PDA

View Full Version : The Dime and Nickel radius please explain....



disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 04:11 PM
Im not sure on this one i have been playing since i was 6 and im 21 now and i have heard it all my life but never though about it........... what does it mean!

1Time
05-29-2005, 04:22 PM
It's the roundness of your tip as you look at it from the side. Some prefer a rounder tip close to the roundness of a dime and others prefer a less rounded tip close to the roundness of a nickel.

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 04:43 PM
Thanks man i thought that is what it meant but i wasnt totally sure... Another Question of mine is that i own an It's George Tip Tool and what are the 13mm and 14mm slots on the end for is it for that?

1Time
05-29-2005, 05:11 PM
I'm not familiar with that tool, but it sounds like these are holes used to measure the diameter of your shaft.

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 05:28 PM
thats what i thought too but i heard its to measure your nickel dime radius but im not sure ...

1Time
05-29-2005, 05:36 PM
You may now be certain. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Billy_Bob
05-29-2005, 08:01 PM
Before cue tips were ever invented, cues just had a flat wood end. (1800's) Then someone discovered that if the wood end was rounded, it gripped the ball better.

So there is flat which does not work very well, and rounded which works better. And you can have a more rounded tip or a less rounded tip. The amount of "roundness" on the tip is the same shape as the curve on a quarter, nickel, or dime (hold coin up to tip to see what shape it has).

Different shaped tips will play differently. So if you have not paid attention to your tip and it has a quarter shape (closer to flat), then you go and get a new tip installed and have it shaped like a nickel or dime (more rounded), it will play differently.

Because of this, I feel it is important to first experiment with different tip shapes - see which you like best. Then keep your tip that shape. Then when you get a new tip installed, it will be the same shape and it will play just like the old tip played.

I prefer sandpaper shapers because you can hold them up to your tip to see if it needs shaping or not. Following is info on sandpaper tip shapers, and coin sizes...

Sandpaper tip shapers...

You can buy sandpaper tip shapers for nickel or dime shape at the below link and quarter shaped sandpaper tip shapers come with cheap tip repair kits sold at discount stores. (Hold coin to inside of shaper to see what size it is.) Use 100 grit sandpaper (held to the inside curve of shaper with your thumb) for initially shaping your tip, then 220 grit sandpaper to re-shape tip or re-surface tip from time to time. Cut sheets of sandpaper with scissors to size.

Hold shaper over tip in front of light to see if your tip needs shaping or not.

Nickel and dime shapers...
(See "Quick Tip" 3/4 way down page)
http://playpool.com/store/shop.php

Do-it-yourself tip shaper...
Cut electrical PVC in half and about 8 inches long - Be safe, use a vise to hold the pipe when sawing and both hands on saw.

PVC SIZES...
Dime (1/2" PVC Pipe) [15.00 mm]
Nickel / Penny (3/4" PVC Pipe) [19.75 mm]
Quarter (1" PVC Pipe) [25mm]
Half dollar (1 1/4" PVC Pipe)
Billiard ball (2" PVC Pipe)

U.S. COIN SIZES...
Dime ......................... 18.00mm
Penny ..................... 19.10mm
Nickel ....................... 21.10mm
Quarter ...................... 24.10mm
Half Dollar .................. 30.50mm

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 08:33 PM
Thanks billy bob

do you own a Its George tip tool if so i was wondering what the slots on the non rounded end is it for that reason? it says 13mm then a dash on top of 14mm i was just wondering what that is for or is it for that reason?

Billy_Bob
05-29-2005, 08:49 PM
Is this a picture of it at the below link? It looks to me the the 13mm / 14mm along with the lines is just a gauge to measure the width of a shaft at the tip.

Now that is a good shaping tool because it has a radius gauge (curved parts). Possibly nickel and dime? Looks like it might shape for nickel and dime as well? (Without a radius gauge, you don't know if your tip needs shaping or not.)

http://store1.yimg.com/I/beadsandbilliards_1847_85562394

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 08:53 PM
Yes sir, that would be the tip tool i have and i might ad its the best ive had also...I just checked it out and it looks like the larger side is a nickel and the smaller side is a dime and the smaller side is a 13mm and the bigger side is a 14mm....it might be for both aye?

Billy_Bob
05-29-2005, 09:01 PM
P.S. So you would hold the tip of your cue between the lines. If the width was between the closest two lines and matched, it would be a 13mm shaft. If it went up to the further line, it would be a 14mm shaft.

And you would hold the curved part on top of your tip in front of a light. If your tip curved to the curve on the tool, it would not need shaping.

You just need to hold a nickel and a dime to both of the curves and figure out which is which. If nickel and dime don't fit, try penny and quarter. Looks like nickel and dime to me though???

And the less rounded part of shaper is probably a nickel shaped shaper and the smaller is probably a dime shaped shaper???

Best to check with coins to be sure... (Most players use a nickel shape - I use a dime shape myself.)

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 09:04 PM
sounds like it i use a dime myself i just checked and ones a dime and ones a nickel i compared the coins to the tool...

Billy_Bob
05-29-2005, 09:16 PM
Well sounds like a good tool. I'll add it to my suggestion list.

It is good because you can see if your tip needs shaping or not, and that it has both nickel and dime.

Some of the cheap shapers that are sold in discount stores are actually quarter shaped. I don't know who makes these things! (Probably the same people who make racks which can't rack the balls properly!)

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 09:20 PM
I wouldnt know about the racking part i dont rack very much but the Tool is excellent everyone at school in the rec. center wants it i bought it off a friend for 10$ retail is like 30$ and the cheapest place i have found is http://www.pooldawg.com/shop/customer/product.php?productid=50384&cat=31&page=1 this site is awesome also and the tool has the one shaping hole the little on in the pic it makes the dime shape prefect every time...

Rackin_Zack
05-29-2005, 09:40 PM
I've heard here recently that a tip's radius will conform to your playing style if you just leave it alone. Of course, you may have to "clean" it up after the first mushroom but that's it for layered tips, especially the hard ones.

disturbed_won
05-29-2005, 09:42 PM
I have also heard that in the 10 months well almost 11 now i have used this Triangle tip it has yet to mushroom and i shoot with a Dime radius it works well for me....

Sid_Vicious
05-30-2005, 07:10 AM
Ditto...sid

Deeman2
05-31-2005, 06:24 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rackin_Zack:</font><hr> I've heard here recently that a tip's radius will conform to your playing style if you just leave it alone. Of course, you may have to "clean" it up after the first mushroom but that's it for layered tips, especially the hard ones. <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> Zack,

I disagree with this one. I think your playing style will conform to your tip, rather than the tip to your playing style. </font color>

Deeman

Sid_Vicious
05-31-2005, 09:44 AM
Sounds like a "chicken or the egg" when you really think about it...sid

Stretch
05-31-2005, 10:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman2:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rackin_Zack:</font><hr> I've heard here recently that a tip's radius will conform to your playing style if you just leave it alone. Of course, you may have to "clean" it up after the first mushroom but that's it for layered tips, especially the hard ones. <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> Zack,

I disagree with this one. I think your playing style will conform to your tip, rather than the tip to your playing style. </font color>

Deeman <hr /></blockquote>

Why not have it both ways? If anything i ware my tips round useing side, draw, and follow. Probably 99% of all my shots are NOT centre ball, and not centre tip. So inevitably i ware my tips round (dime). And that "becomes" the tip that suits my style. If i were a centre ball shooter (majority of the time) like straight pool players. I think i'd be better served with a flater (nickel) tip. They are more forgiving too. Try hitting a perfect stop shot with no side spin from 1 to two feet. A rounded tip has a hard time doing this, it's got to be peeeeerfect. I tryed it with a flat tip with much more success. These shots are played with the centre of your tip so what i did was flatten out the top of the dome. It makes a flat patch on the top and comes into play nicely for plain ball hits. It even feels more secure although that could be me just thinkin it is...it works so who am i to judge lol.

But anyway ya, get the best of both worlds by haveing a round tip.....but make it a snubnose! St.

Deeman2
05-31-2005, 11:06 AM
Stretch,

Good argument but I just think that, for instance, you start off with a flat tip, you're not gonna do so well on draw and english shots. However, you are right, you will make more nice center ball hits and your accuracy will go up there. In the interim, you may change your game to suit what you can do with that flat tip. Then, it finally wears into some sort of a radius. Now, can you change your game to playing that tip properly. Perhaps, but it sure seems like a waste of time.

Maybe I'm wrong. I use a WB with a dime radius. If I put on a new tip and did not shape it, I think I might not have the confidence in my draw shot I do with my present tip.

Deeman

Stretch
05-31-2005, 11:55 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman2:</font><hr> Stretch,

Good argument but I just think that, for instance, you start off with a flat tip, you're not gonna do so well on draw and english shots. However, you are right, you will make more nice center ball hits and your accuracy will go up there. In the interim, you may change your game to suit what you can do with that flat tip. Then, it finally wears into some sort of a radius. Now, can you change your game to playing that tip properly. Perhaps, but it sure seems like a waste of time.

Maybe I'm wrong. I use a WB with a dime radius. If I put on a new tip and did not shape it, I think I might not have the confidence in my draw shot I do with my present tip.

Deeman <hr /></blockquote>

Agreed it's all about your confidence in what you have. For any tip there is a break in period. I hate new shaped tips. None of them perform like they can till they have a bit of ware on them. I got away from shapeing, after the install that is, because it's just a vicious circle (and the tip company's love u for it lol). I might be wrong but shapeing just lines the grain up and this sucks for holding chalk. Picking, or overpicking is just as bad as it lifts the grain. I was always tought to use 80 or 100 grit paper with backing and roll it over. NOT scrape. This prepairs the surface the best. Lightly wipe on chalk and your good to go.

Deeman2
05-31-2005, 12:28 PM
I have finally decided to take the plunge and try a layered tip on my extra shaft (314). I don't know if I'll like it but I've heard so many people swear by them that i thought I'd try. I agree that a new tip is the pits until I have "broken" it in. I don't do much to mine except roll 60 or 80 grit over it on occasion.

Deeman

disturbed_won
05-31-2005, 08:00 PM
Yea im gonna try a Tiger Everest on my pool cue.....I use a Dime radius on my Triangle as of now........

bustah360
05-31-2005, 09:07 PM
Honestly I didn't know what this meant until now either, thx for posting this. On the subject of lamenated tips, I once tried a tiger tip and found myself constantly miscueing. I'm still not sure if that was a stroke problem, tip shape, or just that something that I play much better with a softer tip. I currently play best with a triangle tip. I found moori tips waaaay to hard and was afraid of the same problem I had with the tiger tip. Any input out there?

Rackin_Zack
05-31-2005, 09:18 PM
I personally prefer the feel I get with a hard tip. I tried a Moori S and it seemed to deaden the hit. I now have a Talisman H on my playing cue, which I've been told is a very hard tip, and like the way it plays.

Sid_Vicious
06-01-2005, 05:49 AM
"I agree that a new tip is the pits until I have "broken" it in."

I personally love the sensation of the first hits in a newly installed tip, just like I do the hit and feel of a new, expensive cue. I seem to play with more pride and confidence during those moments. Just me...sid

Qtec
06-01-2005, 06:49 AM
Sid, that all depends on what tip you are using. If you are using a Talisman or Elkmaster [ softer tips] , it takes a while before they are solid. In the begining, they are a bit spongy.
Qtec

Qtec
06-01-2005, 06:57 AM
I dont believe a word you say.
You say you have been doing tips, ferrules, shafts/ for 2 years. You say that you have been playing since you were 6. Then you say that you dont know the dif between nickel and dime shapes?

Have you ever heard of Google?
You do know there is a search program on this board?

I,m sure you do.

Qtec ....

Billy_Bob
06-01-2005, 08:07 AM
Actually I know a lot of players who do not own one book on pool and don't know how to use a computer. They have learned everything they know from other players. Many of these might have heard that the tip should be rounded like a nickel, but that is the extent of of their knowledge. I just had one of these guys ask me the other day what the difference between a dime and a nickel shape was.

But he can whoop my tail at the table. He has many years of experience which I am lacking. So I think experience rules over knowledge (although that safety play I learned here recently sure does help me to win a few against this guy...)

Qtec
06-01-2005, 09:47 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Tip Shaping
Though I've played pool for many years, I've never before shaped a tip or even knew the importance of a well-shaped tip and its ability to hold chalk. Most of the books you read about billiards will contain information about tip shaping. The reason you need to know about shaping cue tips is that the new cues that come with your new pool table will have flat, unshaped tips on the ends. Tip shape is a personal preference, so most folks prefer to shape their own tips.
Opinions vary on the particular curve that a cue tip should have. Within the United States, the curve of a cue tip is most often compared with a U.S. coin--usually a dime, nickel, or quarter. The nickel seems to be the most popular--a dime being more pointy and a quarter being more flat.

With the butt toward the floor, hold the tip of your cue stick at eye level. If the leather tip is new, it will be flat on top. If you hold a coin flat against the side of the cue stick so that the top edge of the coin is aligned with the top of the cue tip, you will see the curve that you should strive for when shaping the tip.

<hr /></blockquote>

That took me 20 seconds!?

[ QUOTE ]
Actually I know a lot of players who do not own one book on pool and don't know how to use a computer. <hr /></blockquote>
Do you know someone who has been doing cue repairs for two years that doesnt know the dif between 'Nickel and Dime'?


Qtec............tut.........

pooltchr
06-01-2005, 10:07 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr>
Do you know someone who has been doing cue repairs for two years that doesnt know the dif between 'Nickel and Dime'?


Qtec............tut.........
<hr /></blockquote>

Not anyone that is going to be working on MY cue!!!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Billy_Bob
06-01-2005, 10:34 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> Do you know someone who has been doing cue repairs for two years that doesnt know the dif between 'Nickel and Dime'? <hr /></blockquote>

Sadly to say, I do know one "cue repair" person who seems only to know about a nickel shape. But worse than that, he does not use a shaping tool of any type. Just shapes the tips "free hand" to get the tip approximately nickel shaped.

I will not let him touch my cue.

I know another "non repair" old timer who "will fix up your tip for you" by taking a knife and slashing an X in the top of it - says it will get better draw! (He's not slashing my Moori with his knife!)

These services are provided at low or no cost to the "bangers". The better players know better and have their own tip shaping tools.