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Paul_Mon
02-27-2006, 09:50 AM
When playing cue ball fouls only and the cue ball is rolling and is about to collide with an object ball but the object ball is accidentally moved out of the path. Or worse yet, the cue ball is rolling towards a pocket destined for a certain scratch and the object ball is accidentally moved and interferes with the cue ball scratching. IMO, you take the balls as they lie with no foul on the shooter. Also, IMO you don't make any attempt to relocate the balls to what might have been. The key word in both cases is “accidentally” moved.

Makes a strong case for playing all balls touched are fouls.


Paul Mon

SPetty
02-27-2006, 10:27 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr>When playing cue ball fouls only and the cue ball is rolling and is about to collide with an object ball but the object ball is accidentally moved out of the path.<hr /></blockquote>That's a foul.<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr>Or worse yet, the cue ball is rolling towards a pocket destined for a certain scratch and the object ball is accidentally moved and interferes with the cue ball scratching.<hr /></blockquote>That's a foul.<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr>Makes a strong case for playing all balls touched are fouls.<hr /></blockquote>Yep.

BCA 1.16.1
CUE BALL FOULS ONLY
When a referee is presiding over a match, it is a foul for a player to touch any ball (cue ball or object ball) with the cue, clothing, body, mechanical bridge or chalk, before, during or after a shot. However, when a referee is not presiding over a game, it is not a foul to accidentally touch stationary balls located between the cue ball and the shooter while in the act of shooting. If such an accident occurs, the player should allow the Tournament Director to restore the object balls to their correct positions. If the player does not allow such a restoration, and a ball set in motion as a normal part of the shot touches such an unrestored ball, or passes partly into a region originally occupied by a disturbed ball, the shot is a foul. In short, if the accident has any effect on the outcome of the shot, it is a foul. In any case, the Tournament Director must be called upon to restore the positions of the disturbed balls as soon as possible, but not during the shot. It is a foul to play another shot before the Tournament Director has restored any accidentally moved balls. At the non-shooting player’s option, the disturbed balls will be left in their new positions. In this case, the balls are considered restored, and subsequent contact on them is not a foul. It is still a foul to make any contact with the cue ball whatsoever while it is in play, except for the normal tip-to-ball contact during a shot.

Paul_Mon
02-27-2006, 11:26 AM
Thanks. Without knowing the rule I was under the misunderstanding that "cue ball only" fouls meant cue ball only. It clearly does not. I should get the rule book.

Rich R.
02-27-2006, 11:31 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr> Thanks. Without knowing the rule I was under the misunderstanding that "cue ball only" fouls meant cue ball only. It clearly does not. I should get the rule book. <hr /></blockquote>
Paul, I believe, in the cases you mentioned, the cue ball is indirectly affected by the accidental movement of the object balls. Therefore, it is considered a cue ball foul.

I'm no referee, so I'm just guessing about the intent of the rule.

Billy_Bob
02-28-2006, 06:47 AM
Also there is accidentally moving an object ball which is "not in play" -vs- accidentially moving an object ball which is "in play".

I think there are 3 different BCA rules which cover this.

jjinfla
03-02-2006, 06:53 AM
Well, so much for the value of your opinion. LOL.

Foul.

Jake

Paul_Mon
03-02-2006, 09:42 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote jjinfla:</font><hr> Well, so much for the value of your opinion. LOL.

Foul.

Jake <hr /></blockquote>

You’re right about that Jake. But I got to tell you that one of the situations actually happened last Sunday. My opponent accidentally moved an object ball just prior to the cue ball making contact with it. Not knowing the rule, other than “cue ball fouls only” I did not call him out for a foul. We were playing one pocket and the object ball in question had just been spotted, so we knew exactly where it could have been restored. But not knowing the rule I accepted the table as is.
I also believe that many players, without the rulebook available, would have done what I did. Rules are great, but if you don’t have them available you’ll have a hard time in these situations.

Paul

wolfdancer
03-02-2006, 12:20 PM
Paul, the rules I played under....that clearly is a foul.
What's going on with the "Americans"? under .500