View Full Version : red dot vs predator? red dot!

05-03-2002, 12:22 PM
when i first visited this board, the dominant thread was predator vs. red dot...tons of replys yet not a single pro-red dot reply. i have to disagree..i recently bought a red dot shaft for my aged hof-6. i noticed a tremendous differance although i did need a few games to become accustomed to it. i held a table for 5 hours with much free beer and food and played several league players including two 5's and a 6... my hof-6 is now my favorite cue. i've have a predator shaft on another cue for years but the red dot to me is superiour. yes i know Meucci hasn't a solid history of quality but in my limited experience the red dot shafts are terrific and far superior to predator. i am going to purchase a 314 shaft for the hof-6 soon anyway though, and another red dot shaft. is there any place to get a predator shaft to collar match a hof-6? i do admit that the predator shaft is better for breaking, otherwise i prefer the red dot. any opther pro-red dots out there or those with a place to get a predator break shaft?
my .02,

05-03-2002, 04:29 PM
You didn't mention how old your hof-6 was.. but I would bet that is more than 7 years old.. Right?

Cue shafts have a history of changing their playability over time.. and after 7 years they will play much stiffer than when they are brand new.

Wood ages like everything else.. and with age.. it changes.

I have been told by more than a couple of cue makers that replacing a shaft every 7 years maybe 2 years too late.

05-03-2002, 05:18 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr> is there any place to get a predator shaft to collar match a hof-6?<hr></blockquote>

Contact Ed at Hawleys Billiards in Dallas (http://www.hawleys.com)

They have Predator "blanks" that can be fitted with matching collars by a cuemaker.

Good luck,

Ken (loves his Predator. Hates Red Dots...they blur his vision)

05-03-2002, 05:29 PM
You just go ahead and use that red-dot. One less guy using a Predator is good for the rest of us Predator users. As far as I am concerned that red-dot hits like a turd. The predator technology does not lie. You can listen to Bob Meucci ramble on all day long if you want. Predator has the technology, Meucci does not.

05-03-2002, 06:20 PM
Why not wait and get a black dot so you'll have a greater variety?
Ken in CT

05-03-2002, 06:48 PM
your right, my hof-6 is over 8 years old..the original shaft is great for english but very whippy. in fact it has a problem i noticed recently..when i screw the shaft on..even very hard and hold the joint up to the light i can see that the joint isn't connecting well at all. only the brass screw is flush with the butt. no wood touching. luckily the new one fits well. i even have a shaft made by a local cue maker..a 14 mm 12" taper..very solid hit but the pin is way off center..so much so it looks very goofy.

05-03-2002, 06:50 PM
is there really a black dot shaft? if so who makes it? any good?

05-03-2002, 07:15 PM
Bob Meucci makes the black dot and he had some at VF. I believe he sold one while I was standing there. They are the "improved" laminated version of the red dot. The claim is that they will be more consistent in performance than the red dots.

I believe he said they were due to be widely available within a reasonable time period, perhaps this summer but I'm not sure as it is another portion of a conversation that I did not put into permanent memory.

The ones he had there didn't have the dot on them but he installed the dot as needed.
Ken in CT

05-04-2002, 05:27 AM
I bought a Predator partial and had my local cue maker fit the shaft and match my joint. He did a great job. The cue I put it on was a Meucci 97-27. By the way my cue came with two red dots. Guess which one I think is the best...

Jerry S.

05-04-2002, 05:33 AM
I agree with Tom on this one. I have always looked at my cue as a tool. Tools wear out. The butt has a longer life than the shaft the way I see it.

Jerry S.

05-04-2002, 05:23 PM
i personally find pool complicated enough without having to check and see if my shaft is 'right side up' (ala red dot) before each shot. The more I don't have to think about, the more concentration I have for each shot. Besides, I think the Meuccis hit like (rhymes with hit).

05-05-2002, 03:30 AM
He was talking about black dots of acid. LOL

05-05-2002, 03:34 AM
There you go. Bob (king of the bullshitters) Meucci admitting there is a better product than the red dot. IT'S CALLED A PREDATOR 314. Put one on your Meucci butt and carry on with life and be happy. /ccboard/images/icons/blush.gif)

05-05-2002, 07:43 AM
Bob's laminated black dot shaft is in no way similar to the Predator shaft. I think his machine is an excellent test for shaft deflection but I have my doubts that it is a good measure of cue ball squirt (deflection?) under real playing conditions. There might be problems with the bridge that the machine uses and I'd like to take a closer look at it.
Ken in CT

05-05-2002, 09:35 AM
Good afternoon:

I own Four (4) Red Dot Shafts, issued with the Two (2) Meucci SE12s I purchased, all of which a siting in my closet collecting dust. WHY? They are collecting dust because I am useing Predator 314s on both of my Meuccis

Dr. D.

Harold Acosta
05-05-2002, 08:25 PM
Save your money and don't purchase the Predator Shaft. You are better off if you go to a local cuemaker and have him make you a new shaft to fit your HOF and its design.

The Predator is over-rated. The red dot is too whimpy...

05-05-2002, 09:14 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Lorri:</font><hr> I personally find pool complicated enough without having to check and see if my shaft is 'right side up' (ala red dot) before each shot. <hr></blockquote>Lorri, if one doesn't want to hold the cue stick so the red dot is up, it doesn't create any disadvantage; it will only negates the potential advantage of doing so.

No wooden cue shaft bends an equal distance for a given sideways force applied around different points on its circumference. Most cue makers simply ignore this fact and don't mark it on the shaft. Meucci doesn't ignore it. They test the shaft around the entire circumference and then put a red dot at the point that the shaft bends the most for a given force. They reccomend this point be held in the up position to minimize the effect of deflection and so there is a consistant resistance to deflection on every shot. Interestingly, the laminated shafts of the Predator, rather than minimizing this variation in deflection, sometimes increase it. This may sometimes be due to the center of the pie-shaped pieces not being in the center of the shaft.

If one doesn't put the red dot up, they are no worse off than shooting with any other shaft which they don't hold in the same vertical position every time, nor even know where the most advantageous position is.

05-05-2002, 09:54 PM
I thought Bob put the dot 90 degrees from the point of most deflection so as to maximize the effect of deflection. That shows how wrong someone can be. I guess I'll go out and find the stiffest shaft I can so as to get the effect Meucci is looking for.

05-05-2002, 10:04 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: TomBrooklyn:</font><hr> Meucci doesn't ignore it. They test the shaft around the entire circumference and then put a red dot at the point that the shaft bends the most for a given force. <hr></blockquote>

tom, i'm willing to be educated here but i never heard that they "test every shaft" but rather that they put the dot on the feathers, spine or spline or whatever you want to call it.

are you sure about that???

as to predators. i suggest everyone try to get aholt of one every few years and try it for an evening. be sure to include some "magic white ball" and long power shots. then just make up your mind for yourself.


05-06-2002, 12:50 PM
Why settle for standard when you can have be customized

Will be in Vegas for BCA. Will have a matched set of Custom Made Meucci GREEN DOT shafts for sale. $200.00 each or both for $375.00. These are one of a kind. Serial numbers are 000001 &amp; 000002. Will consider trade for Predator Cue of equal value.
Shafts are the same quality as the Red Dot and were customized in my shop using a green pen to replace the red dot. Serious buyers only.
Also have a hot tub that holds 1 man and 6 ladies for sale