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shooter72283
06-03-2004, 11:19 PM
Anyone have any opinions on these cues, preferably from personal experience? I ran into a guy today who is willing to sell me one at a reasonable price, but I'd like to know just how collectable they are and how they play. I'd appreciate it if someone could tell me what they play most like out of the cues I have had a chance to play with (i.e.-weight dist., shaft flex, feel of hit):
1. Meucci (so far my favorite)
2. Southwest (drool! But out of my price range)
3. Schon
4. Lucasi (not a big fan of how the weight was distributed)
5. Viking

Cueless Joey
06-03-2004, 11:22 PM
OMG, Meucci over SW and Schon?
I don't get it. /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

shooter72283
06-03-2004, 11:34 PM
Trust me, I'd much rather play with a Southwest. I'd even slightly prefer a Schon. They are excellent cues and if you want to give me one, I'd be more than happy to accept it. I am, however, a student with a near non-existant budget, so when I mentally cross-indexed cost and playability, Meucci comes out on top in my mind. I'm very happy with my Meucci sneaky pete, it has served me very well. This guy is an old (literally, he's pushing 80) friend of mine who is one of the reasons I've become an 8 within 6 months of picking up this game. He's making a nice gesture by offering to sell his protege a really nice stick for a good price, and what I really want to know is if these are the kind of cues you play with or if they are the kind you put on the wall and look at. And if they are the kind of cue you play with on a regular basis, what among that list do they play most like?

Frank_Glenn
06-04-2004, 12:45 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> Trust me, I'd much rather play with a Southwest. I'd even slightly prefer a Schon. They are excellent cues and if you want to give me one, I'd be more than happy to accept it. I am, however, a student with a near non-existant budget, so when I mentally cross-indexed cost and playability, Meucci comes out on top in my mind. I'm very happy with my Meucci sneaky pete, it has served me very well. This guy is an old (literally, he's pushing 80) friend of mine who is one of the reasons I've become an 8 within 6 months of picking up this game. He's making a nice gesture by offering to sell his protege a really nice stick for a good price, and what I really want to know is if these are the kind of cues you play with or if they are the kind you put on the wall and look at. And if they are the kind of cue you play with on a regular basis, what among that list do they play most like? <hr /></blockquote>

His cues range from abour $500 up to more than you may want to pay. Some may be collectors items but if you can afford it on your nonexistant budget, it would be OK to play with it. How it hits is a personal thing. If you like it, go for it.

Chris Cass
06-04-2004, 12:58 AM
Becoming an 8 within 6 mths of learning the game? I don't believe that. However, I do believe that if this man took you under his wing he must like you. I doubt he'd intentionally take advantage of you. He could not know what it's worth but I'd give the company a call. I also think you should like the hit of the cue before concidering anything first. (410) 437-2386

182 11th Street
Pasadena, Maryland, 21122

www.phillippicustomcues.com (http://www.phillippicustomcues.com)

Regards,

C.C.~~a C in 6 mths? Naaa

Tommy_Davidson
06-04-2004, 01:12 AM
&gt; If this cue doesn't look like it was dropped out of a moving car,and you like it the least bit,BUY IT! Richard's cues are about as good as it gets as far as build quality,are not that common,and hit GREAT. My favorite cues of his are steel jointed,and the hit is similar to most of what are somtimes termed "East Coast" type cues. Back in the days of 14.1,the steel jointed type cues were far more popular,and there was an abundance of these type cuemakers on the East Coast. These are cuemakers such as George Balabushka,Gus and later Barry Szamboti,Tim Scruggs,Bill Stroud of Joss West,Danny Janes of Joss East,and the Phillippi cues we're talking about here. The Schons you mentioned were originally patterned after Szambotis,as far as the overall hit Bob Runde,the founder,was trying to duplicate. Many players lean towards Meucci when first starting,reasoning that they are "easier" to juice the cueball with,such as in long draw shots or using sidespin,and they may very well be,but if they happen to change later to a Schon or Pechauer for example,all of a sudden they can't do these things reliably,and incorrectly blame the cue,causing them to switch back. I went from a Meucci to a Schon,and even though my game was the same with the new cue,once I really got used to it,it shot up,and for one simple reason. Because it was much,much stiffer,I could not draw the ball as far or as easily as before,forcing me to develop my stroke back to its original point,which resulted in more balls pocketed,better touch,etc. A stiffer cue,to my anyway,may take longer to adapt to,but after you develop and refine your stroke to the point of being able to do whatever a given shot requires,you can always step back to an easier playing cue,but getting used to letting the cue do the work,then moving up stiffness wise can cause problems. There are also reliability issues with Meucci,the joint collars and ferrules break and crack with alarming regularity,due to them using cheesy materials that they buy in mass quantities,decreasing their cost per part,which adds to the companys bottom line. Their customer service should be renamed customer DISSERVICE,about as bad as it gets. Imagine sending them a cue for a simple repair such as a joint collar or ferrule replacement,or even a refinish,and having the cue lay around in their shop for 2,3,4 months because they can't find a work order for it and therefore have no idea what is to be done to it,despite the fact that you have called them 15 times and asked why this repair is taking so much longer than the 14 days you were quoted,you get the idea. Viking,Southwest,and any of the others you mentioned are much better at dealing with customers,and most feel they make a overall better product. On the other hand,if the Meucci feels better to you than anything else,by all means wear it out,but buy that Phillippi anyway,you can always just keep it. Sorry this was so long winded,but I felt like i had the answers you sought,Tommy D.

shooter72283
06-04-2004, 01:23 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Becoming an 8 within 6 mths of learning the game? I don't believe that.<hr /></blockquote>
Chris, you've read my story before. Since December, all I have done is play pool. There were weeks where I logged 50+ hours at the poolhall. It's not like I magically picked up a cue and BOOM, I can play well. I have spent more time, money, blood, sweat and tears on this game in the past six months than most players do in 5 years. And I confess, December wasn't the first time I had ever picked up a cue, but it was when I started learning to do more than just hit balls into pockets. Even before then I beat the heck out of my casual-playing friends, but now they all think I have gone completely insane. Hell, I honestly think I see more of the guys down at the poolhall than I do of my girlfriend. She is in bed sleeping even as a type this, and I will wake up before she does tomorrow and head out to the poolhall, not to come back until around 4a.m. On a serious note, let me know if you are ever in NC and we can play some one-pocket, cuz I've been getting the impression that you are an outstanding player.

On the subject of the cue, I haven't seen it yet, but he said it is an early model. I'll ask him about it tomorrow, he's at the poolhall like clockwork.
-Dayn

P.S.- Is there some sort of 12-step program for poolplayers?

PQQLK9
06-04-2004, 08:26 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> On a serious note, let me know if you are ever in NC and we can play some one-pocket, cuz I've been getting the impression that you are an outstanding player. <hr /></blockquote>
Hey shooter ,come on down to Charlotte if you want to play some One Pocket...

Chris Cass
06-04-2004, 08:48 AM
Well, I for one am impressed. I know about putting in the time. I took a 2 week vacation one yr and shot 92hrs. Not just only by myself, but only drills to boot. I'm glad I'm wrong. I hear so many people that rate their own game higher than reality dictates and some by the players they play with. Many times they're off a bit.

It's ok to have confidence in yourself and your game. As long as your honest with yourself. Many players are not. The whole key to this game and improving is knowing yourself and your abilities better than anything else. Getting the right instruction by a qualified instructor. Finding the right material to read. Watching the right players play. Understanding how valuable the basics are. To not only excelling but returning to them when needed.

Many times a shooter needs to return to basics to understand what's going on, even the pros. Ball speed, table speed, pattern play, eye pattern, pre-shot routine, mental preporation, stance, grip, stroke patterns, Rythm, most important, the final stroke and the list goes on. This has to be done by a qualified instructor before you burn in any bad habits.

I hold the "C" player in high regard. I know what they did to get there and although there better players with higher ratings. The "C" player has reached a height that a majority of player don't reach. Good Job. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Now, it's time for you to seek a qualified instructor to get you on the right path. To burn in the right stuff. I wasn't lucky enough to have the opportunities players have today. I just had the kick your a$$ degree. My suggestion would be to invest the money and the return will be ten fold later come tourney time. Everything in this game is all how your mind preceives it.

One Pocket? LOL Only played it for a yr. Straight pool, 9 ball, Banks, Rotation, One pocket, 10 ball, 8 ball, Golf, 6 pocket, Snooker, Pea Pool, Belentea (Mexican Pea pool), Kelly Pool (once), Carom (Tic Tic), Billiards (once), Polish pool and probably some I can't think of. I chose this path for two reasons. One, to always get a game. Two, I love pool in every form. I'm a Jack of all and a Ace at none. One thing I find is, it's easy when shots are concerned. You just have to put your mind in another game once in a while. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I do suggest you find a cue that hits right for you. Then keep it. My first cue was a Meucci. Shot with it for 11 yrs. Then, a McDermott for 8 yrs. Then, a South West for 13 yrs and now, a Szamboti. As you see each cue was for a very long time. Going up in stiffness and I don't believe a cue makes the player. I believe the player makes the cue.

An outstanding player? HAHAHAHA Nope, just one who loves the sport, a studier of moves, and people, with the heart of a champion. Outstanding? Naaa, a 4A here, an A there, master this and master that. It's all pigion holing. Ratings are for those who feel the need to put a number on something. I rate players, good, great, phenominal, and world beater. How's that? hahahaha BTW, I rate myself, Good.

Regards,

C.C.~~ /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

shooter72283
06-04-2004, 01:55 PM
PQQLK9,
Where in Charlotte? I will probably be making a trip up to Asheville in about a month and Charlotte is on the way. I wouldn't be opposed to stopping in Charlotte for a few hours if I knew there was promise of a good game.

Chris,
WHat is Polish pool?

Chris Cass
06-04-2004, 03:11 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr>
Chris,
WHat is Polish pool? <hr /></blockquote>

I don't know Nick. I think it's a dig on the polish people but that's what they call it out here. Anyway, I believe the BCA instructors have something they have someone train in or suggest? Anyway, instead of breaking a 9 ball rack with the cb. The racks head ball is the cb. You hit the rack with the 1 ball and carom it into a pocket to continue to shoot. If not your opponent shoots the 1 off the cb and so on till all the balls are gone.

All balls stay down and manytimes you'll see in order to make the shot it turns out to be a dead scratch. Tells you something about the geometry of the game. The tanget lines and yes, it's fun.

Regards,

C.C.~~it's a slam on polish people but everything used to be before the new name change to blondes. Go figure.

tateuts
06-04-2004, 03:26 PM
There aren't too many here in Los Angeles. The couple I played with were outstanding playing cues.

Chris

shooter72283
06-05-2004, 04:56 AM
Chris,
Just so you know, my name is Dayn, not Nick. Your description of Polish pool sounds a lot like what I've been playing a good bit of when I've got nobody to play and am tired of drills, which I call "kiss pool". Basically, you spread a 9 or 10 ball rack out and shoot the lowest ball into the cueball, not only to make the ball carom off the cueball into the pocket but also to get the correct speed in order to carom the next ball off the cueball into the pocket. As far as difficulty goes, it is the hardest game I have ever played, but works wonders for your grasp of table speed.
In response to your skepticism about my improvements, just let me say this: check the time that I created this reply. I got home from the poolhall 20 minutes before I posted this. I left for the poolhall (which is a 10 minute walk from my house. no car, long story) at noon. I ran drills for 4 hours and played (and won!) six games of 14.1 to 120. Then played some 1P with a good buddy just for fun. Then shot a few racks of 9 against the ghost on the table we call "big brown". I've started playing the ghost on the whole 9. If I don't either run out or play a safety that my buddy (who is always there and is rated a 6) can't hit (just hit, not sink), the ghost wins. I lost to the ghost by 3 games in a race to 11 (SOOOOOO CLOSE!). And as far as being realistic about one's skill level, I realize theat I have a very long way to go. I do, however, set goals for myself. I strive to make these goals just beyond what the average person tells me I can attain, making me that more willing to put in the extra effort neccessary to achieve them. At this point, I hope to (no, plan to) be a true contender at the U.S. Open within 5 years. I don't mean a guy who shows up expecting to win and gets knocked out in the first round, but a guy who shows up because he knows that he can play and ends up showing the world that he really can.
I got to play with the Phillipi all day today. WHAT A BEAUTIFUL CUE! It is weighted at 19.4 oz, but felt like nothing when I was holding it, and I'm used to playing with an 17.5oz Meucci! It is a great deal stiffer than my Meucci, but after about an hour of shooting with it, it was fairly easy to get used to. The biggest differences I noticed were that I didn't have to hit short shots nearly as hard and that long draw shots were a lot more difficult to keep straight. John told me he'd be willing to sell it to me for $200, as long as I promise him I will take care of it and never sell it. I told him it was a deal and that I'll buy it as soon as I get my state tax return. I'll post some pix of it for you guys when I get it.

Chris Cass
06-05-2004, 07:37 AM
OOps, I didn't catch it and thought it was PQQLk9, my friend Nick.

You know Dayn, I'm impressed with your determination and desire. That's two of the D's so far and the third you must have already. That's a good thing and it doesn't really matter what you do in the Open. What matters is you weren't afraid of what others think and that you get the chance to play with the best, and that my friend doesn't come along for many.

Sure, it's an open and alls you need is money but it's more to it than that. It's the confidence you put into yourself and the desire to compete with the best. Any pool player that's a real pool player has taken many embarrassing loses on the chin and keeps on going. That's what it takes to be one. Were a special breed here. The entire board might not be pro caliber players but we share a common bond. Were not afraid to put ourselves out there. We go to tourneys and give the secret knod saying, I'm a CCBer and I'm here for you. Welcome to our secret society.

Playing with world class players brings a knew meaning to the game. It's not just a goal but a test of inner strength. My friend Jonny K. told me I had to play with these players. That's what I need and couldn't get it unless I've experienced it first hand. He also told me that he thought I could make it and I know Jonny' always been straight up with me. It wasn't just a nice thing to say.

You go for your goals, one at a time and if you have the inner strength and the three D's along with luck in your life to be able to do it and I for one will have your back anytime.

Life is funny and has a lot of monkey wrenches thrown in your path. I should have been there long ago. I quit the game like 7 times now. Something has always been there to screw me up. Education, Army, Women, Work, Cancer and timing. Now, it's my time. I hope yours comes easier. Do me a favor, when your at the Open when you get there. Take a minute and stop to think. Hey, I'm racking for Keith McKready. That's a rush noone ever forgets. The best is that when Keith racks for you. My advice is, don't play the crowd, it's intimidating, the camera or your opponent. Play the table.

Regards,

C.C.~~the game is the same but I've only heard it as Polish pool. Good luck D. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

poolhuslter9
06-06-2004, 12:22 AM
If you are from the quad cities then I know the Johnny K in which you speak. If he says your up there, then you are up there. There is some good speed there.

Shooter. I am glad you are confident and I am not saying you ar enot as good as you say you are. But I will say this is one hell of a game. And it is Hard. Damm Hard. Even when you are good, you still aren't. When I lived in Iowa, There was a time when I was the best in my room. Now that I moved to chicago, I am no where near the best in my room. I have spent about 50 hours a week on table time in 6 motnhs and they is no way I could move up that fast. There was so many things to know to make consistent runouts. -What a level 8 can do.

Hey C.C, do you know Jay the banker ( I still owe him 20 bucks) and craig rice?

shooter72283
06-06-2004, 01:35 AM
Hustler,
I am well aware that I will probably never be considered a great. I am also aware of the fact that no matter how good you are, there is always someone better. Hell, right now there are easily 20 people who nobody has ever heard about who would beat the ever-living crap out of guys like Efren Reyes any given day of the week. I am not from the Quad Cities, I am from the RTP area of NC, which is a state known for breeding some outstanding poolplayers (i.e.- Johnny Archer and Earl Strickland). I am well aware of the fact that many people could not get to where I am in as little time as I have. What can I say? I'm sorry that I have a natural predisposition toward pool? There are many things one needs to know to make consistent run-outs, but if you stop and watch the greats you see one common trend. That is that they all know that the shortest distance between two points is a straight line. In other words, the easiest way to run-out means knowing the easiest way to get to the next ball.
Coincidentally (unless he moved to NC sometime in the last year) my friend John's last name is Kerrigan, but somehow I doubt it is the same guy.

poolhuslter9
06-06-2004, 03:20 AM
the comments about the quad cities and johnny where not meant for you.............................

Chris Cass
06-06-2004, 07:20 AM
Hi Poolhustler,

Jay the banker? You owe him $20.? I know he didn't win it and I know he didn't bet it and I know if he worked for you he'd end up oweing you. So, it must have been a loan. If it was a loan then, I know you have no sence.

Regards,

C.C.~~quit it Jay. this won't make you famous, try mass murder, cause you can't make it playing. /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Fred Agnir
06-06-2004, 10:08 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr>
You know Dayn, I'm impressed with your determination and desire. That's two of the D's so far and the third you must have already. <hr /></blockquote>

Dough?
Ditziness?
Dumb-luck?
Dandruff?
Dustbins?
Dodge Dart?
Dreadlocks?
Drambuie (w/potato salad)?
Dickheadedness?
Drooling?
Dogs?

Fred &lt;~~~ determined to help

poolhuslter9
06-06-2004, 10:55 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Chris Cass:</font><hr> Hi Poolhustler,

Jay the banker? You owe him $20.? I know he didn't win it and I know he didn't bet it and I know if he worked for you he'd end up oweing you. So, it must have been a loan. If it was a loan then, I know you have no sence.

LOL!!!!!
I am sorry to say he won it. We were playing all day for like 5 hours straight. And, then for the last hours he didn't miss. Made perfect safites and just shot lights out. He only ended up 20 though so not bad.I can make him wait though cause if he lost, I'ld never see it. lol

Chris Cass
06-06-2004, 01:52 PM
Poolhustler,

I got news for you my friend. He most likely didn't have any to begin with. He's never had more than 5 bucks on him ever and will look for 1 and 2 dollar games.

First time I met Jay was at Miller Time Billiards in IA. He came up to me in the pool hall part and asked if I'd play his friend for some money. I said, who? He pointed at the guy sitting at the bar. I said, him? It was my friend Jon Kucharo, lol. He said yes. I told Jay sure, tell him I'll give him the 6 out on the bar box in the bar.

He quickly went over to him and as I walked in Jonny apologized and told Jay never to start running his mouth to his friends again. LOL Jay had odviously just met Jonny and didn't know he and I have known eachother for 10 yrs. LOL

The second time was Leisure Time Billiards in IL. Jay had been banking balls on the 9 ft and I walked up and said, Hey, do you work in a bank? He said no. I said then, why do they call you Jay the banker? He said because I like to play banks. Went completly, over his head.

I then asked if he'd like to play some bank sets. Races to 5 for fifty or something. He said that's way out of my league. I'll mess around and play you some for $3.00 a set. I looked at him and said, I'll try you one. I wanted to give him a taste of his own medicine for trying to fleece me with Jonny.

I beat him 5-0 and he got upset and asked for weight. LOL I said, I'll give you 2 on 5 for $50. a game. (9ball banks) He said, well, when I get some money up I'll play some for $5. like that. I said, well, let me know. I never laugh at anyone but I had a hard time keeping that one in.

The nextime I met Jay was when I went into help Jonny, get his ph ready for the opening. Jay was there helping my run the phone cord through the cieling to the office in the front. I was too weak to run it myself and still can't stand on a ladder. Jay was nice and helped me. He took my direction and I got to know he wasn't such a bad guy but more overrating himself. He truely is harmless and I've decided not to mess with him anymore.

Next thing I went over to AZ to lurk, in which I never have for like 2 yrs. I was looking to see who was dogging my friend Mike there. Well, I got interested in the post, "Who's the best in your state?" It had to be Jay and someone posted, Jonny Kucharo, Craig Rice and him, Jay. I about died laughing. First, Jonny is a pro. Second, Craig is also my friend and you can't put Craig anywhere near Jon's speed. Third, Jay you can't even put in the same sentence. LOL It had to be Jay.

Regards,

C.C.~~never to discuss Jay again. if I were to lose .20 to Jay, I'd never admit it. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

poolhuslter9
06-06-2004, 03:36 PM
CC- that is so funny. He is harmless. Johnny is a pro. And, no craig is no where near johnny's speed. But, craig is very solid. Craig and I get along pretty well. He showed me some stuff when I was just learning and he is a very nice guy. He could have hustled me big the first time I met him and he refused to play me for money.

I have only seen Jay play on 8 fotters, cause he refuses to play on 9s when he comes to Iowa City. I did see him run 6 racks in a row though. But I must be honest here with you even though by your tone it might not be a good idaer. That wasn't jay on AZ. That was me. My notion of Jay being that good was more so of his bragging though. He saying he could beat anyone in the state except for Kucharo, even Bowman when they played. I think it is suspect, but the few times I played him on 8 footers he was solid, very solid. A little strange? Oh god yes. But like you said harmless. Craig on the other hand, when he is on, it is really tough for anyone to beat him. I have nothing but respect for him as a person and a player. I wasn't trying to dog mike. I was just asking his opinion on those players since I only know a handfull from Iowa CIty, I didn't drive much there and aside from college street billiards and the q bar, i only made it to Liasure time in Cedar Rapids a couple of times. I hope mike didn't thing I was trying to argue with him. just check my other posts.
All the best,
Jordan
PS, when I go back to iowa soon, we should play a little.