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JimS
05-09-2002, 10:58 AM
Any yea's or nay's? Thinking maybe I should get Richard Kranicki's book "Answers To A Pool Players Prayers" but it's kinda expensive. Do any of you have any expereince with this work?

Appreciate your feedback!

05-09-2002, 11:52 AM
I downloaded the PDF version of the book, and it makes for an interesting read. Personally, I didn't find anything ground breaking in the material.

It details how to line up your shot using facial points of reference and how to differentiate between the actual contact point vs. the apparent contact point on the CB and OB. It also details the different effects of left/right-eye dominant views as well as the view of using both eyes equally. The method explained would help bring consistency to a beginning player, but anyone at a C level or above will probably find that they are already doing these things out of pure instinct.

It would be a fair addition to any beginning player's library, but if you are already playing at a C level or above, I would save my money.

JimS
05-09-2002, 12:24 PM
I'm playing at a B level sometimes but other times I'm very inconsistent....missing balls that Grandma should make 95% of the time.

I believe, since I just got an eye exam and new glasses, and have worked very hard on my stroke and studied videos of my stroke, that the problem is in the way I'm lining up over the shot. I'm working on using Briesath's "chin lock" method of moving into the shot and am wondering if Kranicki has suggestions that might help.

Sometimes when I'm over a shot I literally can't tell where I'm aiming. Sometimes the ob gets blurry, like I'm crossing my eyes, and sometimes I get a little dizzy. I can't figure out what's happening!!! Driving me nuts to miss 45 degree cut shots with the ob 12" from the hole. I try the contact point method of aiming, the ghost ball, the angle, Hal's stuff and nothing is working.

I've tried a stance with my chin on the cue, raised slightly, raised way up. I"ve tried to aim with the cue under my chin, and I've tried twisting my neck and getting my strongly dominant right eye over the cue. I'll find something that works and the next minute I can't make a ball using that method and then switch to another. I really don't know where to turn next and sometimes I get frantic with frustration.

Thanks for your reading of his work. You provided a well thought out response...appreciate it.

05-09-2002, 12:33 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: JimS:</font><hr> Sometimes when I'm over a shot I literally can't tell where I'm aiming. Sometimes the ob gets blurry, like I'm crossing my eyes, and sometimes I get a little dizzy. I can't figure out what's happening!!! Driving me nuts to miss 45 degree cut shots with the ob 12" from the hole. <hr></blockquote>

jim,

try getting up off the c.b. and doing the mosconi stance on those cuts. something like 12"(maybe more) between the shaft and chin. i know it's stupid, out of date and that noone teaches that way.

just try it and let me know what happens.

dan...medium range cuts only.

Rod
05-09-2002, 02:53 PM
Dan, that is a good idea for an experiment. I don't know that it is out of date though. People should stand at the height where they see the shots best. I've never checked my height over the cue but I play very upright, easily 16" from my chin. Of course if I have to reach for a shot that will narrow the distance. It makes my back sore to look at the players with their chin on the cue. Jim, it should be easier to look through your glasses more upright. yes-no?

05-09-2002, 04:02 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Rod:</font><hr> It makes my back sore to look at the players with their chin on the cue. Jim, it should be easier to look through your glasses more upright. yes-no? <hr></blockquote>


in my opinion, seeing the cut angle is much easier from above but seeing and executing the cue ball is easier from down on the cue. given the many kinds of glasses and frames, i'm not sure we can say which is best without trying them out.

i learned a long time ago that i almost never miss a behind the back cut. why? i'm looking right down on the balls and the cut angle is highlighted. but then i'm also not likely to be doing anything much with the c.b.



dan

phil in sofla
05-09-2002, 06:19 PM
I disagree that the value of the book isn't there once you're past a C player stage.

I'd guess that some of the optical illusions Kranicki points out are EXACTLY the reasons that balls get missed when they are missed by intermediate to advanced players.

As to standing taller for given cut shots, in order to see the line better-- you need to know that elevating your sight line creates a false center of the ball illusion (creating the appearance that the ball is thinner than it is, with the apparent centerline higher or lower than the true equator). This can lead to cutting the ball offline, because you misjudge where the contact will be made, thinking the leading edge of the ball is higher/lower than it really is.

Rod
05-09-2002, 10:10 PM
Quote Phil, As to standing taller for given cut shots, in order to see the line better-- you need to know that elevating your sight line creates a false center of the ball illusion (creating the appearance that the ball is thinner than it is, with the apparent centerline higher or lower than the true equator). This can lead to cutting the ball offline, because you misjudge where the contact will be made, thinking the leading edge of the ball is higher/lower than it really is. "

Actually Phil I don't need to know any of that or want to even think it exists. W. Mosconi, Jimmy Moore and other greats that stood tall never had a problem. If its part of your normal game it shouldn't be a problem. Now if the reference is to somone who normally shoots much lower, I imagine it would take some getting use to. That might throw them off as much as I trying to play with my chin on the cue. Man that c/b looks big down there and the o/balls look smaller. So it's just what your use to seeing.

JimS
05-09-2002, 10:56 PM
Thanks for the suggestion Dan. I've tried shooting from a very upright position on several occasions but without remarkable success.

Tonight I spent three hours working on taking my aiming process slower. I've been consciously, and I suppose sub-consciously, trying to speed up my play because I have one friend, a better player than I, who has woofed at me about slow play to the extent that I've become kinda paranoid about it. He almost runs around the table and aims very quickly and my rhythm bothers him...maybe sharks him.

Tonight when I reverted to taking a good look at the shot from the standing position and then re-checked my aim once or twice while descending into the shot and then getting my chin on the cue and then twisting my head to the left so my right eye is over the cue, I made most of what I tried.
One of my problems is that I EXPECT!!! to make every shot I look at.

I suppose I look pretty weird...being left handed and having my right eye over the cue but that's the way it is for me. If I try to rely on aiming with the cue under my chin/nose I just cannot see the line, the ghost ball or the contact point clearly. I've tried it a thousand times and the center of the face over the cue will NOT work for me. But, as soon as I turn my head so that my right eye is directly over the cue I see the line and the ghost ball clearly. Go figure. A lot of my aiming problems have been from my trying to do it by the book (chin/nose over cue) and not accepting that for whatever physiological reason....I'm different....ummmm...abnormal.

Shooting from a low position is not a problem with my glasses. I have shooters glasses...brand new Decot Hy-Wyd's, which are dynamite glasses. Replacing my old shooters glasses did improve things significantly.

I suppose I'm being impatient. I've only been playing three years but I EXPECT to make every shot I look at and just can't understand why I'd miss anything!!

So....it's back to..."take your time Jim"...use all the aiming techniques you know on every shot to check the line and help insure accuracy and accept the hit of being a slow player. Maybe as I improve I'll play quicker. And, I ordered Kranicki's book as I think it behooves me to learn as much as I can about this vital part of the game. Maybe I'll learn somthing that will instantly make me into an A player /ccboard/images/icons/smile.gif

Thanks Dan, Phil, Rod...all youse guys.

05-10-2002, 12:48 AM
partial snip:
I suppose I look pretty weird...being left handed and having my right eye over the cue but that's the way it is for me.


I'm right handed and my left eye is stronger. Am I supposed to keep my left eye over the cue?

MikeM
05-10-2002, 05:43 AM
Eddie,

Do a search of the ccb using eye alignment and you'll find some threads on the subject. It really depends on a few factors, stance, aiming method, etc.. I am right handed and left eye dominant. It really helps me to get down low over the cue and move my head to the right to get my left eye aligned over the cue. Especially on long thin cut shots. Give it a try and see how it works for you.

MM

Alfie
05-10-2002, 06:01 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Eddie G Chgo:</font><hr> I'm right handed and my left eye is stronger. Am I supposed to keep my left eye over the cue? <hr></blockquote>
The only thing you should worry about is if the cue is actually pointing where you think it's pointing.

IMO

05-10-2002, 06:20 AM
Phil, I respectfully disagree with this assesment. If you are playing at a C level or above, you obviously know how to pocket balls at a very consistent level. Whether you have a conscious knowledge that the actual contact point is lower than the apparent contact point is of little conern since you already "know" where to hit the ball.

Most often, players at this level miss due to a slight mental or mechanical error rather than simply hitting the wrong point. I consider hitting the wrong point to be a problem for lower level players that have yet to develop their "eye".

As I had mentioned, the book is an interesting read. It illustrates the concepts that are done automatically after many years of shooting. If someone at a higher level of play wants to over-analyze what they are already doing out of instinct, so be it.

As for beginning players, this book offers valuable information that would easily help move them along to the next level of play. The key to being successful is knowing how to do the right thing, and being able to execute it consistently. This book definitely teaches a method that allows the shooter to sight the shots correctly, but execution lies in the hands of the person holding the cue.

05-10-2002, 06:25 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Ryan:</font><hr> Most often, players at this level miss due to a slight mental or mechanical error rather than simply hitting the wrong point.<hr></blockquote>

Just to clarify, my intended meaning was that the player rarely misses due to the fact that he/she aimed at the wrong point. Obviously, if the shot is missed, the ball was hit in the wrong location.

I figured that I had better catch that before someone else did.