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View Full Version : What's wrong with turning the wrist?



Isshi
12-24-2003, 07:53 AM
I consider my stroke fairly smooth, and my body movement
minimal. I stay down on the shot, and sometimes stay
motionless after the follow-through, just my eyes following the
cue ball. That's when I notice that...

My wrist has turned in, pivoting as far as it can.
Sometimes I notice it very clearly, like it's a focused part of my
stroke. Still, it feels smooth and natural.

Is there anything seriously wrong with turning the wrist?

Curious, Isshi.

Fat Ivory
12-24-2003, 09:38 AM
Rules such as "don't twist your wrist" are designed to keep the stroke straight. If yours is straight through the range of speeds, then forget it; there's no problem. Many pros keep their wrist twisted outward - and manage to win.

JDB
12-24-2003, 11:36 AM
I am probably wrong...lol, but I seriously think turning the risk is the number one reason for missed shots. I believe it causes balls to rattle in pockets and spit out from imparting unwanted english on the cue ball. It may not be the number one reason, but it is up there.

I just discovered this recently within my own game and have been working hard to come up with a way not to turn the wrist. I notice that when I make the effort not to turn the wrist, balls that used to rattle out of the pocket go in much more cleanly.

This is even more noticeable on my break. When I make the effort to keep the wrist straight (ie., locked) I can park the cue in the middle of the table 60% of the time or so.

This is just my opinion. There are instructors that post on the board, I would be interested in hearing their comments.

JDB
12-24-2003, 11:38 AM
I think you hit the nail on the head with your response. Why do you think some pros keep their wrist turned outward? I believe it is to ensure that they do not twist their wrist. JMO.

Scott Lee
12-24-2003, 11:58 AM
Isshi...I'm not sure if you mean "twisting" your wrist (bad), or simply allowing your wrist to be flexible, along the same straight path of your forearm, which is okay...provided you finish your followthrough. The flexible wrist addition is often referred to as "double pendulum" effect, and many older players used this type of stroke to accentuate the action on the CB. Twisting your wrist, imo, like JPB mentioned, is a receipe for inaccurate hits, and potentially missed shots and/or missed position...
for the exact reason he made mention of...unanticipated, or accidental sidespin. JMO

Scott Lee

Cueless Joey
12-24-2003, 12:00 PM
More moving parts, more to go wrong.
I believe the web of your grip hand has to be in line with your bridge hand and your elbow should be perfectly in line with those two hands.

Rod
12-24-2003, 12:08 PM
Isshi,

I'd could associate turning your wrist with some specialty stroke/english shots although I don't think it's a good idea. I can't even imagine why it would be useful with center ball. It's just another variable that makes exact contact with the cue ball inconsistent. Turning your wrist has to be compensated for somewhere in your arm movement. Meaning your arm "may" travel straight back but moves either inside or outside depending on the wrist turn on your forward swing. If you want to keep that motion, fine but I'd think trying to become a real good player will take a lot longer or might not ever happen.

Rod

JDB
12-24-2003, 05:03 PM
I've probably posted to this thread too much already, but this is an interesting subject to me and I thought of another "test" that leads me to believe turning the wrist is bad.

I have always been terrible at jacked up shots. I make an extremely small percentage of them. However, when I make the effort to lock my wrist to ensure I get no wrist turn my percentage of makes is much, much higher. I would miss even straight in easy jacked up shots prior to locking my wrist.

I now probably make 95% of easy straight in one's as well as a very high percentage of jacked up cut shots, etc.

Just another good test to give a try if you are unsure.

recoveryjones
12-24-2003, 05:42 PM
Try this test. Shoot the cue ball staight up and down the length of a nine foot table (bouncing off the end rail hitting centre ball.Pause and leave your cue tip right where it is after follow through. If the cue ball returns perfect and and hits your tip dead centre thats great. If so you don't need to give to shits about a twisted wrist as you are hitting the cue ball where you want to.If it returns say a 1/4- 1/2 tip of english back even thats not too too bad however a perfect return is what you are looking for.If it returns and misses your cue all together, throw your twisted wrist style into the nearest garbage can.I used to twist my wrist on certain shots, in particular long draw shots.Since I've concentrated on following through with a light grip and straight wrist the results have been awesome.Nowadays you see all kinds of different strokes and stances with succesful results, however in general if you want to get anywhere and progress to the upper eschelons of this game, good basic fundamentals including a straight wrist are the key.You've gotta hit the cue ball where you mean too. Good luck.RJ

Troy
12-24-2003, 06:39 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Isshi:</font><hr>
Is there anything seriously wrong with turning the wrist?

Curious, Isshi.
<hr /></blockquote>
In a word, YES !!! As others have said, you will impart unwanted english.

Many moons ago "Papy", my mentor, taught me this pre-shot idea as a method of eliminating the dreaded wrist-twist ---
When setting up for your shot, move the thumb of your back hand to the TOP of your cue. Notice that wrist position ?? Straight with your forearm... Hold that throughout the stroke.

The idea is that you can NOT twist your wrist with your thumb on top.

Troy

bluewolf
12-25-2003, 06:11 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Isshi:</font><hr> I consider my stroke fairly smooth, and my body movement
minimal. I stay down on the shot, and sometimes stay
motionless after the follow-through, just my eyes following the
cue ball. That's when I notice that...

My wrist has turned in, pivoting as far as it can. <hr /></blockquote>

I think that you need to find out where in your stroke the wrist is turning. If it turns at the END of a long follow, that may be different than turning when striking the cb or in the first part of the follow through.If you turn it on a 'stretch' shot, also might need to use a bridge instead. I dont see too many real good players turning their wrist in the basic stroke and follow.

With a perfect stroke and follow, as taught by scott, randy g and others, the wrist does not turn. Look also at your elbow position. The only way I can turn my wrist is when I am not stroking the cue straight and have cocked my elbow out, resulting in what others have said, english, even if you strike mid cb.

just my .02

Laura

ras314
12-25-2003, 01:10 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Troy:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Isshi:</font><hr>
Is there anything seriously wrong with turning the wrist?

Curious, Isshi.
<hr /></blockquote>
In a word, YES !!! As others have said, you will impart unwanted english.

Many moons ago "Papy", my mentor, taught me this pre-shot idea as a method of eliminating the dreaded wrist-twist ---
When setting up for your shot, move the thumb of your back hand to the TOP of your cue. Notice that wrist position ?? Straight with your forearm... Hold that throughout the stroke.

The idea is that you can NOT twist your wrist with your thumb on top.

Troy <hr /></blockquote>

This was it! I've been having a problem always putting a little right english on the cue ball. To the extent I compensate by attempting to use a little left. Don't know how many times I've scratched off a rail because of this.

Thanks all for this thread.

Qtec
12-25-2003, 10:24 PM
Are you suggesting that the thumb should be on top when griping the cue or when hitting the ball?

Q

Troy
12-28-2003, 06:38 PM
Obviously NOT when actually stroking during the shot.
It's training technique.

Troy...~~~ Thought it should be obvious.
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> Are you suggesting that the thumb should be on top when griping the cue or when hitting the ball?

Q <hr /></blockquote>