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eat_sleep_pool
10-09-2005, 07:55 PM
Hey
Nice title hey lol. Ok im trying to teach my friend how to play pool iv been doing so for about 7 months, and she is doing ALOT better, BUT i and trying to get her to stop jabbing thats all she does and its kinda frustrating. Is there something that i can do to teach her how not to.. And trying to show her how to use backspin is almost imposible to mainly due to the shitty stroke. anyways anyone have tips? and how about helping me help herhow to break, shes really weak but strangth isnt everything.

And, are there different types of strokes for diff shots?? can you explain what they are? is a punch shot one of them? lol

JPB
10-09-2005, 08:39 PM
you aren't qualified to teach her if you are asking this. Sorry. If she wants help hook her up with a professional for lessons. Even if you are a very good player, it usually doesn't work to give lessons to friends. They won't take your advice and most are not competent to teach the skill. In pool and other things. And if by "friend" you mean somebody you have a romantic relationship with, DO NOT give lessons.

eat_sleep_pool
10-09-2005, 08:42 PM
no shes just a friend, and she asked me to help her, shes in no way to go seek help.. im just teaching her for fun.

Sid_Vicious
10-10-2005, 12:48 AM
Go ahead and teach her what you know. You'll be surprised what you learn in the process. My opinion is that "qualified" is a relative term. You can intimidate a fresh player with so called certified instruction, not to mention waste their money. A friend can do a lot in the beginning of their trek into pool...sid

eat_sleep_pool
10-10-2005, 06:21 AM
Thanks for that bost of confidence sid, but can someone answer my questions?? lol

Fran Crimi
10-10-2005, 07:07 AM
I think it's great that you love pool and want to help your friend. But you have to be careful about showing her things the wrong way. It's not easy to teach pool and it's not easy to explain to you how to teach certain things in pool.

Maybe you could pick up some instructional books or DVD's on how to play and share them with her. I think that would be your best bet. Then you can help explain them to her. You'll find the answers to your questions in most good books, like Phil Capelle's book, for example.

If she really starts to get into the game, it wouldn't be such a bad idea to get her some professional instructions. Maybe you could get her a lesson for a Christmas present. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Fran

loyter
10-10-2005, 08:48 AM
I'm going to have to disagree with the assertion that teaching pool is difficult. There are very few basic fundamentals and they are easy to explain. The execution of the fundamentals is the difficult part. Moreover, many of the more advanced techniques are difficult to explain, but teaching someone to shoot is pretty easy.

Teaching golf is hard.

Novices should learn how to stand, how to create a bridge, how to visualize their angles, and how to stroke/follow through. It should take a good long time to get comfortable with these things, and introducing english and banks and other more advanced ideas needs to wait until the player gets comfortable with the basic mechanics of the stroke.

You don't have to have some silly certificate to teach someone what you know. Most of what we learn in life, we learn from people of average to advanced skill levels, and only when we become quite advanced ourselves do we need to go to a professional coach/teacher.

One last thing though, if you are teaching someone fundamentals, make sure you are teaching the proper fundamentals, because these thing will be difficult to repair in the future if learned wrong in the early-going.

Jal
10-10-2005, 11:20 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote eat_sleep_pool:</font><hr> trying to get her to stop jabbing thats all she does and its kinda frustrating. Is there something that i can do to teach her how not to.. <hr /></blockquote>

Short of going to a professional, I would try this.

Have her set up for a shot like she normally would and check the position of her forearm when the tip of her cue is just about to touch the cueball. It should be nearly straight up and down. If not, have her change the position of her grip hand until it is.

Now have her execute her stroke above a yardstick (or meter stick) without actually hitting a cueball. Make sure she draws the tip back to her bridge and measure the length of her stroke from her bridge to the point where the tip stops. It should be something like 16"-24" in length depending on how long her arms are. When she strokes, only her forearm should move. Her elbow should remain relatively fixed in space.

If she's still jabbing even without a cueball present, give her a piece of candy (or some other reward) every time she manages to add a few inches to her stroke. If no amount of encouragement helps, then perhaps professional help is needed. But if her stroke lengthens out, then move on to the next phase.

Introduce the cueball, but place it well beyond the reach of her stroke. After she strokes at it a few times, move it a little closer. Repeat this until she's actually hitting the cueball, and then, step by step, re-position it until it's at the normal distance from her bridge hand. Whenever she reverts to jabbing, move the cueball farther away. Reward her with some candy (or whatever) whenever she maintains her stroke length.

You could also add some sort of mild punishment when she fails to execute properly, such as expressions of disappointment, but here is where a professional has an advantage. People are naturally more compliant and more apt to want to please them. It would help if you don a Gestapo uniform.

I think the above technique is worth a try, if you both have the patience for it.

Jim

eat_sleep_pool
10-10-2005, 01:30 PM
actually thats some good stuff jim.. when i read the give her candy part thouhg i laughed really hard. shes not a kid lol. but thanks

Fran Crimi
10-10-2005, 01:32 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote loyter:</font><hr> I'm going to have to disagree with the assertion that teaching pool is difficult. There are very few basic fundamentals and they are easy to explain. The execution of the fundamentals is the difficult part. Moreover, many of the more advanced techniques are difficult to explain, but teaching someone to shoot is pretty easy.

<hr /></blockquote>

Well, heck. And here I was thinking all these years that teaching fundamentals was hard...what was I thinking?

Fran

loyter
10-10-2005, 01:58 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr>

Well, heck. And here I was thinking all these years that teaching fundamentals was hard...what was I thinking?

Fran <hr /></blockquote>

My point is that the basic mechanics are pretty simple. There are no gross body movements, like golf or even shooting a free-throw. You position your feet correctly, get over the cue, have a solid, stationary bridge, and you use your forearm to stroke. That's pretty much it. Advanced technique may be difficult, the stroke is easy. Whether your student has the coordination to actually master the stroke is another story altogether (and it may take a long long time before he/she does), but helping someone understand the basics is easy.

No offense to those of you who teach pool. I have instructed several players on a recreational level, and I have met with some very good results. But you can't teach a novice to be an A player...that takes time and experience.

One thing I have noticed while showing friends the basics is that I keep wishing someone would have shown me the basic fundamentals of the stroke back when I was 16, so I didn't have to eventually fix all the things I was doing wrong.

Fran Crimi
10-10-2005, 02:46 PM
In teaching basics, you have to prepare the student to advance. That doesn't mean you should teach them advanced things but you have to be 10 steps ahead of them. You have to be able to spot the subtle things, like someone tilting their head slightly to the side, something hardly noticible---maybe it has no effect at all on pocketing easy shots, but things may change for them when they try to shoot tougher shots. The location of their knuckles on the cue might slightly shift through the stroke. It may be so subtle, that it won't matter with easy shots. Again, if it's not picked up and corrected early on, it will cause problems later. A slight upward movement of the head when they execute their stroke. There are so many subtleties like that, maybe in the hundreds, that those instructors with their silly certificates are taught to observe. You have to know which subtleties are okay to let go for now and which ones you have to address right away.

Trust me. It ain't easy. I'm not kidding.

Fran

Tom_In_Cincy
10-10-2005, 03:26 PM
Please let me be the 1st to validate what Ms Crimi is stating.

Ms. Crimi is a certified pocket billiard instructor and has been longer that this website has been in existance.

She also was a top ranked touring womens professional.

Tom&lt;-------always been a huge fan of Ms. Crimi

pooltchr
10-10-2005, 05:27 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr>
Well, heck. And here I was thinking all these years that teaching fundamentals was hard...what was I thinking?

Fran <hr /></blockquote>

Fran...teaching fundamentals IS easy.....
Teaching them properly is another matter altogether! That's why we as instructors keep going back to one another. That's why we spend our time and money trying to learn how to become better at teaching. I know what I have invested, and I know you have invested far more than that. Anyone who thinks it's easy has never learned how to do it the right way.

I believe that none of us can teach anyone how to play pool. We can give them the tools, and teach them how to use them...but it is up to them to apply what they learn from us. As Randy puts it, "We teach people how to LEARN to play pool"
I can put two students of the same skill level into the same class, teach them the exact same things at the same time, and one will become a great player, while the other only average. The difference isn't what I taught them, it's what they did with what I taught them.

Steve

Fran Crimi
10-10-2005, 08:50 PM
Hey, thanks for the thumbs-up Tom. Awfully nice of you to say. Let me know if I can do anything for you. New car, perhaps? /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Fran

caedos
10-10-2005, 08:58 PM
Or how about teaching the same thing to a slow methodical analytic who has to take notes, a fast and stubborn 9-ball player, and an ADDHD 11 year old who just wants to be good enough to beat his buddies? Teaching well means being able to teach the same thing in different ways to reach different people while being responsible for seeing that the message is received in some semblance of what was intended. If you're teaching a friend there is already rapport and hopefully trust. Humor and patience are probably next. After that, accept that because it's among friends (and low to no cost) the student may not feel personally invested in the project enough to pay close attention. This means it's now a social function with limited learning.

It's always an adventure.

Carl

Tom_In_Cincy
10-10-2005, 09:00 PM
TOO LATE.. Just bought a 06' Camry.. the wife loves it...

recoveryjones
10-10-2005, 10:03 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr> In teaching basics, you have to prepare the student to advance. That doesn't mean you should teach them advanced things but you have to be 10 steps ahead of them. You have to be able to spot the subtle things, like someone tilting their head slightly to the side, something hardly noticible---maybe it has no effect at all on pocketing easy shots, but things may change for them when they try to shoot tougher shots. The location of their knuckles on the cue might slightly shift through the stroke. It may be so subtle, that it won't matter with easy shots. Again, if it's not picked up and corrected early on, it will cause problems later. A slight upward movement of the head when they execute their stroke. There are so many subtleties like that, maybe in the hundreds, that those instructors with their silly certificates are taught to observe. You have to know which subtleties are okay to let go for now and which ones you have to address right away.

Trust me. It ain't easy. I'm not kidding.

Fran <hr /></blockquote>

My God, do I need to see someone like you.

Many a friend has told me that my mechanics look good.They like my stance,my straight elbow, my lineup and my apparent stillness. They tell me it looks better than most, however, I know I suck.As a matter of fact, I really suck!!!

It's those little sublities that you speak about that they don't see (that you would),however, that I know that are there. I can feel them.

I work damn hard on my game and my mechanics, however, I know I'm stumped and can go no further without eliminating those sublities and getting professional help.

I've got all the vids, books, aiming systems,stroke trainers, third eyes, Rempe cue balls etc etc and knowledge that most could hope for and have improved loads, however, I'm not going to get much better until those sublities are removed.I've tried to figure things out myself, however,it's time to get some help.Maybe just a few little changes might make all the difference in the world to get to that next level.

So now that I realize I need some help to improve, who do I go to.

A. A seasoned professional, Master instructor?
B. Or some guy that says teaching pool fundamentals is easy?

RJ

pooltchr
10-11-2005, 05:19 AM
Carl,
You are absolutely right. A good instructor must understand the student, their goals, their personality, and how they learn. My point was that, all other things being equil, the student who is willing to invest the time into applying the things taught in class during serious practice is going to advance farther than the student who goes to class, and then just goes out and plays pool.
Play time does not equil practice time.
Steve

DickLeonard
10-11-2005, 06:16 AM
RecoveryJones, It sounds to me like you are suffering from the dread disease of "Paralysis by Analysis". There comes a time when you just have to have Faith in your Stroke and just shoot.####

DickLeonard
10-11-2005, 06:35 AM
Loyter I think teaching Golf is easier because no matter what is wrong with your swing if in the last two feet of your swing it gets in position you can hit the ball.
Example Jim Furyk for one.

A thought just popped into my head maybe teaching Golf is harder,Tiger Woods is still taking lessons.####

Fran Crimi
10-11-2005, 09:33 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> RecoveryJones, It sounds to me like you are suffering from the dread disease of "Paralysis by Analysis". There comes a time when you just have to have Faith in your Stroke and just shoot.#### <hr /></blockquote>


You're right about that, Dick. Sometimes you just have to shoot and trust yourself. But in general, everything changed when ball-in-hand 9 Ball came along. I watched a lot of 14.1 players struggle to make the transition, many of them finally giving up because they struggled with the big shots. Not to take anything away from their skills --- they were the experts at pinpoint position, but many of them didn't focus on fine tuning their fundamentals because they didn't need to as much at that time.

One of Sigel's strong suits in 14.1 was that he was able to come with the big shot when he needed it because he had great fundamentals. He was also a great pinpoint position player, too. He was one of the few who could play both games equally well.

These days, when working with students, you have to anticipate that they may be playing 9 Ball, which means more focus on the picky stuff. Like I said, you have to be 10 steps ahead.

Fran

Voodoo Daddy
10-11-2005, 10:04 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr> TOO LATE.. Just bought a 06' Camry.. the wife loves it... <hr /></blockquote>

Did ya get the A.A.R.P. discount????

Scott Lee
10-11-2005, 10:35 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr> Hey, thanks for the thumbs-up Tom. Awfully nice of you to say. Let me know if I can do anything for you. New car, perhaps? /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Fran <hr /></blockquote>

Fran...Tom is DEFINITELY in the market for a new car! LOL!
He needs a Cadillac! LMAO

Scott

Scott Lee
10-11-2005, 10:48 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote loyter:</font><hr>

Novices should learn how to stand, how to create a bridge, how to visualize their angles, and how to stroke/follow through. It should take a good long time to get comfortable with these things, and introducing english and banks and other more advanced ideas needs to wait until the player gets comfortable with the basic mechanics of the stroke.

You don't have to have some silly certificate to teach someone what you know. Most of what we learn in life, we learn from people of average to advanced skill levels, and only when we become quite advanced ourselves do we need to go to a professional coach/teacher.

One last thing though, if you are teaching someone fundamentals, make sure you are teaching the proper fundamentals, because these thing will be difficult to repair in the future if learned wrong in the early-going. <hr /></blockquote>

loyter...Your last two paragraphs contradict one another.
The basic problem in amateurs trying to teach amateurs, is that THEY have poor fundamentals, and don't even realize it.
Like Fran said, those of us with the "silly certification" have been TRAINED to observe, and correct mechanical and timing problems, as well as educate players on myths that continue to be perpepuated by unknowing masses. The 'silly certification' at least ensures that we, as teachers, understand clearly what a stroke is, and how to correctly demonstrate it. You are absolutely incorrect in your assertion that a beginner has no need nor can benefit from professional instruction from the outset. As far as sid's notion that a professional might 'intimidate' a beginner...that lies with the instructor. Having taught thousands of students, of all abilities, over a 25 yr period, I have never intimidated anyone. Pooltcher hit the nail on the head, when he mentioned that we can only provide the student with the tools. They have to provide their own degree of motivation. BTW, loyter, being able to visualize angles means nothing without a well-defined stroke and preshot routine. Additionally, follow-through is NOT something you learn, or make happen...it is a natural result of a good quality stroke, with no elbow collapse! These are just some of the silly things you might learn, if you open your mind.

Scott Lee
10-11-2005, 10:50 AM
Sure Tom...you didn't have that in June!!! LOL

Scott

Jal
10-11-2005, 10:57 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote eat_sleep_pool:</font><hr> actually thats some good stuff jim.. when i read the give her candy part thouhg i laughed really hard. shes not a kid lol. but thanks <hr /></blockquote>Thank you eat_sleep_pool. Yes, I was being a bit silly, but I thought that if you make a game of it, it might provide a little more incentive. I didn't mean to be insulting to you or her and I'm glad you didn't take it that way...or gave me the benefit of the doubt.

I mentioned that her stroke length should be around 16"-24". Actually, 14"-20" would be more like it, maybe less if she's very petite. I'm 6' tall and mine is about 17". It can only be extended to 24" or more if I grip my cue, which is 60" long, at the very end of the butt.

Jim

Fran Crimi
10-12-2005, 08:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr>
My God, do I need to see someone like you.

Many a friend has told me that my mechanics look good.They like my stance,my straight elbow, my lineup and my apparent stillness. They tell me it looks better than most, however, I know I suck.As a matter of fact, I really suck!!!

It's those little sublities that you speak about that they don't see (that you would),however, that I know that are there. I can feel them.

I work damn hard on my game and my mechanics, however, I know I'm stumped and can go no further without eliminating those sublities and getting professional help.

I've got all the vids, books, aiming systems,stroke trainers, third eyes, Rempe cue balls etc etc and knowledge that most could hope for and have improved loads, however, I'm not going to get much better until those sublities are removed.I've tried to figure things out myself, however,it's time to get some help.Maybe just a few little changes might make all the difference in the world to get to that next level.

So now that I realize I need some help to improve, who do I go to.

A. A seasoned professional, Master instructor?
B. Or some guy that says teaching pool fundamentals is easy?

RJ <hr /></blockquote>


Without seeing you play, but based on what you've written, I'd say a good place for you to start woud be by paying attention to your back hand. Start looking at things like this: What's the tension? Does it tighten when you shoot certain shots? Are you shooting pool with your hand or are you shooting with your arm? Are you trying to control too much with your back hand?

Many times we react to our emotions with our back hand. We don't even realize that we do it. Fear, anxiety, anticipation --- they all show up in the back hand.

Spend some time thinking about it. Look for patterns. You might figure out some interesting stuff.

Fran

Fran Crimi
10-12-2005, 09:42 AM
I thought about your suggestion for a couple of days. Initially, I thought, well yes, this could work. But something about it didn't feel quite right to me. I think I know what that is now. This suggestion is pretty drastic for a beginner. It will instantly put her off her game. I think it could work for someone who's been playing for a few years and recognizes that what they were doing wasn't right, only they didn't know how to change it. Then a light bulb would go off in their head when they felt the difference.

But with beginners, all it feels like is a change, and all changes feel bad, and drastic changes feel terrible. The change needs to be more subtle and gradual over a longer period of time. There's a slight chance it might work, depending on how far along she is, but I would lean more toward her being upset and frustrated.

And that whole acting disappointed stuff...no, don't go there. She's not a lab rat. It's not right. Better to just stay positive with the person.

JMO

Fran

Sid_Vicious
10-12-2005, 10:05 AM
"And that whole acting disappointed stuff...no, don't go there. It's not right. Better to just stay positive with the person."

Absolutely. The only time I show anything other than positive is when they would say, take a totally unneeded combination after many, many time of telling then it's not the selection with an array of other shots easily available. The student knows it(I stop and tell them for one thing) and yet they suddenly have a pool brain of their own and shoot it anyway. At that point, I take my positive mask off. If a student knowingly elects to play the wrong shot right in front of me, they catch a little hell. Otherwise the easiest shot can be missed and I'll find something constructive to say, or not say, which is many times the best response you can give...sid

Fran Crimi
10-12-2005, 10:29 AM
Another approach to that would be to make a joke and have them laugh at themselves in realization that they made a dumb mistake. For example, a student of mine tended to rush his shots and I reminded him to slow down on several occasions. One day when he started rushing, I said, "Do you have a train to catch?" He looked at me puzzled, and said, "No. Why?" I said, "Oh, I just thought by the way you were rushing around the table you needed to finish by a certain time." He started to laugh, and every time after that when I caught him rushing, I'd just have to say, "Late for that train again, are we?" He'd crack up realizing he was rushing again. No negativity there at all. All positive stuff.

Fran

Jal
10-12-2005, 12:29 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fran Crimi:</font><hr> I thought about your suggestion for a couple of days. Initially, I thought, well yes, this could work. But something about it didn't feel quite right to me. I think I know what that is now. This suggestion is pretty drastic for a beginner. It will instantly put her off her game. I think it could work for someone who's been playing for a few years and recognizes that what they were doing wasn't right, only they didn't know how to change it. Then a light bulb would go off in their head when they felt the difference.

But with beginners, all it feels like is a change, and all changes feel bad, and drastic changes feel terrible. The change needs to be more subtle and gradual over a longer period of time. There's a slight chance it might work, depending on how far along she is, but I would lean more toward her being upset and frustrated.

And that whole acting disappointed stuff...no, don't go there. She's not a lab rat. It's not right. Better to just stay positive with the person.

JMO

Fran <hr /></blockquote>Thank you Fran and Sid. You're the experts and I hope eat_sleep_pool takes note of what you said. I certainly have.

You mentioned tension in one's backhand in your response to recoveryjones. Should grip pressure (or lack of it) remain the same for essentially all shots? If so, are there exceptions?

Jim

Fran Crimi
10-12-2005, 01:02 PM
About grip pressure:

I think it varies quite a bit, and justifiably so, probably even moreso in 9 Ball due to the diversity of shots that the player faces.

I'm not ready to discuss when you should or shouldn't tighten your grip because I'm still studying that, but I do feel comfortable in saying that there's a lot of unnecessary tightening going on; and players should pay attention to when they're tightening up, and should try to determine if it's an emotional response or for some other reason.

Fran

HALHOULE
10-12-2005, 05:04 PM
FRAN I DO NOT AGREE WITH YOUR CHOICE OF CAPELLE'S BOOK, AS A WAY TO GAIN SOME PROFICIENCY IN POOL. HIS BOOK IS OVER FIVE HUNDRED PAGES IN LENGTH, AND AT NO TIME DOES HE INSTRUCT HOW TO PUT A BALL INTO A POCKET, AND THAT IS THE NAME OF THE GAME. CAPELLE IS AN AMATEUR PLAYER IN A SMALL LEAGUE IN HUNTINGTON BEACH, CALIFORNIA. AN ASPIRING STUDENT WOULD DO WELL TO SEEK ADVICE AND INSTRUCTION ELSEWHERE.

Voodoo Daddy
10-12-2005, 05:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote HALHOULE:</font><hr> FRAN I DO NOT AGREE WITH YOUR CHOICE OF CAPELLE'S BOOK, AS A WAY TO GAIN SOME PROFICIENCY IN POOL. HIS BOOK IS OVER FIVE HUNDRED PAGES IN LENGTH, AND AT NO TIME DOES HE INSTRUCT HOW TO PUT A BALL INTO A POCKET, AND THAT IS THE NAME OF THE GAME. CAPELLE IS AN AMATEUR PLAYER IN A SMALL LEAGUE IN HUNTINGTON BEACH, CALIFORNIA. AN ASPIRING STUDENT WOULD DO WELL TO SEEK ADVICE AND INSTRUCTION ELSEWHERE. <hr /></blockquote>

I guess your word is gospel...not one others opinion matters but yours. Why do find it manditory to shoot down those that know the most and agree with those that know the least? Are you that bitter a person? I guess you were a world beater in your day and that constitutes your knowledge as ALL knowing? Funny...I asked around and no one seems to know much about you. Having said that does that mean your words fall into Capelle's catagory &lt;which I find a percentage of Phil's work to be incredible&gt; or are you a hypocrite?

Barbara
10-12-2005, 05:50 PM
Hey Voodoo,

When Hal moves East I intend to meet up with him and try to learn his aiming system. I'll let you know.

Barbara

recoveryjones
10-12-2005, 07:11 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> RecoveryJones, It sounds to me like you are suffering from the dread disease of "Paralysis by Analysis". There comes a time when you just have to have Faith in your Stroke and just shoot.#### <hr /></blockquote>

OK,I admit it, I've been 100% well diagnosed.....LOL
Busted and convicted....guilty as charged your Honor.

Actually I play OK, nothing special and I'm considered an average A level player locally. No matter what, pool is enjoyable to me for sure.

I would like to be diagnosed by a qualified instructor some day person to person and improve things even more, because the better I play the more I enjoy things....that all.
RJ

Qtec
10-12-2005, 07:42 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote eat_sleep_pool:</font><hr> Thanks for that bost of confidence sid, but can someone answer my questions?? lol <hr /></blockquote>

First of all you have to get her to change her thinking. The principal is this- we dont hit the QB, we hit THRU the QB. Also, when shooting, our eyes should be on the OB and not the QB.

Set up an easy straight shot with the balls about 1 ft apart, OB 6in from the pocket. Now, if she is hitting the QB just a tip above center on the QB, get her to envisage the same point on the OB, tell her to forget the QB and try to hit that point on the OB with the tip of the Q.
The two points that have to be stressed continually are these - forget the QB, hit the OB.
Once she has got the idea, get her to hit lower on the QB and if she concentrates on the QB when shooting, you will see her draw for the first time.
Good luck. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Qtec......make sure she's not gripping the Q to tightly.

loyter
10-13-2005, 08:34 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote recoveryjones:</font><hr>

My God, do I need to see someone like you.

Many a friend has told me that my mechanics look good.They like my stance,my straight elbow, my lineup and my apparent stillness. They tell me it looks better than most, however, I know I suck.As a matter of fact, I really suck!!!

It's those little sublities that you speak about that they don't see (that you would),however, that I know that are there. I can feel them.

I work damn hard on my game and my mechanics, however, I know I'm stumped and can go no further without eliminating those sublities and getting professional help.

I've got all the vids, books, aiming systems,stroke trainers, third eyes, Rempe cue balls etc etc and knowledge that most could hope for and have improved loads, however, I'm not going to get much better until those sublities are removed.I've tried to figure things out myself, however,it's time to get some help.Maybe just a few little changes might make all the difference in the world to get to that next level.

So now that I realize I need some help to improve, who do I go to.

A. A seasoned professional, Master instructor?
B. Or some guy that says teaching pool fundamentals is easy?

RJ <hr /></blockquote>

RJ, I never said that I could teach a player how to get to the point where they can beat anyone. In fact, if you look back at the original post, you'll see that it is about teaching a beginner how to shoot.

I am not talking about advanced coaching here....I am talking about picking up a cue and making a bridge and developing a stroke. How many true novices would pick up the game with the goal of being a tournament player? Most people just want the basics so they can shoot at the bar on Friday night. Those are the basics that are easy to teach. We are not talking electro-magnetic fields here, just basic physics and some simple form.

loy

Tom_In_Cincy
10-13-2005, 08:51 AM
By now, you should be aware that CCB members for the vast majority, are NOT 'most people'.

Keep thinking that teaching the 'basics' is easy... you're entitled to that opinion, just don't expect me or others on this forum to agree. Fair enough?

[ QUOTE ]
Most people just want the basics so they can shoot at the bar on Friday night. <hr /></blockquote>

I disagree. Most people just want to drink in a bar on Friday nites. Playing pool is just another way to compete against your buddies, like darts or shuffle board.

Fran Crimi
10-13-2005, 09:10 AM
Hey Tom,

Your avatar looks like a tombstone. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Different mentalities for different folks. We answer questions the best we can. We jump in when we think we can help. That's all we can do.

I don't post for one person. There's a lot of people out there reading this board.

Fran