockquote>

Though I understand your point, I think you fail to consider that as there is more room on the table, the position requires less precision.

I've always seen 9-ball as a potters game. The only position skill, IMO, is to make sure you see the next one.

[ QUOTE ]
In 8-ball, a player can be "off-line" for the ball he played shape for, turn around 180 degrees and play another ball in his group. <hr /></blockquote>

True, but he sill still need to get back to that line to sink the ball !!!

[ QUOTE ]
9-ball can also be easily handicapped between two players with varying skills. For example, a weaker player can be given "money balls" like the 7 ball or the 8 ball. Meaning if he pockets his money ball, he wins. This is not practical in 8-ball. <hr /></blockquote>

I've handicap people the same way in 8-ball, I'm not talking about taking the ball off the table, but I've played game where my opponent needed only 5 balls down before shooting on the eight, leaving the remaining 2 on the table. Am I the only one doing this ?

All in all, each game requires different skills, what will make a game better for you might make the same game worst for the otherone because you do not share appreciation of the same skills requirement.

IMO, the best game is always the one you win !!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Ryan
11-17-2003, 12:56 PM
Of the two choices provided, I would not say that 8-ball is a "better" game than 9-ball, but I would say that it presents a greater mental challenge.

A detractor might mention that the increased number of choices would make 8-ball the easier game, but these choices create the need for an increased level of strategy than a rack of 9-ball. In 9-ball, the shot selection pattern is predetermined, so that strategic element is eliminated. The increased "traffic" on the table due makes the play more challenging as well.

I have seen many a decent 9-ball player perform at a less-competitive level in 8-ball, but I have rarely seen the opposite. The only exception that I have seen is when a person is an excellent shot maker, but is lacking precision in the position game.

pooltchr
11-17-2003, 01:55 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote cycopath:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr>Personally, I like 9-ball better, but I REALLY would rather see it changed to 10-ball. <hr /></blockquote>

Why is that? Just curious. <hr /></blockquote>

Two reasons. Making a 10 on the break is far less likely than making the 9 on the snap. And run-outs seem much more difficult. I don't know why, but that extra ball on the table really makes it tougher.

cycopath
11-17-2003, 02:25 PM
I was watching the 10 ball ring game video from the Southern Billiards Tournament. And it seemed like it was hard for anyone to make a ball on the break. I thought maybe that was why the interest in 10 ball.
And you are right about the 10 not wanting to drop. The taped match is 12 hours long, I'm about 9 hours into it, and I think I've seen one 10 ball on the break.

Perk
11-17-2003, 02:40 PM
Not sure the exact statistic, but suppossedly when Pro's play 9ball, the person that breaks doesnt win more than 50% of the time......So what is the huge deal about switchin to 10ball? Seems like it would just make the advantage even larger for the person racking. IMO

Rick the stick
11-17-2003, 03:02 PM
Is a red head better than a blond, a ford better than a chevey, a bud better than a mick, the answer varies depending on who you talk to.

All I play any more is 8 ball because it is like straight pool and it is a fairer game than 9 ball, less luck and more skill involved to win.

The only reason I ever played 9 ball for was to gamble and win money off of you fast and I rarely tried to run out on you, I was a combo short rack ride the 9 ball Kamakazie player, a true ball banger, or at least that was what you thought you had on your hands at the time.

It is harder to string racks of 9 ball than 8 ball because the shots are longer and harder. It is a nice subject you brought up and realize the majority of the opinions on this board will favor 9 ball because that is all most of the board people that are younger now play only 9 ball and that's the only game they really know. Most of them do not have a world that gets outside of that narrow box they are in.

If you want to learn how to play great 8 ball, then learn how to play 14.1 as well. Dont mess wit da stick, mess with my wa and it ain't pretty /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Rick the stick
11-17-2003, 03:08 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote UWPoolGod:</font><hr> Seems to me that I have two different worlds in pool. When I play in Seattle it is 9ball on 9footers. When I am in Vancouver it is 8ball on bar-boxes. Not many 9footers in Vancouver (i.e. poolhalls), so the players are in the bars. And we don't put up $0.50 each rack of 9ball around here, that would get expensive.

I like them both for their due challenge. Esp. 8ball on a 7footer...what a mess. But also like the ease of playing 9ball on a 9footer. Can move the cueball without interference. <hr /></blockquote>


The solution to this is to rack up 9 ball and play one game, then rack up 6 balls and play the game ball the 15, then who ever wins the most games of the two wins the set, solves the problem and makes it a cool challenge. Don't mess wit da stick, mess with my wa it ain't pretty. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 05:49 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote myselfofcourse:</font><hr> I'm doing research for my college speech class. I need feedback on whether or not 8 ball is a better game than 9 ball. I also need a few reasons why, which ever game is better than the other. Thanks. <hr /></blockquote>

I vote for one pocket. Position skills, shooting skills, banks, kicks, advanced safety play are all required.

Now if I could get my hubbie to play it with me. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Laura

Sid_Vicious
11-18-2003, 08:01 AM
You lose too much stroking abilities with the stunted, pulled pokes by using 1-pocket as a primary game, unless 1-p is your only game, maybe 14.1 still fits the 1-p stroke in several ways...nine and eight, uh-uh. Otherwise I ain't giving up my general stroke to play 1-pocket to the efficiency it would require...takes too much away from my other games proficiencies...sid~~~finds it automatic to answer someone, "Do you play one pocket?" NO!

Oh I forgot to answer the 8 and 9-ball question. Nineball is more challenging except for the slop being allowed. Eight has too many reprieves for getting out of line with all of the 7 balls to choose from. Now 15 rotation would be a fine choice but you don't see it anymore.

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 08:13 AM
Even short shots can be executed with a follow and freeze. Then there are the times when a long difficult cut can be performed. Not all 1-p players use a bunt for a stroke.

How would it be possible for someone to use advanced kicking and banking if they did not have a stroke?

Scott Lee, Chris Cass, 1p champ and others perhaps can answer more on this, since they are better at 1-p than I am.

Just because a person likes 1-p best does not mean they do not play other pool games well too, IMO.

Chime in experts.

Fred Agnir
11-18-2003, 08:13 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> Now 15 rotation would be a fine choice but you don't see it anymore. <hr /></blockquote>. I think the scoring is unfair, because the tougher balls score less points. Here's a suggestion in the way I've played rotation. Play it backwards, starting with the 15 first. Sometimes, it's more fun. Sometimes, not.

Fred &lt;~~~ just a variation, that's all

NH_Steve
11-18-2003, 10:18 AM
Naturally I think one Pocket is the best /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif Perhaps the very best thing about it is the dynamic strategy between opponents. One Pocket is less you against the table, and more you against your opponent than any other pool game, IMHO. That's why it is often compared to chess. Not that the strategy is up to the level of chess, but the dynamic move against move is definitely there in One Pocket more than other pool games. Oh, not there aren't little safety and strategy battles in 8-Ball and 9-Ball, but it's a whole different level in One Pocket.

I find it curious that those who criticize One Pocket are generally those that don't really play One Pocket /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif Try asking players that actually are proficient at all games what the 'best game' is, and you get alot more One Pocket /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 11:00 AM
Steve,

I do not understand this reputation of 1-p of poking or bunting (that is baseball /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif) of shots.

There is one time I poke stroke and it is not in one pocket. It is a long stretch across the table with a very long bridge and my grip on the butt end, when the shot and position is easy and speed or firmness of hit is not needed. Some would use the bridge, but I do not like to if I can make the ball and shape another way (stetching, climbing on the table, off handed, etc).

Lots of people I know who play 1-p are also good at 9-ball,8-ball etc. In fact, there is a very good instructor here who teaches very proper fundamentals and position, but 1-p is his favorite game.

I like the strategy of it. I learned safety plays in 1-p which carried over to other games, also and it got me working that much harder on my kicks and banks too.

Laura

cycopath
11-18-2003, 12:20 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr>I vote for one pocket.
Now if I could get my hubbie to play it with me.<hr /></blockquote>

Why does WW not want to play with you? Seems to me he should indulge you in your new found interest in 1P. Maybe he's scared of a butt-whoopin'. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 03:40 PM
Lots of people like ww like a fast paced game.

Significantly slow that pace down and many of these get very irritated, to say the least. In 1-p, if a slower paced game with lots of mental moves does not frustrate you, you do better at it, providing adequate pool ability.

That is how I see it.

Laura

Cueless Joey
11-18-2003, 04:07 PM
One pocket is a delight to watch if the two players can really play.
But, when two scrubs who can't bank a lick, it's a pain to watch.
I can't play it. It's too cerebral for me.

cycopath
11-18-2003, 04:20 PM
That pretty much sums up any cue sports game. It's annoying to watch two people bang the balls around trying to slop in something.

Cycopath&lt;-- Just one notch above the people described above.

nAz
11-18-2003, 04:56 PM
I find 9ball to be much more challenging then 8b the position play has to be way more accurate, then again 8ball last pocket can be harder to run out on then 9B .

10 ball is the way to go /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Sneakster
11-19-2003, 11:22 AM
I say the bigger the table, with the more balls to run out in order, with the tighter pockets, the better!

piglit
11-21-2003, 06:52 AM
Yes.

Ralph S.
11-21-2003, 12:13 PM
I feel its a toss-up. I play both and like both equally, although I am probably a little bit stronger at eight ball vs. nine ball.