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Thunderduck
04-18-2005, 04:53 PM
Do you control the speed of the shot by changing the backswing length, such as a very small backswing for a soft shot? Or do you do a full backswing on every shot, and control the speed by feel and muscle pressure only?

Tduck

1Time
04-18-2005, 05:52 PM
There are various ways to control speed. The best way to get on top of this is with hands on instruction.

A simple way to start learning ball speed on your own is to put a cue ball and object ball on the table, and shoot the OB into different rails at different speeds and angles and pay attention to how far the cue ball travels. See if you can consistently move the cue ball to the center of the table or to a predetermined area of the table.

Rod
04-18-2005, 11:41 PM
My very short answer is bridge length. That changes your stroke length and follow thru. There is per-say no muscle pressure. Feel is always on top shelf and learning/feeling different pace of strokes.

Rod

PQQLK9
04-19-2005, 12:02 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> My very short answer is bridge length. That changes your stroke length and follow thru. There is per-say no muscle pressure. Feel is always on top shelf and learning/feeling different pace of strokes.

Rod <hr /></blockquote>

I agree Rod and that is what Scott taught me.

Fran Crimi
04-19-2005, 12:15 AM
I think the question you have to ask first is what purpose does your bridge length serve? I think first and foremost, it's a function of your vision. Players who stand low tend to have longer bridge lengths because they see the line of the shot better from that distance, particularly long shots. Players who stand more upright tend to see the shot better standing closer to the CB.

Many players who stand lower who have longer bridge lengths will tend to shorten their backstrokes on softer shots.

Players who stand higher, and have shorter bridge lengths may take more full strokes, particularly on longer shots, and vary the speed with muscle control.


Fran

JimS
04-19-2005, 03:07 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr> I think the question you have to ask first is what purpose does your bridge length serve? I think first and foremost, it's a function of your vision. Players who stand low tend to have longer bridge lengths because they see the line of the shot better from that distance, particularly long shots. Players who stand more upright tend to see the shot better standing closer to the CB.

Many players who stand lower who have longer bridge lengths will tend to shorten their backstrokes on softer shots.

Players who stand higher, and have shorter bridge lengths may take more full strokes, particularly on longer shots, and vary the speed with muscle control.


Fran <hr /></blockquote>

I shorten my bridge and my stroke and will bend my bridge arm more (Grady comes to mind). Then for more precise positioning of the cb I may alter slightly where I strike the cb going very slightly higher or lower.

What a very pleasant surprise to be reading this thread and find you here Fran. It's great to see you posting!!!!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

SpiderMan
04-19-2005, 08:25 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> My very short answer is bridge length. That changes your stroke length and follow thru. There is per-say no muscle pressure. Feel is always on top shelf and learning/feeling different pace of strokes.
Rod <hr /></blockquote>
Rod,

I thought I remembered you as an advocate of back-hand english. If you vary your bridge length considerably from shot-to-shot, doesn't that affect your squirt compensation?

SpiderMan

Cane
04-19-2005, 08:37 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr> &lt;snip&gt; Many players who stand lower who have longer bridge lengths will tend to shorten their backstrokes on softer shots.

Players who stand higher, and have shorter bridge lengths may take more full strokes, particularly on longer shots, and vary the speed with muscle control.

Fran <hr /></blockquote>

I agree with Fran. I see this a lot and it works for most players very well. Personally, except for finesse speed (slower than lag speed), I use the same length stroke and finish AND the same bridge length on every other speed shot that I play. I'm neither low or high on the cue... used to be low, chin on the cue, but man, my life is more than half over and I can't bend down like that for hours on end any more. I shoot with my chin about 6 or 7" off of the cue, now. In any case, I used to adjust my stroke length and finish for speed, but have found for me that I'm much more precise using the same stroke on all speeds except when using a specialty stroke. I've just trained myself to do it that way. Lots of practice and lots of muscle memory.

Later,
Bob

bustah360
04-19-2005, 09:39 AM
For myself I use a shorter bridge to leave myself less margin for error. I do this eventhough I play low on the cue. I find most shots for slow speed should be more precise on the ob so that position is played as perfect as possible.

Rod
04-19-2005, 04:49 PM
[ QUOTE ]
If you vary your bridge length considerably from shot-to-shot, doesn't that affect your squirt compensation?
<hr /></blockquote>

Of course it does, it always has, however many shots are shot at std bridge length. The same holds true if you use BHE or not. Pool is an angle/area game as you know. I never meant to imply I use BHE on every shot or change bridge lengths drastically. Except for specialty shots.

Squirt is a nasty word for most people. I guess that why predator shafts sell like hot cakes. LOL Really IMO, a lot more emphases is used on squirt than needed. When anyones accurate stroke repeats time after time, it's still an issue but not a large one.

Rod

tateuts
04-20-2005, 11:00 AM
First, let me say I am not a teacher, but I think one of the stronger parts of my game is cueball control.

The warm up strokes and final backstroke are vital for allowing the player to combine the diverse elements needed to pull off a shot. In addition to point of aim, these strokes allow you to rehearse the combined angle, spin, and force needed to pull off the shot. It’s like taking an imaginary free shot, a “mulligan” so to speak.

I do not think you should try to control the speed or force applied on the shot by increasing and decreasing the backstroke length (except for a few specialty shots). Bridge length and backstroke length are two entirely different things. Further, I don’t think the bridge length makes too much difference (within reason) either, as long as it doesn’t obstruct your view or interfere with your backstroke.

I liken the warm up strokes as an introduction to pace the final backstroke, which is like Lawrence Welk saying "a one and uh two". If you watch the pros, the strokes are all rythymical. Whether it’s like a violin, a cello, or the whole damn orchestra, they are all very rythymical. This rythym sets the tone for the stroke and allows the player to select the amount of force they've learned to use to get the cueball to where they want it. The combination of angle, aim point, spin, force, and other factors, all combine to affect the shot and cueball position. The length of the final backstroke has no effect whatsoever on the force needed on the forward stroke (within reason).

Since the rythym of the stroke, the “one and a two” is so critical to rehearsing the shot, can you see where trying to lengthen and shorten the stroke to control force would just mess everything up?

There are some specialty shots, like push outs, long soft roll shots, other type of cinch shots, where I will shorten up to a 1" to 3" backstroke, but normal to me is 5" - 6" with a 12" bridge.

Chris