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View Full Version : Election Troubles Already Descending on Florida



Qtec
07-15-2004, 03:35 AM
Is there going to be another debacle and if so, what will the consequences be? Personally I think there will be rioting if there is any suggestion of impropriety.



July 15, 2004

By ABBY GOODNOUGH

IAMI, July 14 - Three years after Gov. Jeb Bush announced a new voting system that he called "a model for the rest of the nation," Florida is grappling with some of the same problems that threw the 2000 presidential election into chaos, as well as new ones that critics say could cause even more confusion this November.

The touch-screen voting machines intended to cure many of the ills of 2000 have raised a host of other concerns here just four months before the election. A new state rule excludes the machines from manual recounts, and the integrity of the machines was questioned after a problem was discovered in the audit process of some of them. Voting rights groups filed a lawsuit last week challenging the recount ban, and a Democratic congressman has also sued to request a printed record of every touch-screen vote.

The controversy over the new equipment is just one of Florida's challenges, which also include confirming which voters are ineligible, training poll workers on new policies and processing a flood of new registrations.

State officials announced on Saturday that they would throw out a controversial list used to remove felons from the voting rolls, acknowledging that Hispanic felons were absent from the list. Secretary of State Glenda E. Hood, appointed by Governor Bush last year, had earlier dismissed concerns from lawmakers and advocacy groups about the list of 48,000 suspected felons, which the state made public only after a judge's order.

The United States Civil Rights Commission, which issued a scathing report on the last election here in 2001, will examine problems with the list of felons in a hearing Thursday in Washington.

"The most important thing is to really show the voters that there are reasons to have confidence in these systems," said Bobbie Brinegar, president of the League of Women Voters of Miami-Dade County. "But the mantra has been 'trust us.' And that is not good enough."

Jacob DiPietre, a spokesman for Governor Bush, said the governor was "taking full responsibility" for the problem with the list, adding: "His No. 1 priority is to have a seamless election and an election where people have confidence that their vote will be counted."

The state, whose 36-day recount after the 2000 election stunned and divided the nation, is expected to be a major battleground again this year, with President Bush (the governor's brother) and Senator John Kerry, his probable Democratic opponent, fighting fiercely for its 27 electoral votes. Mr. Bush won Florida by 537 votes last time, but thousands of votes were discarded because of voter error on poorly designed ballots and other problems.

The Republican-led Legislature quickly passed an overhaul of the voting system in 2001, banning the punch-card ballots that caused so much trouble in 2000, giving counties money for new voting equipment and setting recount guidelines. It adopted two-thirds of the recommendations from a bipartisan task force that Governor Bush appointed after the 2000 election, but stayed away from some of the more contentious issues.

Most notably, lawmakers passed over recommendations to make the positions of county elections supervisors nonpartisan and to review the state's policy of permanently stripping felons of voting rights. The package that the Legislature adopted has played a role in the new turmoil. Tucked into the law was a provision keeping registration records secret. A state judge struck it down on July 2, opening the way for a close examination of the list of suspected felons to purge from the rolls.

Newspapers then reported that the list had a simple but glaring flaw: it guaranteed that no Hispanics, who tend to vote Republican here, would be purged, while thousands of blacks, who tend to vote Democratic, might be purged. Governor Bush moved quickly to drop it, but he was too late to avoid accusations from Democratic lawmakers and groups. The critics have denounced the effort to keep the list secret, the touch-screen problems and other troubles as purposeful efforts by Florida's Republican leadership to give President Bush an advantage here.

Unlike her predecessor Katherine Harris, who was co-chairwoman of President Bush's 2000 campaign in Florida even as she oversaw elections, Ms. Hood has publicly stayed away from politics. But critics say that Ms. Hood, a Republican and former Orlando mayor whom Governor Bush appointed, has sown doubt by dismissing criticism of the electoral system and by not answering questions sufficiently.

nAz
07-15-2004, 04:29 AM
I don't think they will riot but it sure as hell will give Moore ammo for another Movie/Doc if bUSH wins.

looks like this is what Kerry plans to do about it...'


Campaign 2004: Kerry sets up 'SWAT team' of lawyers to check voting

By STEWART M. POWELL AND MARK HELM
SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER WASHINGTON BUREAU

BOSTON -- Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry yesterday announced the formation of a nationwide SWAT team of election lawyers to combat the kind of voting irregularities that occurred in Florida four years ago, contributing to the disputed election of President Bush.

Kerry said his team would take "tough action" to prevent the kind of voter "intimidation and harassment" that kept about 1 million African American voters from the polls in 2000 and prevented about 57,000 black voters from casting votes in Palm Beach County, Fla.

The legal team is led by Washington, D.C., attorney Robert Bauer and backed by teams of lawyers around the nation.

Kerry outlined the election program in an interview with executives of The Hearst Corp. and representatives from the company's newspapers, including Kenneth Bunting, executive editor of the Seattle Post-Intelligencer.

Also at the meeting were representatives from Hearst's television stations and magazines from across the country.

Kerry said his lawyers would "go after" local election officials who erroneously "purge people" from the rolls of registered voters.

Kerry also expressed concern about some of the new digital voting machines fielded in some states as part of the congressionally backed, multibillion-dollar effort to modernize the election system in the aftermath of the 2000 irregularities.

Wally_in_Cincy
07-15-2004, 06:30 AM
It's OK, when Bush wins Florida again this will give the Dems something to whine about for the next four years and I can laugh at them.

Ha !

eg8r
07-15-2004, 06:54 AM
Hey Naz I agree with you about the Moore comment. I really don't think there will be rioting but surely there will be some upset people. This is a great quote from Q's article... [ QUOTE ]
"The most important thing is to really show the voters that there are reasons to have confidence in these systems," said Bobbie Brinegar, president of the League of Women Voters of Miami-Dade County. "But the mantra has been 'trust us.' And that is not good enough."
<hr /></blockquote> There is even more proof of the "trust us" without any substance in this quote... [ QUOTE ]
The touch-screen voting machines intended to cure many of the ills of 2000 have raised a host of other concerns here just four months before the election. A new state rule excludes the machines from manual recounts, and the integrity of the machines was questioned after a problem was discovered in the audit process of some of them. <hr /></blockquote> If they have nothing to hide then everything should be available for a recount.

As far as Kerry's mob squad, this is a good indication that Kerry does not trust the liberal communities to do their job. If anyone remembers, the biggest issue was with hanging chads. The only areas in which the Dems wanted to be recounted were the democratic counties and highly democratic districts. If these were the people that screwed it up last time then Kerry is showing that he does want them to have the chance to screw up again, he is sending his lawyers to help out.

eg8r

highsea
07-15-2004, 10:57 AM
Riots in Florida? Lol, I doubt it.

Kerry is so full of it. One Million black voters "intimidated and harrassed" at the polls in 2000? Right. What a load of dung.

So who appointed Kerry as the "overseer" of elections anyway? This is just another tactic to intimidate local election officers. I'm not sure if it's even legal.

Elections are governed by the Secretary of State in each state, based on the rules laid out by that state's legislature. I don't see how a giant team of partisan laywers is going to improve the process. Look for lawsuits in every close state if Kerry loses in November. Sadly, Gore has already set the precedent for this, and I'm afraid this year is going to make 2000 look like nothing. I wish the Dems would leave the election process the f*ck alone.

The only criticism of the electronic machines that I have heard so far is that some do not give a printout to the voter. I think this will be changed by election time. It is this paper printout that the voter can look at to verify that the machine counted his votes correctly, and that officials can go to in a manual recount. I have not heard of a single case where an electronic machine was not more accurate than punch ballots.

-CM

Wally_in_Cincy
07-15-2004, 11:26 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote highsea:</font><hr> Riots in Florida? Lol, I doubt it...<hr /></blockquote>

Don't be too sure about that. Remember in 2000 when the gang of thugs in Dockers, Topsiders, and button-down Oxford shirts went on a "rampage" and "intimidated" the election officials in Palm Beach County (?)

/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Kato
07-15-2004, 12:27 PM
Is it possible we are the dumbest state in the union? We can't even vote without somebody watching over our shoulders. I'm going to vote online if that's possible these days.

Kato~~~can't believe people in Florida can't operate a punch screen..........that's right, nobody can read. Forgot.

highsea
07-15-2004, 01:04 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Wally_in_Cincy:</font><hr>Remember in 2000 when the gang of thugs in Dockers, Topsiders, and button-down Oxford shirts went on a "rampage" and "intimidated" the election officials in Palm Beach County (?) /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>Lol. The Brooks Brothers Gang. They drive Suburban's with tinted windows and carry briefcases. Can't miss'em. /ccboard/images/graemlins/mad.gif

wolfdancer
07-16-2004, 02:57 PM
Lots of folks mistakenly believe that Fla cost the inventor of the internet, the last election...but I saw this on TV...it was the 5 electoral votes of W.Va. Ole George went down there and promised to reopen the coal mines...screw the environment
'course they didn't know what "environment" meant down there, but the chance to load "16 tons of #9 coal"...the normally democratic voters, marked their X's ...which I understand are legal signatures in W.Va...fer Georgie boy