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View Full Version : I lost $2,500



06-18-2002, 01:02 PM
O.K guys. I have been reading this post for sometime. I love the convos. I have been writing for about a month or two. I love the responses. O.K. This is the situation that has been eating at me for about 3 months now. I live in a small area. One day I go to my favorite pool hall and find a loud abnoxious individual shooting. Dude has a good stroke, so I ask to join in. I can tell he is drunk but he still shoots well. About a half hour in, he asks to play for something I agree to $20. 4 hours later I have $200.00
A week later, we do it again. I leave with $200.00. a week later I tap him for $300.00. 3 weeks later, I'm with my lady. I spot this kind gentleman and he spots me. He walks over to where I'm eating my meal and places a not right between my lady and me. He says go ahead count it. I don't he says alright, there is $2,500 there. I'm willing to play until its gone. The lady gives me the go ahead, I drop her home and in a half an our I'm back with my weapons and $500.00 in the pocket. We play one game for twenty, which I win, and he wants to raise the bet to $40.00 a game. It takes me no time to get to $100.00. Then the kiss of death. A known hustler walks through the door. This guy is the epitamy of an unscrupulous sharker. The rap on him is so thick, you need a ginsu to get to the core. He has been wanting a piece of me for some time, however, I tend to leave him alone because of this. He comes over to the table and I say we don't want to see you. He says you have to see me. I say, look, everybody who has come over here has asked us if they can play, we say no and they leave, why can't you do the same? "How much are you playing for?" $40.00 a game. He says, "I have cash you guys have to play me. He proceeds to rack up and then hits the cue ball aimlessly around the table waiting for one of us to take him on. My opponent does not want to see him. He wants me and the $700.00 I took. Well, my boy starts to unscrew his stick, now I'm pissed. We can do this later he says. The hustler, now realizing the damage he has caused, tries to mend things by saying I'll leave you guys alone. But my fish is ready to leave now. We agree to meet Sunday. No show. I go back to the venue at the usual time I see him. No fish. 3 months under the belt now, I know he does not want to be found.

The shark and I have met since then and we always argue about the subject. Why? Because he wants to play me and I refuse and throw that nights appauling behavior in his face. Those who know us are torn some say.

1) The hustler should have listened when it was made clear that we wanted no parts of him.

2) While the flip side says I should have "somehow" got over to the hustler and tell him the story between this guy and myself and offered him a side bet or something.

I say F that. If two men make it clear that they do not want to play you and they are gambling, I leave them alone. I have walked in a room and two people that I know I can take are gambling I ask, beg even plead to get in. But if they say no, I do not put my money on or in the table to force my way in. I think ethics must come in to play some damn where. Excuse me, I still get heated thinking about this.

What do you guys think?

06-18-2002, 01:20 PM
Not only do I agree completely with you (that the hustler was wrong), but did you ever consider he may have been even more responsible for this mess than you first thought?

Somebody got to this guy you were playing. Plain and simple. He lost $700 and was willing to go for more. For whatever reason, he thought it was a good game between you and him. He would not have quit you forever, even after the incident you describe, UNLESS somebody told this guy he can't win (between that night and now).

Who could it be? Hmmm... I'll give you one guess. I've seen this stuff happen before... when you weren't around, the hustler goes up to the guy and tells him, "Listen, you can't beat him. I know how he plays, and you can't win. Why don't you play me instead?" Whether the mark plays him or not, you can bet he's never playing YOU again.

It's sad. You have every right to be pissed as hell.

- Steve

jjinfla
06-18-2002, 01:24 PM
Sounds like you are talking about your other personality. LOL. Jake

cheesemouse
06-18-2002, 01:29 PM
Hun,
Your discription leads me to believe you were playing in a bar on a challenge table. Is this so???

06-18-2002, 03:28 PM
I agree with everything you say Steve but in this situation, I might have thrown the guy a little gapper of sorts, to keep his mouth shut. No, not the standard 10% but something! Fish like this don't come often so sometimes you have to do what it takes to keep the sharks at bay.

I know, I'd be pissed as hell too but if you don't pay the guy, what else are you going to do? You can stew in your own juices or beat the crap out of him. Neither gets you paid.

Pay the putz off and tell him if he ever tries that crap again, you'll knock his action all across the state!


Jude M. Rosenstock

06-18-2002, 03:40 PM
Jude, I agree but this situation may not have allowed The Hun to speak privately with the hustler. And since he can't offer the gapper in front of the mark, his hands may have been tied.

- Steve

Tom_In_Cincy
06-18-2002, 04:39 PM
If you are out fishing (really fishing) in a boat and another fisherman comes along and scares off the fish, wouldn't you be correct in feeling that the intruder was over stepping his bounds?

Rude, arrogant, obnoxious and downright intrusive to your privacy. The guy was wrong. 100% wrong.

But, then again, he's after you and your money, and hasn't been successful with other tactics either, has he? I guess he is borderline desparate to get your game. I wonder why?

Ralph S.
06-18-2002, 06:36 PM
Bummer about losing that kind of action. I dont really condone the use of force, but if he ever tries that crap again, I would let him know you arent afraid to take him outside and discuss it further so to say. JMO.
Ralph S.

Chris Cass
06-19-2002, 12:27 AM
Hi Hum,

I myself would have seen the hustler and right off the bat would have told the mark, you'll be right back. Take the hustler on the side and told him. I would have said, I'll play you some later but now I'm in action. Even if you wern't going to play him anyway. If he gives you a hard time? I'd say, queer my action pal and I'll rip your face off.

Regards,

C.C.~~pissed just hearing this.

06-19-2002, 06:11 AM
Challenge table

06-19-2002, 06:20 AM
This guy is a mark but he isn't stupid. This man has told me point blank, he likes to play me because I shoot well, I deal with his obnoxious behavior like a true gent and I'm honest. I mean he has lost track of his money on a number of occasions, giving me more than I was due. I always give him back the excess. I've fouled when he wasn't looking and call the penalty on myself, to his dismay. For me to leave him, rush over to a known shark, whisper some things and then come back would be too suspicious.

06-19-2002, 06:22 AM
My hands were definitely tied

cheesemouse
06-19-2002, 06:26 AM
Hun,
Being that it was a recognized challenge table the guy wasn't completely out of bounds but he still should have grasped the situation and backed off. He is a nit and a low class one at that. I would never let him forget it either. Claim jumpers are as bad as railbirds....

06-19-2002, 06:29 AM
I would have to suspect that between the door and my table, the weak of heart, so called gamblers who backed down from this guy, told him the story. Come to think of it, one of those guys told me not to go home for my stick, the guy probably wouldn't be there when I returned. He told me couldn't play the guy cause he's too obnoxious. Now that this crosses my mind three months later, I wouldn't be suprised if he permanently scared away my fish. Especially after he saw how I handled him. And this guy swears he can beat me.

06-19-2002, 06:33 AM
I can't use force. A long time ago I decided to read the Koran. Though I don't believe all that I read. There a things that just make sense. One is the reason why God does not condone gambling. The violence that ensues is one result of gambling. I refuse to be the perfect example, secondly, I refuse to have anyone tarnish my views on this game I love so much and I refuse to have its image ruined as a result of gambling, which truly has nothing to do with the game.

Vagabond
06-19-2002, 07:32 AM
Howdy Hun,
If the things u wrote were true, u have to take some responsibility for that guy not leaving u alone.In your story u mentioned that after telling him to leave u asked him for how much he wanted to play .He said 40$. You gave a double message to him ( on one hand asking him to leave and on the other willing to play for the right price).U can`t blame the guy for not leaving u alone.No means no. Cheers
Vagabond

Eric.
06-19-2002, 08:02 AM
Vag,

I think you read it wrong. Hun didn't ask the guy to make a game, he just answered the question(How much are you guys playing for?) I think it's a no win situation. Personally, I would pull the jerk aside and tell him that "What goes around, comes around" and I would do him the same way if he keeps it up.


Eric >firm believer of stuff going around and coming around

06-19-2002, 09:06 AM
No, he asked how much we were playing for. No double message given.

06-19-2002, 09:13 AM
Thanks for the defense. And you best believe I let him know from here on in, whenever I see him gambling, I'm busting his action by exposing him for what he is a sharker and a hustler. He has been trying to make ammends but I know what his ulterior motive is, my pocket. In fact, I let him know that I have an individual willing to back me in a race to five for $1,000.00 against him. I further let him know that this individual has the money to lose, so it's no sweat, I have nothing to lose and everything to gain, but because he is a sharker and because I suffered at the hands of his unethical behavior, he can kiss a chance at the $1,000.00 good bye. Do you believe this guy had the audacity to propose a hustle against the guy who was to put up the $1,000.00. I mean he just doesn't get it.

06-19-2002, 09:21 AM
I understand your point, however, in this particular venue. There is only one recognized money table. All the others are for those people who came for good honest fun. Five tables one for the likes of us who require more adrenalin. Yes, he had a right to challenge, but the gamblers know what's right and what's wrong. They know the unwritten rules. Even worse, this guy was top notch when I was a chump. I watched him gamble on that very table when I respected him, so he knows. Now that I'm not a push-over and in the past 2 years have garnered a respectable rep and some change he's got amnesia. Go figure.

06-19-2002, 09:28 AM
Hun, if I were you, I wouldn't show that punk a nickel. In fact, I would go as far as to set up a time with him. Late night, like 12 or 1 and don't even show up. I bet he'll leave you alone for good.

06-19-2002, 09:51 AM
shark or no shark if I dont want him near my table I tell him to go if he does not go I make him go period.

Vagabond
06-19-2002, 10:26 AM
Hi,
Thanks for the response.It appears that I misread the the scenario.I stand corrected.cheers
Vagabond

06-19-2002, 10:29 AM
Hi, Hun:

I totally agree that shark was grossly out of line...no contest there. But in reading your posts, I'm sensing a mixed message. You've stated that gambling truly has nothing to do with the game of pool, but you're upset because your fish jumped the hook.

I understand that your rage might be about circumstances of how your opponent dropped out....in essence, the principle of the situation. If that's so, though, would you still be seething 3 months later if the lost opponent had only been worth $40 instead of $2500? Even the title of your thread -- "I lost $2500" focuses on the money (gambling) instead of the outrage over the etiquette violation.

If it really is the money you're upset over, it'll be tough to swallow what's happened. But if it's the courtesy violation you're ticked about, I'd make it a point to talk to shark and tell him you're seething and why. Since you're adverse to threatening force, an alternative would be to reassure him that you can (and WILL) put the word out on him (effectively killing HIS action) if he commits a similar breach.

06-19-2002, 11:02 AM
LOOK HUN .THE SHARK WAS WRONG 4 GETTING IN THE MIDDLE OF U ACTION.THE BEST WAY 2 DEAL WITH THIS GUY IS WHEN EVERY U SEE HIM PLAYING SOMEONE. BLOW UP HIS SPOT .TELL THE GUY HE'S PLAYING THAT HE CAN WIN. BUT MAKE SURE THAT KNOW WERE THIS ALL STARTED FROM . AND FIGHTING HIM OVER THIS NO REASON . . THERES NO REASON 2 FIGHT ABOUT THIS.IT'S ALL ABOUT MONEY WE NEVER HOLD IT 4 LONG THEN IT'S GONE..
SO DON'T GET 2 MAD REVENGE IS ALWAYS SO SWEAT.

06-19-2002, 11:13 AM
Let's put it like this. Once upon a time, I was a purist. I loved the game for the love of the game. Somewhere along the line, in my education, I started to gamble and started to like it a lot. Although I like it a lot, I do realize that it does not have anything to do with the purity of this game of pool. I can make the differentiation and I realize what type of problems materialize because of it. What I'm trying to say is I realize money has nothing to do with the game and I don't want something that is truly not the essence of the game to cause me to start disliking it. Example, usining violent methods to secure cash. It's like drunk obnoxious people have nothing to do with the game in truth, but when you go to shoot, sometimes you just have to deal with them.
I care about both things.
The cash that I had a chance at.
And the manner in which this idiot went about breaking up the action.
If the fish only had $40 bones in his pocket, I would still be upset because of how the shark handled it. But I don't want to give the impression that I don't care about the money, I'm human, with flaws, I care about the cash I just know that cash is truly not one of the principles, techniques, or skills that make up the true essence of the game. Hope this made some sense. Didn't want to make you think that I was trying to paint myself as a saint, just a gambler with the some ethics.

06-19-2002, 04:24 PM
Hi Hun.
I saw my share of players like your shark when I use to play in the 60s. He was showing he's as class less as you described him. But maybe in his mind he just saw all that easy money. And he wanted some. I know that's simplifing it. But that's how he was probably thinking.

When you have a fish like that, it really isn't gambling. That's my opinion. I'm not saying your're wrong to take advantage of him. I like to think I would at least offer him a spot where I would have less of an advantage. But I would probably be greedy and just try to take all his money.

One more thought for you. If you beat him for $700 and he had $2500, the shark only cost you $1800. DID I SAY ONLY?

06-19-2002, 08:18 PM
No it was $2,500, the $700 was acquired in previos sessions. I couldn't give this guy a spot cause he was great, his problem was booze. I never told him this of course. But I noticed this guy could really shoot but thought booze helped his game. If we played for 4 hours he drank for for hours. Me, I drink a heiniken an hour or hour and a half. But you are probably right, even if I were like an A and he a B, if he didn't ask I wasn't offering.