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jjinfla
01-29-2005, 06:57 PM
Today we competed in the Money Cup for our 9-ball team. Twenty teams who all finished in the top 3 of their respective divisions. I asked 54 people the following questions:

"In pool what do the letters WPBA stand for?:

Know: 24 Don't know: 30

"Name five players in the WPBA:

Could name: 21 Could not: 33

I find it completely amazing that pool players do not even know what the letters WPBA stand for. And Allison Fisher is a representative for the APA.

When it came to naming WPBA players Allison Fisher, Karen Corr and Jeanette Lee were most often named. Unfortunately those are the three who appear on TV the most.

So if the results are this bad among pool players I wonder how bad it would be among the non pool playing public.

Seems to me that the pros need to start on a PR campaign.

Jake

landshark77
01-29-2005, 07:02 PM
Do the same poll, but focus on the UPA and the boys. See what you come up with then. IMO, people will know less about the boys. But yes, pool playing in general needs more
PR.

And while your at it ask APA player what the APA stands for...I would be suprised if half of them (us) know. /ccboard/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

cheesemouse
01-29-2005, 07:18 PM
jjinfla,

I did a similar thing acouple years ago. My poll was pretty informal but the outcome was pretty dismal. I was at a tourney with 100 players, it was the weekend before the start of the 2002 US Open 9-Ball. I asked approx 30 players these two questions: When does the Open start? What state is it held in? I got no correct response to either question...my conclusion. The normal run of mill pool player DON'T KNOW AND DON'T CARE.
Pool had a real PR problem back then and nothing has changed.

CarolNYC
01-30-2005, 03:14 AM
[ QUOTE ]
So if the results are this bad among pool players I wonder how bad it would be among the non pool playing public. <hr /></blockquote>

Hi Jake,
Im sorry, but I wouldnt give this survey any merit- I could ask poolplayers in my city the same question and I guarantee you 90% or more would know!
I think location has alot to do with it /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Carol

jjinfla
01-30-2005, 06:34 AM
Landshark77 - strange you should mention that. A few of the people told me it was good I didn't ask about the men because they knew less of them.

Carol - You really expect a 90% favorable result because you think there are more pool players up there? Only way to find out is to do the survey yourself. Stop at a poolhall where the APA plays and let us know what you find out.

Florida really is a Mecca for pool players. There are thousands who play in the APA within 50 miles of me. Plus there are thousands more in the retired communities (many from the NE) who play pool. Many have not played for twenty years or more and are now very active within their own communities and the local bars. And we can see plenty of good tournaments within a 100 miles. From the pros to the amateurs to the just regular players. In the last couple of years I have collected signatures of thirty pros on cue balls. Men and women. Had I really tried I could easily have had 4 times that many but I would only go for one or two signatures (or none) after Charlie got mad at me for getting all five of the players from up north when they came to Tampa.

I even gave the questions to our league operators, husband and wife team, and of course they both had no problem with the questions. But she told me that most of the APA players in her league (and she knows them all by name) just play pool for the fun of it, the chance to win a trip to Vegas or a plaque, or to be honored by their teammates, or just to enjoy a few beers with the guys once or twice a week and really care less about the pros. And I just found out that he is a BCA certified instructor but his membership has lapsed.

Of course don't do the survey at a Joss tournament.
That would be like stuffing the ballot box.

Jake

CarolNYC
01-30-2005, 01:53 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Carol - You really expect a 90% favorable result because you think there are more pool players up there? <hr /></blockquote>
No Jake, I expect a favorable outcome due to the quality of player-ya know what I mean? /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[ QUOTE ]
I even gave the questions to our league operators, husband and wife team, and of course they both had no problem with the questions. But she told me that most of the APA players in her league (and she knows them all by name) just play pool for the fun of it, the chance to win a trip to Vegas or a plaque, or to be honored by their teammates, or just to enjoy a few beers with the guys once or twice a week and really care less about the pros <hr /></blockquote>

and here you have it-"play pool for fun!"Most players I'm familiar with do NOT play for fun,they play hardcore and jamup-theres the difference /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Carol~going into Pathmark tomorrow and doing the survey on the Stepford Wives,ha ha ha! /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Take care!

jjinfla
01-30-2005, 03:52 PM
Carol,

You play on the WPBA tour so I would expect you and your friends would be able to answer those simple 1st grade questions.

My questions were made to APA players. They are very, very, very basic questions. And if pool players can't answer those simple questions then what does it say for the state of pool. I suggest you find some APA players and ask them these same basic questions. But do not ask them at a WPBA tournament.

Now had I said name 5 players on the WPBA not including Allison, Karen, Jeanette, Ewa, Vivian and Kim then I would fully expect to get no correct answers to that question.

And if you think the tour is really that well known then you are deceiving yourself and therein lies the problem with the WPBA.

The reason I tried this poll is because in another thread someone mentioned that the top 8 women in the WPBA carry the tour. I personally think it is the top 3, Allison, Jeannette and Karen.

Jake

landshark77
01-30-2005, 04:09 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr>
The reason I tried this poll is because in another thread someone mentioned that the top 8 women in the WPBA carry the tour. I personally think it is the top 3, Allison, Jeannette and Karen.

<hr /></blockquote>

And I still say that is BS!!!! They are the most recognizable because they are on TV all the time, if they weren't there it would be others Jake...then those would be the top 3 that you say "carry" the tour. They do NOT carry the tour, if that were true then why do people show up on Thurs, Fri, and Sat.? Yeah Sunday sells more, but the Superbowl and the Series sell more than everyday season play...people just wanna see who wins. I doubt the tour would succeed with ONLY the top 3. There are 61 other players that make that tour. If it were just the top then why did they extend the field a year or so ago?

But you do have a point with the PR of pool in general, not just the WPBA (but I agree that the WPBA sucks at it currently). I don't watch or play Basketball, but I can name off the rules, the teams, and the players.

CarolNYC
01-31-2005, 03:53 AM
Sorry Jake,
I should've been clearer when I said "players Im famaliar with" that meant,excluding the WPBA tour members-I've never played in the Bronx,but I have in the other 4 boroughs of NYC,so just counting them, I'd say alot of people are famaliar with who's who!
Theres a difference in people who play for fun and go out once a week to mix and mingle,have a good time and people who play,ya know?
E.G.-I was on a Womans bowling league-3 person team-we played for fun,trophies,etc. but ask me to name top bowlers -have no idea-but a (guy)friend of mine,who is a very good bowler,(like 700-800's)knows everything about bowling-see, theres a difference!
I don't know Jake-you may be right cause my Mom doesnt even know who's who /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif,but I hope your not! /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Take care!
Carol

jjinfla
01-31-2005, 06:08 AM
Landshark77,

Everybody loves a winner! No one remembers who came in 2nd.
But why fight it. (Except Ga Young Kim last year) The tour has those top ladies so just use them to benefit the rest of the league. They are the drawing card to bring attention to the rest. Right now Ga Young Kim has the best chance to join the top and become the public's favorite. Why? Because she is winning. And has appeared on TV. But winning alone is not all that is important to the paying public. You need pizzazz too. And she has that too. LOL

Carol I specifically picked the APA for that survey because I consider them the first step up from the non-playing public. The entry into the world of pool. They are learning how the game is played and should be familiar with the pros. Or at least have an interest in them if they want to see how the game should really be played. But keep in mind that there are a lot of APA players who get BIH and miss a ball 12 inches from the pocket. (I have 3 on my team where EVERY shot is a challenge LOL). But they have fun. They know nothing about the professional world of pool. And if pool players know knothing about the pros then what do the non-playing public know about them?

I just think that the WPBA is missing the boat by not doing more to get the the public's attention.

Now Allison Fisher and Earl Strickland are spokepersons for the APA and do a great job. It should benefit both the APA and the WPBA. Upcoming WPBA stars Melissa Herndon, Kelly Fisher and champion Ga Young Kim are fatured in this month's APA magazine. Last issue they featured Megan Minerich, Ewa Laurence, Vivian Villarreal, Sarah Ellerby, Tiffany Nelson. It appears that the APA orgnization does more to promote the WPBA than the WPBA does to promote itself.

When was the last time you saw a news article, something in print or on TV other than on ESPN or in a billiards magazine, about the WPBA? I can't ever recall seeing any. But then that could be that it is because I am not near where the WPBA plays.

But don't get me wrong the WPBA is the best game in town. Of course it is the only one. But I really have not seen any improvement in the past 6 years that I have been following the game.

The APA used to advertise that they had 120,000 players. Now they advertise that they have 250,000 players and growing. So it shows that the market for pool is growing in popularity. It is up to the pros to tap into that market.

Jake

DickLeonard
01-31-2005, 06:36 AM
Jjinfla my take on this survey is 60% of the people in Florida don't know their own name. ####

CarolNYC
01-31-2005, 06:47 AM
ha ha ha ha ha!
Carol /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

LARRY_BOY
01-31-2005, 06:55 AM
Now you can see why pool isn't a staple on t.v. Even pool players themselves don't watch or follow the sport.

I'd rather be lucky than good........

CarolNYC
01-31-2005, 06:59 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I specifically picked the APA for that survey because I consider them the first step up from the non-playing public <hr /></blockquote>
Jake,
I think APA players are great-I can't tell you how much fun I had with the APA tournament going on at the Nationals in Oregon-as a matter of fact, alot of them welcomed us in for the challenge and knew who we were! /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[ QUOTE ]
When was the last time you saw a news article, something in print or on TV other than on ESPN or in a billiards magazine, about the WPBA <hr /></blockquote>

I hate to say this, but just last week announcing us playing the FDNY charity /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Jake,
I understand what your saying! I visited AZ and seen something gremlin posted of a survey he did in Maryland-to me, thats nonsense!
I love Maryland and I know for a fact that there are alot of players out there who are jamup and who know who' who-its surveys like this that ,to me,are useless!

Have a great day!
Carol /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Rich R.
01-31-2005, 07:58 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote CarolNYC:</font><hr> I love Maryland and I know for a fact that there are alot of players out there who are jamup and who know who' who-its surveys like this that ,to me,are useless!
<hr /></blockquote>
I don't know about "jamup", but I thank you for the rest. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

SPetty
01-31-2005, 10:24 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> Now Allison Fisher and Earl Strickland are spokepersons for the APA and do a great job. <hr /></blockquote>I don't think so.

Allison is affiliated with APA, but I don't think Earl is. (He must have told me that in a dream... /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

jjinfla
01-31-2005, 04:42 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Jjinfla my take on this survey is 60% of the people in Florida don't know their own name. #### <hr /></blockquote>

Leonard, Leonard, Leonard. What can I say about you. You really are a .... Richard.

Actually the educational level of the students here in Florida is slightly above Kentucky. Very slightly. And most of the adults come from New York. Long Island must be a ghost town by now - they are all down here. At least they all say they are from LI. So I guess your point is probably valid.

Jake

landshark77
01-31-2005, 10:10 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr>
Upcoming WPBA stars Melissa Herndon, Kelly Fisher and champion Ga Young Kim are fatured in this month's APA magazine. <hr /></blockquote>

Whoa! You set me up for major disapointment! My mag was in the mail today and I rushed to read this "feature", LMAO. Not even close. I will even go as far to say that Allison's and Karen's names were mentioned more than the "featured" ladies combined. There was a full page WPBA advertisement though, didn't say much, but it is something. Eh, most APA players junk that mag anyway.