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Tom_In_Cincy
10-25-2005, 09:10 PM
Can you beleive this?

From a friend

Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 2:40 AM
Subject: Fw: Important Notice - Ban policy

Dear WPA Board Members,

For your information, after the WPA meeting, APBU has the following new policy in place effective October 12th, 2005.



Impose/put a ban on a player for a specific period of time:

1. The followings apply to all players in Asia.

2. Player who participates in the tournament/event that is not sanctioned by both APBU and WPA, the player will be banned by the APBU for one year.

3. In the above situation, the ban will be effective from the first day of that tournament and will be for 365 days.

4. During the ban period, the player can not play in the APBU or WPA sanctioned tournament/event.

5. During the ban period, any nomination for this banned player by the national association is not valid. If the banned player is nominated, this nation will be treated as forefeit this quota spot.

6. The banned player's name and country will be made public in the annoucements, including APBU internet info site and notices.

7. Ban by APBU will be also notified to WPA World Pool-billiard Association. WPA and its other continental
federations will support and follow through the same ban notice sent from APBU.

Best regards,
Spencer Shiau
APBU General Secretary
APBU - Asian Pocket Billiard Union

thecardman
10-26-2005, 05:24 AM
Hmmm, so the APBU want to ban anyone that doesn't do what they want them to (main example I can think of are the IPT events).

But let's be honest here. Do you really see them banning, for example, Efren Reyes? Or Bustamente? Or any other big-name Asian player that is on the IPT rosta? I don't think so. Remember the WPA tried this with the huge Japanese event that Efren won a few years ago? I think we'll see the same thing happening with this. Either that or the Asian players that are "banned" will give the APBU the collective finger and make a mint on the IPT tour.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

thecardman
/ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Fran Crimi
10-26-2005, 09:56 AM
This is the key to the whole thing:

[ QUOTE ]
<font color="blue"> For your information, after the WPA meeting, APBU has the following new policy in place effective October 12th, 2005.</font color>
<hr /></blockquote>

There was a meeting. I'm sure Asia wasn't the only one in attendance. We may be seeing more announcements. The IPT system doesn't fit the WPA model because only the strongest players will survive, regardless of their countries. The WPA format on the other hand, is set up according to Olympic format, where each country is entitled to representation, regardless of playing ability.

Yes, this is about sanctioning money, but along with that sanctioning money comes a guarantee that a certain format is being followed, namely, the WPA format.

I think the only thing this move by the WPA will succeed in doing is turning the players in anger against their governing bodies.

Fran

Brian in VA
10-26-2005, 01:55 PM
Quote Fran "I think the only thing this move by the WPA will succeed in doing is turning the players in anger against their governing bodies."

I couldn't agree more Fran. The players are independent contractors and the sactioning bodies are trying to make them into employees. Do they receive a stipend from them? If so, I could see their thinking they have a right to do so. But money talks.....

Brian in VA

Barbara
10-26-2005, 04:45 PM
Can you say "Cut your nose off... " What was the end of that saying??

What a crock! The players will rebel. There is no sanctioning body of pool players out there today that can guarantee what IPT is just offering for now.

Barbara

Mrs_DG
10-26-2005, 06:20 PM
So sad. It feel like the same politics that go on in the local musician unions. What if all you want to do is play because you love it?
mrs dg
Glad to see the sunshine after all the rain...

Fran Crimi
10-26-2005, 07:03 PM
[quote Barbara:] Can you say "Cut your nose off... <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> Right, but I don't think they realize it yet. They're trying to hang onto being the only World Governing Body. I think that at some point they're going to have to realize they're going to have to learn to co-exist in the same world with the IPT. There's room for both if they don't cut off their noses.

Here's one quote from the IPT that I'm sure is causing them some distress: </font color>


"We are considering doing a European Open Championship, and Australian Open Championship, and an Asia Open Championship in 2007."


<font color="blue"> Plus, this is big, big, big---The IPT has signed with William Morris. This is a first. No pool organization has been able to get near an agency like this.</font color>


October 6, 2005

William Morris Agency to Rep International Pool Tour
Leading Talent Agency Signs with IPT for TV, Marketing Ventures

Beverly Hills, CA. (Oct 4, 2005): The International Pool Tour (IPT) has announced that it has signed a talent and marketing agreement with the legendary William Morris Agency. The Agency will represent the IPT in various segments of its broadcasting, branding and marketing initiatives, both in the United States and internationally.

The IPT is the first pool league in history to be represented by a major talent agency.

Rich R.
10-27-2005, 03:33 AM
On the IPT web site, KT addresses the question of sanctioning by other organizations and answers in a big way.

http://www.internationalpooltour.com/ipt_content/q_and_a/default.asp#a7

QUESTION:
Why didnít you get sanctioned by any of the governing bodies of pool?

Answer:
There is no such thing as a governing body of pool. The last time I checked there was act of congress or law passed anywhere in the world that gave any organization or group of people the right to control the sport of pool. There is no law stated anywhere that any individual organization has the right to tell me what I can and canít do with my money or investments relating to pool. I am not a big believer in associations or organizations. I believe they are parasitical organizations that suck off the production of others. As I stated before, if there is a pool organization in the world that claims to be in operation for the betterment of the sport, the only way you can determine whether they have succeeded or not is to ask the simple question: Last year, what did the top pool player in the world earn, and what did the 30th top guy earn? If you canít have 30 players in the world that are earning over $300,000 or $400,000 a year, then you have failed miserably at creating an environment where pool players can earn a decent living. Therefore, there is no organization that qualifies to come up to me, put a gun to my head, and demand money out of my pocket. Itís insane when these groups come to me and say that they own the players. If you donít pay us, our players are not going to be allowed to play in your tournaments. When I heard this I laughed and said, ďWell, I guess your players will stay broke.Ē This is a free market system. The bottom line is simple, Iím putting together some tournaments, Iím giving away huge amounts of prize money, and any player who wants to qualify for the tournaments and play can, and if they donít want to play they donít have to play. It doesnít matter to me who wins the prize money, but I can tell you this, no mafia-style organization is going to come up to me and demand money out of my pocket because of my successful enterprise. In the next two years I am going to give away more than $20 Million dollars in prize money! I donít care which players I give the money to. If a player is stupid enough not to play in IPT events he will just stay broke. I donít know the names of the players I will be giving these millions of dollars to. The one thing I do know is if a player is not playing in IPT events that they will not receive a dime of the $20 Million dollars in prize money I will be giving away!

DickLeonard
10-27-2005, 05:49 AM
RichR. Tiger Wood's caddy made more money than all the poolplayers combined.####

Tom_In_Cincy
10-27-2005, 12:33 PM
#####,
Yeah, the top ten golf tour pro's caddys made more last year than all pool players total for the last 10 years... but there is one big difference.

The Caddys actually had to walk 5 miles almost every day of the week, carry clubs, keep notes and be able to give accurate advice to the Pros. This is a lot closer to REAL work than what Pro Pool players do.

/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Harold Acosta
10-27-2005, 06:15 PM
The CPB (South America) also joined the bandwagon...

Countries affected by the ban are:

APBU (Asian Pocket Billiards Union):

Bangladesh, Brunei, China, Chinese Taipei, Hong Kong, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Japan, Korea, Macau, Malaysia, Mongolia, Pakistan, Phillipines, Qatar, Singapore, Sri Lanka, Thailand, United Arab Emirates, Vietnam

CPB (Confederacion Panamericana de Billar):

Argentina, Aruba, Bolivia, Brasil, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, (Curacao - Netherland Antilles), Ecuador, Guadaloupe, Guatemala, Honduras, Mexico, Nicaragua, Panama, Peru, Puerto Rico, Uruguay, Venezuela.

What will happen next with this ban?

Stay tuned for the next episode of:

Que sera, sera...The WPA vs the IPT.


Harold Acosta - President
Puerto Rican Billiard Federation

Keith Talent
10-28-2005, 08:50 AM
Pool parasites ... you'd have thought they'd all died of hunger by now. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

eg8r
10-28-2005, 09:03 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Que sera, sera...The WPA vs the IPT.
<hr /></blockquote> With all due respect, there is no WPA vs IPT. The IPT can care less what the WPA does. If you really want to be honest here and look at the situation as it has turned out, what you have is WPA (incl CPB and APBU) vs. the Players. You see, what is happening is that the WPA is hindering their players from bettering themselves by attending a few more tournaments each year. You are causing the players undue stress by having to decide one or the other. If the players have the option to better themselves and make some more money you should not stand in their way and hinder them.

eg8r

rukiddingme
10-28-2005, 11:25 AM
can't we all just learn to get along?.......
ruk

Harold Acosta
10-28-2005, 03:33 PM
eg8r:

The ban was imposed by the CPB President - Mr. Victor Robayo. Mr. Robayo jumped on the bandwagon as soon as he learned what the APBU had done.

As far as I know, CPB countries were not consulted on this matter; it was abitrarily imposed by Mr. Robayo.

I am in no way responsible for this decision and I vehemently oppose it. My opinion was voiced to all CPB Countries and to the CPB President.

I'm the "Lone Ranger" on this one....

eg8r
10-28-2005, 07:36 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I am in no way responsible for this decision and I vehemently oppose it. My opinion was voiced to all CPB Countries and to the CPB President.

I'm the "Lone Ranger" on this one.... <hr /></blockquote> Sorry for my assumption. Keep up the good fight. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif By forcing the players to stay away from the IPT is really a lose-lose battle for the players. This ban is selfishness driven by fear. I cannot for one second believe this could be positive for pool.

eg8r

Fran Crimi
10-29-2005, 07:01 AM
How would you keep up the good fight if you were in Harold's position? There are 19 countries affected by the CPB ban, and what do you do when you're the only one objecting? Should he allow the Association of Puerto Rico be allowed to be dropped off the roster of international events, where NONE of his players would then be able to compete in WPA sanctioned events? Should he accept the ban under protest and allow the few who compete in IPT events be banned from other international events? What do you do? Do you sacrifice the whole for the few?

What Harold needs is a team of international lawyers to sort this out. Can someone lend him the money? I'm sure it will run into the tens of thousands.

It's easy to say keep fighting when you're not the one facing this. If Harold wants to keep his association together for the benefit of his players, he may just have to accept the ban under protest, explain the unfortunate situation to his players, and hope that public opinion will help turn this around, and maybe other affected countries will step up to the plate. Unfortunately, the Puerto Rican players who would be affected by the ban will probably turn against Harold and his association. Thanks to the WPA and the CPB, he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

Fran

HALHOULE
10-29-2005, 08:16 AM
CAN'T WE ALL JUST LEARN TO GET ALONG. NO,NO,NO,NO.LET'S HAVE A DOWN IN THE DIRT BRAWL. OR,BETTER YET, LET'S OPT FOR THE JELLO BRAWL.