PDA

View Full Version : Put Strickland in the Hall of Fame already!!!!



recoveryjones
12-30-2004, 11:35 PM
Earl Strickland has once again been nominated (for the Hall of Fame) in the greatest player catergory along with Robin Bell- Dodson and Sang Lee.

If Earl doesn't get in, the whole Hall of Fame is a big joke as far as I'm concerned. SIX WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS and FIVE US OPENS !!!! That's ELEVEN MAJOR TITLES, not to mention 100's of other tourney wins.

That's like a tennis player winning 6 Wimbeldon's and 5 US Opens or like a golfer winning 6 British Opens and 5 US Opens. It's a freakin' joke. In any other sport Earl would have been in on the very first(no offense Ewa Laurance) ballot. Hell Tiger Woods has only won 8 majors and if he retired tommorow he'd get into golfs Hall of Fame.


Sure enough Earl has horrified many(including me) with his antics. But were Ty Cobb in baseball or John McInroe in tennis nice people....I think not. Is Barry Bonds going to be kept out of the Hall of Fame?....I think not. They are getting in for their outstanding play on the baseball field and tennis court. What Earl has accomplished on the pool table MUST not be ignored.

Love him or hate him, Earl deserves in the Hall of Fame.If the powers that be vote for anyone other than Earl (and Strickland doesn't get in on this ballot for political reasons)they might as well call it the "The Hall of Shame." RJ

Fleece3
12-31-2004, 01:24 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr> Earl Strickland has once again been nominated (for the Hall of Fame) in the greatest player catergory along with Robin Bell- Dodson and Sang Lee.

If Earl doesn't get in, the whole Hall of Fame is a big joke as far as I'm concerned. SIX WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS and FIVE US OPENS !!!! That's ELEVEN MAJOR TITLES, not to mention 100's of other tourney wins.

That's like a tennis player winning 6 Wimbeldon's and 5 US Opens or like a golfer winning 6 British Opens and 5 US Opens. It's a freakin' joke. In any other sport Earl would have been in on the very first(no offense Ewa Laurance) ballot. Hell Tiger Woods has only won 8 majors and if he retired tommorow he'd get into golfs Hall of Fame.


Sure enough Earl has horrified many(including me) with his antics. But were Ty Cobb in baseball or John McInroe in tennis nice people....I think not. Is Barry Bonds going to be kept out of the Hall of Fame?....I think not. They are getting in for their outstanding play on the baseball field and tennis court. What Earl has accomplished on the pool table MUST not be ignored.

Love him or hate him, Earl deserves in the Hall of Fame.If the powers that be vote for anyone other than Earl (and Strickland doesn't get in on this ballot for political reasons)they might as well call it the "The Hall of Shame." RJ <hr /></blockquote>

I could not have said it any better, or agreed any more. So I will simly say......

AMEN!!!!!

PQQLK9
12-31-2004, 02:07 AM
ditto! /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

pooltchr
12-31-2004, 06:46 AM
As a general rule, I think HOF is reserved for those who have passed their prime in their game, or completely retired. I'm not so sure that Earl doesn't have a couple of big bullets left to fire.
It's going to happen, no doubt..it's just a matter of timing.
Same holds true for Allison.
Steve

Rich R.
12-31-2004, 07:05 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr> Sure enough Earl has horrified many(including me) with his antics. But were Ty Cobb in baseball or John McInroe in tennis nice people....I think not. Is Barry Bonds going to be kept out of the Hall of Fame?....I think not. They are getting in for their outstanding play on the baseball field and tennis court. What Earl has accomplished on the pool table MUST not be ignored. <hr /></blockquote>
You are forgetting the case of Pete Rose. He is being kept out of the baseball HOF for reasons that have nothing to do with his play. As of now, Earl is in the same situation.

I do not necessarily like both of these men, but I firmly believe they belong in their perspective HOF, based solely on their playing abilities.
Unfortunately, I don't get a vote, in either situation. /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

randyg
12-31-2004, 07:11 AM
Along with what POOLTCHR said: I understand that Earl pulled his own name out of the balloting the first time around. One must always have all the facts before one can make a intelligent decision......randyg

jjinfla
12-31-2004, 07:28 AM
I sure would like Earl to win but Sang Lee deserves it too. Robin is great also but not as great as the other two. In my opinion.

Since many people believe that the HOF award should be awarded to people in the twilight of their career they may decide to vote for Sang Lee. But since it is only one vote, Robin Bell Dotson may win if the vote between Earl and Sang Lee is close.

If 1000 people vote and 600 of them believe that either Earl or Sang Lee should get it and they split giving 300 to Earl and 300 to Sang Lee then Robin wins with 400 votes. That is why I would like to see a voting process where you rate each nominee, 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Then all the 1st place votes get 3 points, 2nd gets 2 points and 3rd gets 3 points. The one with the most points wins.

Anyway, I predict Robin to win and be elected to the HOF.
Any bets?

Jake

DavidMorris
12-31-2004, 08:51 AM
I'm thinking I read an interview with Earl, might've been in BD this past year, saying he doesn't believe that active players should make it into the HOF. I wonder if he'll continue to withdraw his nomination...

I definitely believe Earl is worthy of HOF, no doubt. However I question the comparison with Pete Rose. Rose was a definitely a fine player, and was a childhood hero of mine. His talent was certainly HOF material, but his actions were illegal and dishonest and a black eye to the sport. Much like today's steroid abuse problems that will likely prevent Bonds from making the HOF. Rose lied for decades, swearing up and down he didn't do what he did, until a few years ago when he came clean only because he wants into the HOF. If he'd admitted what he did back when it happened, he might've looked at a suspension and big fine, but it probably wouldn't have blacklisted him.

Earl may act childish and impetuous and be a big jerk sometimes, but AFAIK he's not done anything close to shaming the sport. Besides, his recent admission to seeing a doctor and taking medication leads me to believe he's suffering from some condition that he's had a tough time controlling on his own. The fact that he's seeking help and his behavior of late (that I've witnessed) has been much better leaves me no concerns about his getting into the HOF, assuming he wants to at this stage of his game.

JohnnyP
12-31-2004, 08:52 AM
I keep looking for Robin's name on the ladies tour, but it's never there. When did she stop playing?

Wally_in_Cincy
12-31-2004, 09:12 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JohnnyP:</font><hr> I keep looking for Robin's name on the ladies tour, but it's never there. When did she stop playing? <hr /></blockquote>

She retired around the early part of 2003. She spends her time now selling the Frog jump cues.

Harold Acosta
12-31-2004, 09:39 AM
This is a "paper-created" Hall of Fame. It actually does not exist. No physical location. I just hope that if the BCA finally decides to create the "Real Thing", they will have all their "paperwork" in order and induct all those whom they have selected.

In my opinion, the HOF should be for people already retired, or no longer living.

Sang Lee most probably be selected this time. Earl will have to wait. Robin would probably make it.

Here's some info about Sang Lee:

Remembering Sang Chun Lee

by Ira Lee

Besides just titles, Sang Lee's obituary should mention that Sang Lee single-handedly is responsible for the 3-cushion resurgence in the US in the last decade - a game that was nearly extinct before his arrival in the states.

Sang Lee's dream when he immigrated to the US was "to make 3-cushion billiards beautiful in America". He is responsible for planting the seeds of 3-cushion as a clean gentleman's sport in the US. Many 3-cushion players in the US today have been affected by his inspiring play and impeccable behavior at the table. His philosophy for top play was different than others. He advocated to his students the use of feel and an accompanying mindset of honest introspection (as opposed to "hating-your-opponent") in the continuous striving to advance oneself. He encouraged the notion of treasuring one's moments at the table and never giving up. Many of his disciples are recognized as role models of sportsmanship on the table and known for their graciousness off the table.

While here, he inspired so many people to begin playing 3-cushion billiards in the US. Most pool players that never previously had any exposure to 3-cushion billiards knew they were witnessing something special if they had to opportunity to see Sang Lee play his game. Many of them converted cue disciplines after watching Sang Lee's game.

At the top of his game Sang Lee was one of the best ever. He was arguably the most talented instinct player to ever hold a cue. There was something magical about the way Sang Lee played 3-cushion billiards. In competition, few people had his strong heart - somehow he had the capability to dig down deep and play his best when it mattered the most. No other player in history had his stroke or delicate touch.

His depth of knowledge was went beyond the limitations of billiard systems commonly employed to decipher 3-cushion. Sang Lee possessed a perfect photographic memory which empowered him to recognize subtle nuances between similar looking shots that demanded new solutions. Expert players would regularly puzzle over his unique approach - up until they watched his ingenious solution to an intricate problem unfold before them.

He has an unbeaten (unofficial) record of scoring 50 points in only 4 innings (19, 11, 9, 11 and out against one of his room customers) during a house tournament in NYC. He also broke Willie Hoppe's record of consecutive US National wins without a single loss during his 12 year US Championship reign.

His generosity towards the game was unparalleled. Every year, Sang Lee sponsored showcase spectacular "international invitational" tournaments where he donated tens of thousands of dollars annually to invite the best players of the world to compete in his events. Many of these events have been documented on video tape by Accu-Stats and CaromTV. His tradition of showcase events continues even after his passing. A $100,000 memorial tournament in his name is scheduled to be held Aug 1-7, 2005 in NYC and is being organized by his dedicated students and fans.

During his life, he opened two billiard rooms in NYC. First SL Billiards and then he later opened NYC's Carom Cafe, the largest 3-cushion billiard room in the US featuring a beautifully lit arena of 10 Verhoeven heated table.

Sang Lee died on Oct. 19, 2004 after a valiant battle with severe stomach cancer that lasted months.

Sang Lee is remembered by his loved ones as an individual of unequalled generosity and warm person with a tremendous heart. He has left behind him a wake of devoted fans, all of who remember him as a true Champion that always offered his time, encouragement, and vast knowledge to any player that took an interest to carom billiards. The entire international billiard community mourns his passing and feels a great, great loss.

Sang Lee is survived by his loving wife Kyung and his daughter Olivia Lee whom he loved very dearly. Both Olivia and his young niece, Ester Park, continue to play 3-cushion billiards in the NYC leagues and participate actively in the USBA Junior competitions.

http://caromtv.com/Remembering%20Sang%20Lee.html

dg-in-centralpa
12-31-2004, 10:19 AM
I agree that Earl should be there. Isn't Allen Hopkins on the ballot again this year? I think he deserves it as much if not more than Earl. He's made an impact on the pool world as a player as well as his tournaments. My vote would be for Hopkins.

DG - I don't get to vote either

Fred Agnir
12-31-2004, 11:33 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr>
If Earl doesn't get in, the whole Hall of Fame is a big joke as far as I'm concerned. <hr /></blockquote>

There is absolutely no way that Earl won't make it in. The only odd comparisons would be to Varner, Sigel, Reyes and Mizerak, players that were/are still winning a lot of tournaments when they got in. Other than those, the rest were either past their prime, or dead. It was a mistake, IMO, for Reyes to get in so early.

Earl is still a top player who is a threat to win several tournaments a year. Even to his own sentiments, he didn't think that currently competitive players should be in the HOF balloting.

Fred

superB
12-31-2004, 04:50 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> That is why I would like to see a voting process where you rate each nominee, 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Then all the 1st place votes get 3 points, 2nd gets 2 points and 3rd gets 3 points. The one with the most points wins.
<hr /></blockquote>
We should elect the US president the same way. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Pelican
01-01-2005, 10:15 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr>
If Earl doesn't get in, the whole Hall of Fame is a big joke as far as I'm concerned. <hr /></blockquote>

It already is due to current competative players being in it. You even said yourself "if Tiger Woods retired".
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fred Agnir:</font><hr>
It was a mistake, IMO, for Reyes to get in so early. <hr /></blockquote>
I agree 100%
[ QUOTE ]

his own sentiments, he didn't think that currently competitive players should be in the HOF balloting.

Fred <hr /></blockquote>

This is the way it should be.

Popcorn
01-01-2005, 05:34 PM
I agree. Champion player, teacher, business owner, promoter and most of all ambassador to the game. My money would be on Sang Lee this time around, he meets all the criteria of a hall of fame player. Unfortunately Earl only meets one, great player. Almost everything else about him is a negative. He will get in for sure some time, but I don't think it wil be now.

nail
01-01-2005, 07:23 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Popcorn:</font><hr> I agree. Champion player, teacher, business owner, promoter and most of all ambassador to the game. My money would be on Sang Lee this time around, he meets all the criteria of a hall of fame player. Unfortunately Earl only meets one, great player. Almost everything else about him is a negative. He will get in for sure some time, but I don't think it wil be now. <hr /></blockquote>
Well said Popcorn, I couldn't agree more.

Barbara
01-02-2005, 02:54 PM
I just saw him cheat on ESPN in the Skins game!! In the "all balls foul" he moved the 5-ball with either his hand or cue. Of course, Scott Smith wasn't in position to see the foul, but Earl snookered Charlie and didn't admit to the foul!

Well he lost anyway, serves him right.

This is not what we need on tv!

Barbara

wolfdancer
01-02-2005, 03:07 PM
Harold, thanks for the post....great man, great player.

monkeydude20
01-02-2005, 03:54 PM
I think all should be compared to the greatest Willie Mosconi. The God of pool. If they are any where near as good as he is then they ought to get in. And honestly, I don't believe that Earl is anywhere near Willie's talent on the table.
Jk /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

recoveryjones
01-02-2005, 05:54 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote monkeydude20:</font><hr> I think all should be compared to the greatest Willie Mosconi. The God of pool. If they are any where near as good as he is then they ought to get in. And honestly, I don't believe that Earl is anywhere near Willie's talent on the table.
Jk /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif <hr /></blockquote>

So what you are basically saying is that Hockey should only have Wayne Gretzky in it's Hall of Fame, Baseball Babe Ruth,Basketball Wilt Chamberlain.......what you are saying is completley ridiculous.So is saying that Earl isn't anywhere close to Willie's talent.First of all Earl plays mainly 9 ball, while Willie played Straight pool.It's like comparing apples and oranges.

Grady Matthews (on one of his instructional videos) even said that MOST OF the Old time players of yesterday (although very good players)couldn't compete with todays modern players. The oldtimers played with mudd balls, and 5" pockets. If anyone is eligible to compare the old players to the new, it's Grady Matthews.After all he's been around long enough to have seen or played them all.

Ignoring 11 MAJOR TITLES that Earl has won with comments like your's makes me wonder if you are on the BCA's selection commitee....LOL, RJ

Barbara
01-02-2005, 06:10 PM
And Pete Rose will still not be eligible for Baseball's HOF because he was caught gambling. Not fixing, just gambling.

Can anyone say "Calcuttas"?

Barbara

recoveryjones
01-02-2005, 06:23 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Popcorn:</font><hr> I agree. Champion player, teacher, business owner, promoter and most of all ambassador to the game. My money would be on Sang Lee this time around, he meets all the criteria of a hall of fame player. Unfortunately Earl only meets one, great player. Almost everything else about him is a negative. He will get in for sure some time, but I don't think it wil be now. <hr /></blockquote>

Earl only has to meet the criteria of "Greatest Player", because that's the catergory he was nominated for.All those extra's that Sang Lee has done are commendable, however, to use them in this case(arguementivly) wouldn't be correct because(this catergory) it's not about who was a teacher, ambassador, promotor, bussiness owner.The catergory is "Greatest Player", plain and simple.

No doubt Sang Lee was also a great player and probably is destined for the HOF someday, for sure.Having said all of this, Earl's 11 MAJOR titles including 6 WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS must not be ignored.RJ

recoveryjones
01-02-2005, 06:44 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Barbara:</font><hr> And Pete Rose will still not be eligible for Baseball's HOF because he was caught gambling. Not fixing, just gambling.

Can anyone say "Calcuttas"?
Barbara <hr /></blockquote>


My God Barbara, seems you've got a real dislike on for "The Pearl." I agree with you 100% that he has pulled some stunts that would have him win "The Jerk of Alltime Award" How he reacted when Steve Davis choked on a shot a few years ago was embarrasing, no doubt.At times he's not been the worlds most likeable guy.Personally I don't really like the guy, AS A PERSON.

Having said that, he's been nominated by the BCA for "The Greatest player" award and I can't ignore his 11 MAJOR titles including 6 WORLD Championships.Maybe others can and that's cool...were all different.Take care Barbara, RJ

ps. It's a well know fact that more than a few players have thrown the odd match because they have bet on another player in a Calcutta.Pete Rose has been caught and convicted of betting on baseball.With regards to the many pool players who have pulled mischievious gambling stunts, unfortunatley they are innocent until proven(like Pete) guilty. RJ

Popcorn
01-02-2005, 07:31 PM
In my opinion those things do mean something when voting for someone to a hall of fame. I would say also if you want to go just by greatist player standing as you suggest, Sang Lee was a better Billiard player then Earl is a pool player. When in the running next to a man like Sang Lee for the hall of fame, Earl runs a distant second. I am sorry, that is my opinion and I think you will see it will also be the opinion of the voting members. Don't get me wrong, I am not an Earl basher. I know him and to a degree like him, I am however not blind. Other then the interest of watching him play, he is a good player, he is of very little consequence to the sport at all. You have a different opinion and thats fine.

--------------- Please read.
Besides just titles, Sang Lee's obituary should mention that Sang Lee single-handedly is responsible for the 3-cushion resurgence in the US in the last decade - a game that was nearly extinct before his arrival in the states.

Sang Lee's dream when he immigrated to the US was "to make 3-cushion billiards
beautiful in America". He is responsible for planting the seeds of 3-cushion as a clean gentleman's sport in the US. Many 3-cushion players in the US today have been affected by his inspiring play and impeccable behavior at the table. His philosophy for top play was different than others. He advocated to his students the use of feel and an accompanying mindset of honest introspection (as opposed to "hating-your-opponent") in the continuous striving to advance oneself. He encouraged the notion of treasuring one's moments at the table and never giving up. Many of his disciples are
recognized as role models of sportsmanship on the table and known for their
graciousness off the table.

While here, he inspired so many people to begin playing 3-cushion billiards in the US. Most pool players that never previously had any exposure to 3-cushion billiards knew they were witnessing something special if they had to opportunity to see Sang Lee play his game. Many of them converted cue disciplines after watching Sang Lee's game.

At the top of his game Sang Lee was one of the best ever. He was arguably the most talented instinct player to ever hold a cue. There was something magical about the way Sang Lee played 3-cushion billiards. In competition, few people had his strong heart - somehow he had the capability to dig down deep and play his best when it mattered the most. No other player in history had his stroke or delicate touch.

His depth of knowledge was went beyond the limitations of billiard systems commonly employed to decipher 3-cushion. Sang Lee possessed a perfect photographic memory which empowered him to recognize subtle nuances between similar looking shots that demanded new solutions. Expert players would regularly puzzle over his unique approach - up until they watched his ingenious solution to an intricate problem unfold before them.

He has an unbeaten (unofficial) record of scoring 50 points in only 4 innings (19, 11, 9, 11 and out against one of his room customers) during a house tournament in NYC. He also broke Willie Hoppe's record of consecutive US National wins without a single loss during his 12 year US Championship reign.

His generosity towards the game was unparalleled. Every year, Sang Lee sponsored showcase spectacular "international invitational" tournaments where he donated tens of thousands of dollars annually to invite the best players of the world to compete in his events. Many of these events have been documented on video tape by Accu-Stats and CaromTV. His tradition of showcase events continues even after his passing. A $100,000 memorial tournament in his name is scheduled to be held Aug 1-7, 2005 in NYC and is being organized by his dedicated students and fans.

During his life, he opened two billiard rooms in NYC. First SL Billiards and then he later opened NYC's Carom Cafe, the largest 3-cushion billiard room in the US featuring a beautifully lit arena of 10 Verhoeven heated table.

Sang Lee died on Oct. 19, 2004 after a valiant battle with severe stomach cancer that lasted months.

Sang Lee is remembered by his loved ones as an individual of unequalled generosity and warm person with a tremendous heart. He has left behind him a wake of devoted fans, all of who remember him as a true Champion that always offered his time, encouragement, and vast knowledge to any player that took an interest to carom billiards. The entire international billiard community mourns his passing and feels a great, great loss.

Sang Lee is survived by his loving wife Kyung and his daughter Olivia Lee whom he loved very dearly. Both Olivia and his young niece, Ester Park, continue to play 3-cushion billiards in the NYC leagues and participate actively in the USBA Junior competitions.

recoveryjones
01-02-2005, 08:29 PM
I respect your opinion and I'm glad you respect mine.I'm sure they both will get to the HOF in time.

When I made this post I wasn't aware that Earl had pulled himself out of the running last year. In my opnion I thought he had been more successful as a player than Ewa Laurance. If he pulled himself out of the running last year he will no doubt do the same this year. If that's the case Sang Lee is a mortal lock to win over Robin Dodson. JMO, RJ

bigbro6060
01-03-2005, 12:15 AM
There is no doubt Earl will be in the Hall of Fame

It should happen when he retires

nhp
01-03-2005, 01:07 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Barbara:</font><hr> I just saw him cheat on ESPN in the Skins game!! In the "all balls foul" he moved the 5-ball with either his hand or cue. Of course, Scott Smith wasn't in position to see the foul, but Earl snookered Charlie and didn't admit to the foul!

Well he lost anyway, serves him right.

This is not what we need on tv!

Barbara <hr /></blockquote>

Um, I think it's safe to say that almost every single pro out there would simply not just say "here, ball in hand" if their hand or a piece of their clothing grazed an object ball causing no disturbance to the game, if the ref didn't call it on them. On the other hand, if a player intentionally moves an object ball other than the cueball, it's automatic loss of game. If that were the case with Earl, then I think what you said would have more merit, IMHO.

nhp
01-03-2005, 01:20 AM
Tafkaenema on this board says Earl can't play a lick, so how can he possibly make it in the HOF? /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif