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Deeman2
12-14-2004, 09:13 AM
I had the great pleasure of getting a pre-publication copy of "The Great Break Shot" by Charlie Bond. I read it in two sittings and will give my account of it's worth and content.

As I always say, I am happy with a book purchase if I learn one thing I will carry forever. I can honestly say I learned many things from this book that will have practical application in my game. I began with the assumption that there's not much that can fill a book on breaking. I was wrong. The inclusion (properly credited) of "Racking Secrets" by Joe Tucker is worth a fair book price on it's own. I, and I assume many others, have vastly underestimated the complexities in racking balls. Either that or we assume that it is too complex a subject to thoughtfully analysed. Joe takes every possible combination of rack and lets us know the risks and opportunities of each along with how to attack these situations to gain the most benefit. He really boils it down to a few simple rules to make sure, even when you know a rack is not perfect, how to maximize your opportunities for a good outcome. If you read this book and no longer make a close inspection of a rack you do so at your own peril.

Charlie included a very nice tribute to Steve Miserack at a very appropriate time in the big man's life. Also included are very nice listing of top instructers and products that can help people with their games as well as how to contact them for lessons.

I was, at first, concerned about all the diagrams showing physilogical views of the elbow, shoulder and sub-dermal drawings of the muscles that impact the stroke. However, Charlie clearly shows their association with the "shot line" and how dropping your shoulder creates problems in maintaining alignment over and through the shot. As well, he takes a great deal of time to explain the aiming process and how your brain deals with this and other aspecs of pool.

His section on rhythm or timing is very good as well as the basics on stance, grip, stepping into the shot and other of the things most of us consider basic but don't spend enough time and energy doing properly. In this part of the book, in general, there is much standard information on equipment, nomenclature, etc. I might be tempted to shrug this off this as too basic but, again, the basics are what this great game is all about and not having it would make this less of a complete book on pool as well as the break shot.

There are also credited excerpts from one of my favorite books, "Play your best Nine Ball" by Phil Capelle.

There is also much good information about Charlie's Break Rak. I am not sure if all this information comes with the Break Rak when purchased but it certainly is in the book.

The Great Break Shot also has fine illustrations of the greats of the game along with quotes from famous and not so famous people. The book also covers all games from eight ball, nine ball, one pocket, seven ball, 14.1, etc.

Charlie has taken some new information and cleverly laced it with important work of other great writers to make this subject interesting, informative and or value to the pool community. I would recommend this book to anyone who is a serious student of the game. You can tell this was written by a fellow "Pool Lover" as well as a man with discrete knowledge of the game to go along with that love.

It was my pleasure to have an early chance to read it.

Deeman

Fred Agnir
12-14-2004, 09:42 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman2:</font><hr> I had the great pleasure of getting a pre-publication copy of "The Great Break Shot" by Charlie Bond.
...
...

It was my pleasure to have an early chance to read it.

Deeman

<hr /></blockquote> I'm officially jealous.

Fred

wolfdancer
12-14-2004, 11:40 AM
Thanks for a thoughful, incisive review...I'd buy the book, based on your post.

ceebee
12-14-2004, 01:03 PM
Thanks Deeman2 for the kind words about the book.

"The GREAT Break Shot" covers the Break Shot fundamentals, has a good practice or training curriculum, lists discipline training and explains some mental aspects of the Break Shot, for most Pocket Billiard games. The games covered are 8 Ball, 9 Ball (including the initial and breakout breaks in Straight Pool... plus 5 or 6 breaks for One Pocket) and many more. The book is approximately 190 pages in length.

Adding Joe Tucker's NEW &amp; IMPROVED book, titled, "Racking Secrets", was a real addition to this book charged with lots of detail information. Having Joe Tucker as an advisor was a real plus for me too. Joe really gives the reader lots of info to use, in their future matches. Most of this info would have never been privy to most of us, had not Joe Tucker wrote his first book, titled, "Racking Secrets", which is sought after by many.

Since I believe in using the right equipment, for the right job, I had to insert some good sound information to help players choose a good Break Cue.

The GREAT Break Shot addresses pool players of all levels of play. Since the Break Shot has become so powerful, in games of tournament competition and or gambling, learning all you can about the power and or management of this shot, will be the catalyst to your capabilities.

SPetty
12-14-2004, 01:09 PM
Well, I just think it's mean of you both to talk about a book that I can't get. At the very least, tell us when and where to get the book...

(and no, I'm not a shill for ceebee...)

Sid_Vicious
12-14-2004, 01:31 PM
"YEA, WHAT SPETTY SAID! sid

Barbara
12-14-2004, 01:51 PM
So are you going to have a booth at the VF SBE and if so, is there going to be a "deal" if you buy both the break rack and the book?

Barbara

ceebee
12-14-2004, 05:09 PM
what are you talking about Spetty... you're gonna get your's. I just cannot give you a date. This the Christmas season and every printer in the U.S.A. is busier than a cranberry merchant.

Spetty, You get a free autographed copy of my book as a token appreciation for your help and all the free food &amp; beer at Petty Point Pool Hall. You are the greatest hostess.

SPetty
12-14-2004, 06:35 PM
hahaha /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

WooHoo! I'll accept it, but only if you deliver it in person!

And that idea Barbara had - BreakRak plus book - great idea!

Chopstick
12-15-2004, 07:04 AM
I also have a copy of the Great Break Shot. Charlie's experience as an engineer and golf instructor has served him well in the presentation of this work. The book begins by addressing the fundamentals of body alignment necessary to establish a foundation for a consistent break shot. It then progresses into a detailed explanation, including anatomical diagrams, of why these principals of alignment are necessary. It reminds me of Mac O'Grady's work on the golf swing.

The next portion gets into what actually happens to the balls during a break shot. Joe Tucker's work in this area is a worthy addition to Charlie's excellent presentation of cue ball behavior. I would have liked to have seen different styles, of nine ball breaks, currently in use by professionals included, i.e. the cut break, side draw breaks, etc. I think this is probably material for his second book.

All in all, it is a nice piece of work and a worthy addition to any serious players bookshelf.

Popcorn
12-15-2004, 07:49 AM
quote
"Since I believe in using the right equipment, for the right job, I had to insert some good sound information to help players choose a good Break Cue."

What is your advice on break cues?

ceebee
12-15-2004, 09:42 AM
Popcorn, I don't give advice. I tell people how I gained some success. They can take my preferences and mix them with their own personal knowledge &amp; experiences to hopefully make the right choice for them.

I have 2 Break Cues. Predator Cues gave me a Predator BK, to let players to use as a demonstrator, when trying out the BreakRAK. John Parker, of Auerbach Custom Cues, also made me a Break Cue. Both Cues have a hard laminated tip. Both Cues have a tip with a spherical surface that resembles the outside contour of a .50 cent piece. The Auerbach Cue has a short ferrule.

The Predator Cue and the Auerbach Cue both have a radial laminated shaft. These kind of shafts have a stiff spine. Both Cues have a stiffer taper to them.

Both Break Cues have a stainless collared joint, the Predator Cue has a quick release joint screw, the Auerbach Cue has a titanium Joint Screw. The Predator Cue does not have a wrap. The Auerbach Cue has Tiger Stack Wrap.

Both Cues weigh 19 ounces and the balance point is located such that youíd swear that both cues were lighter.

Both Cues are the same length.

Every person has an opinion or a preference on just about any subject. Having experienced a great amount of success with these two cues, as a 62 year old man, that has played the game for 47 years, Iím happy with these two specimens, with these specifications.

There are Pool Cue makers all across America that can make you a good Break Cue. There are several listed in my book. A hard tip wonít compress very much, so you get your moneyís worth on impact. A Flatter spherical tip will assist you in your slight miss-hits on the cue ball. A radial shaft is stiff at any rotation, that I feel is a very important feature.

I donít think Iíve seen a professional pool player break with their playing cue and Iím sure that action has to do with saving the tip on their playing cue. I feel the technology that has been incorporated into a stiff shaft, for breaking, has something to do with their reasoning as well. Remember, the Pros are using their tools to make a living, thatís about as important as a tool can be.

The tip, the ferrule, the shaft and the joint are the important features. The balance of the cue aids in the ease of use.

Barbara
12-15-2004, 10:10 AM
ceebee,

When your book gets published, pm me because I want the whole package at once.

Barbara

Deeman2
12-15-2004, 03:22 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Thanks for a thoughful, incisive review...I'd buy the book, based on your post. <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> Wolfdancer,

Thank-you for the compliment on my review. I might mention that I have no financial stake in the book or any products or services I review here. If I did, I would not make a review.

I don't think you will be disappointed in the book. By the way, I am considering introducing a new product to the market in a few months. I will send it to Fred for review as well as a couple of others. We all know Fred will tear anything apart if it's not helpful. He may be an equipment whore but he's an honest one...

Deeman</font color>

Fred Agnir
12-15-2004, 03:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman2:</font><hr>
I am considering introducing a new product to the market in a few months. I will send it to Fred for review as well as a couple of others. We all know Fred will tear anything apart if it's not helpful. He may be an equipment whore but he's an honest one...

Deeman</font color> <hr /></blockquote>Cool. As long as whatever it is matches my shooting glove... I'm in.

Fred

SPetty
12-15-2004, 03:58 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman2:</font><hr>By the way, I am considering introducing a new product to the market in a few months. I will send it to Fred for review as well as a couple of others. <hr /></blockquote>Me Me Me! /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Rich R.
12-16-2004, 04:09 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fred Agnir:</font><hr>Cool. As long as whatever it is matches my shooting glove... I'm in. <hr /></blockquote>
<font color="pink"> That would be HOT PINK!!!!!! </font color> /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif

jpeters
12-16-2004, 07:14 AM
In Volume 9 of the Billiard Sanctuary videos Tim White, 9 year old Landon Shuffett and Huter Lombardo teach a detailed analysis of how to break the balls at speeds over 30mph. The shots are slowed down and given specific names and reasons in the movements of the body to attain this speed. They also discuss and show in frame by frame slow motion the entire movement of the body incuding the arm, feet, elbow, cue stick and head. At the end of Volume #9 in the Pro Shop section, Tim uses and sells the Break Rak. He shows exactly how to hit the rak with the lessons learned from earlier in the video. The results are very powerful. I imagine that the author of this book Charlie Bond has something to do with the Break Rak also. Where can I get one of these books?

DavidMorris
12-16-2004, 07:32 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jpeters:</font><hr> In Volume 9 of the Billiard Sanctuary videos Tim White, 9 year old Landon Shuffett and Huter Lombardo teach a detailed analysis of how to break the balls at speeds over 30mph.<hr /></blockquote>
Now that I'd like to see. Over 30mph? Pro's don't even exceed 30mph, if they do it's rare and I've never seen it happen. The fastest breaks I've seen clocked were around 28-29mph -- and the vast majority of pro's "hard" breaks I've seen are in the low to mid 20's. Are you saying a 9-year old is breaking at 30mph?
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jpeters:</font><hr>I imagine that the author of this book Charlie Bond has something to do with the Break Rak also. Where can I get one of these books? <hr /></blockquote>
Charlie is CCB member ceebee (he posted above), and he's the inventor of the Break Rak. You can buy both the Break Rak and the book from his website: http://www.breakrak.com

Eric.
12-16-2004, 08:31 AM
From what I've seen of Landon, he isn't breaking anywhere near 30 MPH. He does have a nice game, though.

JPeter's tends to shill Tim White's stuff constantly. Make your own conclusions.


Eric

Deeman2
12-16-2004, 08:36 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DavidMorris:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote jpeters:</font><hr> In Volume 9 of the Billiard Sanctuary videos Tim White, 9 year old Landon Shuffett and Huter Lombardo teach a detailed analysis of how to break the balls at speeds over 30mph.<hr /></blockquote>
Now that I'd like to see. Over 30mph? Pro's don't even exceed 30mph, if they do it's rare and I've never seen it happen. <font color="blue"> While it is rare, I was with Jango in Hannover, Germany for a biliard expo in about 1994~95. He broke (just trying to hit it for speed at 31.8 MPH! [we had to convert from KPH]. If I remember correctly, Mike Massey hit it a little over 30 MPH as well. Both said they would never be able to hit a controlled break that hard. </font color> The fastest breaks I've seen clocked were around 28-29mph -- and the vast majority of pro's "hard" breaks I've seen are in the low to mid 20's. Are you saying a 9-year old is breaking at 30mph? <font color="blue"> That would seem at bit more than a nine year old could generate but who knows? Tiger was hitting 300 yard drives at about that age! </font color>
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jpeters:</font><hr>I imagine that the author of this book Charlie Bond has something to do with the Break Rak also. Where can I get one of these books? <hr /></blockquote>
Charlie is CCB member ceebee (he posted above), and he's the inventor of the Break Rak. You can buy both the Break Rak and the book from his website: http://www.breakrak.com <hr /></blockquote>

jpeters
12-16-2004, 09:31 AM
Sorry if you all think I am trying to sell the Billiard Sanctuary videos. I have no benefit in the sales. They are the only ones I watch and study so it is what is on my mind constantly. I have reviewed them over 9 times so far so you can understand the depth and direction of my thoughts. I don't think Landon was breaking as hard as Tim but he sure has one heck of a break. There is no measuring devise on the videos showing the actual speeds and I would not have any idea by watching how fast they were. I thought originally that the break speed might be around 100 mph as I relate it to tennis. Tim does talk about breaking slightly over 30 mph a few times and that is where I got the measurement from. They are definetely loud and fast...compared to mine.

Eric.
12-16-2004, 10:30 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jpeters:</font><hr> Sorry if you all think I am trying to sell the Billiard Sanctuary videos. I have no benefit in the sales. They are the only ones I watch and study so it is what is on my mind constantly.

<font color="green">If you are looking for knowledge, ther are alot of interesting videos out there. Have you considered other instrutor's? Sometimes a different viewpoint may help. </font color>

I have reviewed them over 9 times so far so you can understand the depth and direction of my thoughts.

<font color="green">Again, if that guy's material is the only material you have exposure to, and you take it as Gospel, you might be missing something. </font color>

I don't think Landon was breaking as hard as Tim but he sure has one heck of a break.

<font color="green"> I've seen Landon's break in person. For his age, he does have a very good start. While I didn't "measure" his break speed, I know from experience that he wasn't close to 30 MPH. I've never seen you video instructor's break. </font color>

There is no measuring devise on the videos showing the actual speeds and I would not have any idea by watching how fast they were. I thought originally that the break speed might be around 100 mph as I relate it to tennis. Tim does talk about breaking slightly over 30 mph a few times and that is where I got the measurement from. They are definetely loud and fast...compared to mine. <hr /></blockquote>

jpeter's, I'll be the first to apoligize for mistakenly insinuating that you are Tim White, under a fake alias, shilling your our stuff. I'll say this much, if it's ever proven that you are a fake, I would think it would kill your credibility, as well as being a bit embarassing /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif


Eric &gt;otherwise known as Eric

PQQLK9
12-16-2004, 11:02 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Eric.:</font><hr>JPeter's tends to shill Tim White's stuff constantly. Make your own conclusions <hr /></blockquote>

That is an understatement to say the least. (ad nauseam)

I will buy the book as soon as it is available.

ceebee
12-16-2004, 11:12 AM
Let me give you an idea of what 20 miles an hour is.

20 miles x 5280 (feet per mile) = 105600 feet

105600 feet divided by 60 minutes = 1760 feet per minute

1760 divided by 60 seconds = 29.3 feet per second.

The break shot distance on a Pool Table is about 54 inches. That is 4.5 feet.

I will round up 29.3 feet to 30 for easy numbers

30 feet divided by 4.5 feet would be 6.66 break shot distances for 1 second of time.

Somebody check my math.

SPetty
12-16-2004, 11:51 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ceebee:</font><hr>Somebody check my math.<hr /></blockquote>Or put another way, 15/100ths of a second to get from a stopped cue ball to the head of the rack!

Eric.
12-16-2004, 12:07 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote PQQLK9:</font><hr>
I will buy the book as soon as it is available.

<hr /></blockquote>

I'm with ya, Nick. Just having Joe Tucker's rack info included is worth it by itself.


Eric &gt;will buy a copy too

Rangercap
12-17-2004, 10:57 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ceebee:</font><hr> Let me give you an idea of what 20 miles an hour is.

20 miles x 5280 (feet per mile) = 105600 feet

105600 feet divided by 60 minutes = 1760 feet per minute

1760 divided by 60 seconds = 29.3 feet per second.

The break shot distance on a Pool Table is about 54 inches. That is 4.5 feet.

I will round up 29.3 feet to 30 for easy numbers

30 feet divided by 4.5 feet would be 6.66 break shot distances for 1 second of time.

Somebody check my math. <hr /></blockquote>

I was watching Santos Sambajon yesterday on ESPN and he had a break shot of 28 mph. How fast is 28 mph?

28 mph = 12.5 meters per second (m/s)and if the break distance is 54 inches (using ceebees numbers)

54 inches = 1.37 meters

Acceleration defined as a = (v^2 Ė vo^2) / 2s

Where v = final velocity and vo is initial velocity. We know vo is zero, since the break is from a standing ball and s = the distance traveled. ThereforeÖ

a = (12.5 m/s)^2 / (1.37 m)*2

= 156.25 / 2.74 = 57 m/sec^2

How fast is 57 m/sec^2 ???

Letís take a dragster...

A typical dragster can hit 350 mph on a 1/4 mile track

So 1/4 mile = 1320 feet = 402.3 meters

350 mph = 156.5 meters per second (m/s)

And since a dragster starts at zero also, vo = zero.

So... a = (v^2) / 2*s

= (156.5^2) / 2*402.3 = 24492.25 / 804.6 = 30.44 m/sec^2

His break was faster than a dragster!

Feel free to check my math

bb

ceebee
12-17-2004, 11:55 AM
your formula proves my numbers to be sort of wrong. I did not calculate from a dead standstill to a top velocity before impact.

Maybe the RADAR guns are calculating the same way as I. In order to reach a velocity of 20 MPH, in less than 1/15th of a second, what would that calculate if the distance was 100 feet or a minute???

somebody help out here.

A dragster is also spinning it's wheels at the start, the Cue Ball has hit the target, before the starting light's filament begins to completely dim.

SpiderMan
12-17-2004, 01:01 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ceebee:</font><hr>

Both Cues weigh 19 ounces and the balance point is located such that youíd swear that both cues were lighter.

The tip, the ferrule, the shaft and the joint are the important features. The balance of the cue aids in the ease of use.
<hr /></blockquote>

Charlie,

In your last post you made these two references to "balance" of the break cue. What balance characteristic do you feel both makes the cue feel lighter and aids in "ease of use"?

I'm assuming that when you refer to balance you mean front/rear weight distribution. Do both of these cues share a particular forward or rearward balance characteristic that differs from the typical play cue?

SpiderMan

ceebee
12-17-2004, 01:48 PM
Hello Spidey, how are you doing?

A cue specifically made to be used as a Break Cue probably has a different taper in the shaft. The joint might even be turned larger. The specs are generally proprietary info, so I won't expound on that info.

Since the joint might be larger and the taper may be turned to give a stiffer hit, the weight ratio over the length of the cue might be different than a normal play cue. The kind of wood, the tapers, the ornamentation, the kind of joint all add to or subtract from the weight in a cue. The balance point might even be a bit forward of playing cue, due to a thicker tapered shaft. I have found that playing with a well balanced cue feels good and functions well.

Some house cues offer this stiff taper and weight ratio, but generally do not have a good hard breaking tip. So that combination doesn't work well. Most house cues feel like a piece of lifeless lumber, but I have found one or two that I bought and or tried to buy.

I don't like a butt heavy cue or a front loaded one. But what I might select in a cue, might not be the same thing another player might like. Preferences abound across the board, specs run the gamut. We are all fortunate that many cuemakers, with their many ideas, somehow come up with good equipment for us all to use.