PDA

View Full Version : Tip Life...



mworkman
01-17-2006, 01:03 PM
I play about 10-15 hours per week and my tips ussually last about 6 months at the most. I'm currently using Everest tips which I like alot. It seems that they should last longer. I try to be conservative when I shape it, and use a tip tapper instead of a shaper about half the time. Is this just the price you pay for having a well rounded tip? Is there anyway to keep it rounded and maintain a long life?
Some of my friends tips seem to last a long time, but they dont shape em either, and they look kinda flat.

Billy_Bob
01-17-2006, 02:02 PM
I replace my own tips so have low tip replacement costs. And have a spare shaft, so I can install a new tip on one and let the glue dry while using the other shaft.

I feel it is important to always play with the same shaped tip. I don't care if I have to replace my tips every 2 months, I will keep them the same shape. Actually my tips last about 6 months as well.

The tip is the "business end" of the cue. This is where I will put my $$ on spending. I want good surface condition and same shape always.

I frequently beat other players who put their $$ into what the butt looks like or what "name" is written on the butt, but could care less about their tip. I love it when someone says they have a new tip. Chances are it is a different brand, hardness and shape. They will be cursing their tip and I will be winning!

So good for you!

Note: I don't do any tip tapping. I found this to make the tip inconsistent. It would be better just after tip tapping, then decline. So it was changing the characteristics of the tip. I find it is better to use a sandpaper shaper and lightly sand about once a week to give the tip a fresh surface. Or I will do this just before a tournament. This seems to keep the tip fairly consistent at all times.

Manda
01-17-2006, 03:15 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Billy_Bob:</font><hr>
The tip is the "business end" of the cue. This is where I will put my $$ on spending. I want good surface condition and same shape always.<hr /></blockquote>

What kind of tip do you use? Do you know if the type of joint you have will affect what type of tip you should put on a cue? I have been playing with a LePro for years and for some reason it seems my english is just not improving much. I can get english well, just not as much as I would like sometimes. Maybe it's more along the lines of consistancy. It's like I hit some kind of a road block and can't get much better. Any advice?

SpiderMan
01-17-2006, 03:40 PM
6 months seems reasonable, for your play habits and only occasional shaping.

SpiderMan

Sid_Vicious
01-17-2006, 04:03 PM
I always have the same predictable response to this subject. I shape it once, twice tops if it changes but my layered tips nearly never do change. Regardless there's no scuffing, tapping or shaping with mine and I get far more than 6 months, year and more. I understand that many players feel a need to tweak the shape and poke at it to seemingly get roughness,,,I simply let the tip shape as it wants and use chalk relentlessly. Jm2c...sid

Cane
01-17-2006, 05:07 PM
I'm with Sid. I use Moori Quicks on my dog cue and I just changed them. The ones I took off could probably gone a couple of more months, but they had been on there since July of 2004, so I figured "Why not". I shoot, depending on the week, between 20 and 40 hours of pool, every week. A good tip with proper care, should last a VERY long time.

Hate swithing tips, though... it took me 10 or 12 balls to get used to new tips! /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Later,
Bob

SpiderMan
01-17-2006, 09:58 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> I always have the same predictable response to this subject. I shape it once, twice tops if it changes but my layered tips nearly never do change. Regardless there's no scuffing, tapping or shaping with mine and I get far more than 6 months, year and more. I understand that many players feel a need to tweak the shape and poke at it to seemingly get roughness,,,I simply let the tip shape as it wants and use chalk relentlessly. Jm2c...sid <hr /></blockquote>

Although I shape my tip about once a week, I don't consider this to affect the life because I never take any off the center/top. I just shape the periphery to match the natural compression of the center. As I see it, the overall height decrease is mostly due to play. I just make the sides match.

Of course, another reason my tips go faster than yours is that I have only one cue, while you select from about 30 of them /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

SpiderMan

Sid_Vicious
01-18-2006, 07:36 AM
True on the many cues I own and yet my reference to tip life of way more than a year was my Woodworth, which I almost exclusively used for all of that time preceeding the move a few months ago. My assortment of other cues saw daylight once every so often in reality. As far as just touching the sides like you do and never shortening the height, I somehow can not grasp that analysis. If that same tip were to be left exactly untouched, I venture to say that you would see maybe twice the life of the tip, assuming you played the tip down thin. Think about it this way. If the shaping was not done, then the tip would be wearing equally at all points around the crown's entire surface. Once the shaper removes even the perimeter, the center then has to take immediate wear more readily. As Deno Andrews told me once, "A tip will shape to your play style." A Triangle, IMO, is hard enough to live up to that analogy. One thing you did not state as a difference between the two of us is the amount of pool you play compared to me. I play league, and many hours on the weekends, whereas you hit many tournaments and hang more on other days. We may actually have a near 2-1 hour play time today. Thay wasn't the case though for the trial on the Woodsworth though, cuz I was a fiend for pool back then. I feel I play better now after slowing down, just a sidenote to the topic...sid

mworkman
01-18-2006, 08:25 AM
Sid. I take it you never really shape the tip then?? What shape does it maintain then. Do you use much english while shooting? I would think your tips are fairly flat and not rounded much. I have a friend who just uses a tapper, yes it lasts a super long time, but is pretty flat.

Deeman3
01-18-2006, 08:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> True on the many cues I own and yet my reference to tip life of way more than a year was my Woodworth, which I almost exclusively used for all of that time preceeding the move a few months ago. My assortment of other cues saw daylight once every so often in reality. As far as just touching the sides like you do and never shortening the height, I somehow can not grasp that analysis. If that same tip were to be left exactly untouched, I venture to say that you would see maybe twice the life of the tip, assuming you played the tip down thin. Think about it this way. If the shaping was not done, then the tip would be wearing equally at all points around the crown's entire surface. <font color="blue"> Sid, this assumes two things, that the tip was properly shaped in the first place and that you have normal distribution of shots on the surface of the tip. Many things can impact this distribution like the shafts from Meucci that have "orientation" dots, causing one area of the tip to experience more hits than normal (unless your distribution of english, follow and draw are completely random). </font color> Once the shaper removes even the perimeter, the center then has to take immediate wear more readily. As Deno Andrews told me once, "A tip will shape to your play style." A Triangle, IMO, is hard enough to live up to that analogy. One thing you did not state as a difference between the two of us is the amount of pool you play compared to me. <font color="blue"> So, if these things are true, are bar stick tips so badly shaped? </font color> I play league, and many hours on the weekends, whereas you hit many tournaments and hang more on other days. We may actually have a near 2-1 hour play time today. Thay wasn't the case though for the trial on the Woodsworth though, cuz I was a fiend for pool back then. I feel I play better now after slowing down, just a sidenote to the topic...sid <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue">Sid, I respect you but can't figure out how you feel a "played into shape" tip is better than the masterpieces that Spiderman crafts. </font color>

Deeman
shapes his tips about once a month....

Scott Lee
01-18-2006, 08:56 AM
I agree with sid and Cane. I play every day, almost never touch my tips, and they last FOREVER. Spiderman did my last tips (and they are still perfectly playable, AND I break with them too!)...how long has that been Marty? 2-3 yrs? A testiment to good tips and good installation, I think!

Scott Lee

Manda
01-18-2006, 10:39 AM
I aslo only shape my tip once,after I put a new one on. The only time I ever feel the need to mess with my tip(tap,scruff,pic) is if all I have to shoot with is bad chalk. Miscue miscue miscue....ick!

Sid_Vicious
01-18-2006, 10:39 AM
If shaped to a nickel for instance, or dime, doesn't matter, the way you use english(a lot or very little) along with your stroke habits, will take that shape and re-model it to that set of parameters. I never thought about it until Deno visited here several years back and made the statement to me. So other than maybe one reshape following a new tip install, I quit touching my tips except with chalk. I am a believer...sid

SpiderMan
01-18-2006, 11:23 AM
I suspect that chalk may itself be abrasive, and may therefore serve a "shaping" function by sanding down the tip minutely each time you use it. If you scuffed mainly the edges (as many do), and chalked frequently (as many don't), the chalk could be your "shaper". I don't think this is really that different from doing it with sandpaper, it just spreads it out over time.

With no external abrasive involved (chalk or sandpaper), I suspect that most players would wind up with a flatter tip than they like. After about a week of play, my dime shaper touches the edges and not the center, so I use it lightly to return to nominal. I want my tip curvature consistent, a "dime every time".

Tips are cheap enough that I don't care whether one lasts six months or nine. Most seem to get slightly "dead" over a long period of time anyway, so I'd still replace it to have my shaft "come alive" again (please, no x-rated comments from the Pepsi generation /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif).

SpiderMan

SpiderMan
01-18-2006, 11:27 AM
Yes, it's been at least 2 years since I put new tips on all of your shafts. I'd like to look at them when you pass through this summer. Perhaps there's some sort of record in the making, like those guys you see in Motor Trend ads who have 450,000 miles on their Toyotas.

SpiderMan

Snapshot9
01-18-2006, 12:15 PM
First, I am old school, okay! ...lol when tips were shaped with nothing but sandpaper, no, not even the sandpaper shapers, just plain sandpaper, and after awhile it becomes sort of a artform... lol
I shot about 30 years with Le Pro tips, never knew any other, but when I got my custom cue with a Hercules layered tip, I
immediately noticed a difference, which was a solidness that
I did not feel ever before, and on every type of shot. A shot to test a tip with is a long almost straight in shot
with lots of english, then same shot drawing back 2", then
same shot following 2". I always use this shot for testing
a tip, plus power draw shots, plus spin shots. What the layered tip did for me was on certain shots that you might
have doubts about miscueing or not getting the english you want were gone, with those doubts gone, I became more consistent, didn't miscue, and more confident in my game.
A Hercules medium hard layered tip lasts me 2-2 1/2 years,
I shape it once, I use only a TipPik on it, and over time,
and on rare occasions, I use a little sandpaper to touch it
up, mostly the sides of the tip. I have my cuemaker replace
tips for me.
The sandpaper shaper - The angled portion of the tip between
the top and sides of a tip is suppose to 45 degrees, with the
shaper that is curved, I find that you can not maintain this
angle, which ultimately affects your shooting.

SpiderMan
01-18-2006, 12:39 PM
Have you replaced your tip since the Hercules construction changed? Less than five years ago, Hercules were advertised as a 23-layer tip. When I bought some from Atlas Billiard supply in 2003, they were indistinguishable from ordinary Talisman tips - looking as if they had come out of the same popcorn machine. Even the font and ink used for markings was identical.

I had several phone and email conversations with the vendor, including an exchange of micro-photographs. Atlas assured me several times that they did not have an inventory mixup, and that this is how Hercules tips are now made. If this is true, and you still like them, you should just buy them from Talisman for less money.

SpiderMan

Billy_Bob
01-18-2006, 01:33 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Manda:</font><hr> What kind of tip do you use? Do you know if the type of joint you have will affect what type of tip you should put on a cue? I have been playing with a LePro for years and for some reason it seems my english is just not improving much. I can get english well, just not as much as I would like sometimes. Maybe it's more along the lines of consistancy. It's like I hit some kind of a road block and can't get much better. Any advice? <hr /></blockquote>

I use a dime shaped Moori Q (hard) tip. Note that Predator says that a dime shape will have less cue ball deflection, so changing tip shapes in my mind will mean you will need to change your aim when using english - and always having the same shaped tip will mean you can always aim the same when using english.

Just a common sense thing. Always same cue/tip specifications, it will will always play the same.

I don't think the joint has much of anything to do with a playing cue. I have a Uni-Loc quick release for faster assembly and long screw type for breaking cue for a more sturdy joint.

So far as not being able to get enough english, I don't understand this. Unless your tip is in the condition of many house cue tips. That being black and slick surface with shiny spots.

Once a week or before tournaments, I lightly sand my tip with a dime shaped sandpaper shaper. When I apply chalk to my tip, it has an even uniform coating of chalk all over. Like a building which has just been freshly painted. All the same color. It is pretty to look at! Such a uniform coating of chalk.

But I apply chalk to a house cue with a nasty tip, and the surface looks like it has been in a bar room brawl! Black and blue! Quite nasty looking. And will not play well at all.

I can get all the english I want or very little. It could be my dime shaped tip. Or it could be my freshly sanded surface. Or it could be that I apply chalk before each shot, especially around the sides of the tip. And will examine the tip under the light periodically to be sure it has no black spots anywhere.

And when using english. It is how many tips of english I apply. 1 tip to right, 2 tips, 1/2 tip, etc. Recently I tried just 1 mm to right of center and found that this gets just a tad of CB spin.