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HarryDC
11-11-2005, 09:25 PM
Received this tonight from Deno:

IPT™ Announcement - Dress Code Announced November 11 , 2005

IPT matches will be filmed to the highest quality production values ever in the history of the sport. The players who are featured in IPT television broadcasts will soon become household names and reach celebrity status, unlike what the pool world has ever seen. The IPT dress code is designed to set a standard of professionalism, respect, and class, that up until now has been reserved for the highly paid athletes of such sports as golf, baseball, soccer, football, etc. Since IPT players will be earning more money than any other pool players in the world, they should look and dress as such.
These dress code guidelines are designed to make IPT players stand out as the well paid professionals and celebrities that they are. We encourage individuality as well as comfort. The general rule of the IPT is "You can't over dress!" When an IPT player walks into the room, everyone will KNOW "That's an IPT player!" The following are the official IPT Dress Code
Standards:

International Pool Tour Dress Code:
IPT Member Players are expected to be dressed professionally at all times while at an IPT tournament, meeting, exhibition, media event, interview, public appearance, or any time while representing the International Pool Tour. The following guidelines outline the IPT dress code. This dress code may change at any time with or without notice. It is a player's responsibility to be familiar with this dress code. Any questions about certain garments that might not meet this code must be cleared by the Tour Director in advance.

Male players -
The minimum expected dress code for male players is dress slacks, dress shoes (clean and polished), long sleeve button-up dress shirt (with collar), and sport coat. While playing, players may remove their sport coat and roll up their sleeves (if desired). The suggested dress code for male players is a formal suit and tie, with or without a vest, a button-up dress shirt (with collar), and dress shoes, or a sport coat and tie. Turtle necks may also be worn with a sport coat. While playing, players may remove their coat and tie if desired, and roll up their sleeves. No short sleeve shirts are allowed. All shirts must be tucked in with the exception of certain turtle necks.

Female players -
Expected & suggested dress code for female players is dress slacks, dress blouse or turtle neck, sweater, etc., and dress shoes. Female players may opt to wear a skirt, or a dress. Casual sun dresses or any other casual
attire is not allowed. Sandals or flip-flops are not allowed. Other open style dress shoes may be allowed if they are dressy and not casual. Players who are not sure if a specific shoe will meet code must have it cleared in advance by the Tour Director.

All players -
The following clothing is not allowed: Jeans (any denim of any kind), khakis, sneakers, trainers, or any type of gym-type shoe, flip-flops, sandals, baseball caps, berets, sock hats, visors, or any casual hat or cap.

Sponsorship Logos -
Players are allowed to display their sponsorship logo(s) as long as they are embroidered onto their shirts or blouses. Players may display up to three logos on their shirts. Logos must be tastefully displayed and appropriately sized so as not to detract from the dressy nature of IPT events. Logos that are overly bold or obnoxious are not allowed. If there is any question whatsoever that a sponsorship logo might not be compliant with the dress code, it is the responsibility of the player to have the logo size and appearance cleared by the Tour Director.

General Appearance -
All players are expected to be neatly dressed. All players must wear a belt if their slacks have belt loops. Shoes must be shined and in good condition. Players are expected to be well groomed with regard to hair cuts, facial hair, and cleanliness.

Cue Cases -
Players are allowed an encouraged to display their sponsorship logo stickers on their cue cases. The IPT crew will do their best to display cue cases on television programs for players who are on television tables.

Deno J. Andrews
Tour Director,
International Pool Tour
www.internationalpooltour.com (http://www.internationalpooltour.com)

Cheers
HarryDC /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Sid_Vicious
11-11-2005, 11:20 PM
Sounds like church to me...sid

pooltchr
11-12-2005, 05:29 AM
It's certainly not unreasonable. If I take a job at the local bank, and they tell me I need to wear a suit and tie to work, I can either do it, or find another job.
That being said, I think there are a lot of players who are going to need to make a quick trip to the Men's Warehouse!!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Steve

PQQLK9
11-12-2005, 09:43 AM
I love it! /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Cane
11-12-2005, 10:42 AM
The only thing I'd have a hard time with is the dress shoes. Damn, you know what a pair of nice dress shoes that are comfortable in size 16 cost???

Hey, Nick... Glad you showed back up. It was great to meet you in Charlotte. Hopefully, next time we meet I won't be working and we can get a little table time in.

Later,
Bob

SPetty
11-12-2005, 07:17 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Cane:</font><hr> The only thing I'd have a hard time with is the dress shoes. <hr /></blockquote>Yep, I agree. Not that I would ever have a chance to play in the IPT, but since the achilles tendon surgery, I've got a doctor's note that puts me in athletic shoes until further notice. I think the pool players should be allowed to play in the most comfortable shoes they prefer - athletic shoes provide more comfort and support than any other shoe, as far as I know.

supergreenman
11-12-2005, 07:56 PM
Since pool players are athletes, and a good pool posture starts at your feet, athletic shoes should be allowed. That being said. There are manufactures of some very dressy athletec shoes in the golf world. I'm sure Nike or Etonic (sp) have something that would be suitable. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif you might have to take the spikes out. but most courses don't allow hard spikes anymore anyways.

Tom_In_Cincy
11-12-2005, 09:32 PM
I like the 'dress code'. It's better than a uniform.

Logos stiched into the shirts is very acceptable. Stick on patches are so 'cheap' looking.

I've been wearing dress shoes for most of my adult life. IMO the best thing in the last 15 years is the 'walking shoes'. Light weight and cushioned. Perfect for the walk around the pool table. Leather uppers that are stylish and can be worn with slacks as dress shoes.

I think it was ### that told the story of Mike Sigel getting away with wearing black tennis shoes at a 'dress up' tournament while every one else was wearing stiff leather soled shoes. Seems the TD wasn't checking too close for shoes.
And, the great part, they are cheaper that tennis shoes.

rackem
11-12-2005, 10:43 PM
I really don't feel that rolled up long sleeves is the way to go. It seems as though there would be a possibility of object ball and stroke interference with dangling sleeve cuffs. My vote is for short sleeves allowed. /ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Qtec
11-12-2005, 11:53 PM
[ QUOTE ]
It's certainly not unreasonable. If I take a job at the local bank, and they tell me I need to wear a suit and tie to work, I can either do it, or find another job. <hr /></blockquote>

Correct PTCHR, but thats a for JOB but this is supposed to be a pool tournament. The players are not employmed by the IPT.
Of course, you have to wear different types of clothing for different types of WORK,[ you dont see many painters wearing suits] but that applies to sports also. The clothes fit the sport, not the other way around.
There is nothing wrong with a dress code but this is just stupid. For the new audience the IPT hopes to reach, there will be nothing to distinguish the players from the spectators.
The new viewer will probably think,
"what kind of 'sport' is this. They dont even have a uniform, they just play in their normal everyday clothes!."

Black shoes, black trousers and a polo, thats the accepted dress code over here and it looks smart.

JMO

Q
Just in from the IPT press room.
Dress code- Additional rules.

All players who are deemed to be more than 20lbs overwieght will be required to attend the IPT-Fight the Flab-boot camp. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
All ugly players will be required to have cosmetic surgery before they will be allowed on camera- E.Reyes excluded. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Nasal hair and Ear hair will not be tolerated![ this goes for the Ladies also] The official IPT plucker will be available for players at all times. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
After every hill-hill match, a change of underwear is compulsory! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Small players, if reaching the final, shall be required to grow to a height of 5'8''due to camera and lighting problems. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

watch this space.

HALHOULE
11-13-2005, 03:09 AM
WHEN DID POOL PLAYERS EVER QUALIFY AS ATHLETES? THEY ARE POOL PLAYERS, NOTHING ELSE.

HALHOULE
11-13-2005, 03:16 AM
POOL IS NOT A SPORT AND NEVER WILL BE. IT IS A GAME. A GAME OF POOL.

Snapshot9
11-13-2005, 02:05 PM
I disagree with you Hal. Any sport, baseball, football, hockey, soccer, tennis, can be called just a game. What matters is how it is approached and conducted on an ongoing
basis, especially when you have defined a professional level.

I would question whether shoes that look like dress shoes
on top, but have rubber cushioned soles would be permitted
for the sake of the player's feet. Playing in dress shoes
for a long tournament can be torture.

Bet that 80% of the men's players wear turtlenecks, and
some mens' pro players might not even own a sportcoat, let
alone a suit.

brian_
11-13-2005, 03:06 PM
After reading the dress code I'm now wondering how many players will even bother with the IPT. I was starting to think this was going to work until this dress code come out. Sure pool in the 40's was played in suits, but the 40's are over. I think the IPT is shooting itself in the foot with this dress code, but hey it's their money.

I'm not trying to be a smarta** but can anyone name any sport or game played in the U.S. that requires it's players to dress like that? Cause I can't think of any specially not that get tv time.

Maybe they should just switch the game to snooker instead of 8ball, since they are wanting to dress players like snooker players. Oh wait that wouldn't work because most people don't even know what snooker is. I thought 8ball was chosen because it's a game everyone knows so how is the avg person going to relate to some guy in a suit? Am I the only one that thinks most of the people that play 8ball, which we all seem to agree is played mostly in bars, don't wear a suit but maybe a few times a year and certainly not for work?

I do hope the IPT sees this is the wrong way to go before it's too late, because believe it or not I am hoping it takes off, just don't see it happening with a goofy dress code like that.

Barbara
11-13-2005, 03:21 PM
When I first played in Vegas and wore long sleeves I wore sleeve bands above my elbows to keep the sleeves out of my way. They worked.

I also think this would be an ideal situation to contact a sports footwear company and see what they can come up with to wear that's dressy and comfortable at the same time. They do this for golfers, right?

Barbara

Fran Crimi
11-13-2005, 04:47 PM
I think the IPT dress code is a GREAT idea. Wait till you see how nice everyone looks. There is no comparing the elegance of long sleeve vs. short sleeve shirts, even with rolled-up long sleeve shirts. Trudeau is right-on with this.

Fran

Brian in VA
11-13-2005, 06:21 PM
From one Brian to another, I think this is the right way to go. The PGA tour has a dress code that all the players adhere to; who on earth wears long pants in the heat of summer to play golf? The PGA tour, that's who because that's the rule.

I agree with Fran. I think it adds a touch of class to the event, sorely needed IMHO, and it is just one more step in getting our sport / game into the main stream.

Brian in VA

Qtec
11-13-2005, 07:38 PM
Long sleeves?

http://www.hainsworth.com/blog/puffy_shirt.jpg

/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Q

catscradle
11-14-2005, 06:38 AM
What a crock of $hit.

catscradle
11-14-2005, 06:39 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote HALHOULE:</font><hr> POOL IS NOT A SPORT AND NEVER WILL BE. IT IS A GAME. A GAME OF POOL. <hr /></blockquote>

Didn't you know Hal, they're even calling poker a sport now. lol /ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif What next, basket-weaving?

catscradle
11-14-2005, 06:44 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> &lt;/font&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;font class="small"&gt;Quote:&lt;/font&gt;&lt;hr /&gt;
It's certainly not unreasonable. If I take a job at the local bank, and they tell me I need to wear a suit and tie to work, I can either do it, or find another job. <hr /></blockquote>

Correct PTCHR, but thats a for JOB but this is supposed to be a pool tournament. The players are not employmed by the IPT.
Of course, you have to wear different types of clothing for different types of WORK,[ you dont see many painters wearing suits] but that applies to sports also. The clothes fit the sport, not the other way around.
There is nothing wrong with a dress code but this is just stupid. For the new audience the IPT hopes to reach, there will be nothing to distinguish the players from the spectators.
The new viewer will probably think,
"what kind of 'sport' is this. They dont even have a uniform, they just play in their normal everyday clothes!."

Black shoes, black trousers and a polo, thats the accepted dress code over here and it looks smart.

JMO

Q
Just in from the IPT press room.
Dress code- Additional rules.

All players who are deemed to be more than 20lbs overwieght will be required to attend the IPT-Fight the Flab-boot camp. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
All ugly players will be required to have cosmetic surgery before they will be allowed on camera- E.Reyes excluded. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Nasal hair and Ear hair will not be tolerated![ this goes for the Ladies also] The official IPT plucker will be available for players at all times. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
After every hill-hill match, a change of underwear is compulsory! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Small players, if reaching the final, shall be required to grow to a height of 5'8''due to camera and lighting problems. /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

watch this space.


<hr /></blockquote>

lol ... I think soccer (football for you non-US citizens) players should be required to play in a tuxedo. Sure it will slow them down a little and they may want to avoid slide tackles, but it would do wonders for the image of the game and no more cleated boots, wingtips only.

Fran Crimi
11-14-2005, 06:54 AM
LOL! I remember that episode---Jerry's puffy shirt.

That's not exactly what I had in mind but it'll do. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Fran

Deeman3
11-14-2005, 07:01 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote brian_:</font><hr> After reading the dress code I'm now wondering how many players will even bother with the IPT. <font color="blue"> Only the ones that want a shot at the $200,000. </font color> I was starting to think this was going to work until this dress code come out. <font color="blue">Yeah, this really kills the sport, doesn't it? </font color> Sure pool in the 40's was played in suits, but the 40's are over. I think the IPT is shooting itself in the foot with this dress code, but hey it's their money. <font color="blue">Yep, It is. </font color>

I'm not trying to be a smarta** but can anyone name any sport or game played in the U.S. that requires it's players to dress like that? <font color="blue"> Golf. now even basketball players on their busses and in public. </font color> Cause I can't think of any specially not that get tv time. <font color="blue"> Now you can.</font color>

Maybe they should just switch the game to snooker instead of 8ball, since they are wanting to dress players like snooker players. Oh wait that wouldn't work because most people don't even know what snooker is. <font color="blue">Where have you been. Most know very well what snooker is. The cue sport where they dress well and make a lot of money. </font color> I thought 8ball was chosen because it's a game everyone knows so how is the avg person going to relate to some guy in a suit? Am I the only one that thinks most of the people that play 8ball, which we all seem to agree is played mostly in bars, don't wear a suit but maybe a few times a year and certainly not for work? <font color="blue"> See, to a pool player, a tournament is work, that's his office. To a guy in a bar, it's recreation. </font color>

I do hope the IPT sees this is the wrong way to go before it's too late, because believe it or not I am hoping it takes off, just don't see it happening with a goofy dress code like that. <font color="blue">I think they are making good sense. I believe a goofy dress code is players showing up looking like refugees in t-shirts, tennis shoes and ball caps.

Hey, most tournament, with a few exceptions. are losing money revenue and good sponsirship. Why don't we let someonoe try something else for change. Maybe there is another way to market this stuff that doesn't require it's participants to be undistingusable from the patrons.

Deeman </font color> <hr /></blockquote>

catscradle
11-14-2005, 07:35 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote brian_:</font><hr> After reading the dress code I'm now wondering how many players will even bother with the IPT. <font color="blue"> Only the ones that want a shot at the $200,000. </font color> I was starting to think this was going to work until this dress code come out. <font color="blue">Yeah, this really kills the sport, doesn't it? </font color> Sure pool in the 40's was played in suits, but the 40's are over. I think the IPT is shooting itself in the foot with this dress code, but hey it's their money. <font color="blue">Yep, It is. </font color>

I'm not trying to be a smarta** but can anyone name any sport or game played in the U.S. that requires it's players to dress like that? <font color="blue"> Golf. now even basketball players on their busses and in public. </font color> Cause I can't think of any specially not that get tv time. <font color="blue"> Now you can.</font color>

Maybe they should just switch the game to snooker instead of 8ball, since they are wanting to dress players like snooker players. Oh wait that wouldn't work because most people don't even know what snooker is. <font color="blue">Where have you been. Most know very well what snooker is. The cue sport where they dress well and make a lot of money. </font color> I thought 8ball was chosen because it's a game everyone knows so how is the avg person going to relate to some guy in a suit? Am I the only one that thinks most of the people that play 8ball, which we all seem to agree is played mostly in bars, don't wear a suit but maybe a few times a year and certainly not for work? <font color="blue"> See, to a pool player, a tournament is work, that's his office. To a guy in a bar, it's recreation. </font color>

I do hope the IPT sees this is the wrong way to go before it's too late, because believe it or not I am hoping it takes off, just don't see it happening with a goofy dress code like that. <font color="blue">I think they are making good sense. I believe a goofy dress code is players showing up looking like refugees in t-shirts, tennis shoes and ball caps.

Hey, most tournament, with a few exceptions. are losing money revenue and good sponsirship. Why don't we let someonoe try something else for change. Maybe there is another way to market this stuff that doesn't require it's participants to be undistingusable from the patrons.

Deeman </font color> <hr /></blockquote> <hr /></blockquote>

Deeman,
The few televised events that show pool now the players are dressed in what I would call "business casual". That manner of dress is sufficient for most business now, including banks and financial companies, the consevative elite. So why is that not sufficient for the IPT? It is clean, neat and not at all detracting from pool. Suits and ties? People only wear suits and ties to interviews, funerals, and weddings now, and at that rather reluctantly. People competing in the IPT (on television or otherwise) should be allowed to compete in something presentable, but COMFORTABLE. You referenced golfers, correct me if I'm wrong, but they used to compete in a sport jacket and tie, now they compete in something presentable but COMFORTABLE. It is a new world, to a large extend we've left phony elitism behind and that is a good thing. The IPT should think about that, because requiring a suit, tie, and "dress shoes" would undoubtably be phony.

catscradle
11-14-2005, 08:16 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Barbara:</font><hr> When I first played in Vegas and wore long sleeves I wore sleeve bands above my elbows to keep the sleeves out of my way. They worked.

I also think this would be an ideal situation to contact a sports footwear company and see what they can come up with to wear that's dressy and comfortable at the same time. They do this for golfers, right?

Barbara <hr /></blockquote>

Oh goody, sleeve garters just like the roaring 20's. Gee whiz, they can wear translucent green visors too. This will appeal to nobody except a few sentimentalist who remember the "good olde days" with rose colored glasses. I'm almost 60 years old, and as I remember the good olde days weren't really all that much better. I don't think the presence of a dress code will hurt the fan count, but anybody who thinks this will really make a difference is foolish. My kids went to a Jusuit school, their dress code would work well, no jeans (though I do prefer jeans) and shirts with a "rollable" color, i.e. those 3-button LaCoste type shirts work fine. Why should the players have to be uncomfortable when the rest of society (except for Kevin and his minions) would consider "business casual" just fine?
If he is going to have a dress code, he should have one that works, not this nonsense.

Deeman3
11-14-2005, 08:31 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote brian_:</font><hr> After reading the dress code I'm now wondering how many players will even bother with the IPT. <font color="blue"> Only the ones that want a shot at the $200,000. </font color> I was starting to think this was going to work until this dress code come out. <font color="blue">Yeah, this really kills the sport, doesn't it? </font color> Sure pool in the 40's was played in suits, but the 40's are over. I think the IPT is shooting itself in the foot with this dress code, but hey it's their money. <font color="blue">Yep, It is. </font color>

I'm not trying to be a smarta** but can anyone name any sport or game played in the U.S. that requires it's players to dress like that? <font color="blue"> Golf. now even basketball players on their busses and in public. </font color> Cause I can't think of any specially not that get tv time. <font color="blue"> Now you can.</font color>

Maybe they should just switch the game to snooker instead of 8ball, since they are wanting to dress players like snooker players. Oh wait that wouldn't work because most people don't even know what snooker is. <font color="blue">Where have you been. Most know very well what snooker is. The cue sport where they dress well and make a lot of money. </font color> I thought 8ball was chosen because it's a game everyone knows so how is the avg person going to relate to some guy in a suit? Am I the only one that thinks most of the people that play 8ball, which we all seem to agree is played mostly in bars, don't wear a suit but maybe a few times a year and certainly not for work? <font color="blue"> See, to a pool player, a tournament is work, that's his office. To a guy in a bar, it's recreation. </font color>

I do hope the IPT sees this is the wrong way to go before it's too late, because believe it or not I am hoping it takes off, just don't see it happening with a goofy dress code like that. <font color="blue">I think they are making good sense. I believe a goofy dress code is players showing up looking like refugees in t-shirts, tennis shoes and ball caps.

Hey, most tournament, with a few exceptions. are losing money revenue and good sponsirship. Why don't we let someonoe try something else for change. Maybe there is another way to market this stuff that doesn't require it's participants to be undistingusable from the patrons.

Deeman </font color> <hr /></blockquote> <hr /></blockquote>

Deeman,
The few televised events that show pool now the players are dressed in what I would call "business casual". That manner of dress is sufficient for most business now, including banks and financial companies, the consevative elite. So why is that not sufficient for the IPT? It is clean, neat and not at all detracting from pool. Suits and ties? People only wear suits and ties to interviews, funerals, and weddings now, and at that rather reluctantly. People competing in the IPT (on television or otherwise) should be allowed to compete in something presentable, but COMFORTABLE. You referenced golfers, correct me if I'm wrong, but they used to compete in a sport jacket and tie, now they compete in something presentable but COMFORTABLE. It is a new world, to a large extend we've left phony elitism behind and that is a good thing. The IPT should think about that, because requiring a suit, tie, and "dress shoes" would undoubtably be phony.

<hr /></blockquote> <font color="blue">

Catscradle:

Maybe a suit is a little over the top but if you attend a few tournaments a year, some of these guys look like bums when they are playing. That's o.k. but I just think if someone is putting up a ton of money and has a strategy for winning fans and getting more glamore and prestige back into the game, we sould let them try by their method, not our modified version of their effort.

Maybe the dress code has no importance but let's give this group a chance with their straegy, not ours.

Are you thinking that seeing well dressed players is going to drive away fans? Is dressing for an event that pays so well asking more than a player can do? Would you really be happier with a uniform?

I just say, let them try their way. If it works, great. if not you can say I told you so, get those clowns back into def leppard shirts.


Deeman </font color>

Vagabond
11-14-2005, 08:33 AM
Even cloths made by `Fendi, Halston, Channel, Karl Lagerfeld` can look crappy if they are NOT WASHED &amp; WELL PRESSED.
Cloths from Sears &amp; walMart can be made to look good if they are washed and pressed well ( and with starch when appropriate)
Key is wash and Press. /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

catscradle
11-14-2005, 09:31 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> Catscradle:

Maybe a suit is a little over the top but if you attend a few tournaments a year, some of these guys look like bums when they are playing. That's o.k. but I just think if someone is putting up a ton of money and has a strategy for winning fans and getting more glamore and prestige back into the game, we sould let them try by their method, not our modified version of their effort.

Maybe the dress code has no importance but let's give this group a chance with their straegy, not ours.

Are you thinking that seeing well dressed players is going to drive away fans? Is dressing for an event that pays so well asking more than a player can do? Would you really be happier with a uniform?

I just say, let them try their way. If it works, great. if not you can say I told you so, get those clowns back into def leppard shirts.


Deeman </font color> <hr /></blockquote>

I like the idea of a dress code that requires a certain amount of decorum, but not to the point it can interfer with performance. I don't think requiring a dress code will hurt fan support, just I don't think it will make much difference beyond the point where players are not dressed "scary".
I agree that IPT can make the rules they like, it's their money, but I think this dress code thing is a side street people always go down think it is what keeps pool from being a world class sport, it isn't the problem. The problem has more to do with the fact that it's kind of boring to watch unless you're a player who can appreciate what's going on. Golf is boring to watch also, but it has tons of players who'll watch anyway and appreciate the skill of the golfers.

DickLeonard
11-14-2005, 09:45 AM
Catscraddle as long as the checks clear the Bank, they are calling the shots. If you don't like the rules don't play. That is pretty simple.####

supergreenman
11-14-2005, 09:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote HALHOULE:</font><hr> WHEN DID POOL PLAYERS EVER QUALIFY AS ATHLETES? THEY ARE POOL PLAYERS, NOTHING ELSE. <hr /></blockquote>

Pool players, Good competative pool players anyways, are athletes. Take Mika Immonem for instance, in an interview he attributed his success to a good diet, weight training and excersize along with hours and hours of practice. hmmm that sounds suspiciously athletic to me.

Anybody that's spent time in a long tournament should agree that people that have greater endurance and focas have a better chance at winning.

Athletes train thier bodies to perform specific functions to excel at thier sport. Isn't that what developing a good stance and stroke is? I think so.

This pool player IS an athlete.

HarryDC
11-14-2005, 09:48 AM
Hello Harry Here,

I like waistcoats, white shirts, and bowties! garters for the long sleevs. Tux with dinner jacket is fine. I don't intend to spend high entertainment dollars to watch pool players in Jungle Jim Cloths! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c294/Gremlin711/SARAH_E_CHRIS_S.jpg

If it's good enough for Sarah Chris and I it's good enough
for the pool players.

HarryDC

catscradle
11-14-2005, 01:13 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Catscraddle as long as the checks clear the Bank, they are calling the shots. If you don't like the rules don't play. That is pretty simple.#### <hr /></blockquote>

That's true, but I can still have an opinion. Nothing we say here will effect the IPT in the least, it is just an oppourtunity for us to express an opinion. IMO.

brian_
11-14-2005, 01:49 PM
I think a few people took me the wrong way. I have no problem with a dress code, just this one. As others have pointed out even golf has changed to a more comfatable dress code. With as many great picky player as there are in this world some will flat out refuse to dress like that. One name that keeps coming to mind is Strickland. Plus correct me if I'm wrong but the whole idea of this is to get more people playing pool and hopefully raise the level of play right? How many of todays youth do you think are going to really strive to play on a tour where they have to dress like that? None I know of. I think if they take it down to business casual as everyone else has said it would be alot better overall.

Then again I think it will be hilarious to see Efren in a suit. Myself I think the whole think will just look funny cause you know it's gonna look like a bunch of monkeys in suits. So I guess the dress code in a way won't be so bad, cause atleast if the pool coverage sucks it will still be hilarious to watch.

BTW to whoever it was that said most people knew what snooker was I meant the avg american not the avg pool player, big difference. Also NBA players may have to wear suits in interviews but last I checked not on the court.

I guess what it all comes down to is we'll all just have to wait and see who's right or wrong about the IPT.

catscradle
11-14-2005, 02:01 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote supergreenman:</font><hr>
Pool players, Good competative pool players anyways, are athletes... <hr /></blockquote>

Like Ralph Greenleaf, Boston Shorty, Buddy Hall, Steve Mizerak, Danny Bassovich, etc. It never hears in any endeavor to be more athletic and in better shape, but pool does not require an athelete. Having keen eyesight and a good stroke has very little to do with being able to run even a 5K.
JMHO.

Snapshot9
11-14-2005, 02:34 PM
Being a shotputter does not require a svelte body, and they
are considered an athlete. Being in good shape affects your
endurance, and concentration level. Any good money pool player will tell you that sometimes those good ole boys not in shape that their game will drop off after playing so many hours.

On the dress code, I do not see any reason that a nice looking shoe with cushioned soles could not be worn. I also
do not see why a half or mock turtleneck could not be worn, and it would be okay with a sportcoat, and then okay for playing in. If long sleeve, then the sleeves could be pushed up to 3/4 length. And I do not see any reason why
cotton khaki pants could not be worn, as long as they were not wadded up on the floor for 3 days before the tournament, and picked up and put on for the tournament. They need to
be clean and look nice, but should be able to play in clothes that are comfortable. Business casual attire if fine, wear a sportcoat with it to the event, then take off the sportcoat to play. I do not want to see T-shirts or
male butt-cracks though. Or as they used to say, 'Dress like you have some couth to you'.... lol

HarryDC
11-14-2005, 02:47 PM
Hello Harry Here,

Note, Corey in this photo has no trouble with a tux at Tokyo
9-Ball. I think he is playing Kambata of Japan. Sorry I can't remember it's so long ago. This is what I like to see, the players looked great compaired to the crowd. I won't watch if the players don't dress up. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c294/Gremlin711/DEUEL_COREY_TUX.jpg

Ralph S.
11-14-2005, 06:15 PM
Okay here goes my two cents worth. From all the posts I have read, I think more are in favor of the relaxed or business/casual type attire. Personally, I think that khakis and a nice polo type shirt would be just fine. I mean it's like sewing logos or sponsorship decals on a dress shirt? Someone wasn't thinking clearly. That would look hideous, where as they look decent on polo shirts.

Also, the clothing styles that are popular or in-style now are greatly influenced by the hip-hop culture. Personally I don't care for the hip-hop or the clothing trends they have set. This is just todays society.

I will watch the IPT events, but the dress code is a little excessive in its demands.

catscradle
11-15-2005, 05:28 AM
My last word ...

"Distrust any enterprise which requires new clothing." - Henry David Thoreau ... /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

jjinfla
11-15-2005, 06:43 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote brian_:</font><hr>

I'm not trying to be a smarta** but can anyone name any sport or game played in the U.S. that requires it's players to dress like that? Cause I can't think of any specially not that get tv time.

<hr /></blockquote>

Last time I checked EVERY team in professional sports has a dress code - they tell each and every player exactly what to wear on the field - they are called uniforms.

And now basketball is telling their players what to wear off the field of play. It is dress suits for them - no more bling.

Of course players do have a choice - they can opt out of playing and go hang with the bums.

Jake

DickLeonard
11-15-2005, 06:59 AM
Pooltchr You have lined up the First Sponsor for the New Tour. You better keep your ideas to your self until they hire you as a Media Consultant.####

DickLeonard
11-15-2005, 07:03 AM
Cane when I go to the New Balance Warehouse sale near Boston you can always buy the large sizes 15,16,17 for $5 dollars a pair. I have a size 15 I bought for my Halloween Costume.####

HALHOULE
11-15-2005, 07:11 AM
stance or stroke pockets nothing, ball to ball to pocket pockets everything

DickLeonard
11-15-2005, 07:12 AM
HAL I DON'T KNOW WHAT PLANET YOUR FROM, TRYING TO BELITTLE THE GAME THAT YOU PREACH TO KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT THE AIMING SYSTEM. I DON'T ANY SPORT THAT IS NOT A GAME. eg THE GAME OF GOLF,A GAME OF BOWLING A GAME OF TENNIS,A GAME OF BASEBALL, A GAME OF FOOTBALL,A BASKETBALL GAME.

WAIT A BOXING MATCH, A WRESTING MATCH, I STAND CORRECTED ####

catscradle
11-15-2005, 07:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> HAL I DON'T KNOW WHAT PLANET YOUR FROM, TRYING TO BELITTLE THE GAME THAT YOU PREACH TO KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT THE AIMING SYSTEM. I DON'T ANY SPORT THAT IS NOT A GAME. eg THE GAME OF GOLF,A GAME OF BOWLING A GAME OF TENNIS,A GAME OF BASEBALL, A GAME OF FOOTBALL,A BASKETBALL GAME.

WAIT A BOXING MATCH, A WRESTING MATCH, I STAND CORRECTED #### <hr /></blockquote>

Now I'm beyond confused. houle all small letters, LEONARD ALL CAPS. What is happening with the world, maybe everything is reversing itself. Is this Armeggedon or a plot by little green men?

supergreenman
11-15-2005, 08:58 AM
Hmmmm "Cue sports" pool is a sport and competitive players are athletes. Why else would it be carried on ESPN. You don't see it on the Home Shopping Network or the Cooking channel. It's no different from golf or any other sport.

I doubt you're ever going to change your mind about it though Hal so I'm not going to bother to try. I'll just take comfort in the fact that I'm right(IMO) :P

catscradle
11-15-2005, 09:21 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote supergreenman:</font><hr> Hmmmm "Cue sports" pool is a sport and competitive players are athletes. Why else would it be carried on ESPN. You don't see it on the Home Shopping Network or the Cooking channel. It's no different from golf or any other sport.

I doubt you're ever going to change your mind about it though Hal so I'm not going to bother to try. I'll just take comfort in the fact that I'm right(IMO) :P <hr /></blockquote>

I would call pool a sport, but I don't think pool players are neccessarily athletes, though some are.
The fact that ESPN carries pool doesn't make it a sport. ESPN also carries scrabble, spelling bees, and poker, none of which I would call a sport.

Rich R.
11-15-2005, 11:49 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr>I would call pool a sport, but I don't think pool players are neccessarily athletes, though some are.<hr /></blockquote>
Pool is definitely a sport. It requires good eye to hand coordination, concentration and a certain amount of stamina, to get through a long tournament.

In the Olympics, they have several archery events and many shooting events, ranging from air pistol to skeet and trap shooting. The people who compete in these events are called "athletes", therefore, I believe pool players should be called athletes too. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

catscradle
11-15-2005, 12:41 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rich R.:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr>I would call pool a sport, but I don't think pool players are neccessarily athletes, though some are.<hr /></blockquote>
Pool is definitely a sport. It requires good eye to hand coordination, concentration and a certain amount of stamina, to get through a long tournament.

In the Olympics, they have several archery events and many shooting events, ranging from air pistol to skeet and trap shooting. The people who compete in these events are called "athletes", therefore, I believe pool players should be called athletes too. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif <hr /></blockquote>

Well I did some poking around a dictionary and have concluded that the definitions of "sport" and "athlete" is so broad as to make us all right. Pool is and is not a sport and poolplayers are and aren't athletes depending upon which definition you choose to use. Now since we're all right, "Can't we all just get along". /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

supergreenman
11-15-2005, 12:53 PM
My last word on the subject in hopes of adding a little (more) humor to it. If they can make ribbon twirling an olympic event and call it a sport and ribbon twirlers athletes then they can call pool a sport and pool players athletes since pool is an olympic event too.

:P I'm sure ribbon twirlers throughout the world will be offended at being lumped in with pool players. If that's the case, then I'd like to quote GWB "Mission Accomplished"

wolfdancer
11-15-2005, 01:06 PM
Hal, I'm of the same opinion....it's a great game....but hardly an athletic competition.
The first two definitions of sport in dictionary.com:


1. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
2. A particular form of this activity.

An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
............#3 does list it as a pastime, recreation....but..

Scott Lee
11-15-2005, 02:42 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr>
I like the idea of a dress code that requires a certain amount of decorum, but not to the point it can interfer with performance.
<hr /></blockquote>

Steve...I have to disagree with you here. I wear a sportcoat and tie/dress slacks and dress shoes everytime I perform at a school! In 10 years and over a thousand exhibitions, it has not affected my ability to play well, even one iota...and certainly should not affect any professional tournament player either. It may not be particularly comfortable for some of them, but those are THE RULES. Play by them, or don't play...it's as simple as that! I, for one, am totally in favor of the dress code, and agree wholeheartedly with Fran. In the case of this first IPT event, where LAST PLACE prize money is $6200 (more than 1st Place $$$ in many pro events), I think most players will jump at the chance to "dress up and play pool" for the cash! jmo

Scott Lee

thecardman
11-16-2005, 02:31 AM
Someone mentioned earlier in this thread about snooker players and how they wear tuxedos, etc. You cannot imagine the hoo-ha that went on when the dresscode was relaxed to allow them to play without a bow tie on!

Actually, it was kinda like the hoo-ha that's going on here about the IPT telling people to dress smartly, giving the sport/game/whatever of pool a MORE PROFESSIONAL LOOK. Or maybe those of you who don't like this dresscode are happy being looked down upon by the rest of the sporting community.

My personal preference is that this is a great idea (like you couldn't get that impression from what I've just said!). Not too formal and not too relaxed.

Just remember, if you don't like the dresscode, you don't have to play in any of their events - whether you are on the tour or are having to qualify. But in doing that, you can kiss those lovely litte Dollar signs goodbye as they fly away!

Just my 2 pence (or cents!).

thecardman
/ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

catscradle
11-16-2005, 06:38 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Scott Lee:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr>
I like the idea of a dress code that requires a certain amount of decorum, but not to the point it can interfer with performance.
<hr /></blockquote>

Steve...I have to disagree with you here. I wear a sportcoat and tie/dress slacks and dress shoes everytime I perform at a school! In 10 years and over a thousand exhibitions, it has not affected my ability to play well, even one iota...and certainly should not affect any professional tournament player either. It may not be particularly comfortable for some of them, but those are THE RULES. Play by them, or don't play...it's as simple as that! I, for one, am totally in favor of the dress code, and agree wholeheartedly with Fran. In the case of this first IPT event, where LAST PLACE prize money is $6200 (more than 1st Place $$$ in many pro events), I think most players will jump at the chance to "dress up and play pool" for the cash! jmo

Scott Lee <hr /></blockquote>

Yeah, but try playing in a pair of ballet shoes, do you think you're play might be effected? The grab you described is what you're used to and you probably, like me, grew up wearing dress shoes to school, church etc. Some of these young players probably have only worn hard soled shoes to the occassional wedding or funeral, don't you think the unfamiliarity will effect their play? Personally, I hate to even walk in dress shoes, unless you wear the same pair everyday for a significant amount of breakin time, they are very uncomfortable.
Bottom line though, their money they can do what they want, but I think it is unreasonable and will not add significantly to the image of pool. Snooker and 3-c don't do well in the USA despite the dress codes, I really don't think dress codes make a difference. If pool was popular, you'd soon see people dressing as poolplayers dress regardless of how they dressed.
I only wish I were good enough that I could protest the dress code. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
JMHO too.

HarryDC
11-16-2005, 06:50 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote thecardman:</font><hr> Someone mentioned earlier in this thread about snooker players and how they wear tuxedos, etc. You cannot imagine the hoo-ha that went on when the dresscode was relaxed to allow them to play without a bow tie on!

Actually, it was kinda like the hoo-ha that's going on here about the IPT telling people to dress smartly, giving the sport/game/whatever of pool a MORE PROFESSIONAL LOOK. Or maybe those of you who don't like this dresscode are happy being looked down upon by the rest of the sporting community.

My personal preference is that this is a great idea (like you couldn't get that impression from what I've just said!). Not too formal and not too relaxed.

Just remember, if you don't like the dresscode, you don't have to play in any of their events - whether you are on the tour or are having to qualify. But in doing that, you can kiss those lovely litte Dollar signs goodbye as they fly away!

Just my 2 pence (or cents!).

thecardman
/ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif <hr /></blockquote>


Cardman,

I am always open to compromise given the choices below I think I would watch Jamie Jones rather than Patroni. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c294/Gremlin711/J_Jones_001.jpg
Jamie

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c294/Gremlin711/PATRONI_0001.jpg
Fabio

Cheers!

supergreenman
11-16-2005, 08:23 AM
Yeah, but try playing in a pair of ballet shoes, do you think you're play might be effected? The grab you described is what you're used to and you probably, like me, grew up wearing dress shoes to school, church etc. Some of these young players probably have only worn hard soled shoes to the occassional wedding or funeral, don't you think the unfamiliarity will effect their play? Personally, I hate to even walk in dress shoes, unless you wear the same pair everyday for a significant amount of breakin time, they are very uncomfortable.
Bottom line though, their money they can do what they want, but I think it is unreasonable and will not add significantly to the image of pool. Snooker and 3-c don't do well in the USA despite the dress codes, I really don't think dress codes make a difference. If pool was popular, you'd soon see people dressing as poolplayers dress regardless of how they dressed.
I only wish I were good enough that I could protest the dress code. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
JMHO too.

<hr /></blockquote>

I often don't have time to go home from work before I play on league nights and frequently play in dress shoes. personally, I find the support and the extra lift the heels give me make it a bit easier to play. Dress shoes are meant to look good, not be uncomfortable a lot of people spend the whole day on thier feet wearing dress shoes. I don't think it would be a negative factor unless someone chose tournament day to be the day to break thier new dress shoes in.

James

rackem
11-17-2005, 12:26 AM
I feel as though the IPT might be dropping the ball here by not allowing individulised clothing and shoes. they could be missing out on some additional sponsership money from big name clothing companys like Nike and others. with a little latitude they might even come up with a special pool shoe. /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Leviathan
11-17-2005, 05:12 AM
I wear eyeglasses when I play and have trouble with glare on the lenses. One can see through the glare, but the eyestrain takes a toll after a few hours of play. Anti-glare lens coatings reduce the glare but don't eliminate it completely.

A hat, cap, or visor may be the best solution from the player's point of view. The shadow a hatbrim casts on one's face plays hell with television camerawork, but the IPT dress code doesn't say one can't wear a formal hat. A Borsalino like Piggy's might be a good option. Damn, that man wears a hat right!

AS

supergreenman
11-17-2005, 07:59 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Leviathan:</font><hr> I
A hat, cap, or visor may be the best solution from the player's point of view. The shadow a hatbrim casts on one's face plays hell with television camerawork, but the IPT dress code doesn't say one can't wear a formal hat. A Borsalino like Piggy's might be a good option. Damn, that man wears a hat right!

AS <hr /></blockquote>

~sarcastic font~ Oh come on now, what's more classy than a well worn baseball cap and a tux ~/end sarcastic font~

I was amazed at how much my play improved when I started wearing a hat to cut out the glare. It didn't take long to get used to having the cap brim in my field of vision. Very similar to when I switched from an open bridge to a closed bringe it took a little time to get used to but afterwards my play improved noticably.

Cowboy hats and a tux? Bowler hats and a tux? a smoke and a pancake? waffles and a cigar? ....

James

Scott Lee
11-17-2005, 01:36 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote catscradle:</font><hr> The grab you described is what you're used to and you probably, like me, grew up wearing dress shoes to school, church etc. <hr /></blockquote>

Steve...Nope, I did not grow up HAVING to wear those kind of clothes, and I STILL don't...except when I am WORKING!
I dress professionally, because I am a professional, and expect to be paid like a professional. Away from work, I'm found 98% of the time in jeans, t-shirt, and soft shoes (the other two percent I'm otherwise involved where clothes are optional! LOL). It won't affect anyone's play, because they are playing for big bucks. I've always said, a REAL player should be able to play great in a tux or buck naked...or anywhere in between!

Scott Lee

ceebee
11-18-2005, 09:21 AM
I kinda enjoyed the "Hollywood 8-Ball Production". The glitz &amp; bright lites may not need to be that glitzy, but the atmosphere was a show. I didn't enjoy all of Mike Sigel's rhetoric. Has "Captain Hook", become "Mike, the Mouth"?

I could hope the commentators will be better, in the future. I never enjoyed some of the pro golf commentators, who estimated 8 foot putts, when the putt was obviously shorter than the player's height.

I wish Loree John could have played better. As the show progresses (hopefully), a high level of play by both players, will be the norm.

I agree with you Scott, dressing up to the casual dress level won't be difficult at all &amp; won't affect play. I do think a dress code will add to the "high society production level" of TV &amp; hopefully display a higher standard for our chosen Sport..

NOTE: I wear ECCO shoes, they are very nice looking &amp; they are SUPER Comfortable. I can wear them all day long &amp; all night long too. A change of socks is refreshing after about 10 hours.

catscradle
11-18-2005, 11:04 AM
BTW, I think the IPT dress code failed it's first test in the Sigel/Jones match. Sigel looked like hell with his shirt tail flying in the breeze behind him. He would have looked a lot better in a polo type shirt (or other shirt designed to be untucked) purposely untucked.
I think professionalism has nothing to do with dress code. I've worked in software companies with no dress code (and it showed) most of my career. Now I work in the IT department of a stuffy business with a dress code. The software companies were no less professional than where I work now. Where the rubber hit the road, they got the job done and that's all that counts.