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View Full Version : Let's bring back the 5 X 10's!!!!!!!



05-02-2002, 05:42 PM
Howdy,

I was having some discussions with some of my friends over various subjects and how they effect the game. We had arguments over Sardo racks, soft breaks, winner break format...etc. One thing that came up was the table size itself. The standard 4 1/2 X 9 foot table size replaced the 5 X 10's in the 60's and 70's due to the fact that TV promoters wanted to see faster action. (if this is wrong, please correct me). I heard that in one Johnson City tournament (probably in '67), they used a table (a finals table?) that was 5 X 10 with 4 1/4 inch pockets!!!! Like I said, I don't know if this is correct, but it's what I heard. Any comments on bringing back 5 X 10 tables? I know it won't happen, but I just wanted to know what people would think of this.

TomBrooklyn
05-02-2002, 05:53 PM
I like the majestic look of a 5' x 10'.

05-02-2002, 06:25 PM
Yep. I used to play on two of them at the old 211 Club in Seattle. They were old Brunswicks with 4 1/2" pockets. More than anything, I played on these tables to work on my shot drills involving long shots with center cue ball.

05-02-2002, 07:34 PM
the story I read was that 5 x 10s were displaced by the proprietor, to get the game over & get the nickel. I also read that Straight Pool was displaced by 9-Ball, to keep the attention of the viewer. Ever wonder how many folks go to sleep or become inebriated & pass out while watching Major Sports... We are poised & soon the manufacturers will realize that our game, with it's $500 cases crammed full of $2000 Cues is DOWNTOWN. I don't know of any FootBall, Basketball, Soccer or Nascar fan that invests as much as a Pool Player... but the Golfers do & they made it to the top. I used to be a Professional Golfer, but today I find it boring to watch Tiger walk up the fairway & listen to the commentator sweat over a 4 footer that he's calling a 10 footer. Budweiser owes us a tournament a week with the money made from beer sales in Pool Rooms & bars... whahttya say .... cb

Doctor_D
05-02-2002, 07:36 PM
Good evening:

If you are up for a real challenge, use regular billiard balls on a 6' x 12' Snooker table for practice.

Dr. D.

Ken
05-02-2002, 08:19 PM
I don't know about bringing them back. Space is limited in poolrooms and the way they pack the 9 footers in I don't think they would go for the idea. Also bad for the date trade. There's a room 20 miles away that has about 25 7 footers and one 9 foot. The place is packed with the date crowd. How much fun would it be for the beginner lady players to try to deal with a 10 foot table? If you can keep them happy you get return business and with a good bar operation you have a very profitable situation.

Of course, I'm all in favor of owning one. I have my eye on a convertible ten footer that might be for sale soon. It just doesn't generate enough business as a billiard table to justify its space and all the serious players want to stick to the gold crowns.
Ken in CT~~anyone want to buy a nine footer?

05-02-2002, 08:19 PM
Just to be a bit of a stickler, I recently read somewhere that one of the major reasons that the 5 by 10's were outlawed was the phonomenal reach of Erving Crane.
According to this mag, Crane had such a reach advantage over Mosconi and Greenleaf, that they shortened the table, to negate his physical "advantage" of getting to balls without using the bridge.
This also concurs with the idea of using a bridge, always position old man whitey so the bridge does not come into play..
Middle table, keep it in the middle of the table, that is how to make the game look easy!!

Carson

05-02-2002, 09:08 PM
Dan McGoorty claimed that he used to watch Don Willis shoot wing shots using billiard balls on a snooker table. Wow. That must have been an amazing sight.

Troy
05-02-2002, 09:25 PM
I'm fairly sure Dr D meant regular 2.25" pool balls, not billiard balls..... /ccboard/images/icons/smile.gif

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Doctor_D:</font><hr> Good evening:

If you are up for a real challenge, use regular billiard balls on a 6' x 12' Snooker table for practice.

Dr. D.
<hr></blockquote>

Vagabond
05-02-2002, 10:53 PM
Hello Mates,
It is my understanding that years ago southern states used to have 8 foot tables and Northern states used to have 10 footers.when some visioneries were trying to promote the game and set uniform standards accross the nation, there was no agreement between the south and the north as to the size of the table .North wanted 10 footer and south wanted 8 footers.For a comprise 9 footer was created.

05-02-2002, 11:57 PM
The balls would probably jump off the tables when they hit the cushions due to height disparity. Buy some of the practice devices that narrow the pocket openings instead.

05-03-2002, 01:26 AM
I remember a few years ago when I was called to do an exhibition at the Union League Club in Manhattan. I thought it would be fun to bring Jimmy Fusco in on it and after some convincing, I got him to agree to drive in from Philly. We both arrived at the same time and when we looked around the room, all we saw were 5 by 10's. We just looked at each other and said, "Uh-oh..." It was pretty funny. Half the shots worked and half didn't. But thanks to Jimmy's nutty sense of humor, he had them falling off the chairs laughing.

I'm not sure why they got rid of them in pool rooms...space issues I imagine, but 5 X 10's are alive and well in the private clubs in New York City. You just have to know where to go to find them. The New York Athletic Club has a billiard room of about 10 tables, both pool and snooker, where the smallest table in the house is 5 by 10. the Metropolitan Club has two pool tables, both 5 by 10. They're around, just hidden from the public.

Fran

Rod
05-03-2002, 01:31 AM
I'm sure all of what you mentioned had some effect on changing the table size. One other factor is most homes do not have the room for a table that large. The main gambling table at a room I played in was a 10 footer. 10 footers sure separate the men from the boys. On the other hand the 7' tables are the great equalizer. People make shots on those hitting the rail a foot above the pocket. Even on a 9 footer a shot hit that far off wouldn't even scare the pocket. Sure bring them back, but even the pool rooms have a problem with the space they take.

Rich R.
05-03-2002, 04:32 AM
I always wondered what the war was about. Thanks Vagabond. Rich R.~~~not good at history.

cheesemouse
05-03-2002, 08:19 AM
darshan27, The harsh reality is $$$ per square foot. Years age I was involved in the Bar/Restaurant business. We started with a back room in the bar with four pool tables but once our seafood menu became popular the need for more four/six top dining tables pushed the pool tables right out the back door. It's called chasing the dollar. 5x10's is a true fantasy but send the drugs, I'll try anything once.

Troy
05-03-2002, 08:52 AM
Actually, regular pool balls (2.25") do NOT "jump" off the table when they hit the cushion.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Anonymous:</font><hr> The balls would probably jump off the tables when they hit the cushions due to height disparity. Buy some of the practice devices that narrow the pocket openings instead. <hr></blockquote>

05-03-2002, 09:49 AM
Troy, the nose of the cushions on a snooker table are lower then the middle height of a reg ball. What do you think will happen?

Rod
05-03-2002, 10:15 AM
Anon, I've played a fair amount of 9 ball on snooker tables with 2.250 balls, and they do not jump off the table.
Were are only talking about 1/16" difference from the base of the ball, compared to a 2.125 snooker ball.

JimS
05-03-2002, 11:05 AM
Speaking of owning a 10 ft table, I saw yesterday that there is a 10 ft snooker table for sale on eBay, location given as Cincy.

05-03-2002, 11:16 AM
Hey, thanks for the info. I've only been to NYC once, and only went to both Amsterdam clubs and Chelsea Billiards (I heard it closed down. Is that true?)and could not find any 5 x 10's. I'm just so used to playing on those. When I go back, I'll check on the other clubs.

05-03-2002, 03:13 PM
OK, I'll admit defeat on that issue, but I can't believe that the balls will bank "correctly"?????

#### leonard
05-06-2002, 12:13 PM
The first year that they used 41/2 x9 tables was in 1950 in the Worlds Champinship/National Championship at Chicagos Navy Pier. The second year my next door neighbor Joe Canton won the National Championship defeating Irving Crane in that match he ran 110 and out. Joe was a towering 5ft2 and Irving 6ft +. On 5x10s Joe was winning 4-3 or 3-4 but on 4 1/2 x9 Joe was nearly unbeatable in 14.1. Don Willis would say Jimmy Moore always said if he knew what Joe knew about 14.1 Mosconi would never beat him a game. I witnessed Willis make 6 wing shots in a row on a 5x10 snooker table in Canton Ohio. I never heard of 5x10s used in Johnson ####