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Wally_in_Cincy
08-16-2004, 09:06 AM
Dubya's in Cincy speaking to the VFW convention. I am listening to his speech. He is getting a really good reception. He says knowing what he knows now he still would have gone into Iraq.

and an F-16 just flew over my office /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

landshark77
08-16-2004, 09:19 AM
Yeah, he will be here tomorrow. I will be there in person to see him. Maybe I'll post my thoughts afterwards, if anyone is interested.

Wally_in_Cincy
08-16-2004, 10:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote landshark77:</font><hr> Yeah, he will be here tomorrow. <hr /></blockquote>

I think he is already between a rock and a hard place /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

landshark77
08-16-2004, 11:08 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Wally_in_Cincy:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote landshark77:</font><hr> Yeah, he will be here tomorrow. <hr /></blockquote>

I think he is already between a rock and a hard place /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Ha! You're a funny man, Charlie Brown! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Kato
08-16-2004, 06:51 PM
Is he going to hang out at the Casa de Hamiltucky Hammer and have a Bud? /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Kato

Qtec
08-16-2004, 09:09 PM
WOW.
Do me a favour Wally, if you see him, maybe you could ask about this,,,,,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3733-2004Aug15.html?nav=hcmodule
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A6462-2004Aug16.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A1315-2004Aug14.html

Appalachia Is Paying Price for White House Rule Change


By Joby Warrick
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, August 17, 2004; Page A01



Last of three articles

BECKLEY, W.Va. -- The coal industry chafes at the name -- "mountaintop removal" -- but it aptly describes the novel mining method that became popular in this part of Appalachia in the late 1980s. Miners target a green peak, scrape it bare of trees and topsoil, and then blast away layer after layer of rock until the mountaintop is gone.

In just over a decade, coal miners used the technique to flatten hundreds of peaks across a region spanning West Virginia, eastern Kentucky and Tennessee. Thousands of tons of rocky debris were dumped into valleys, permanently burying more than 700 miles of mountain streams. By 1999, concerns over the damage to waterways triggered a backlash of lawsuits and court rulings that slowed the industry's growth to a trickle.

Today, mountaintop removal is booming again, and the practice of dumping mining debris into streambeds is explicitly protected, thanks to a small wording change to federal environmental regulations. U.S. officials simply reclassified the debris from objectionable "waste" to legally acceptable "fill."

The "fill rule," as the May 2002 rule change is now known, is a case study of how the Bush administration has attempted to reshape environmental policy in the face of fierce opposition from environmentalists, citizens groups and political opponents. Rather than proposing broad changes or drafting new legislation, administration officials often have taken existing regulations and made subtle tweaks that carry large consequences.

Earlier this year, the Energy Department helped insert wording into a Senate bill to reclassify millions of gallons of "high-level" radioactive waste as "incidental," a change that would spare the government the expense of removing and treating the waste.



The Fine Print: An Agency Takes a Turn
Bush Forces a Shift In Regulatory Thrust
OSHA Made More Business-Friendly

By Amy Goldstein and Sarah Cohen
Washington Post Staff Writers
Sunday, August 15, 2004; Page A01

First of three articles

Tuberculosis had sneaked up again, reappearing with alarming frequency across the United States. The government began writing rules to protect 5 million people whose jobs put them in special danger. Hospitals and homeless shelters, prisons and drug treatment centers -- all would be required to test their employees for TB, hand out breathing masks and quarantine those with the disease. These steps, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration predicted, could prevent 25,000 infections a year and 135 deaths.

By the time President Bush moved into the White House, the tuberculosis rules, first envisioned in 1993, were nearly complete. But the new administration did nothing on the issue for the next three years.

Then, on the last day of 2003, in an action so obscure it was not mentioned in any major newspaper in the country, the administration canceled the rules. Voluntary measures, federal officials said, were effective enough to make regulation unnecessary.

The demise of the decade-old plan of defense against tuberculosis reflects the way OSHA has altered its regulatory mission to embrace a more business-friendly posture. In the past 3 1/2 years, OSHA, the branch of the Labor Department in charge of workers' well-being, has eliminated nearly five times as many pending standards as it has completed. It has not started any major new health or safety rules, setting Bush apart from the previous three presidents, including Ronald Reagan .



Administration Lags on Beryllium Standard


By Amy Goldstein
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, August 15, 2004; 12:01 AM


A strong and lightweight metal, beryllium is used to make nuclear weapons and golf clubs. It can be blended into alloys found in dental appliances and anti-lock brakes. Useful as it is, the metal also causes cancers and an often-fatal lung ailment called chronic beryllium disease.

For that reason, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration has long placed limits on the concentration of beryllium to which workers may be exposed. Research starting in the late 1970s suggests the limits are not strict enough.

Nine months after President Bush took office, Public Citizen Health Research Group and the Paper, Allied-Industrial, Chemical &amp; Energy Workers International Union petitioned OSHA to issue a tougher standard on an emergency basis. They argued that the Energy Department had in 2000 tightened the beryllium exposure limit to one-tenth the level that OSHA allows.

It took a year for OSHA's top official, John L. Henshaw, to turn down the petition. "I share your concern about the risks beryllium-exposed workers face," Henshaw wrote to Sidney Wolfe, the director of Public Citizen. But the agency should not move too quickly because of "data gaps" in how many workers are exposed and whether a screening test is effective, Henshaw wrote.

The agency still is working on a beryllium standard, OSHA officials said. Wolfe said that, since Bush took office, no one at OSHA has met with his liberal consumer lobby. Nor did the agency inform the group that it was writing an advisory bulletin for dental laboratory workers who might be exposed to beryllium.

OSHA, however, did discuss the bulletin with Brush Wellman Inc., the world's biggest producer of beryllium and the only U.S. company that mines beryllium ore. In the weeks before the bulletin was issued in April 2002, company officials submitted editing suggestions and had a teleconference with the OSHA staff.

"Brush Wellman appreciates the opportunity to participate in an ongoing and open dialogue with OSHA to improve workers understanding of beryllium-related health issues," the company's vice president for environmental health and safety, Marc E. Kolanz, wrote in one set of suggestions.

The company sought to play down the risk of exposure and reduce the number of workers advised to get checkups. Brush Wellman proposed inserting a few words to say that workers should be screened only "if they have developed symptoms" of chronic beryllium disease-rather than recommending tests for a much broader group. The company also proposed saying that people who have the disease but lack symptoms "may not progress to clinical chronic beryllium disease over time," an assertion that a senior OSHA epidemiologist said was untrue.

When the nine-page bulletin came out that spring, some of the company's suggestions were included. The most important one was a footnote casting doubt on whether screening tests were worthwhile. It was based on a single report by researchers who had been funded by Brush Wellman.

A company spokesman, Patrick Carpenter, said in a written statement that Brush Wellman had "provided suggestions on correcting inaccuracies ..... and clarifications to contribute to a more informative, complete and straightforward document."

The OSHA epidemiologist, Peter Infante, quit a shortly after the bulletin came out. An OSHA official, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said: "We tried to do a fair presentation of everything available to us."

Infante said the episode had pushed him into retirement. "You have to fight and beat your head against the wall just to maintain the scientific integrity of the document," Infante said. "The agency staffer has to show why the industry is wrong. That's what's disgusting."


This is just the 'tip of the iceberg'.
ie, According to this govt it is safe for a truck driver to drive for 11 hours straight????

There is also another story about a weed killer. I,ll post that one soon.

Q

landshark77
08-16-2004, 10:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> WOW.
Do me a favour Wally, if you see him, maybe you could ask about this,,,,,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3733-2004Aug15.html?nav=hcmodule
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A6462-2004Aug16.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A1315-2004Aug14.html

Appalachia Is Paying Price for White House Rule Change




Q <hr /></blockquote>

Hey Q, I'm gonna jump in here. Three facts and then my opinion.

1. I am a Bush supporter.
2. I live in WV.
3. I will be seeing Mr. Bush speak in WV in the PM.

I know you posted 3 articles, but I am only qualified to give my opinion on one. (I am going to assume that your reason for posting them is that you are against there concepts, as you offer no real point) The one that affects my home state. The one about Mountain Top removal. I love the mountains. You have never seen a more beautiful view than when you are in deep WV and you feel so small because the mountains are so big. And the way the rivers flow at their feet is purely priceless. WV is a poor state. Last I checked Arkansas was just below us, which made us the 2nd poorest state in the nation. (I could now be wrong about this fact, as I haven't checked in a while.) We are boardered in our Eastern Panhandle by the fastest growing county in the NATION, which is Loudon Co, VA. These people are over flowing from VA to WV because the cost of living is so much cheaper and Va is running out of room. Where are these people going to live? Have you ever seen a house on the side of the mountain? You can't do it. You essentially have to dig through the mountain to falten it out. What do you do with all of the dirt? It is used as fill dirt for other construction in the valleys. What happens? Mountians start to disappear and the valleys aren't valleys anymore. WV is becoming as flat as the midwest. Now this parctice was going on prior to Mr. Bush...long beofre him. As a matter of fact a mountain disapeared down the road from me when Clinton was in office. Where did the fill go? Interstae 81. Further more WV is known for it's coal industry. Most of our citizens are miners or come from miners. The fact is this industry is fading in WV pretty fast. I do not know the reasons why, but the unemployment rate in WV is high. It is above the national average, last I read. How are the people of WV supposed to live. Those that live in towns boardering other states travel there to work, while those who live in the center are out of luck. There is no industry, no factories, again, you can not build on the side of a mountian. You have to excavate it...use the dirt as fill dirt. Moving WV around, that is what they are doing...it is not waste..it never was. We use it. Now, do I want them to stop. Yes. I want my mountains, my view, my rivers. But at the same time I want my state to be as rich as VA and MD. I want to know that I will have a job next year without having to worry if the Govener is going to cut my budget again. I want doctors that I can go to in my state, I want a decent workers comp plan...I want alot of things, but Bush did not do this to WV and Kerry sure as hell ain't going to fix it. The only thing that will fix WV is if its educated citizens lived here and worked here, but they don't, they leave...because there isn't crap in WV, because you can't build it on a mountian...and if you don't build it, they won't come. It is that simple. Until the Washington Post lives in WV, they don't know what they are talking about. It's just some tree hugging crap.
I am sure that those who know about the other two subjects can tear them down just the same.

Wally_in_Cincy
08-17-2004, 06:30 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Kato:</font><hr> Is he going to hang out at the Casa de Hamiltucky Hammer and have a Bud? /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Kato <hr /></blockquote>

Nah, I invited him over for some 8-ball but we found out his limo can't turn the corner on "Rue de Waldo". And my backyard is not big enough for Marine One.

Wally_in_Cincy
08-17-2004, 07:01 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> Tuberculosis had sneaked up again...

By the time President Bush moved into the White House, the tuberculosis rules, first envisioned in 1993, were nearly complete. But the new administration did nothing on the issue for the next three years.

<font color="blue">Q, most of the people with TB probably have AIDS too. If you make special rules for them you be accused of being homophobic. </font color>

Administration Lags on Beryllium Standard

<font color="blue">You're really diggin' deep aren't you? </font color>

There is also another story about a weed killer. I,ll post that one soon.

<font color="blue">I'll be quivering in anticipation for your story of the "killer weed-killer" /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif </font color>
<hr /></blockquote>