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View Full Version : WANNABEEs & MAGIC WANDS... or >>>>> reality



06-08-2002, 11:51 AM
After several years (45) of Playing & LEARNING the game of Pocket Billiards and/or watching Players play & try to develop their game... it's obvious that most will buy an expensive MAGIC WAND & feel certain that will make them "a Player". When that doesn't work... they UPGRADE with hope that the "new" MAGIC WAND will certainly do the trick. They now have 2-3 years of banging balls, maybe $1000 or so in equipment (Cues, Case & accessories), another $2000-$3000 in table time & they have not progressed passed the 5-6 Speed mark. Plus they are losing a good bit of money if they GAMBLE.
The thought of LEARNING to play the Game from a House Pro or a Pool School never crossed their mind... that's beneath them or above them???? But, it's not all the fault of the wannabee! I have 3 very large Pool Halls within a 5 mile circle in my town & none of them offer Individual or Group lessons. So who's the wannabee's leader???? The folks that sell MAGIC WANDs.... THINK ABOUT IT..... a bystander

Tom_In_Cincy
06-08-2002, 12:49 PM
Very good point, cue makers market their goods as and answer to increasing the players performance.

But this has been going on for almost 40 years,, this isn't news..

THE News should be that the League Organizations should be running an instructional league, with qualified instructors. I've been suggesting this for almost 15 years.

PQQLK9
06-08-2002, 05:26 PM
Oh get a life bystander and stop raining on other people's parade...sounds like you are a miserable ol'fart....if you don't like nice equiptment...DON'T BUY IT...some of us like the pride of ownership if for no other reason than it makes us feel good. Now having said all that I do advocate continuing education.

06-08-2002, 05:39 PM
nope, I'm not miserable at all. I'm a good player & I've got a couple thousand dollars in my case & cues. I just made a statement that folks could spend their money wiser & enjoy the game more. That's an opinion, to which I am entitled... this is America isn't it. If you want to be free...let others be free too. By the way... my old man told me once.. when you throw a rock into a pack of dogs... the one that yelps, is the one you hit !

PQQLK9
06-08-2002, 06:14 PM
Ouch...my dad taught me not to throw stones at people or animals...anyhow mr. goodplayer with over$2k worth of stuff...looks like your dog is bigger than mine ...no offence intended....I'll probably need the wild 7 if we ever play...( heck i'm just trying to achieve "newbie" status on this board.

Ralph S.
06-08-2002, 11:17 PM
My opinion or thoughts on this thread are that we have actually been through this before. The majority of the players are recreational and are not looking to play the pro circuit. I agree with Tom in Cincy's statement that the advertising of merchandise <mainly cues> is geared to the recreational player. Also take into consideration that many people spend the greatest amount of their disposable income on entertainment and recreation . Pool does fall into this category. Many people prefer to own nice things, I do, don't you? So give the average person a break, it cant really bother you that much can it? If they decide they want to progress their skill level they will pursue it at their own pace. JMO.
Ralph S.

Chris Cass
06-08-2002, 11:39 PM
Hi Bystander,

I take no offense to your post at all. Your probably right on the mark in the lessons part. In my case, I started out young. I've only have about $90. in my first two cues in which I actually bought. I've gambled and both won and lost throughout my life.

I broke my first cue outside of a bar. I wasn't even losing but hated the way I was playing. LOL Since then, everytime I won I spent the money upgrading my equipment. Won a Schon cue once, a low level R-6. Shot with it and couldn't make a ball at the time. Going from a Meucci to a stiffer cue was brutal. I sold it and bought 2 McDermott's. Alittle stiffer and was trying to get away from the wip. Sold one and won $600. with the other. Been going up ever since. Won a cheap cue in a charity tourney signed by Steve Miserak(sp?)and $60. that same night off a guy playing cheap 9 ball. Traded the case and $60. for a leather case, which traded again for an Instroke.

I've been going up ever since. Granted, I've never had a lesson other than playing some strong players. My point being there's a lot of ways to move up in equipment and also skill level. I do see your point about money well spent. They didn't have the type of instruction when I was coming up. Well, atleast nobody told me. LOL Basically you can see how pool has grown. Today's players come from kids with at home equipment and instructors with qualifications other than, the kick your a$$ degree. LOL

Regards,

C.C.

bigalerickson
06-09-2002, 01:56 AM
I think the point that bystander brings up is a interesting oberservation if nothing else. That being, that there are these people, that we all see on a weekly basis, who have been playing pool for a long time, and have not made a markable improvement with their game in years. This "market group" of players, I would say is the most profitable market for both pool halls and suppliers to be catering to.
I would suggest to any pool hall, that if they had a large number of this grouping of people in their place regularly to start pushing lessons. Some people just give up on improving, and just love the game, my dad is one of those people, he has no desire to play better pool, and to his credit it takes a few hours and a few drinks to get five up on him still. The other people though, that have nice cues, pretty cases, but still play at a low level, are most likely there because they no longer realize the possibility for their improvement. Pool Halls should be encouraging these players growth, as it will only help the ph make more money with lessons and table time.

Does anybody else get the sense, that besides being open late, pool halls do not cater to customers?
My local pool hall, I can't believe its still in business, you walk in, the owner looks at you funny, even if he recognizes you, looks bewildered and almost offended when you ask a question of the "Can I get a set of balls for my table?" sort.

Just me ramblin late at night.

Goodnight.

BigAl - to three nickels off my dad tonight (yes i mean actual nickels, and yes they are of incredible value to me).

Chris Cass
06-09-2002, 08:26 AM
Hi Big Al,

Yes, I totally agree with you. We have Grumpy, I asked to use the half moon sander one day and he said, Why don't you buy one for yourself. I said, why when I can use yours. He's always got a smart allec comment. I use the tip machine when I have to and he'll say, Changing tips again? Why don't you buy one of those damm things.

It takes 3 rings on the phone before he gets off his ass to answer the pnone. When the little girls come in about 23 yrs old he is sure to say something or get a big hug. He made a comment one day and the girl called him a dirty old man. He laughed. First time in 5 yrs I seen him crack a smile. LOL

Nobody gives lessons at my ph. Nobody, wants to pay for them. Once I saw Mark come in and give some but his student will nit me a hundred times a day for free advice. Go figure.

Touching about your Dad playing with you and yes, I believe those 3 nickels mean a hell of a lot to you. I like ya big guy.

Regards,

C.C.

Rich R.
06-09-2002, 09:26 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Ralph S.:</font><hr> My opinion or thoughts on this thread are that we have actually been through this before. The majority of the players are recreational and are not looking to play the pro circuit. I agree with Tom in Cincy's statement that the advertising of merchandise &lt;mainly cues&gt; is geared to the recreational player. Also take into consideration that many people spend the greatest amount of their disposable income on entertainment and recreation . Pool does fall into this category. Many people prefer to own nice things, I do, don't you? So give the average person a break, it cant really bother you that much can it? If they decide they want to progress their skill level they will pursue it at their own pace. JMO.
Ralph S. <hr></blockquote>
Well said Ralph. I don't believe there is any connection between the price of you cue and the quality of your game. I have seen players run racks with a mop handle and I have seen players with multi-thoundand dollar cues that can't make a ball. There are many people who own Ferraris or other exotic cars but will never race on a track. Spending a lot or a little on a cue stick is just another choice in life.
Rich R.

06-09-2002, 01:04 PM
Alright, for once reading this post I agree, I have to say that qualified instructors would be a very added bonus to the league groups around the country. I have been a moderate level player for quite a few years and have been asked to teach quite a bit. Since then I have asked several pros on the net a rather serious question that I still can't get an answer to, not a single answer from anyone that I have asked. It's one of those things that you always get different answers to.

So, here's the question: when cutting a ball very sharply, what english would YOU use... running or inside? I have always used inside and a softer stroke... what do you do?

Anyway... I have to say that I love that comment about the instructors. Keep up the good ideas, some day people have to listen.

Doc

Tom_In_Cincy
06-09-2002, 01:14 PM
On cuts, Mike Sigel has always said he uses inside. That's a pretty good endorsement, if you asked me.

As instructors go, there are good reasons to use inside or outside depending on the situation (needed shape, or avoiding making contact with an other ball)

But, for the winning ball, I would recommend using what you are most confident. I practice both inside and outside for just making the ball. I like outside the best, only because I use it more often than inside.

Scott Lee
06-11-2002, 10:04 AM
Anonymous...As an instructor, I will answer your question from my point of view. It depends of the cut...you call it a "steep" cut. Does that mean it approaches 90 degrees? If so, then inside english would make the shot much easier to pocket, than outside english. If the cut is 45-60 degrees, I personally would use NO english (unless I needed it to gain position play). The bottomline answer, imo, is that english (sidespin) is not necessary to pocket balls, in the majority of shot situations...and should be used more often than not, only when you can't get the CB to go where you want afterwards, without it.

Scott Lee

Kato
06-11-2002, 01:34 PM
And how did you come across that SouthWest and Justis?

Kato~~~feels like he missed part of the story

Michelle
06-11-2002, 03:28 PM
Let me take the middle of the road on this issue...
For people who are somewhat beginners, and are actually trying to improve their game, I feel it is important for them to have quality equipment. No, not necessarily a Schon cue and and Instroke case, but not some $50 cue carried around in a soft case, or god forbid, no case at all. If someone is trying to improve, through lessons or lots of practice or whatever, they will get frustrated if they do not have equipment that is going to perform well. They need a somewhat stiff cue and a good tip and a way to protect their equipment. If their equipment is subpar, and they don't feel they are improving, they may just get too frustrated and give up.

And, on the subject of English on cuts:
Little to none, and I wish that every player I talked to didn't think I was absolutle crazy when I try to explain to them why. (Being a 26 yr. old blond female, trying to explain this to most guys my age and up is just not an easy task! haha)

06-11-2002, 09:07 PM
Darlin', being a 26 year old blonde female and thinking that guys are going to listen to you explain ANYTHING is dreaming!!! LOL Lorri, a former 26 year old blonde female /ccboard/images/icons/smile.gif

Chris Cass
06-12-2002, 12:19 AM
Hi Kato,

That's a long story. LOL

C.C.~~lets just say I'm way ahead of the game.