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shooter72283
07-27-2004, 04:29 AM
First off, I just want to vent:
I turned 21 last Thursday. Yaaaaaaay!!! The good news is that I can now participate in the local APA league, and my car insurance rates have gone down (old speeding tickets are now over 3 years old and I am no longer an "unexperienced driver"). The bad news is, now I am free to have a beer at the poolhall whenever I want. For some this might not seem like such a big issue, but for me it is apparently a bad thing. I'm not an alcoholic or anything (although if you ask any AA member I know, an alcoholic is somebody who has more than one drink a month /ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif), but my pool game is definetly suffering. I went to Jump Shots tonight at about 11 and a kid with one of those all-graphite Cuetecs, something that to me just screams "take my money, please!", asks me if I want to shoot some. I had just come there from my home turf PH where I had been since 4pm, and had had ~7 Rolling Rocks since then ($1.25 domestics all day and my buddies were buying, so who was I to say no?). On a normal day I would have handed this kid his ass on a silver platter, but tonight I just couldn't swing it. I beat him, but I should have humilliated (sp?) him. To put it in perspective, I have been told that I should be rated around an 8, which will be lots of fun when I actually start playing APA and am started out as a 4 /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif(I foresee some potential issues over this at first, lol), and I would imagine this kid (~19y.o.) is about a 4 maybe 5. Just to let you know, I offered a spot, but he declined (his friend had been watching me and my buddy just banging balls around, and decided he would take the liberty of getting his friend in over his head).
Secondly:
I enjoy my newfound freedom to drink alcoholic beverages at my favorite hangout, but I already feel as though maybe I should not drink at all when playing pool.
Sorry to take up your time, but I just wanted to vent a bit. I guess from now on I will play my matches and then use the money I win to buy myself a cold one if I am in the mood and it is before 2am.
/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

catscradle
07-27-2004, 05:40 AM
To quote Dirty Harry:

"A man's got to know his own limitations."

PQQLK9
07-27-2004, 06:49 AM
Please drink in moderation and be responsible for the consequences of your actions, DUI's,health problems etc.
Enjoy your new priviledges

Wally_in_Cincy
07-27-2004, 07:09 AM
I think you already know the answer to your query.

Popcorn
07-27-2004, 08:55 AM
I am not sure why you wrote this post but the drinking is a bad thing as I am sure you already know. I don't drink at all and never have, but don't begrudge some else having a drink if they want, you just have to be responsible. The problem is there is a catch 22 here. As you drink your ability to be a responsible person is lessened and you are at the mercy of the alcohol. Knowing that in advance is a scary thing. I would suggest you not drink at all. I promise you your life will be better in many ways if you avoid this useless activity.

woody_968
07-27-2004, 11:23 AM
1st - If you see it becomming a problem listen to yourself now and dont drink while playing pool. I dont, so that means I rarely have the opportunity to drink /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

2nd - Apparently I must go get me a fiberglass cue, if thats all it takes to get a game /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

crawdaddio
07-27-2004, 11:27 AM
I enjoy a good, well made brew from time to time, but never (anymore) when I am playing (serious) pool. Absolutely ruins your concentration, stroke, and ability to judge the game. Trust me, I have lost some pretty important games because I thought "I'll just have a couple while I play"......never again.

Take it for what it's worth to ya. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

SPetty
07-27-2004, 12:00 PM
Or put another way - just because you can drink legally doesn't mean you have to!

Rod
07-27-2004, 12:38 PM
Right. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

1a2b3c
07-27-2004, 05:04 PM
thats what i was thinking, the second part that is.

shooter72283
07-28-2004, 01:14 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote woody_968:</font><hr>Apparently I must go get me a fiberglass cue, if thats all it takes to get a game /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif <hr /></blockquote>
LOL./ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gifAll I have to say about that is this. I know three people who own graphite cues. They all bought them because of the whole "will never warp" BS (a properly kept, well made wooden shaft will almost never warp, as if a shaft was terribly expensive to begin with), and all tend to favor trendy eurotrash kinda stuff over solid, reputable equipment. It wasn't so much the cue that said "take my money", as it was the way he held and stroked it. I don't care if they are playing with a broomstick, you can spot a well tuned stroke from a mile away just as easily as a horrible one, although I have been thrown off a few times by guys who had "checks".
I went back to the same PH tonight and that kid was there again. He said he wanted a rematch, only this time he wanted to play for $50 and also wanted a game. I guess he didn't notice that I wasn't drinking, which is something I always pay attention to when shooting with someone. Long story short, I am $200 richer and got accused of hustling, even though I was giving him the call 6-out by the last set, which is the biggest spot I have ever given (he wouldn't walk away, just kept asking for a bigger spot!).
Like I said in my original post, at the end of the night I bought myself a beer and paid for both our time, but felt much better about myself when all was said and done.

SteveEllis
07-28-2004, 05:52 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> ... Long story short, I am $200 richer and got accused of hustling, ...
<hr /></blockquote>

Well if you are a hustler it doesn't sound like you're a very good one as he won't be bringing anymore money your way. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

BTW, I agree with everybody else, can the drinking, at least while you're playing. As a former drinker (or a dry drinker, take your pick of terminology) I agree with Popcorn you'd probably be better off not drinking at all, but to each his own.

nhp
07-28-2004, 06:04 AM
[ QUOTE ]
To put it in perspective, I have been told that I should be rated around an 8, which will be lots of fun when I actually start playing APA and am started out as a 4 <hr /></blockquote>

Wow! You only started learning the game since December and you already play like an 8? Introduce me to your teacher!

Frank_Glenn
07-28-2004, 08:48 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> To put it in perspective, I have been told that I should be rated around an 8, which will be lots of fun when I actually start playing APA and am started out as a 4 <hr /></blockquote>

If you are that good, just go get on the Pro tour, don't bother with the APA. YMMV (LOL)

Pelican
07-28-2004, 10:09 PM
Well now 72283. You have been shooting less than a year and you are sure you're an 8. Sounds like my step-son, he just turned 22. If he was half as good as he thinks he is, he would be making a good living at pool instead of a poor living driving nails in 90+ degree heat. I feel, no, I'm sure, that when you get on an APA team you are going to find a lot of us old folks that shoot pool are still around. I will be 49 years older than you next November. Now, you might get me in a fast game like 9 ball, but if you would care to try a thinking game, like one hole, well, you get the idea. A bit of advice, old folks like to give advice, when some one want to give you some advice - listen, you might just learn something (unless of course you know all there is to know). /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Later, Pel

Oh, I'm an alcoholic so I can give advice on that too, but I got a feeling you just need to learn on your own /ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

shooter72283
07-29-2004, 12:02 AM
Pelican,
First off, I'd like to say that what is ranked an 8 in a small town like mine is probably comparable to a 4 or 5 in a town with a bigger playing field. I went up to Richmond a while ago and played a guy who was rated 6 who beat me rather easily with no spot. APA ratings can vary greatly from one area to the next depending on the field of players, when I play in a non-APA 9-ball tourney at the PHs in town, I'm an 8. As far as BCA-type ratings (which are a lot more solid, it seems), I'm somewhere between a B and B+ player. If you leave me with 6 or 7 balls and a clear shot, I'll be out from there 3/4 of the time. I still can't string racks of 9 consistently (I think my one-time best ever was 4 in a row), but usually run about 2 out of 5 racks. My high run in 14.1 is 62, and I average around 30. The reason I'm even at this level so quick is because all I did for about 6mo was play pool for several hours a day. And as far as old folks' advice, I got to where I am for listening to and attently watching the old folks at my PH. I don't run many balls very well, but I have become a fairly good defensive player, which is why I like one hole so much (I'm not and idiot and love a good game of chess, so that helps a bit). I never said that I was anywhere near a pro player, you put words in my mouth. And since when is ANY APA 8 anywhere near pro-level? I know that I am not great and that I don't know everything, what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that.

catscradle
07-29-2004, 04:45 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> Pelican,
First off, I'd like to say that what is ranked an 8 in a small town like mine is probably comparable to a 4 or 5 in a town with a bigger playing field. I went up to Richmond a while ago and played a guy who was rated 6 who beat me rather easily with no spot. APA ratings can vary greatly from one area to the next depending on the field of players,
<hr /></blockquote>

Actually I think the variance is more a result of poor score keeping and sandbagging.

[ QUOTE ]
when I play in a non-APA 9-ball tourney at the PHs in town, I'm an 8. As far as BCA-type ratings (which are a lot more solid, it seems), I'm somewhere between a B and B+ player. If you leave me with 6 or 7 balls and a clear shot, I'll be out from there 3/4 of the time. I still can't string racks of 9 consistently (I think my one-time best ever was 4 in a row), but usually run about 2 out of 5 racks. My high run in 14.1 is 62, and I average around 30. The reason I'm even at this level so quick is because all I did for about 6mo was play pool for several hours a day.
<hr /></blockquote>
I think with that level of skill you should be an 8 (I'm assuming 9-ball here), but there are plenty of sandbagging 6's and 7's who shoot better than that. I think a good 'B' player should reach the highest levels in APA (9 in 9-ball, 7 in 8-ball), but they don't.

[ QUOTE ]
And as far as old folks' advice, I got to where I am for listening to and attently watching the old folks at my PH. I don't run many balls very well, but I have become a fairly good defensive player, which is why I like one hole so much (I'm not and idiot and love a good game of chess, so that helps a bit). I never said that I was anywhere near a pro player, you put words in my mouth. And since when is ANY APA 8 anywhere near pro-level? I know that I am not great and that I don't know everything, what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that. <hr /></blockquote>

Well said (for a 21 year old that is /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif). I thought you were just an enthusiastic kid in your original post, but I could certainly see how it could be interpreted as some inexperienced kid talking out his a$$ and thinking he was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Also don't forget we seniors (and pelican is even more senior than me) get a little cranky sometimes. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif And we dry drinkers can get a little cranky at times too.
As far as the original topic drinkin', I found my pattern when I was younger was that though I didn't drink too often I almost always drank too much if I drank at all, therefore, I quit forever. Now you may not fit this pattern (though your original post suggest you do) and if you do you may outgrow it, but I think it bears watching. It is a subtle form of alcoholism that can easily be denied.
You've got a lot of good years ahead of you, enjoy them, but don't waste them. Seniors like Pelican and I have a lot of good years ahead too, but you've got more. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Pelican, forgive me if I've taken inappropriate freedoms presuming what you may or may not be thinking.

nhp
07-29-2004, 05:23 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> Pelican,
First off, I'd like to say that what is ranked an 8 in a small town like mine is probably comparable to a 4 or 5 in a town with a bigger playing field. I went up to Richmond a while ago and played a guy who was rated 6 who beat me rather easily with no spot. APA ratings can vary greatly from one area to the next depending on the field of players, when I play in a non-APA 9-ball tourney at the PHs in town, I'm an 8. As far as BCA-type ratings (which are a lot more solid, it seems), I'm somewhere between a B and B+ player. If you leave me with 6 or 7 balls and a clear shot, I'll be out from there 3/4 of the time. I still can't string racks of 9 consistently (I think my one-time best ever was 4 in a row), but usually run about 2 out of 5 racks. My high run in 14.1 is 62, and I average around 30. The reason I'm even at this level so quick is because all I did for about 6mo was play pool for several hours a day. And as far as old folks' advice, I got to where I am for listening to and attently watching the old folks at my PH. I don't run many balls very well, but I have become a fairly good defensive player, which is why I like one hole so much (I'm not and idiot and love a good game of chess, so that helps a bit). I never said that I was anywhere near a pro player, you put words in my mouth. And since when is ANY APA 8 anywhere near pro-level? I know that I am not great and that I don't know everything, what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that. <hr /></blockquote>

Shooter, if this is all completely true, with no exaggeration, you are going to be a champion one day. I'm 23, I've been playing for 8 years, 3 of those years playing every day ALL day (I worked at a poolhall) at least 5-10 hours per day, and I've never ran a 4-pack. I've ran a couple 3's, a decent amount of 2's, but never 4. My high run in straight-pool is 36 balls (although I rarely play it), I've ran 8 and out in 1-hole twice in my life, and I like to practice rotation. Ernesto Dominguez, Tang Hoa, and quite a few other pros have told me I have a ton of talent for the game, and it sounds like you play better than me. Being that you've been playing less than a year, well, I feel like I suck now lol. Thanks alot! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Voodoo Daddy
07-29-2004, 06:21 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> one of those all-graphite Cuetecs, something that to me just screams "take my money, please!",/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

I just wished more young guys thought this...I bought one of those cues just for that reason. Works better than live shrimp, HAHAHAHAHAHA


Voodoo~~~hasnt played in a year but wished I knew 5 guys like you...I would have NEVER quit!!

Frank_Glenn
07-29-2004, 06:33 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> My high run in 14.1 is 62, and I average around 30. <hr /></blockquote>

If you average 30 you are all ready a world beater. BTW, who did you play in Richmond? If you don't know his name, where did you play him?

Leviathan
07-29-2004, 06:41 AM
"Works better than live shrimp"--Voodoo, you're the original Good Humor man. My first smile of the day!

AS

Wally_in_Cincy
07-29-2004, 07:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nhp:</font><hr>.... Being that you've been playing less than a year, well, I feel like I suck now lol. Thanks alot! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

LOL how do you think I feel as an APA 8-ball 5 after six years /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Oy !

SpiderMan
07-29-2004, 09:26 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> First off, I'd like to say that what is ranked an 8 in a small town like mine is probably comparable to a 4 or 5 in a town with a bigger playing field. I went up to Richmond a while ago and played a guy who was rated 6 who beat me rather easily with no spot.

I think my one-time best ever was 4 in a row), but usually run about 2 out of 5 racks. My high run in 14.1 is 62, and I average around 30. <hr /></blockquote>

Shooter,

Unless these performances were on 8-foot tables with wide pockets, you should not be beaten by an honest APA 6 in ANY market. I was an APA 7 in a big market, but I've only had 3 consecutive B&amp;Rs in 9-ball on a tight 9-footer. Nine-ball is among my least favorite games, but still it sounds like you probably play a little above THIS 7.

The only thing I would question is your "average" run of 30 balls. Do even the world-class shooters average 30 balls an inning? Typically their games are one or more really big runs punctuating a series of short innings and safeties. Sometimes the loser of a game will have a very low score, and obviously a much lower average. My average in a game of 14.1 is probably about three or four, because I have a lot of zeroes from safeties. Maybe I'd do better if I played it more, but I can't ever see me AVERAGING 30 an inning.

Perhaps what you meant by a 30-ball average is that you will have a 30-ball run somewhere in most sessions?

Is 72283 your zip? If so, we're not that far apart and may get to play sometime /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

SpiderMan

SPetty
07-29-2004, 09:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> I know that I am not great and that I don't know everything, what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that. <hr /></blockquote>Settle down, shooter72283. He's just an old guy giving you some advice. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

SpiderMan
07-29-2004, 10:23 AM
Happy Birthday!

To the main point of your post, drinking ... (I responded to the pool-related stuff in another post)

My advice to you would be "don't". If you're only 21 and you already have (heavy) drinking strongly associated with a good time and socializing, quitting or even slowing down might turn out to be difficult - but if you were a friend of mine I'd want you to do it.

As you've noticed, your game suffers when you drink. I know there are people who play better on a little alcohol, but they are a rare few who can control their intake to the point of only achieving relaxation without debilitation. Don't try to self-medicate, it doesn't work for most. But, I imagine you're drinking is more for fun and socialization anyway.

I'm not a drinker and never formed the habit (I think I may have had a beer sometime last month), but I have many friends who do. One of my best friends and a former BCA teammate died several years ago of alcohol-related complications. He drank several times a week to the extent you describe for yourself, started retaining fluid and found his liver was damaged, several months later he bled to death internally after an emergency surgery to close a ripped artery where a fluid-recycling stint had been implanted. Yes, his doctors killed him by medical misadventure, but if he wasn't an alcoholic he would have never been in the hospital anyway.

One of my best friends from high school is a "functioning" alcoholic now, ie he goes to work every day and is well-respected in his technical field, but he looks five years older than me and will probably be gone long before I'm ready to lose him. I'd do anything to get him off the juice, but I don't know how.

Maybe you feel you can cut back or quit anytime - if that's the case, then I'd do it. There's a lot of ways to have fun, and you can socialize with your buddies on only one or two drinks.

If you get on a challenge table where the losers are buying drinks, start sending them to your friends in the bar. Spread it around, don't kill anyone, that's what I do.

SpiderMan

shooter72283
07-29-2004, 03:49 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SpiderMan:</font><hr>Perhaps what you meant by a 30-ball average is that you will have a 30-ball run somewhere in most sessions?<hr /></blockquote>
That is exactly what I meant. No, my zip is 27704. 7/22/83 is my birthday.
As far as the guy I got beat by in Richmond. I was traveling with a buddy and he dragged me into the hall, I don't remember the name, but will ask him tonight. I usually play on 9' Diamond Pros, and I played this guy on a 7' bar table. Also, we played 8-ball, which I rarely play. I probably could have beaten him on my home turf, but I am beginning to notice that I have a hard time adjusting in unfamiliar surroundings (I have social anxiety disorder, mix that with gambling in a strange place and the outlook is not good).
And guys, by only playing since December, I mean only bothering to learn the game. I have been banging balls around since I was about 12, but never actually bothered to learn anything about the game until this past December. I just never really considered banging around balls with my buddies to be actually playing the game, more like having the game play you.

1a2b3c
07-29-2004, 08:33 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote woody_968:</font><hr>Apparently I must go get me a fiberglass cue, if thats all it takes to get a game /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif <hr /></blockquote>
LOL./ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gifAll I have to say about that is this. I know three people who own graphite cues. They all bought them because of the whole "will never warp" BS (a properly kept, well made wooden shaft will almost never warp, as if a shaft was terribly expensive to begin with), and all tend to favor trendy eurotrash kinda stuff over solid, reputable equipment. It wasn't so much the cue that said "take my money", as it was the way he held and stroked it. I don't care if they are playing with a broomstick, you can spot a well tuned stroke from a mile away just as easily as a horrible one, although I have been thrown off a few times by guys who had "checks".
I went back to the same PH tonight and that kid was there again. He said he wanted a rematch, only this time he wanted to play for $50 and also wanted a game. I guess he didn't notice that I wasn't drinking, which is something I always pay attention to when shooting with someone. Long story short, I am $200 richer and got accused of hustling, even though I was giving him the call 6-out by the last set, which is the biggest spot I have ever given (he wouldn't walk away, just kept asking for a bigger spot!).
Like I said in my original post, at the end of the night I bought myself a beer and paid for both our time, but felt much better about myself when all was said and done. <hr /></blockquote>

never judge a player by the stroke. Good way to get taken for a ride. I hide my true stroke and i consider myself just slightly above average.

Pelican
07-29-2004, 10:34 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that. <hr /></blockquote>

I reckon I just get tired of folks that get on the computer and shoot off about how good they are when they know that nobody can call their hand and say - put up sport. Easy to say stuff when there's not a table handy. I was in a hall on Saturday, July 10th, just sitting on the rail when Scotty Townsend said he would bet his whole roll that he could beat the ghost in a race to seven. Consider this - he was around a hundred fifty miles from home and offering to bet all the money he had - that takes cajones. He got called. He won 7-3.

Young man, when you can do that, betting every penny you have on you, be that far from home, and have witnesses, you have made the scene and will have my respect. As for me, I wouldn't bet a race to 2 on myself (even if the ghost gave me a spot /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

Don't forget, get with me when you want advice on how to be an alcoholic. That was my area of expertise. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

mudshark
08-06-2004, 10:44 PM
Oh my, do you live in my area? I own one of those "take my money, please!" cues and I can assure you that I am an 8. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif so please becareful what you wish for, because you will quickly see that it isn't the stick, but rather the player who you are playing against.

Have a nice day

mudshark
08-06-2004, 10:54 PM
I must apologize, I didn't read all the posts before I made mine. I should clarify that at my PH, we are on a 10 point scale. So I would be a 5 on your scales. Sorry if I confused anyone.

Chris Cass
08-06-2004, 11:17 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SPetty:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote shooter72283:</font><hr> I know that I am not great and that I don't know everything, what I don't know is where you think you get off ragging on me like that. <hr /></blockquote>Settle down, shooter72283. He's just an old guy giving you some advice. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
<hr /></blockquote>

He's not an old guy.

Regards,

C.C.

Chris Cass
08-06-2004, 11:55 PM
Hi Pelican,

I think he didn't really mean averaging 30 ball runs. He even stated it further down the posts. So many people will tell these things like 30 ball runs or whatever without knowing how an average is calculated. They know most likely but don't corolate (sp?) it with averaging in pool. 4 innings on a game to 125. approx

They're going by what they think or concider how many balls with safe returns and they keep on shooting. It could also be by their times, when they ran 30 and is not new to them at times.

The APA thing is a tough call. It seems they do some sandbagging and are noted for it by reputation. I believe this kid means well and was only venting about his day. This is a tough call for me, being accused of my triumps as just talk or braging and worse, never happened.

It's all in the text of how one reads it I guess. I never felt I was all that but I know now someone that doesn't know me personally could think I'm blowing my horn. I do blow it. I'm just able to hear myself. I might even agree to a point. lol

He did woof a bit, but who doesn't? Just wanting to talk to another player that he thought might listen and console with. I don't think he meant any disrespect to you either. If I thought that I would jump down his throat instantly. I think he's a good kid. Not street wise, but good. Atleast he talked about the drinking thing. Many great players been known to drink and do drugs. They do it to deaden the nerves and it works well with freeing up their stroke. I don't recommend it only because, that's what it will take to get there everytime. That's just one more variable in the game. imho No more than getting mad helps some. I myself like getting a little buzzed but I don't feel the need to.


Regards,

C.C.