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View Full Version : 2 rail kick "parallel aiming system" - HOGWASH!



Billy_Bob
02-06-2005, 03:40 PM
Ok I am trying to practice the 2 rail kick shot parallel aiming system, but depending on your source of information for this system, you will get *many* different answers on how to do this and when to use it.

It seems to me that this is could be a good easy to use 2 rail kick system, but there does not seem to be a standard answer of how to use the system accurately in all situations.

And I have not read anything about a method to accurately transfer the parallel line (from between the balls to pocket) to the cue ball to rail shot. Or a method to double check your aim.

It seems to me that this system should have a lot more elements to work accurately - each time, every time.

1. Very accurate center line aiming. When placing the cue between the two balls at an angle, you may be off a bit. Maybe better to place a finger between both balls when looking at them so they are horozontal in your line of sight, then line up the cue between your finger and the center of the pocket gutter. ???

2. Accurate method of transfering the line parallel to the cue ball/rail line of aim. ???

3. Method of double checking the aim?

4. Exact rules for shooting/aiming. When angle such and so, dead center. When angle another such and so, use ?? english or aim ?? further over.

5. Exact rules for when not to use this system.

I think I have figured out a way to test this system... That is to draw a diagonal line from a corner pocket to a center pocket, then place 3 ring binder hole reinforcement stickers every 4 inches on the line from the center of the line working outwards.

Line would be like the following with balls where stickers would be (of course you would only use two balls at a time). Then place two balls near center - them move both outwards from center. Also cue ball at one extreme and move OB further and further away, then move CB over a spot.

START(
%AM7Q2%BP6M9%CR8K8%DT5I7%EV6G7%FX7E6%GK6S1%HI6U2%I G5W2%JE1Y5
%QC1C3%WZ3C9%XC6[4
)END

http://endeavor.med.nyu.edu/~wei/pool/


Following is some of the stuff I have read about this system,,,

When to use this system various answers I have read from different sources...

1. The system works fairly well for angles into the cushion of around 45 degrees. If the angle is almost zero or 90, the spin on the first or second cushion will destroy the equality of the angle.

2. Cue ball and object ball must be on same end of table.

3. When you start approaching 30-40 degrees, the last leg will open up.

4. Exact geometry will be in error on a pool table because the rail sticks out one half ball.


How to aim various answers I have read...

1. Dead center.

2. 1 tip of running english and 1/2 tip of follow.

3. 1 tip of running english.

4. Aim closer to the corner pocket than exact parallel.

5. When the first leg starts approaching 30-40 degrees, the last leg will open up. Adjust for this.


Where to line up middle of balls to pocket various answers I have read.

1. Line up middle of balls to pocket.

2. Line up middle of balls to where cushion edges meet.

3. Line up middle of balls to center of the rail gutter.

ras314
02-06-2005, 06:38 PM
A long time ago an old timer told me pool was a game of fractions of an inch and memory.

Two rail kicks are a good example of the need for memory. A center hit on the cb will open up a bit off the second rail, how much depends on the angle, speed of hit, and condition of the rails. There is no system that is exact for all situtions, so practice and remember how the ball runs. Just be sure of your stroke and hit or you will learn nothing.

As far as the diamond being behind the rail, I usually put a coin on the edge of the rail straight out from the diamond and use that for an aiming point. Put one also on the second rail where it should hit. Both should jump. I've been told 3 cushion players tend to shoot directly at the diamond and use running english, which may be part of your confusion.

There is a lot of art besides the science in pool, that is what makes it so much fun.

GeraldG
02-06-2005, 08:44 PM
The mistake most people make when trying to use the diamonds is that they essentially draw a line straight from the diamond to the edge of the cushion and try to hit that spot on the cushion. Most diamond systems that I've seen expect that you will be aiming through the diamond from the position of your cueball. The actual contact point on the cushion will be a few inches from the point on the cushion straight out from the diamond.

dr_dave
02-06-2005, 09:02 PM
FYI, NV 7-9 (http://www.engr.colostate.edu/~dga/pool/normal_videos/NV7-9.htm) shows a demonstration of how the aiming method works. Details are discussed on pages 228-230 in "The Illustrated Principles of Pool and Billiards." As with all bank and kick shot aiming systems, speed, English, and cushion properties must be taken into consideration. Intuition and practice on a given table are critically important to being successful with the methods.

Billy_Bob
02-06-2005, 10:15 PM
Just experimenting around with the cue ball in different positions to get different angles on the 1st rail, I tried the following and hit the object ball a higher percentage of the time...

1. Place finger on middle spot between OB and CB while looking at the two balls so they are on a horizontal line. (Get more accurate middle position between balls.)

2. Line up cue stick over finger to center of pocket gutter. (Center of gutter more accurate than guessing where rails would meet.)

3. Move cue stick to left/right while keeping angle until it is over cue ball. Look for spot on table to aim at or object/spot on room wall to aim at.

4. Repeat steps 1-3 to see if I get same aim spot. (double check)

5. Adjust aim one cue tip closer to pocket and shoot.

highsea
02-06-2005, 10:36 PM
This is how I practice this shot. YMMV.

I stand across the table directly opposite the OB and CB. I place the tip of my cue on the midpoint of the line between the balls. Without letting the tip move, I pivot the butt to the corner pocket, and line it up in the center of the pocket. Then I look at the parallel line from the CB, and place a piece of chalk on the cushion. Then I move back to the shot and just aim for the chalk. Medium stroke with no english, and I usually make good contact with the OB.

This is no good in a match, because you are marking a cushion, but it helps in practice to see the line. It is also easier to show someone else how to line up the shot if you do it this way. Usually if I miss, it's because I don't trust myself when I get down on the shot, and I end up putting a little spin on the CB. I have learned not to do this. lol.

Jimmy B
02-07-2005, 12:36 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote highsea:</font><hr> and place a piece of chalk on the cushion. .

This is no good in a match, because you are marking a cushion, <hr /></blockquote>

I understand this to be the rule, but first you are not technically marking anything, and my second pet peeve on this topic is that I've seen many Filipinos (who use powder) place a finger on the table or rail when looking at a shot and leave a small powder mark on the clothe, to me this is a much worse offense and I've never once seen it called. I've watched Santos do it a hundred times. BTW if you find the spot on the table you want to hit and focus on it, then pick up the chalk and chalk your tip and then place it down on the rail I think it's a very hard foul to have called on you. Just my $.02.

JB

Bob_Jewett
02-10-2005, 07:50 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Billy_Bob:</font><hr> Ok I am trying to practice the 2 rail kick shot parallel aiming system, but depending on your source of information for this system, you will get *many* different answers on how to do this and when to use it.
...
<hr /></blockquote>
The system assumes that the rails reflect the cue ball like mirrors.

For any particular ball you're trying to hit on a one-rail mirror kick, there is a "mirrored target ball" that can be placed in the ideal reflected spot so that it represents the ball to be hit no matter where the cue ball is. This fact makes practicing such a system very easy -- put up the object ball and the mirrored target ball, and you can try the shot from any cue ball position without any arithmetic or diamond counting or crossing diagonals and perpendiculars construction. Most books and instructors get the location of the mirrored target wrong.

Similarly, for the ideal two-rail (parallel) system, for any ball on the table, there is a mirrored target ball that is the ideal aiming target for two-rail kicks to that ball. This is shown in the July 2004 Billiards Digest. Basically, the target ball is as far from the corner pocket as the ball you're trying to hit and in a straight line: object ball -- pocket -- target ball.
This allows you to see if whatever system you're trying (like join the bisector to the pocket and aim parallel) is giving you the geometrically correct answer.

After you perfect your system to get the geometrically correct answer, the next question is whether that will get a hit on the object ball. Or maybe spin and/or corrections are needed.

GeraldG
02-10-2005, 07:59 PM
Holy Smokes, Bob!!! Do you ever get the feeling that there's just too much pool stuff in your brain? It would seem that it would be entirely possible to get to the point that you're so smart you can't remember everything you know.....do you remember forgetting anything lately? /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Billy_Bob
02-10-2005, 08:39 PM
Thanks Bob!