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View Full Version : Behavior of PROs -very disappointing



Vagabond
12-16-2004, 08:56 AM
Hi,
I am refering to what I had seen in the photos of recently concluded Grady`s Gulcoast classic in Gulfport,MS.Go to one pocket.org and u will find them under the section of Message board.When Buddy Hall was shooting, his opponent Marco was standing (instead of sitting in a designated seat).In another photo Lil John was shooting and his opponent ( looks like Richie Richeson)was standing.More than two years ago I expressed my concerns about this kind of behaviors.Some experts on CCB commented that it is only ball bangers who do that.I said that it was not true and I had seen that behavior with all categories of players.Anyway,it is a shame. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Vagabond

9 Ball Girl
12-16-2004, 09:05 AM
From those pictures, it looks like their seats (Marco and Richie) are in the line of the shot that their opponent is taking, IMO. I've actually stood up myself when my seat happens to be in my opponent's line of shot or if my opponent is shooting in such a way that I can't see what they're doing.

But I do agree with you, though, that I have seen the "ball banger stand up routine" from Pros.

Perk
12-16-2004, 09:07 AM
I agree that standing/pacing/walking around the table is not a good thing, but looking at these pictures, I would conclude that they are playing 1P?

If this is the case, isnt it common to be fairly close to the table in 1P, since you are commonly trading 1 shot at a time? Unless of course the guy is in a run. Safety play, and strategic moves seem to involve alot of interaction between each player. I watched Marco match up in Chicago awhile back, and he was always the same way as he was in that picture. I dont think they are interferring in any way. IMO

Maybe in the other games that would be to close to the table, but I think that they are far enough back imo in 1P.

Cheers.

SPetty
12-16-2004, 11:37 AM
from onepocket.org:

Buddy photo:
http://onepocket.org/images/BuddyandMarco-109.gif

Lil John photo:
http://onepocket.org/images/JohnMacias-097.gif

Steve Lipsky
12-16-2004, 11:42 AM
I agree that standing is a terrible no-no in a professional match. In these cases, I can't tell if it's warranted or not.

BUT... pool's much bigger problem is in the dresscode. The player standing in the second photo should not even be allowed in the building, let alone playing a professional match.

Unreal.

- Steve

Wally_in_Cincy
12-16-2004, 12:35 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Steve Lipsky:</font><hr> .. pool's much bigger problem is in the dresscode. <hr /></blockquote>

You should attend the "Dirty" City Classic some time /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

In all fairness though there some very well dressed players there

Jim Wetch
Ralf Soquet
Max Eberle
John Schmidt
Johnny Archer

to name a few

Bob_Jewett
12-16-2004, 12:39 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vagabond:</font><hr> ... his opponent ... was standing (instead of sitting in a designated seat).... <hr /></blockquote>
I think that for one pocket, this is not only acceptable, but often desireable. Both of the opponents are standing out of the line of sight of the player, and depending on where the chairs are, it could be lots of long, pointless walks to get back to them when trading rapid safeties.

Vagabond
12-17-2004, 06:35 AM
Hi,
Let us apply this in a pool room.you are playing some seious 9 ball game on the table next to these guys.The one pocket player stands between the tables.U wonder about your aiming point-whether u aim to the leather of the pocket or to this one pocket player`s A%% that is close to your table and the face.This happened all the time where ever I played pool.I always used to say one pocket and one pocket players and players who play Golf on snooker table should all be placed in an isolated corner of a pool room.
I am posting this to create awareness and start protesting against those inconsiderate of other`s exhistence on this planet pool. It is annoying.
Vagabond /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Perk
12-17-2004, 07:04 AM
There is a spectator section behind the players standing in those pictures, not tables. These players are not doing anything wrong.

&lt;--still agree that its not kewl with you about the inbetween tables though!

Vagabond
12-17-2004, 07:06 AM
In the last 12 years there has been no change in this player`s dress.Except on two occasions, I always have seen him that way.He is a road player from Muskeegan,MI and currently living in Florida.
Vagabond /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

catscradle
12-17-2004, 11:32 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Steve Lipsky:</font><hr> I agree that standing is a terrible no-no in a professional match. In these cases, I can't tell if it's warranted or not.

BUT... pool's much bigger problem is in the dresscode. The player standing in the second photo should not even be allowed in the building, let alone playing a professional match.

Unreal.

- Steve <hr /></blockquote>

Dress codes bah, humbug.
"Distrust any enterprise which requires new clothing." - Henry David Thoreau.

Stretch
12-17-2004, 11:52 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Steve Lipsky:</font><hr> I agree that standing is a terrible no-no in a professional match. In these cases, I can't tell if it's warranted or not.

BUT... pool's much bigger problem is in the dresscode. The player standing in the second photo should not even be allowed in the building, let alone playing a professional match.

Unreal.

- Steve <hr /></blockquote>

Dress codes bah, humbug.
"Distrust any enterprise which requires new clothing." - Henry David Thoreau. <hr /></blockquote>

Figures a writer would say that.....sitting at home all day getting "inspired" LOL. But i have to say from a spectators point of view well Turned Out Players are more Fun to watch. It really adds a sence of occation to the Match. Look at some of the outfits that the Woman Pro's wear. They deffinately dress to impress. St~~shows up at tournies in his Sunday best~~

Scott Lee
12-17-2004, 12:24 PM
Stretch...I sure agree with you! It adds a lot of class to see the pro players at least wearing nice clothes. Heck, 100 years ago, ALL professional matches were played in tuxedos...with most of the audience dressed the same, and the women wearing beautiful gowns! Don't have to go that far, but it does certainly spruce up the atmosphere, imo!

Scott Lee

SpiderMan
12-17-2004, 12:49 PM
Neither of the players (Buddy, Lil John) in the photos SPetty linked should be distracted by the opponents pictured. They are far removed from the line of sight, and probably further from the table than you think.

Unless the photographer was very near the table (not likely, as that would be an even worse distraction), then the shots were taken with a telephoto lens. This minimizes the apparent distance between the people in the photo. The opponents are actually even further from the shooters than they appear.

SpiderMan

Bob_Jewett
12-17-2004, 01:36 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vagabond:</font><hr>...
Let us apply this in a pool room....
<hr /></blockquote>
But the situation was in a tournament, and it appears that the standing players in question were bothering nobody -- neither the neighboring tables nor the opponent. If you are going to make a poster to support your crusade, you should find some other situation. Maybe Earl at the WC.

I will agree than in a pool room, one pocket players are often under foot because a good safety will leave them frozen to a cushion, requiring their cue to stick out five feet from the table. But in my experience, it is the beginners who are far more often pointlessly in the way than the 1P players who generally are far more experienced and have a better sense of where they shouldn't be.

Tom_In_Cincy
12-17-2004, 01:57 PM
Vagabond,

If you ever make it to Sacramento and play in a tournament at Hard Times Billiards, you will hear me announce these items.

1. turn off your cell phones, it will cost you a game if it goes off during a match
2. Non-shooting player must remain in their chair
3. Close hits; call TD for a ruling, otherwise the call will go to the shooter
4. You are only allowed one break during your match, and it must be taken when it is your turn. 5 minutes MAX. Penalty for this infraction is loss of game.
5. Jump cues are allowed until Jan 1st 2005.
6. 3 rule foul is in effect, you must warn your opponent they are on 2 fouls prior to them getting down on the shot.

Those items have been announced at the players meeting prior to each tournament for the last year or so that I have been here. All are considered a 1st warning.

The players have not complained and and are very supportive.

catscradle
12-17-2004, 01:58 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Scott Lee:</font><hr> Stretch...I sure agree with you! It adds a lot of class to see the pro players at least wearing nice clothes. Heck, 100 years ago, ALL professional matches were played in tuxedos...with most of the audience dressed the same, and the women wearing beautiful gowns! Don't have to go that far, but it does certainly spruce up the atmosphere, imo!

Scott Lee <hr /></blockquote>

But 100 years ago they dressed up for supper too or for an evening of board games at a friends house, are you prepared to go back to that?

Barbara
12-17-2004, 02:06 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr>
1. turn off your cell phones, it will cost you a game if it goes off during a match
<hr /></blockquote>

Wow Tom, you're easy!

The "Gina Kim-Lipsky Cell Phone Rule" I employ is that if it goes off while you're playing, you lose the game you're playing. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif The second time it happens, you forfeit your match. /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Barbara~~~haven't had any complaints or instances of this happening, either...

Tom_In_Cincy
12-17-2004, 02:52 PM
In the last 16 months, since I've been running the tournaments, this has only happened 3 times, two instances were hill-hill matches, one was during the first game of a match.

I still have problems with spectators, there are signs going into the tournament room, NO CELL PHONES, but it seems some of the spectators can't READ.

It's not my rule, the players voted the rule in, I just enforce it. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

nhp
12-17-2004, 05:53 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vagabond:</font><hr> Hi,
I am refering to what I had seen in the photos of recently concluded Grady`s Gulcoast classic in Gulfport,MS.Go to one pocket.org and u will find them under the section of Message board.When Buddy Hall was shooting, his opponent Marco was standing (instead of sitting in a designated seat).In another photo Lil John was shooting and his opponent ( looks like Richie Richeson)was standing.More than two years ago I expressed my concerns about this kind of behaviors.Some experts on CCB commented that it is only ball bangers who do that.I said that it was not true and I had seen that behavior with all categories of players.Anyway,it is a shame. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Vagabond <hr /></blockquote>

Often during one-pocket matches the two players don't usually sit down often. The reason why is because it is pretty common knowledge that sitting down then standing up very, very often has a tendency to throw a player's rythm off, and can get you out of stroke. In 9-ball, it's a bit different because a player can take long turns at the table. There is absoloutely nothing wrong with standing up OUT of your opponent's line of sight. Some people prefer to do this, and as long as there are no rules against this, then there is nothing wrong. You are going overboard here, overreacting.

recoveryjones
12-18-2004, 12:46 AM
I played a well known pro in a handicap tournament in Vancouver Canada. I was only a B+ at the time and he (being a Pro +) had to give me the wild 7,8 and 9.

Anyways I'm leading 2-1 (race to 9) and I fluke a nine ball and then an 8 ball off the break (back to back) for a 4-1 lead.The very next game he runs four or five balls and then hooks himself badly when playing for shape.He then turns to me (with a real angry look on his face) and loudly proclaims, "I bet your liking this!" He then pulls out his jump stick and makes a real sloppy hit, which I thought was a foul. I grab the cue ball(ball in hand) and he calls foul.Apparently he had made(witnesses say) a good hit, however, I was rattled from his unexpected earlier comments and that's why I probably missed it being a good hit.He proceeds to run out and eventually takes the match.

I was sharked, really shocked and surprised at his poor sportsmanship. I thought as a pro (been on TV) that he should have carried himself much better. I lost a lot respect for him that day.

The pool hall janitor told me what to do next time something like that happens.He said if someones says, "I bet your liking this!" (in a mean way) that your to say back to him, "Ya it feels great." or something to that effect.Maybe the janitors methods of handling things are better than mine, because I was rattled after that.

I don't know if two wrongs make a right, however, I do know I was sharked that day.I expected a lot more class out of a pro. RJ

rukiddingme
12-18-2004, 04:01 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vagabond:</font><hr> Hi,
I am refering to what I had seen in the photos of recently concluded Grady`s Gulcoast classic in Gulfport,MS.Go to one pocket.org and u will find them under the section of Message board.When Buddy Hall was shooting, his opponent Marco was standing (instead of sitting in a designated seat).In another photo Lil John was shooting and his opponent ( looks like Richie Richeson)was standing.More than two years ago I expressed my concerns about this kind of behaviors.Some experts on CCB commented that it is only ball bangers who do that.I said that it was not true and I had seen that behavior with all categories of players.Anyway,it is a shame. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Vagabond [/quote

FYI...Marco is a real stand up guy (no pun intended)
and I have never seen him behave unprofessionally.
ruk