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tateuts
11-17-2003, 05:46 PM
Those of you who have taken lessons from Scott Lee know that he has great teaching skills. He could easily have been a first class school teacher or professor.

My story is that I used to play a lot, quit playing for 20 years, and decided to get back into the sport about a year ago. I like my game, but I want to be more consistent in competition.

Can Scott teach an advanced player? You bet he can.

We went through my whole game for about 4 hours. He pretty much checked over everything. I felt fortunate that he didn't want to change my stroke or mechanics, but he showed me a few things that added some weapons to the arsenal. Namely, he set me up with options for a pre-shot routine and he taught me a neat little soft stroke that is a great offensive and defensive weapon. He also showed me some pressure drills. These helped almost immediately in the tournament we had the next day.

This part is hard to describe, but he gave me a fresh approach on various ways to play shape. I asked him about ways of hitting shots for shape, and he pointed out to me how he viewed the angles. His approach is positive and simple. As a result, he has developed reliable ways to help pressure proof the game.

It was great having a very experienced, knowledgeable, professional instructor over for a session. I can't wait until I have time to practice and totally assimulate Scott's suggestions into my game.

Scott's a straight shooter who's not afraid to tell it like it is.

Chris

Barbara
11-17-2003, 07:32 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> Those of you who have taken lessons from Scott Lee know that he has great teaching skills. He could easily have been a first class school teacher or professor.

My story is that I used to play a lot, quit playing for 20 years, and decided to get back into the sport about a year ago. I like my game, but I want to be more consistent in competition.

Can Scott teach an advanced player? You bet he can.

We went through my whole game for about 4 hours. He pretty much checked over everything. I felt fortunate that he didn't want to change my stroke or mechanics, but he showed me a few things that added some weapons to the arsenal. Namely, he set me up with options for a pre-shot routine and he taught me a neat little soft stroke that is a great offensive and defensive weapon. He also showed me some pressure drills. These helped almost immediately in the tournament we had the next day.

This part is hard to describe, but he gave me a fresh approach on various ways to play shape. I asked him about ways of hitting shots for shape, and he pointed out to me how he viewed the angles. His approach is positive and simple. As a result, he has developed reliable ways to help pressure proof the game.

It was great having a very experienced, knowledgeable, professional instructor over for a session. I can't wait until I have time to practice and totally assimulate Scott's suggestions into my game.

Scott's a straight shooter who's not afraid to tell it like it is.

Chris <hr /></blockquote>

Yeah, and so when is Scott comning to the Philly Area??? And when I'm not working the Expo??

Owwwww..... He's only here when I'm busy....

Barbara~~~was working when the IP party was happening and no one came down with any "relief"....

tateuts
11-17-2003, 09:08 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Barbara:</font><hr>
Yeah, and so when is Scott comning to the Philly Area??? And when I'm not working the Expo??

Owwwww..... He's only here when I'm busy....

Barbara~~~was working when the IP party was happening and no one came down with any "relief".... <hr /></blockquote>

Barbara,

I'll tell you what, I recommend it. I really felt energized after the lesson. I was ready to play. He has a certain amount of enthusiasm for the game he passes on, and an interest in his pupils. For example, Scott stopped by my room to see how I did in the tournament the next day. Some of the little things he showed me came up in the competition - it was great because it gave me something to think about besides missing!

Chris

rukiddingme
11-17-2003, 09:18 PM
The nice thing is that Scott tapes your lesson and you can review your lesson at will... /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif
ruk

ras314
11-17-2003, 11:56 PM
uh oh, another free lesson poster. LOL

Did Scott get his car situation straightened out?

dmgwalsh
11-18-2003, 05:28 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> he showed me a few things that added some weapons to the arsenal. He also showed me some pressure drills.
Chris <hr /></blockquote>

Can you share the drills? Anything other than the 13 ball drill and 15 ball drill recently posted here? Dennus

jjinfla
11-18-2003, 06:52 AM
This is beginning to sound more and more like those info commercials on TV during the wee hours of the night or sat/sun mornings.

nhp
11-18-2003, 07:13 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> This is beginning to sound more and more like those info commercials on TV during the wee hours of the night or sat/sun mornings. <hr /></blockquote>

Would you guys shut up with that? Chris is not trying to advertise Scott, he is just content with what Scott taught him, and he is letting other people know that. I had a lesson from Scott the same day as Chris, I was also very pleased, but the reason I didn't make a thread like this one is because I knew people like you would start talking crap. Look, Scott is a great instructor, people who have taken lessons from him have always said it, now GET OVER IT and stop casting doubt on the guy. I happen to know Chris, we play at the same poolroom. He is not some guy advertising Scott.

There is nothing more annoying than pessimists.

Wally_in_Cincy
11-18-2003, 07:56 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote dmgwalsh:</font><hr>
Can you share the drills? Anything other than the 13 ball drill and 15 ball drill recently posted here? Dennus <hr /></blockquote>

Some of the same drills are included in Black Belt Billiards, a book I would highly recommend.

That's the best I can do since I'm not a WEI guy.

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 08:34 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> Those of you who have taken lessons from Scott Lee know that he has great teaching skills. He could easily have been a first class school teacher or professor.

I felt fortunate that he didn't want to change my stroke or mechanics, but he showed me a few things that added some weapons to the arsenal.

Chris <hr /></blockquote>

I have taken three of Scotts lessons. He started me on the path to good fundamentals. Unfortunately, I do not think Scott would approve of my current stroke. I used to never drop my elbow and was quite obsessed with this.

Nowadays, I just let the cue go and the arm follows. On many shots, the elbow does not drop, sometimes only a couple of inches, but sometimes more. I literally 'throw the cue', with the exception of a light touch to keep it from flying across the table, the cue goes and the arm follows.

This is controversial and many will not agree, not scott, probably not randy g either, but there is no muscleling of anything. It is still the no elbow drop pendulum swing in the prestroke, but on the hit, letting the cue go.

Sorry if this sounds controversial or it once again opens up this can of worms. It is simply my truth, my style, what is natural and I am playing better this way /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

My truth only. No reflection on others.

Laura---&gt; what ever it takes

dmgwalsh
11-18-2003, 09:05 AM
Which ones. I have that book but haven't gone too far into it. I've had two lessons with him and am trying to concentrate on things he teaches me in prep for my next lesson with him.

dmgwalsh
11-18-2003, 09:08 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Wally_in_Cincy:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote dmgwalsh:</font><hr>
Can you share the drills? Anything other than the 13 ball drill and 15 ball drill recently posted here? Dennus <hr /></blockquote>
sorry my last post was not specific. Which Black belt drills did scott use? (I have the book) I'd like to get a head start before I see him again.
Some of the same drills are included in Black Belt Billiards, a book I would highly recommend.

That's the best I can do since I'm not a WEI guy. <hr /></blockquote>

ras314
11-18-2003, 09:53 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nhp:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> This is beginning to sound more and more like those info commercials on TV during the wee hours of the night or sat/sun mornings. <hr /></blockquote>

Would you guys shut up with that? Chris is not trying to advertise Scott, he is just content with what Scott taught him, and he is letting other people know that. I had a lesson from Scott the same day as Chris, I was also very pleased, but the reason I didn't make a thread like this one is because I knew people like you would start talking crap. Look, Scott is a great instructor, people who have taken lessons from him have always said it, now GET OVER IT and stop casting doubt on the guy. I happen to know Chris, we play at the same poolroom. He is not some guy advertising Scott.

There is nothing more annoying than pessimists. <hr /></blockquote>
Hope my comment was not considered casting doubt on Scott. I consider him a friend and a heck of a good instructor. I think the main guy running him down is just amusing and a little bit sicko.

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 10:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> This is beginning to sound more and more like those info commercials on TV during the wee hours of the night or sat/sun mornings. <hr /></blockquote>

Jake,

This is the reason these threads keep coming up. Scott is a regular on ccb. Lots of people took his lessons and got a lot out of them. Scott is also personable and fun to be around.

The more people on ccb that take scott's lessons, the more he has been recommended. When someone new( to Scott) takes one of his lessons after a recommendation, they are often excited and start another post about 'my lesson with Scott Lee'.

When I took my first lesson with scott, I got a stroke (though I now usually drop my elbow a couple of inches or so-slap slap), a bridge, a stance etc. For months, if I had any question about the correctness of what he had showed me, I watched the tape. But I did not watch me, I watched his stroke because it was much better than mine.

I had never had a lesson with a professional instructor so I was very excited about what I had learned. I was a beginner at that time so did not get some of the advanced drills but did watch WW (sl 7 in apa) tape too later on so I could practice some of them.

Since then, I have taken two more lessons with Scott, been to pool school with Randy G and FL showed me his opinion on the draw and other things when he was here. I have tried to be open minded and also have learned a lot from reading others here like Chris,Rod,Popcorn, Fred and many others.

I do not think that this is intentional advertisement but just an excited student starting a post.

Laura

ras314
11-18-2003, 11:22 AM
I contacted Scott for a lesson because of the many posts here that indicated he put a lot of emphasis on the stroke. They were right, helped me considerably. Made me realize how much time I wasted years ago by not having that quality of instruction.

I didn't post about the lesson since others described his teaching skills better than I could. His personality and energy is a big plus also.

BTW, on my video there is a very good shot of Scott dropping his elbow during the follow thru. Made for a nice smooth stroke. Seems to me ridgedly forcing the elbow to stay still makes for a short follow thru. At least in my case.

bluewolf
11-18-2003, 11:40 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>

BTW, on my video there is a very good shot of Scott dropping his elbow during the follow thru. Made for a nice smooth stroke. Seems to me ridgedly forcing the elbow to stay still makes for a short follow thru. At least in my case. <hr /></blockquote>

Mine drops about two inches on most shots and a few it does not drop. On a few shots it dropped more. I just had to let that cue go and stop being so concerned about where my elbow was. Having my stroke straight and freezing on the follow is what I do.

Laura

Fred Agnir
11-18-2003, 12:09 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>
BTW, on my video there is a very good shot of Scott dropping his elbow during the follow thru. <hr /></blockquote>Does Scott teach an elbow drop?

Fred &lt;~~~ wading through past posts

Wally_in_Cincy
11-18-2003, 12:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>
....I think the main guy running him down is just amusing and a little bit sicko. <hr /></blockquote>

Jake has just been a bit crabby lately /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

tateuts
11-18-2003, 12:45 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> This is beginning to sound more and more like those info commercials on TV during the wee hours of the night or sat/sun mornings. <hr /></blockquote>

I didn't mean to advertise for him. I just wanted to express my opinion that Scott is not just for beginners, which is what some posters here have implied.

I would recommend to any player at any level to take a lesson from Scott. I'm telling you I was pumped up with what he showed me.

Chris

tateuts
11-18-2003, 01:42 PM
The largest benefit I got from Scott's lesson was learning a better way of slow rolling the cue ball. Since then, I have watched tournament tapes and realized that almost all the pros use this technique to one degree or another. It's mainly just a very short back stroke and smooth acceleration through the cue ball with follow though on the forward stroke. I was taking too long of a back stroke on very light touch shots.

As far as drills go, here's the best drill he showed me:

START(
%Ag6T5%Bg6H4%Dg7M3%Eg6R0%Gg6E9%Hg6O7%Ig7J7%Jg5Y3%M g6W0%Pm1Y1

)END

WEI Table (http://endeavor.med.nyu.edu/~wei/pool/pooltable2.html)

You get ball in hand after every shot. Set the cue ball up about one foot from the object ball aimed straight for a corner shot downtable and shoot them with a simple stop shot at slow (lag) speed. Do this three times in a row, or start over.

This is a very simple drill and it sounds kind of dumb, right? You actually have to try it to realize the benefits.

This drill helped me a lot with a couple of things:

1) Focus - it's easy to miss these if you don't pay attention.

2) Care in setting up - it's hard to make even easy shots without good set up and being on the cue ball on the correct vertical line.

3) Pre-shot routine. It's easier to get through the drill with a pre-shot routine.

4) Nerves - it's easy to run some balls, but when you get near the end, knowing you may have to start over, the pressure increases and the shots become more difficult.

5) Once you get good at this drill, down table shots are duck soup.

Anyway, that's just one thing. I was kind of surprised that I got so much from this one simple exercise.

Chris

ras314
11-18-2003, 02:04 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Wally_in_Cincy:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>
....I think the main guy running him down is just amusing and a little bit sicko. <hr /></blockquote>

Jake has just been a bit crabby lately /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Jake wasn't who I have in mind, rather the guy that likes to call everybody "bozo". Has been posting some readable posts lately.

tateuts
11-18-2003, 02:19 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fred Agnir:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>
BTW, on my video there is a very good shot of Scott dropping his elbow during the follow thru. <hr /></blockquote>Does Scott teach an elbow drop?

Fred &lt;~~~ wading through past posts <hr /></blockquote>


Scott does not teach an elbow drop. He liked my mechanics because I don't drop my elbow.

Chris

Candyman
11-18-2003, 02:19 PM
I love that drill. Try to incorporate Scott's "draw drill" on the last set. Instead of BIH, try to draw the ball back and over each time. It really helps on the finesse part of your game.

tateuts
11-18-2003, 02:25 PM
Thanks, Candyman, I'll try it.

I would like to point out that Scott doesn't pretend that he invented any of this stuff, either.


Chris

Wally_in_Cincy
11-18-2003, 02:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> Thanks, Candyman, I'll try it.

I would like to point out that Scott doesn't pretend that he invented any of this stuff, either.


Chris <hr /></blockquote>

Unlike our CCBer who claims he invented the jump cue LOL

Candyman
11-18-2003, 02:40 PM
Quote tateuts:
I would like to point out that Scott doesn't pretend that he invented any of this stuff, either.


Chris
---------------------------------------------------------
You are exactly right. In fact Scott goes out of the way to give credit to people like Frank Oliva, Jack White, Willie Jopling, Jerry Briesath, Tom Rossman, Mike Massey and others. He is a very humble man in my view.

jjinfla
11-18-2003, 06:56 PM
Gee Wally, Talk about being crabby, you take the cake. If you check you will not find me criticizing Scott. I can't, I never met the man, nor had a lesson from him. All I said is this thread is sounding like an infomercial. Ever watch one of those? That doesn't make Scott bad. Why would you even think that?

And Tateuts I sure hope you didn't pay $200 to learn that drill because it is very common and in all the books and videos. Because it is so good. There are so many variations to it that you can keep on that drill forever. Example: vary the distance between OB and CB. Use stop shots or follow or draw. Follow or draw to a designated spot. Instead of being straight in line you can be on an angle to come off the rail for position on the next ball in line.

And I have to agree that Black Belt Billiards is a very good book. But it does no one any good sitting on a shelf and looking at the pictures once in a while. I got my copy last March and am up to page 83 out of 129. I have really enjoyed the experience so far and I know if I keep at it I will someday be an SL3 in the APA. LOL

Scott Lee
11-18-2003, 07:08 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fred Agnir:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr>
BTW, on my video there is a very good shot of Scott dropping his elbow during the follow thru. <hr /></blockquote>Does Scott teach an elbow drop?

Fred &lt;~~~ wading through past posts <hr /></blockquote>

Fred and ras314...No, I do not teach an elbow drop. Quite the opposite, in fact. ras214, if you look carefully at the video, you will notice me standing nearly straight up, as opposed to down over the cuestick. This body position makes it "appear" that I am dropping my elbow...when, in fact, I am still moving my forearm in a complete pendulum motion, from start to finish. There no demonstrable elbow drop...perhaps, on occasion, a couple of inches, but no more.

Scott Lee

ras314
11-18-2003, 08:07 PM
"if you look carefully at the video, you will notice me standing nearly straight up, as opposed to down over the cuestick. This body position makes it "appear" that I am dropping my elbow...when, in fact, I am still moving my forearm in a complete pendulum motion, from start to finish."

Yes, you were pretty high over the cue. And the "elbow drop" was not a whole lot, but noticeable. Kinda of like the elbow just follows thru with the stroke. See a lot of the men pros with the same looking stroke.

I'm clear back near the end of the cue now and getting comfortable with it. I still have to let the elbow drop to get a long smooth follow thru unless I'm down low on the cue. Long being 4 or 5 inches to me. Now working on getting the bridge a little shorter also.

I wouldn't be concerned with all this except I'm getting improved cb contol and better consisentcy the more I work at it.

tateuts
11-18-2003, 09:03 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> And Tateuts I sure hope you didn't pay $200 to learn that drill because it is very common and in all the books and videos. <hr /></blockquote>

No, I actually paid $300!

In all seriousness, you sound a little like me, a head strong do-it-yourselfer, right? Well, it wasn't about drills or whatever. When you're playing a lot and working on things, it helps to get an expert outside opinion. Not so much a teacher as a "coach". Scott has a lot of coaching ability. In order to get to the next level, it takes small improvements for me that become harder and harder to come by. He has an expert eye and a lot of teaching experience.

That's like going to the doctor and saying "well, I could have gone to the pharmacy and bought those pills for $20, why should I pay you $200 and the lab $200 for the tests?".

Chris

tateuts
11-18-2003, 09:16 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ras314:</font><hr> I'm clear back near the end of the cue now and getting comfortable with it. I still have to let the elbow drop to get a long smooth follow thru unless I'm down low on the cue. Long being 4 or 5 inches to me. Now working on getting the bridge a little shorter also.

I wouldn't be concerned with all this except I'm getting improved cb contol and better consisentcy the more I work at it. <hr /></blockquote>

I actually never once in my life looked to see if my elbow was dropping or not - I could care less. Scott just pointed it out to me that mine doesn't. All I care about is putting a nice stroke on the cue ball, making the shot and getting shape.

Chris

ras314
11-18-2003, 10:12 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> All I care about is putting a nice stroke on the cue ball, making the shot and getting shape.
<hr /></blockquote>

Yea, that about covers the whole ball of wax. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

What I trying to do is whatever it takes to get the nice consisent follow thru since that helps all of the above. Haven't tried the slip stroke or "throwing" the cue. Yet.

jjinfla
11-19-2003, 04:56 AM
Tateuts,

Unfortunately for me there are no trained instructors around here otherwise I would have signed up. I am sure it would have saved me a lot of time in my learning curve. There is one good player who I took lessons from but he has no structure to his lessons and more or less just give tips.So now I just play him for money every now and again. He wins the money and he gives me some tips to help my game.
But I was looking for an instructor that I could go to every other week or so who would work with me on an ongoing basis. Where I could learn something and then work on it between lessons. But that is not available around here so I am forced to use the videos and books. Too bad there are no pool schools like they have in Karate.

bluewolf
11-19-2003, 05:21 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> Tateuts,

But I was looking for an instructor that I could go to every other week or so who would work with me on an ongoing basis. Where I could learn something and then work on it between lessons. But that is not available around here so I am forced to use the videos and books. Too bad there are no pool schools like they have in Karate. <hr /></blockquote>

Where do you live, Jake. Randy g said he would come to my town if I could find some students that would make it financially worth his expenses in time. Considering what you get, he does not charge much when you consider his costs for plane fare and hotel-food. Or perhaps you could do this with someone else like Scott or FL. You might even consider driving a couple of hours to where someone is who teaches a good lesson.

I know you are a pretty good player, so I am not giving you advice as a player. But, if you can afford to fly in someone and put them up, that might also be a possibility.

My son is near palm beach, which is 12-14 hours from me, yet a round trip ticket purchased two weeks ahead is only about $170. Plane fare these days is pretty cheap.

Laura

dmgwalsh
11-19-2003, 08:03 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr>
And I have to agree that Black Belt Billiards is a very good book. But it does no one any good sitting on a shelf and looking at the pictures once in a while. I got my copy last March and am up to page 83 out of 129. <hr /></blockquote>

I took mine off the shelf to look at it again after reading this. I'm already doing a lot of the drills because he takes a lot from Bert Kinister and I've done quite a few of his tapes. When i get tired of the ones I'm doing now, maybe I'll look again for some others. Dennis

Scott Lee
11-19-2003, 03:13 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr>

That's like going to the doctor and saying "well, I could have gone to the pharmacy and bought those pills for $20, why should I pay you $200 and the lab $200 for the tests?".

Chris <hr /></blockquote>

Whoa! Where do you GET those pills??? They're 'stroke pills', right? LOL Glad I could help you, Chris! Thanks for sharing your home and your interests with me! I look forward to seeing you the next time I'm back in S. CA!

Scott Lee