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veager
10-20-2005, 09:03 AM
My wife and I Captain a 8ball team and lately she's been in a slump. I feel her problem is that she is so intent on running out the rack or getting ball count that she shoots herself into trouble, because all her opponents gota do is safe play her.

We practice and she will run 7 balls with no 8ball shot , so I keep safing her, then runout. She doesen't seem to get the concept and will get angry at me because I question her on why she would shoot all her balls off when she cannot finish the rack. How can I make her stop doing this short of breaking her cue?

Sid_Vicious
10-20-2005, 09:17 AM
Keep doing what you are doing. Honestly speaking though, if a wife/GF has her mind in one direction, you'll be the last person to get her to do it the right way. Let her work one on one with someone else, and if it works like it always has for me she'll pop up and say something like, "Hey ol'So-and-So showed me that I don't need to run balls without getting out to win!" Whether it be pool or anything else, that's the way it seems to be in relationships. I ain't trying to be sexist, but it seems that females get this stubborn bug more than men do...sid

SPetty
10-20-2005, 09:17 AM
Lot's of real good advice right here:

Beating a better player (http://www.billiardsdigest.com/ccboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=ccb&Number=207844)

Snapshot9
10-20-2005, 10:09 AM
You have to teach her to not make what I call 'No Future'
shots. That you do not make a ball if you can not continue
the run (by not getting shape), or the shot after will be
almost Zero chance of making or will leave a sold out table.
It is better to leave that first ball on the table, getting
it close to the next ball (so a breakout can be achieved),
or to play safe by just hitting it, and trying to put the
cue ball where you don't have a good shot, thereby optimizing her chances to get to the table again. You have
to explain it in a similiar manner to her, so that she understands cause and effect from her actions, a bad shot
on the next ball will leave a sure sell out vs, a safety
(as much as she can) that might allow her to shoot again.
Do you see now where I got the term 'No Future' shots?

sack316
10-20-2005, 01:24 PM
Usually what I try to do when faced with a situation such as this one is try to present the strategy in a different way. Usually my female players/girlfriends/ and even some male players for that matter, get insulted (for lack of a better word) when someone tries to show them what they should do. I think they may feel like you/me are making them feel dumb or like they don't know what they are doing, and the natural response (no matter how valid your advice is) tends to be getting mad, frustrated, and rejecting our advice.
So instead of saying, "you shoulda done this" or " why did you do that" I'll generally do one of two things. One is I may try to stop them before a shot I know is trouble. I'll patiently say something like, "I see what you're doing, and that's fine. But let's see what happens if you try this." or "let me show you something pretty cool that you can do here". And then show them a safe play.
If she doesn't react to that well... I'll wait for them to shoot the trouble shot, and then step in and say "good try" or "that was good" then reset the balls as they were and then show them the correct shot and let them see the difference in what they did and should do. You may even want to act like it just hit you and you're curious to see if a shot will work of done a certain way... that way they feel like they are helping you in a way.
And if none of that works well for ya, I can always fall back on the old, "let me show you how to beat ME" routine" They always want to beat me and "get me back" for hooking them or beating them or whatever. Sometimes the prospect of sweet revenge will open up an ear.
Just some of my thoughts,
Sack

wolfdancer
10-20-2005, 03:50 PM
Sid is right on....you can't change her mind....so, the solution is for her to discover it on her own.
Here's what I'd do,and have done. Get her to play the 8-ball "sucker bet" game. Break, take all the balls from one group off the table, then it's your shot...to run, or play safe.
Alternate this with her, and let her see for herself, that the player with the most balls usually wins, just like in real life.

theinel
10-21-2005, 12:53 AM
The advice given, and the link to "beating a better player" thread pretty much cover what your wife/gf needs to do. I would just add something that many lesser skilled players don't comprehend in 8-ball... The goal is not to make balls, it is to win the game. Yes balls must eventually be made, but if the shooter is not confident of legally pocketing the eight ball during his/her current turn at the table then strategy, and not pointless, or counter-productive ball pocketing, must take precedence.

veager
10-21-2005, 05:44 AM
Good advice here. I always preach that it don't matter who shoots better, it's who wins the game. I need to find another person to coach her. It would be better recieved comming from a stranger.

Sid_Vicious
10-21-2005, 06:37 AM
It always stung to have to realize that I, the one who was supposedly THE CHOSEN ONE, "in sickness and health", "till death do you part", by the significant other, wasn't accepted as adequate, much less superior as a coach, in ANYTHING! Bottomline is, that's the ironic way it is. Once the VERY first impass comes between a spouse or GF over these types of tutorial things, it is time to give up, cuz things will only get uglier. You are doing the right thing in getting another person to teach, just suck it up and go on. On the positive side though, she'll melt a little in time and you will have knowledge to give, just spoon feed is my best advice, and learn to duck at the proper moment...sid

caedos
11-02-2005, 10:21 PM
You might introduce her to the posts on this board! I'm sure almost all of us are strangers to her and she could read the feedback and work it out for herself a bit. Did you say she often runs seven and gets bad shape for the 8-ball? Does she have the routine of picking out the Link Ball to get to the 8-ball? It's one of the most important balls to any pattern I choose. The 8-ball can be very routine if the correct Link Ball (or Key Ball) is used.

Carl

onepocketfanatic
11-03-2005, 09:46 PM
When I started playing in an 8 ball league several years ago, it was after laying off the game for 20 years. I was having the same kind of problem your wife is having. MY team mates during practice would constanly safe me after I ran almost all of my balls off the table. Eventually I got smart, and started safing them when possible, even though I thought I could get out. Tell her as the captain of the team told me "safeties win games"! Not only do I play safe now, I LOOK for them. Almost nothing in the game of pool beats ball in hand!

supergreenman
11-04-2005, 09:21 AM
Playing safe after running your balls out isn't going to win you any games. You're opponent is just going to play safe right back on you. and since he/she has more balls on the table to hide behind you're going to end up giving up a ball in hand and losing a game

Cornerman
11-04-2005, 09:44 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote veager:</font><hr> She doesen't seem to get the concept and will get angry at me because I question her on why she would shoot all her balls off when she cannot finish the rack. How can I make her stop doing this short of breaking her cue? <hr /></blockquote>
I'm no help, but I'll give you my point of view.

Don't play with her. She's your partner. The last thing she wants to be is your student.

No couples on my teams.

Fred &lt;~~~ No help

MosconiJr
11-04-2005, 11:47 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Cornerman:</font><hr>
I'm no help, but I'll give you my point of view.

Don't play with her. She's your partner. The last thing she wants to be is your student.

No couples on my teams.

Fred &lt;~~~ No help <hr /></blockquote>
Excellent advise, Fred. I never thought of the "being equal" point. Even subconsciously, this could cause couples not to be good as student/teacher.

MJr

daniels_jack
11-04-2005, 12:46 PM
my GF and i play pool al the time and not to dog her game but im the better of the 2 due mostly to the fact i play more strategically planning runs and what not shes just now kinda getting into that, what im gettin to is if you are maybe a better player than her and this fact is know just tell her when giving advice "well this is what i did to get batter at this" things like that, kinda spoon feed her as somone said and show her using examples it might feel kinda like an akward moment at first cause shes not gonna wanna listen but if you be patient with her she may warm up to the idea of you showing her things, i dunno it work with my girl hope it can work for you

pooltchr
11-04-2005, 09:20 PM
As a BCA instructor, I will teach anyone......EXCEPT MY WIFE!!!
If she want's an instructor, I will send her to see Cane or Randy or Scott...but I value my relationship too much to even attempt taking her on as a student.
Steve

Fran Crimi
11-04-2005, 09:49 PM
I see this with couples all the time, and I'm guilty of it myself. You cross barriers that you shouldn't cross because you're a couple and you think it gives you that right. People don't like to be told what to do, particularly when they're not asking for advice. They don't like it when a stranger does it to them and it's no different when their Significant Other does it to them.

You can tell her that you have some ideas about her game that you'd like to share with her if she would like to hear your opinion. She'll let you know if she want's to try to work it out on her own or if she's open at that time to hear you out. Let her know you're there for her and leave it at that. She'll decide when she's ready to hear what you or anyone else has to say.

Then if she does come to you to hear your ideas, she'll be more open to your suggestions because it's her choice and it's not being forced on her.

Fran

HALHOULE
11-05-2005, 05:31 AM
WHAT IS "SAFING" ??

John_Madden
11-05-2005, 04:54 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr> As a BCA instructor, I will teach anyone......EXCEPT MY WIFE!!!
If she want's an instructor, I will send her to see Cane or Randy or Scott...but I value my relationship too much to even attempt taking her on as a student.

Steve <hr /></blockquote>

I tried teaching my wife when we were 18 or so. I wish I knew what I know now. My advice for any couple is --- get a good instructor. Give advice only when asked - and tread softly - not all people wanting to play have the same intensity for the game as you may have - so its not as high on the priorities of life.
Jack
www.johnmaddencues.com (http://www.johnmaddencues.com)

Scott Lee
11-10-2005, 01:09 PM
Jack...It's not too late! LOL I'll be happy to come over for the weekend, and work with her...and I BELIEVE in barter! One thing...you have to stay out of the basement while we work (you can be out in the shop! LOL).
/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Scott