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04-19-2002, 11:18 AM
Is the WPBAs condition terminal or can a cure be found?

Mary

Tom_In_Cincy
04-19-2002, 11:33 AM
Looks like the tournament schedule is still non-committed.
And, as long as you have the top 20 players seeded all the time, the majority of the exposure is going to be to them.
This may not be a bad thing, but, these are conditions that make the tour and the TV shows stale.

Not much excitement available.
Where is the entertainment?

Vagabond
04-19-2002, 07:19 PM
Hello Mates,
I see it as a generic problem with the game of pool rather than with WPBA. cheers
vagabond

Retardo
04-19-2002, 07:43 PM
Can anybody explain the relationship between ESPN/TV and the WPBA? I've heard Steve Tipton say that they have to PAY ESPN to put the tournaments on. Does that make sense? Who gets the advertising money?

Additional ramblings: They want to improve their image yet they hold most of their tournaments in second rate casinos while having a "no gambling" rule for the ladies . Why do casinos like pool tournaments if no one else does or conversely why doesn't anyone else like them when they seem to work for casinos?

Tom_In_Cincy
04-19-2002, 09:52 PM
Steve Tipton has told me the same. ESPN will only allot so many hours of the WPBA pool broadcasts.
ESPN sells these hours to the WPBA and the WPBA then sells the advertizing rights.
At one time there was only 8 hours (for 8 tournaments) and it was just recently expanded to 10 or 12 hours. But, it looks like the WPBA is behind on getting all these tournaments lined up, or is not posting any information on their website.

There seems to be a problem.. I wonder...

Wally_in_Cincy
04-20-2002, 09:55 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr> Steve Tipton has told me the same. ESPN will only allot so many hours of the WPBA pool broadcasts.
ESPN sells these hours to the WPBA and the WPBA then sells the advertizing rights. <hr></blockquote>

I believe that is correct.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr> At one time there was only 8 hours (for 8 tournaments) and it was just recently expanded to 10 or 12 hours. But, it looks like the WPBA is behind on getting all these tournaments lined up, or is not posting any information on their website.

There seems to be a problem.. I wonder...
<hr></blockquote>

As I understand it, they tape the semifinals and finals. For 6 tournaments last year that's 18 hours. With repeats they air somewhere between 40 and 60 hours each year. If I'm wrong I'm sure Fran or Chris in NC will correct me. LOL

I think they were late getting the tournament dates finalized last year but it worked out OK.

To Retardo-as far as the tournaments being held in casinos, that's where the money is. Casinos make a LOT of money and they sponsor the tourneys to bring people in and to keep their name out in front of the public.

Is the WPBA terminal? Not at all IMO. If they can break even they'll be tickled pink. The women have never made a whole lot of money anyway.

04-20-2002, 10:40 AM
Wasn't there some talk of a lawsuit or something by someone that was ousted or something that was probably going to change or bankrupt the entire WPBA? What happened there?

Wally_in_Cincy
04-20-2002, 11:12 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Anonymous:</font><hr> Wasn't there some talk of a lawsuit or something by someone that was ousted or something that was probably going to change or bankrupt the entire WPBA? What happened there? <hr></blockquote>

Not that I know of.

CCB regular Dr. D (Diana Sorrentino) was ousted from the board of directors a few months ago. Some folks here had encouraged her to sue the WPBA but I don't know if she did or even if she has grounds. Check back later. I'm sure she'll read this thread and post her thoughts unless there's some legalities involved which would prohibit her commenting.

Harold Acosta
04-20-2002, 11:16 AM
Tom, do all the other sports pay ESPN this type of arrangement: Selling the hours, and the sport selling the advertisement rights?

04-20-2002, 11:37 AM
I believe the schedule is set for the year, but don't look for it on the WPBA website - they don't seem to update very often. Check some of the player websites (like Gerda's).

The WPBA are very aware of the problem with seeing the same faces on TV all the time and are considering changes that would get more exposure for the other girls.
There is a lot that can be done and frankly I don't think ESPN is the best place for them. It seems like ESPN would rather make up phony sports (like X Games) targeted at a specific demographic than cover a wider range of legitimate sports. The sports channels on my satellite system are filled with soccer, cricket, golf, etc. Plenty of room for billiards.

Tom_In_Cincy
04-20-2002, 11:41 AM
I doubt that the NFL and MLB pay ESPN, in fact, I would think its quite the opposite.

I cannot answer for the all the other Non-Major League games/sports.

I just know about the WPBA.

04-20-2002, 12:51 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr> I doubt that the NFL and MLB pay ESPN, in fact, I would think its quite the opposite.

I cannot answer for the all the other Non-Major League games/sports.

I just know about the WPBA.
<hr></blockquote>

ESPN has a contract with MLB that is worth 800 million over 6 years. The contract is until 2005. That is around 133 million a season, but the contract is back heavy.

ESPN has a contract with the NFL that pays 600 million a season for Sunday Night Football, I believe this is for 8 years. This is a small piece of the pie for the NFL. Their last contract was worth over 17 billion over 8 years from all the networks combined.

Neither of these are fair comparisons but they give an idea of the type of money some sports are dealing with.

Stauber

04-20-2002, 04:28 PM
I know Dr D and I can tell you for sure that she has filed a law suit in federal court againsts the WPBA. Where it is now I do not know but I am sure we will all be hearing lots more real soon.

Jackie

04-21-2002, 06:37 AM
Allen Hopkins told me three years ago that he had to pay espn $ 40,000 for one hour of broad casting

jjinfla
04-21-2002, 07:06 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Anonymous:</font><hr> Wasn't there some talk of a lawsuit or something by someone that was ousted or something that was probably going to change or bankrupt the entire WPBA? What happened there? <hr></blockquote>

When reading the above, why do I have the feeling that it was written by a regular who decided to become anon to post the tongue in cheek question? But it did produce the desired results, didn't it? LOL Jake

Vince S.
04-21-2002, 05:41 PM
ESPN needs Baseball, Football, Basketball and Hockey to servive as a company. However, in thier eyes, Pool needs them. Bottom line here is that no matter what ESPN says, I personally think that they couldn't care less about pool. Pool is just another way for them to fill whatever dead time they might have laying around.

Here's a company with hundreds of millions of dollars to play around with (maybe a billion) and they hold one hour of airtime ransom for $40,000. That's pathetic! And when a tournament actually is aired, it's with thier rules and thier format. It's a shame how our industry has kissed thier feet.

Is it just me or is anyone else tired of watching reruns of the same match 5 times over? Here's an idea. There's a show called ESPN Classics where they show sporting events of the past. Instead of all those same match reruns why don't they go over to Accustats and contract some tapes from them. I'm sure they have some great matches from the past that NOBODY has ever seen. They say that current viewership numbers don't warrent additional air time, well I bet if they start showing some of the past great matches they might find viewership up quite a bit. I know I'd watch them.

Vince S.

cheesemouse
04-21-2002, 07:04 PM
Vince,
ESPN will never make you happy with pool coverage. They sold out to nude beach volley ball.

Vince S.
04-22-2002, 02:56 PM
Your right cheesemouse, and one other thing, I would bet that they don't have to sell thier own advertising space either!

Vince S.

Cuemage
04-22-2002, 07:06 PM
I would like to testify that Accu-Stats makes a quality product. I have several of their tapes &amp; just entered their movie of the month club promotion. These tapes are without a doubt better than ANYTHING I have seen on ESPN, Prime Network, or otherwise. (And yes, I do realize the importance ESPN money and exposure would bring to the sport). I would recommend viewing these tapes &amp; using them as an instruction tool.

Tha Cuemage