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bigbro6060
04-14-2004, 01:50 AM
How do you guys handle nerves before a big match ?

cheers

Predator314
04-14-2004, 06:27 AM
Get Drunk /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Nahhh.... the nervousness is what keeps me coming back. I think you just learn to play with nerves after a while. I like the feeling.

Chris Cass
04-14-2004, 07:48 AM
Hi Bro,

The key to it is not easy but there's two ways to do this. One, you need to keep your fears and anxzieties(sp) in check. The other is, just play the table and not think of what your opponent can do from his or her chair.

The mental side of the game is the hardest part to master. A lot has to do with the way your mind preceives it. Man, my spelling sucks. Anyway, the more you analize things. The more you let these negative thoughts creep in. Keep this game simple and you'll overcome many obsticles.

I find my nerves settle, the more I play for, gambling wise. Tournament wise, I let too many negative thoughts come into my head. That's not a good thing. It's cost me many losses, when they should be victories. I've found a few tournament secrets to live by. Don't try to find out if your in the money bracket. Don't look to see who you play next, it doesn't matter anyway. Try to keep your mind fresh. Breathing exercizes work great, when nerves hit ya in a match. The actual nervous thing leaves when your done breathing. I get myself dizzy a bit. The rush of oxygen to the brain makes your thoughts clear. Don't over stuff yourself before a match. If you plan to eat do it atleast 1/2 hr earlier. Don't look into the crowd. You could see Barry there and then your toast. LOL

There's a lot on the subject in print. I myself need to find something that works for me. Your nerves after time and entering events more will work better for you in time too. They'll seem to calm down a bit.

Oh and lastly. Practice how you play. In tourneys or in a gambling match. So many practice one way and when under stress they'll play another. It should be the same all the time. Now to acheieve this, one must apply pressure during practice. Adjust spots to force you to play. Imho How many times have you've heard players say, "I'm suppose to kill that guy." "He's not suppose to win." Instead of, I need to beat this guy. The opponent knows your suppose to win so, there's no pressure on him. He's suppose to lose. LOL This is true with all of us. You can't get lazy or you'll be racking. I just think of how much I hate to rack. I've done my racking. Now it's time for someone else. LOL

Regards,

C.C.~~good gambler but poor tournament player. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

shooter72283
04-28-2004, 12:59 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr>
analize
<hr /></blockquote>

LOL. Sorry, couldn't help myself on this one! Great advice, though. Sounds like something straight outta the Monk's mouth.

bluewolf
04-28-2004, 05:59 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr> Hi Bro,

The key to it is not easy but there's two ways to do this. One, you need to keep your fears and anxzieties(sp) in check. The other is, just play the table and not think of what your opponent can do from his or her chair.

The mental side of the game is the hardest part to master. A lot has to do with the way your mind preceives it. <hr /></blockquote>

I have better luck with this when I mentally prepare myself before walking into the pool room. I am usually pretty calm, although that went out the window when I had to play my first captain, who had looked down his nose at me as a beginning two. I never got any encouragement and was crushed with no positive so lost most of my first matches, because I could not quite get it together.

Anyway, when I did play in a tournament last year, I walked in calm with no expectations other than to play my best and learn something about nine ball, which I knew next to nothing about other than what I had seen on TV.Also to just be able to stand up and play since I was playing with a back injury. LOL Anyway, being my first non handicapped event, I was a little nervous but able to become calm while playing.

I am pretty okay with myself, regardless of how many shots I missed or won or lost, as long as I played with relaxation and confidence and had my best game.

Laura

Predator314
04-28-2004, 06:38 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr>

not think of what your opponent can do from his or her chair.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is good advice. When you have confidence in your stroke, that will dominate nerves. I played in an 8 ball tournament the week before last. I usually get nervous in tournaments and that's what I like about them. That Saturday night, though, my stroke was really working. I felt so confident. I didn't really feel any nerves. When the names were drawn, I got stuck in the worst bracket. No easy games in this bracket. I ended up winning the tournament without losing a single game (game, not match). It was crazy. I could have beaten Archer that night. When I got up to shoot, I knew that I could run out. There were a couple occasions where I could just tell almost nobody could run out. In the past with the nerves working, I would normally pick off some balls and end up just clearing the table for my opponent. The main instance that comes to mind was in the finals. My opponent broke and didn't really leave me anything. I knew the high balls were the ones to take, but I also knew that the balls were really cluttered and my chances of getting out were slim. I felt so confident in my game, I just made sure I got a high ball and then played safe. My opponent made a good hit and put me back at the table with the same exact layout. I played the same safety again. He made another good hit, but left me with a makeable shot and a break out. I knew it was over at that point. I ran out, then broke and ran out again for the win. I thought, Man that was too easy. I did notice my nerves a little when my hands were shaking putting my cue back in the case. Didn't notice them one time while I was shooting or waiting to shoot.

To sum it all up, I think confidence can overpower nerves on any occasion. Not just in pool.

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 07:07 AM
Hi Pred,

"There's nothing more scarry than a pool player with confidence." "There's nothing that'll pi$$ you off more than a pool player that's cocky." Hope you remember the difference, when you play.

Great job,

C.C.~~only one stroke matters. the last one. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 07:21 AM
The Monks mouth? hummmm, Well, this is coming out of the Monkeys mouth. hahahahahahaha

Regards,

C.C.~~couldn't help myself either. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 08:13 AM
Bluewolf,

Your a prime example of what ones mind preceives. You say the captain was looking down on you as a 2. Maybe, you were looking up at him or her, as a captain?

The no encouragement and the no positive, is nothing more than excuses to make your mind write it off. Deep down, it isn't written off. It's in the back of your mind and I imagine the experience is vivid in your mind right now. The never playing the game, is a valid excuse but nevertheless it's an excuse.

Let me help you out here Laura. All you can do as a pool player is to put yourself out there. Try your best and learn to find positives from your opponent and the table. The way to do this is by thinking everything thoroughly through before getting down to shoot the ball.

Put yourself out there 100%, when trying to make the ball. That's all you can do anyway. If you make a mistake? Correct it in your mind right away and store it in your mind, as done and move on.

When you hit a ball good, you should store that too. Patt yourself on the back and say to yourself, "I did that rather well." When your opponent misses, take that as a major positive. You get to shoot again.

Don't look for others to praise your play. That stuff is always nice to hear and will make you feel good. The down side is you'll get dependant on it and play the crowd or railbirds instead of the table. They praise you when you win and talk smak about you when you lose. They don't pay your entry. This, could lead to loss of focus trying to please them instead of paying attention to what your doing. You can only truely focus 100%, on one thing at a time. That would be the shot. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

It's true as a beginner that you really are at the mercy of the experienced shooter but, if you make one shot good. You can still walk away with your head held high. It also gives you permission, not be nervous. Your only there to put togather the pieces of a puzzle.

On your best day playing. Take and remember how you felt. Remember how your stroke felt and how everything you did felt. If you made one great shot that day. It was worth the entire day shooting.

Lastly, if someone ever mentions to you that, you shot the wrong ball, you did this wrong, you could have went this way and any other negative remarks. Take and throw those negatives out and evaluate what the person is saying. If you think what they said was correct in thinking then, correct the scenerio in your head and move on. I mean, walk the shot through your head and picture doing them again, but correctly or differently.

As a beginner your not suppose to shoot jam up. You can only put yourself out there and try. Don't make excuses for yourself to yourself or others. Just make corrections in your mind and that's all you can do.

Remember this, "If Efren can miss, it's ok if I do." That's also a good answer to those negative remarks to those type people, I stay away from. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Regards,

C.C.~~was a 2 once. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 08:52 AM
Bluewolf,

I want to add something to this. When you practice. Practice the shots that you missed in your previous matches. Also, if you play any tourneys, keep a record besides the one in your head as to what you did.

I play many tourneys lately. My records indicated that I was going 2 and out. This upset me but made me look at what was happening. I had to work on getting out of the gate sooner in the beginning matches.

This is starting to change now. At VF I didn't do anything in the singles event. The second chance I won a few then lost but that was single elim. Then, I went to the IA state event. At IA I placed like 25th -32nd or 32nd -48th. I have it written down but too lazy to get it right this minute.

I've been working on some stuff in practice. The shots I missed and the mindset when entering the match. Well, I went to a tourney 2 hrs away and had to play with plug balls that didn't roll straight and the field was pretty strong for a bar tourney. It was like a pub crawl. I had to shoot in like 5 bars in a 2 blk radious. The day was nice, like 80 degrees. I really enjoyed it although my K-mommy wasn't there and no Spike either. Still, I had a good time. I took 5th out of 32 players. Mostly masters and I went for $5. in the cal in which I bought half myself for $2.50 from the guy who bought me. LOL I was in the bathroom when they called my name. I still won $100. but I could have won the $400. first place and the cal only payed 2 spots but $360. for first. That would have been $580. for a $25. entry fee. Callllosss /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

My next tourney I went to was an event Bob Romano put togather. This only had a 40 player field. It was suppose to have a 128 player field but the Viking tour stop kind of killed the turnout. I hate that when that happens. If they could get togather both events could have been great but instead they split the players and both lost out. What am I saying? Us players lose out too.

Anyway, this also had a star studded field of masters too. I took 5th. $300. minus entry and table fees, food and gas. Still, I loved it. The place was really relaxing and the owners Eric and Mike(?) where extremely cordial. I messed up there and lost the winner bracket match. Then, two and out. I was there 15 hrs and drove another 2 hrs home. Bob and Eydie Romano offered to give me their room so I wouldn't have to drive home. Eydie keep wanting to feed me and Bob called my home to see if I got home ok. God, I love these people. The owner Eric had his partner make me a beef sandwich to take with on the house. Great hosts for sure. Can't wait for the Midwest Expo.

Anyway, keep the records. They pay off and the next event I play I plan on taking second. LOL Naa, I go to win but expect nothing but to put myself out there.

You have a advantage married to Ray. He can help you a lot if you take his advice with an open mind.

Regards,

C.C.~~I know, it's not all about me. hahahahaha

Predator314
04-28-2004, 09:03 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr> Hi Pred,

"There's nothing more scarry than a pool player with confidence." "There's nothing that'll pi$$ you off more than a pool player that's cocky." Hope you remember the difference, when you play.

Great job,

C.C.~~only one stroke matters. the last one. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Personally, I think there is a big difference between cocky and confident. It's kind of hard to put the difference into words. I think cocky has to do with strutting around and talk. Confidence, in my opinion, is when you let your actions speak instead of your words.

Some real world examples of what I'm trying to explain: If you watch American Idol, Latoya London is a fine example of confidence. She is good and she knows it, but she doesn't tell everyone she is good.

I also have a friend that shoots pool. He used to be the best around these parts. He worked hard on his game and it showed. A couple of years ago, you could just see confidence when he was at the table and it really scared his opponents. He's kind of lost interest in the past few years and has lost confidence in his stroke.

The cocky pool player is the one I want to beat the most.

Popcorn
04-28-2004, 09:04 AM
They are normal, it lets you know you are alive. Just be prepared and don't dwell on it. Like everything, nerves come from anticipation, but once you are playing they should calm down. Just don't get yourself in a mental state before you play. Don't be trying to run racks in practice, just do simple things. The last thing you want to do is start dogging it in practice due to your nervousness and go into the match saying to yourself, "I can't make a ball".

Popcorn
04-28-2004, 09:49 AM
The difference between cocky and confidence is, confidence will take you all the way through the match, even if you don't win, it has a basis. If they are substituting cocky in place of genuine confidence, it can evaporate in an instant if things go wrong. You see it all the time, they get quiet real quick.

bluewolf
04-28-2004, 09:56 AM
As a beginning two, I could get in balls but only the short ones and could hit in three in a row on an open table if the shape was not hard and could do defense but was losing, not getting that last eight ball.

I think that lots of sl2s need to have their self-esteem bolstered because almost everybody around them plays better. No one was encouraging me, even ww thought I was crappy, and it was like I would get a compliment and then their body language said that they thought that I was crappy. ww did not say that but I read body language and I knew what they thought. You might not believe me and think I imagined it but it really is true. I was even told by my captain that I would be a 2 for a very long time. So as a beginner, i lacked self esteem, and being very intuitive I was picking up way more than people thought that they were communicating.

To make this scientific, research has been done. When a person says one thing and their body language says something different, people believe the body language rather than the words.

But, right before we got married, ww was trying to talk me into playing league. I told him I was not good at pool. He said 'we need crappy women players' END QUOTE.

At the end of the session, I beat a very good sl4. Sure I had the 2 spot but it was a turning point and won 7 straight matches, and had 70% wins for my second session as a sl2.

I am not like that now. If I lose, I try to look at what I could have done differently or a shot I need to work on providing I was not in that state where I remember nothing haha. If I was playing someone better, I look at the good things they did to improve my play. Sometimes losses or near losses are mental errors and I try to look at those too. My latest one is to not underestimate an opponent who seems weaker but rather 'play the table not the player' in a sense.


Also ww has such a different brain than I, the thought of not thinking about english, just looking at the shot and where I want to cb to go, going down on the shot and letting my body/brain make the decision with no thinking, seemed foreign to him, when I talked to him about it. And I truly believe that the brain stores things and the more one shoots, the more material the brain has to store, and if that english or ball speed resulted in less than perfect results then the brain remembers. if I think about english, ball speed or anything like that, even when standing, I am more likely to miss the shot or the shape.

other than looking at the table for strategy and trying to decide what is the next right shot, and where I want the cb to end up while standing, I am playig off the right side of the brain, very much like is described in 'the inner game of tennis'

WW helped with what I call 'zen pool', just knocking in balls with good fundamentals. In the beginning, he tended to try to get me to do things above my skill also. He really is a good coach for a good player but not for a weak one.

Laura

bluewolf
04-28-2004, 10:07 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr> Bluewolf,

Your a prime example of what ones mind preceives. You say the captain was looking down on you as a 2. Maybe, you were looking up at him or her, as a captain?


Regards,

C.C.~~was a 2 once. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

<hr /></blockquote>

I know you mean well but h, no, he was a jerk and i thought that he was a crappy four and by the end of that session, I knew that I was going to beat him when I got a little better. It was just a matter of time. I was like a klingon waiting for revenge. At one time, right after I went three, I was going to challenge him dead even race to three with $50 down!!! well, ww talked me out of it and then I did play him later. But the revenge was not that sweet afterall. Glad to win but not gloating or feeling that way. He chose to play me because he thought it was an easy win and beat himself up unmercifally after his loss. He did not realize what I had done to win, just thought that he played bad.

Laura

Predator314
04-28-2004, 12:29 PM
One thing that will overcome the nerves, but is often hard to do is to get in that "zone". I'm sure a lot of people on this board know what I'm talking about. You get in a state of mind where you are just making balls and not realizing it. You can run 3 or 4 racks straight and not know it until someone tells you. I wish I knew how to make myself achieve that "zone" every time I play. I think it has a lot to do with your concentration level and state of mind when you play.

I also believe this "zone" is where the "chemical players" have an unfair advantage. I had a guy tell me one time that he could spot God the 8 when he was on cocaine. This is a guy many of you probably know and have watched play. I just grinned and walked away.

bluewolf
04-28-2004, 01:05 PM
Think of walking into the poolhall knowing you will compete and having control over your thoughts and emotions so that you walk in with confidence, concentration and relazation. Then you walk in, and think of all of the things in the hall or the tournament that can pull you out of that state, and the mental discipline required to hang onto that state until your turn at the table. To be able to step up still focuss, still concentrated and still relaxed that you will do your best, but not so relaxed that you do not 'bear down' enough to perform.

I think that some experienced pool players are so advanced that they do this naturally, it has become automatic. For people like me, I work at keeping that attitude. Ralf souquet devotes as much or more on mental aspects than practice of the sport.

I have not played pool very long but in karate, to have that focus did require hard work. And I am not talking zone, I am talking about what happens before that. I bet that even in players who are not disciplined but sort of 'fell' into that state like I did when I was a beginner, prior to league play, had those other aspects in tact on that day at that time.

Psychologists have said that it is impossible to have two competing thoughts in the mind at one time. My first thing I learned to do when I was nervous on the 8 was to say something good in my mind like 'I can trust my stroke' or whatever works, and I found that it pushed out the negative thoughts. That was my first step. then two times in a row, I played bad due to letting personal problem come into my head while playing. I was so mad at myself for being so undisciplined that I let those things scew up my game, so came up with something else to say to myelf to send that stuff away. It does not mean I am never nervous, but it has helped a bit.

Sara Rousey went to a hypnotist to learn certain words and worked on meditation.

Those like popcorn and chris played a long time to get where they are and I give 1000-1 that getting the 'mental toolbox' that they currently have took time too.

Just my .02

Keith Talent
04-28-2004, 02:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr>
Psychologists have said that it is impossible to have two competing thoughts in the mind at one time. My first thing I learned to do when I was nervous on the 8 was to say something good in my mind like 'I can trust my stroke' or whatever works, and I found that it pushed out the negative thoughts. <hr /></blockquote>

I look at this another way, sort of ... and it's a vaguely Eastern approach, if not exactly zen, because I don't know enough about zen to define it. Rather than thinking any sort of thought, I let my mind empty itself out. Though this might, er, be easier for me than for some, since that might be my normal state. If I were to say to myself, I can trust my stroke, the devil's advocate in my brain would snap back, "What makes you so %&amp;^*# sure about that?" /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I just try to get that good, loose, relaxed feeling going. Maybe I'll think about a few bars from a song -- "Prove it All Night" seems to work OK -- but not think about the words. Words can lead you anywhere, and the zone, I think, is really a silent place, where you're just reacting and thinking instinctively.

bluewolf
04-28-2004, 03:09 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Keith Talent:</font><hr>

I look at this another way, sort of ... and it's a vaguely Eastern approach, if not exactly zen, because I don't know enough about zen to define it. Rather than thinking any sort of thought, I let my mind empty itself out. Though this might, er, be easier for me than for some, since that might be my normal state. <hr /></blockquote>

What I did in the beginning was put in other thoughts. But I do think the zen or eastern meditation is superior, so am glad you mentioned it. Maybe it is normal for certain persons, but considering how good you are at the sport, I have heard this from others who have achieved a similar level.

Self hypnosis with saying certain words is beneficial, especially when one first realizes that lack of control over emotions and thoughts are killing their game. Total non-attachment and not thinking seems to me to be the ideal, it is just that some of us have to have certain steps in between to get where you may be naturally. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Laura

dg-in-centralpa
04-28-2004, 03:22 PM
Nerves - what an ugly topic. Monday our league had an end of the season tournament. If you survive the first night, you play the second night in the money rounds. In practice I couldn't miss until the last game before the match started. Then my stroke left me and I got nervous. I couldn't shake it. I won my first match and choked on a game but my opponent choked as well. My next match I had the guy beat so badly playing safe that when I had the chance to run out, I scratched. I ended up losing this match and not making it to the money. What's worse, I was expected to be in the finals. I tried to empty my mind, but nothing worked. Sometimes I will drink a shot of whiskey to help calm me down. I should have tried that this week but I didn't.
At the state 8 ball tournament last year, I held my nerves in check until I got in the money round, then fell apart. I still cashed but I could have done better. I wish I knew meditation or something similar to try before a big match.

DG - didn't play my best this year in leagues

Keith Talent
04-28-2004, 03:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr> Maybe it is normal for certain persons, but considering how good you are at the sport, I have heard this from others who have achieved a similar level.
Laura <hr /></blockquote>

Laura, Whoa! Wait a sec ... I'm not claiming to be particularly good at this, it's just something I occasionally get a peek at. Like the sense that I COULD play at a much higher level than I normally do now ... with the right amount of practice, or maybe intoxicants. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr> Total non-attachment and not thinking seems to me to be the ideal, it is just that some of us have to have certain steps in between to get where you may be naturally. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Laura <hr /></blockquote>
I do have a talent, you could say, for jumping right in, or stepping off the cliff without taking the usual intermediate steps. This might not be all good, but it's my nature. /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif I'm often told I do things without thinking, or that I can be amazingly thoughtless. /ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 06:07 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr> Bluewolf,

Your a prime example of what ones mind preceives. You say the captain was looking down on you as a 2. Maybe, you were looking up at him or her, as a captain?


Regards,

C.C.~~was a 2 once. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

<hr /></blockquote>

I know you mean well but h, no, he was a jerk and i thought that he was a crappy four and by the end of that session, I knew that I was going to beat him when I got a little better. It was just a matter of time. I was like a klingon waiting for revenge. At one time, right after I went three, I was going to challenge him dead even race to three with $50 down!!! well, ww talked me out of it and then I did play him later. But the revenge was not that sweet afterall. Glad to win but not gloating or feeling that way. He chose to play me because he thought it was an easy win and beat himself up unmercifally after his loss. He did not realize what I had done to win, just thought that he played bad.

Laura <hr /></blockquote>

Hense, the name Wolf came about. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

C.C.

Chris Cass
04-28-2004, 07:10 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Predator314:</font><hr>

I also believe this "zone" is where the "chemical players" have an unfair advantage. I had a guy tell me one time that he could spot God the 8 when he was on cocaine. This is a guy many of you probably know and have watched play. I just grinned and walked away. <hr /></blockquote>

Hi Pred,

I can tell you know many things and we think a lot alike. I do have a arguement on this though. I know it seems this way and especially in a short race or one or two sets. Story time:

I went on the road with a guy they call Rocketman. At the time we went I was like 17 I think? Rocket was really good. Not only as a shooter but a gambler too. His whole family is talented. One a state chess champion, another an artist. They were all talented unfortunally disfunctional also.

Rocket was a non-drug user at the time, alcohol included. This guy shot lights out. He'd have to spot many balls just to get a game. My hustling skills and handicaping skills where honed by him.

Anyway, after that I moved away and seen very little of him till yrs later. Rocket had been addicted to what they called "Dummy Dust or Animal tranquilizer." This made him in a constant zone, as you will. I remember playing him some $100. sets at Maries Golden Cue in Chicago. He was feeling no pain as he'd put a 7 pack on me and then go bavck into the bathroom and come out and do the same. This went on for what seemed hrs and he wouldn't miss.

I was frustrated as can be. I never got out the chair except to rack. Finally, after about 4 hrs Rocket had been messing up every rack and I soon won my $600. back, plus and broke him. He didn't know when to quit nor had any resemblance to a normal person.

I would have quit him and should have because it was like taking candy from a baby but, he fired at me under that stuff and although we are friends. It's only fair.

Another time we played at Harolds ph. It was late and in walks Rocket, looking for a game. He was offering me the 7 ball. I'll tell you. He couldn't think of giving me the 7 and win. We played a set for our usual $100. race to 7. I toasted him. He went to the bathroom again and again, I toasted him. This time he was smart and knew he didn't have a chance. Not to mention the fact I broke him winning the last 2 barrels he had.

He went back to the Bathroom atleast 4 times and at the end of the night he was digging into his cue stick with a knife. I asked him why he was doing that? He told me the CIA had planted a microphone in it. Then, he was looking along the walls for more of these bugs.

Another time he was locked up for directing traffic in the middle of a busy intersection, without a shirt on, in the middle of winter and snowing out. They locked him up for that in Rivers Edge mental hospital for that one. They took him on a Fri and when he came down on Sat. he realized he was stuck in there till a Dr. could release him on Mon. Everyone laughed over that one but as a longtime friend I felt bad for him. I spoke with him many times and he wouldn't listen to me. The trouble is, he was really a nice person. A good person but in the long run. He ruined his talent. Last I heard he got his leg amputated because he wouldn't go to the Dr. for antibiotics. This is a total waist of what I think could have been one of the legends today.

Regards,

C.C.~~in time they will lose......

bluewolf
04-29-2004, 05:20 AM
great post chris. The benefits of drugs are short lives and more often than not end up in 'jails,institutions or death'.

from the good players I have seen as 'zoners', it seems to result more from sound mental discipline with the ability that popcorn has aluded to of coming to the table and able to play their best game, with concentration, confidence and sound training and experience

laura

catscradle
04-29-2004, 06:32 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> ... Sounds like something straight outta the Monk's mouth. <hr /></blockquote>

There are some of us who might consider that NOT a good recommendation for the afore mentioned advice.

catscradle
04-29-2004, 06:39 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bluewolf:</font><hr> great post chris. The benefits of drugs are short lives and more often than not end up in 'jails,institutions or death'.

from the good players I have seen as 'zoners', it seems to result more from sound mental discipline with the ability that popcorn has aluded to of coming to the table and able to play their best game, with concentration, confidence and sound training and experience

laura <hr /></blockquote>

It could well be argued that the benefits of drugs are non-existant. There is only an illusion of benefit and that is short lived IF YOUR LUCKY. If your unlucky the illusion persists until your life is totally ruined.
JMHO.

Predator314
04-29-2004, 06:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr>
It could well be argued that the benefits of drugs are non-existant. There is only an illusion of benefit and that is short lived IF YOUR LUCKY. If your unlucky the illusion persists until your life is totally ruined.
JMHO. <hr /></blockquote>

I'm just going off what I've been told by a couple "chemical" players. I have no first hand experience here. The guy I spoke of earlier, I could only dream of shooting his speed. I've never actually sit watched these players for 8-10 hours at a time, so I don't know how well they hold up in the long run. All I know is that it can ruin their lives and really isn't worth it.

Chris Cass
04-29-2004, 06:47 AM
Please elaborate.

C.C.~~ /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Popcorn
04-29-2004, 08:43 AM
The benefit of the drugs is certainly real, it is not an illusion. If they are good players it can make them play like you don't even exist. Although it may be short lived, it could easily outlast your bankroll. I have played a lot of guys that were on something and you almost always have to pull up, it is not worth the struggle. Now on the other hand, take pot for instance. It may effect a player to the degree he does not have an honest assessment of what Is going on. He is losing every game and enjoying the experience. I have never taken a drug, not even pot, or drank, except a few beers once when I was about 20, but I have a pretty good idea what it does to people playing pool. To C. C. Was that guy Rocketman's first name Raffer, (sp?)?

Chris Cass
04-29-2004, 08:58 AM
Hi Popcorn,

First let me say in BW's post comparing me with you. I took as a compliment. She know's not what she says. Anyway, he could have used any name as most will on the road but his real first name is Richard.

Your advice is extremely sound. It isn't worth the aggravation playing some of these guys unless, you know they won't quit ya and you have the BR to stay. It's way frustrating though and takes major patience to hang. All in all your right on the money. It's bad action.

Regards,

C.C.

Popcorn
04-29-2004, 10:06 AM
The guy I was talking about was also called "Tangle eyes" he had funny eyes.

Wally_in_Cincy
04-29-2004, 10:20 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Popcorn:</font><hr> The guy I was talking about was also called "Tangle eyes" he had funny eyes. <hr /></blockquote>

In one of Keith McCready's columns in Inside Pool he talks about a guy named Tangle-eye. One of his eyes looked in a different direction than the other. Keith said he beat him so bad one time Tangle-eye ran his head thru a wall /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

probly a different guy

Popcorn
04-29-2004, 11:17 AM
I would say it was the same guy. His first name was Raffer and I won't use his last name but it started with a W. I think he was from around Louisiana.

mworkman
04-29-2004, 11:26 AM
If I'm in control of my mind, I'm tough to beat. I won a tournament last week with a strong field. I was totally relaxed, not thinking of anything but playing my best.
Then last night I finished out of the money and was totally out of it mentally.
I was in the losers bracket race to 3 (winners was 4). I actually won my match 3-2 but didnt realize it untill I got home. We continued to play and he won 4-3 in a race to 3. I wish I could be more consistant with my play. Just relax and play pool. Easy to say, but tough to do.

Nightstalker
04-29-2004, 11:33 AM
I just started league play in February and have not fully learned how to play the same way in casual games as in league. I am getting better lately though. I have a match tonight, I always try to just relax and play. We'll see how I apply that tonight. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Popcorn
04-29-2004, 12:23 PM
quote

"have not fully learned how to play the same way in casual games as in league."


It would be naive to think they are one and the same, they are not. There is going to be nerves when you play in tournaments or league play, but you have to play through it. Even though nervous, you should be sitting in the chair hoping the guy misses so you can get up and do your stuff. You don't want to be sitting there dreading having to go to the table for fear of making a fool of yourself. Nerves hopefully, will be just enough to bring out your best game. You should actually find yourself playing your best in match play and tournaments then you do in casual play. Don't feel, because you are feeling nervous before a match you are going to play bad, it can be quite the contrary.

Nightstalker
04-29-2004, 12:26 PM
I am not naive enough to believe that they are the same, I was more referring to my ability to just play the table without allowing outside influences to affect me whether that be my own nerves, etc.

tateuts
04-29-2004, 05:23 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bigbro6060:</font><hr> How do you guys handle nerves before a big match ?

cheers <hr /></blockquote>

There are nerves and there are nerves.

If you're talking about a huge adrenaline rush, heart beating, hands shaking, a full blown panic attack - these generally only last 10 or 15 minutes. So, I would say, take your time and play through it until you calm down - tell yourself "this will pass". Even better, if you can harness the adrenaline and use it, you may play better than you've ever played in your life.

If your talking about missing shots or position because of nervous jerkiness, then here's some advice. Here are some tangibles you can do - I do these and it helps me a lot.

1) Be fully warmed up. Warming up and being sharp helps you relax and play your best. Warm up until you are playing your speed and feel loose. Be selfish about warming up. Once you're warm, keep warm between matches.


2) Slow it down and smooth it out. In competition, I think most players have a tendancy to rush when they're nervous. Jumping up on shots, rushing to shoot (to get it over with), and rushing the stroke are all pretty common. To this I say "slow down and keep it smooth". Take your time, look at the table, think, and plan your move. Slow down your stroke - especially your "transition" from back stroke to forward stroke - and keep it smooth. Oh yeah, don't forget to aim.

3) Try to play your speed, not above it. If you try to do too much, you will put undue pressure on yourself, you will miss and undoubtedly hurt your performance. Remember, the goal is to win, not impress the audience. Realistically, if you can just play your speed in a big match that's what the goal should be.

4) Compete often. There is no substitute for experience, and the more frequently you compete the better you will adjust to it.


Chris

Nightstalker
04-29-2004, 10:55 PM
Nerves did not hurt me tonight. I defeated my opponent 2-0 in my league match. We are both sl3's. It only took 9 total innings for both games combined. I think I shot very well. I had to sink the 8 ball to win each game. I am going to try to build upon this and keep making strides with the mental side of my game. When I can just let the game flow I do pretty well. When I allow my thoughts to interfere it is not pretty.

Chris Cass
04-29-2004, 10:59 PM
Who said it wasn't tough to do? I've done the same thing as you before. I just wasn't thinking and it costs ya too.

MN has some stong fields too. Ya got Lee, Rory, Derick, Ty and a few others. They don't have to lose. You have to keep your head right because most of the time these tourneys are so long between races. It's easy to get tired waiting. That's when the mistakes happen like not remembering about the loser brack side race being shorter.

Regards,

C.C.

Chris Cass
04-29-2004, 11:01 PM
Hi Popcorn,

Not the same guys. The guy I'm talking about does an impression of Grady that's uncanny. LOL His eyes did travel but nothing like a defect or floating eye.

Regards,

C.C.

cheesemouse
04-30-2004, 08:32 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bigbro6060:</font><hr> How do you guys handle nerves before a big match ?

cheers <hr /></blockquote>

Big,

I'm assuming your talking about a 'first big match' of an event....

I cut myself some slack by making some assumptions about that first match.
&lt;my opponent is likely as nervious as I.
&lt;I'm not going to come out firing and in stroke
&lt;I set a small goal...I try not to be the first to make an error, in shot making or the mental game.
&lt;I pretend I'm in slow motion...this gives me time to calm myself and double check my thinking.
&lt;I try to smile..... /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Chris Cass
04-30-2004, 11:35 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote cheesemouse:</font><hr>
Big,

I'm assuming your talking about a 'first big match' of an event....

&lt;I try to smile..... /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Your busted Cheese, I think you can't stop smiling. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Regards,

C.C.~~the mouse ate the cat. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

cheesemouse
04-30-2004, 11:40 AM
CC,

You and I would have a ball playing some stick.... /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Chris Cass
04-30-2004, 11:45 AM
Cheese,

I'd be tickled to death just to spend the day with you just hanging out. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Regards,

C.C.

SPetty
04-30-2004, 11:53 AM
Howdy cheesemouse,

I think CC is going to do his best to get to the USOpen in September. You should start making your plans to get there as well!

cheesemouse
04-30-2004, 08:15 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SPetty:</font><hr> Howdy cheesemouse,

I think CC is going to do his best to get to the USOpen in September. You should start making your plans to get there as well!

<hr /></blockquote>

SPetty,

Boy, that would be fun and I would do it in a heart beat if I could. Now, if the US OPEN were in Oct I would have a better chance of getting there. My golf season would be over and I'd be free to go...dam.. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif