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Qtec
04-06-2006, 10:53 AM
Libby court papers: Cheney said Bush OK'd intelligence leak

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Vice President Dick Cheney's former top aide told prosecutors that his boss said President Bush authorized the leak of sensitive intelligence information about Iraq, according to court papers filed by prosecutors in the CIA leak case.

Before his indictment, I. Lewis Libby testified to the grand jury investigating the CIA leak that Cheney told him to pass on information and that it was Bush who authorized the disclosure, the court papers say. According to the documents, the authorization led to the July 8, 2003, conversation between Libby and New York Times reporter Judith Miller.

There was no indication in the filing that either Bush or Cheney authorized Libby to disclose Valerie Plame's CIA identity.

But the disclosure in documents filed Wednesday means that the president and the vice president put Libby in play as a secret provider of information to reporters about prewar intelligence on Iraq.

The authorization came as the Bush administration faced mounting criticism about its failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, the main reason the president and his aides had given for going to war.

Libby's participation in a critical conversation with Miller on July 8, 2003 "occurred only after the vice president advised defendant that the president specifically had authorized defendant to disclose certain information in the National Intelligence Estimate," the papers by Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald stated. The filing did not specify the "certain information."

"Defendant testified that the circumstances of his conversation with reporter Miller -- getting approval from the president through the vice president to discuss material that would be classified but for that approval -- were unique in his recollection," the papers added.

Libby is asking for voluminous amounts of classified information from the government in order to defend himself against five counts of perjury, obstruction and lying to the FBI in the Plame affair.

He is accused of making false statements about how he learned of Plame's CIA employment and what he told reporters about it.

Her CIA status was publicly disclosed eight days after her husband, former U.S. Ambassador Joseph Wilson, accused the Bush administration of twisting prewar intelligence to exaggerate the Iraqi threat from weapons of mass destruction.

In 2002, Wilson had been dispatched to Africa by the CIA to check out intelligence that Iraq had an agreement to acquire uranium yellowcake from Niger, and Wilson had concluded that there was no such arrangement.

Libby says he needs extensive classified files from the government to demonstrate that Plame's CIA connection was a peripheral matter that he never focused on, and that the role of Wilson's wife was a small piece in a building public controversy over the failure to find WMD in Iraq.

Fitzgerald said in the new court filing that Libby's requests for information go too far and the prosecutor cited Libby's own statements to investigators in an attempt to limit the amount of information the government must turn over to Cheney's former chief of staff for his criminal defense.

According to Miller's grand jury testimony, Libby told her about Plame's CIA status in the July 8, 2003 conversation that took place shortly after the White House aide -- according to the new court filing -- was authorized by Bush through Cheney to disclose sensitive intelligence about Iraq and WMD contained in a National Intelligence Estimate.

The court filing was first disclosed by The New York Sun.

Copyright 2006 The Associated Press.



<font color="blue"> If this is true,[ and its seems that it is], Cheney was lying when he said 'he knew nothing about it'. Bush was lying when he claimed he 'wanted to get to the bottom of this' <font color="purple"> he already knew </font color> and 'if anyone was involved' they would be fired? [ yeah I know, later he back-tracked on this - "he will sack anyone in the White House who committed a crime in relation to the leaking of the identity of a CIA agent. ]

Like I said before, they panicked when people started to pick up on what Wilson was saying. They were so desperate to kill the story that they made a lot of mistakes and now its all coming back on them.

Here is a flashback. Scott McClellan- the PRESIDENTS spokesman- lying thru his teeth and squirming like a rat caught in a trap.

squirm (http://www.thenation.com/blogs/capitalgames?bid=3&amp;pid=982)

</font color>

The truth will out.

Q

Sid_Vicious
04-06-2006, 12:32 PM
HELL YEA! About time, that crook. How the system can protect him from this major law being broken will be a giant injustice if it happens...sid

wolfdancer
04-06-2006, 12:54 PM
Q, what's really interesting about your post here.....is that the usual "Republican Guard" is not challenging the accuracy of the content???????
And if the story is in fact, true....and the leak was authorized by GWB....does it imply that he had to discredit Wilson, and suppress the truth....which did not fit into the
reasons for the planned war?

pooltchr
04-06-2006, 01:17 PM
It could be that Libby is going down, knows he's going down, and is trying to save his own a$$, or just deciding to take someone with him. Without all the facts, it's hard to say.

What I find really interesting is that someone who doesn't even live in this country seems so gleefully intent on seeing our president impeached, as indicated by the subject of this thread.
Steve

Cueless Joey
04-06-2006, 01:20 PM
I bet GWB resigns tomorrow afternoon.
/ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

wolfdancer
04-06-2006, 02:07 PM
Steve, it's a hot topic....and while believable....I hope that
it's not true....I don't like to see the office of the President impuned by anyone....JFK/Nixon/Bill....
As Americans, we put a lot of faith, a lot of trust, in our elected leaders....and while we don't mind trash-talking if it's the other party's watch....
This can only hurt the country's image even more....
Q might not be an American....but what the "superpower nations" do, certainly affects the rest of the world....and he usually just posts news items.

DickLeonard
04-06-2006, 02:47 PM
Wolfdancer I can't believe this is true, I enjoyed making this stuff up in my mind, trying to rattle certain people's chain. Having it turnout to be true is mind boggling now I have to turn my novel into-non-fiction.

What will Random House say now, keep your manuscript we don't want it.####

Sid_Vicious
04-06-2006, 02:58 PM
"As Americans, we put a lot of faith, a lot of trust, in our elected leaders...."

This guy's been over the line WAY to far on many things, but this exposing identity and putting security agents lives at risk for his political gains, certainly makes Bill C's bj and shading the truth, a pebble on a mountain side. It is treason, plain and simple. Bush has had this coming, 'bout time...sid

wolfdancer
04-06-2006, 04:01 PM
Dick, they turned down my script...'cause I can't spell impugned.
And some years ago, my JFK assassination theory was turned down by Oliver Stone, Sharon Stone, and Bob "everybody must get stoned" Dylan.
I had worked it out that anybody that could get that many accurate shots off, in that short time frame.....could probably bat over .300, and hit in 56 straight games.

wolfdancer
04-06-2006, 04:09 PM
http://prisonplanet.com/Pictures/mar06/220306bush_blames_reality.jpg

pooltchr
04-06-2006, 04:14 PM
As a strategy, I don't think impeachment is the route the Democrats want to go. The VP takes over the top spot and probably hand picks a new VP (It's happened before!) VP doesn't run in '08 and the Republicans have someone (McCain is a possibility) already in the white house who can only have a higher approval rating than GW has. In two years, he/she has enough time to build a solid case for election and probably not enough time to pi$$ off very many voters. The Dems don't seem to be able to come up with any strong candidates, and would have an uphill fight in '08. Their best hope is for GW to stay put and launch their attack against the Republican leadership as it is now.
I don't think they are that smart.
JMHO
Steve

DickLeonard
04-06-2006, 07:01 PM
Pooltchr If the dems get control and start Impeachment you can't get one without the other. Then the Speaker of the House would become President.

If Bush gave the order and Cheney relayed it they are both guilty of committing the same crime. Two for the price of one. I won't be on the Board for a few months while I put this book together.

Wow this is like hitting a Grand Slam in the bottom of the Ninth to win the World Series.####

Drop1
04-06-2006, 07:28 PM
I got turned down because I couldn't spell vasectomy,and I had one. I do like visecetomy better.

Sid_Vicious
04-06-2006, 08:18 PM
"If Bush gave the order and Cheney relayed it they are both guilty of committing the same crime."

Exactly...sid

Qtec
04-07-2006, 12:16 AM
President Bush, 9/30/03:

"I don't know of anybody in my administration who leaked classified information. If somebody did leak classified information, I'd like to know it, and we'll take the appropriate action."

President Bush, 9/30/03:

"If there is a leak out of my administration, I want to know who it is. And if the person has violated law, the person will be taken care of. . . . I have told our administration, people in my administration to be fully cooperative. I want to know the truth. If anybody has got any information inside our administration or outside our administration, it would be helpful if they came forward with the information so we can find out whether or not these allegations are true and get on about the business."

President Bush, 10/28/03:

"I'd like to know if somebody in my White House did leak sensitive information."

President Bush, 6/10/04:

Reporter: "Do you stand by your pledge to fire anyone found to have done so?"

President Bush: "Yes. And that's up to the U.S. Attorney to find the facts."

President Bush, 10/28/03:

"I want to know the truth. ... I have no idea whether we'll find out who the leaker is, partially because, in all due respect to your profession, you do a very good job of protecting the leakers."

President Bush, 7/18/05 issue of USA Today:

"If someone committed crime, they will no longer work in my administration."

White House Press Secretary, 9/29/03:

"The President has set high standards, the highest of standards for people in his administration. He's made it very clear to people in his administration that he expects them to adhere to the highest standards of conduct. If anyone in this administration was involved in it, they would no longer be in this administration."

White House Press Secretary, 10/7/03:

"Let me answer what the President has said. I speak for the President and I'll talk to you about what he wants . . .If someone leaked classified information, the President wants to know. If someone in this administration leaked classified information, they will no longer be a part of this administration, because that's not the way this White House operates, that's not the way this President expects people in his administration to conduct their business."



Steve, all I,ve ever done is to dispute the lies and the false info coming from this Admin.

Q

pooltchr
04-07-2006, 05:22 AM
Technically, since the President has the authority to declassify any documents, I don't think they can make this stick. And there is nothing in the documents that would indicate he said anything about Valerie, I think this is going to turn out to be a big nothing. It will not help his approval ratings, but I don't think he really cares what his rating is. He's done in 2 years anyway.
Steve

eg8r
04-07-2006, 10:38 AM
[ QUOTE ]
If this is true,[ and its seems that it is], <hr /></blockquote> Because you desperately want it to?

eg8r

wolfdancer
04-07-2006, 11:24 AM
Q,if this is true.....makes me wonder if any of this is also true?
Esp. the "Bush..." video clip

web page (http://martiallaw911.info/video.htm)

SPetty
04-07-2006, 12:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr>The Dems don't seem to be able to come up with any strong candidates, and would have an uphill fight in '08. Their best hope is for GW to stay put and launch their attack against the Republican leadership as it is now.<hr /></blockquote>"We've lost every advantage we've ever had," GOP pollster Tony Fabrizio said. "The good news is Democrats don't have much of a plan. The bad news is they may not need one."

pooltchr
04-07-2006, 05:27 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SPetty:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr>The Dems don't seem to be able to come up with any strong candidates, and would have an uphill fight in '08. Their best hope is for GW to stay put and launch their attack against the Republican leadership as it is now.<hr /></blockquote>"We've lost every advantage we've ever had," GOP pollster Tony Fabrizio said. "The good news is Democrats don't have much of a plan. The bad news is they may not need one." <hr /></blockquote>

That doesn't say a lot for our political system when you really stop and think about it. One party doesn't have a clue what the American public thinks, but could still win the election simply because the other party has simply blown the opportunities they had. It's really sad. I stated at the last election that I felt like I was voting for the lesser of two evils. Looks like the next election, they will be lowering the bar even further! /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Steve

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 06:58 AM
The administration is already fixing law and motives for their treasonist actions, McClellan already out there making a distinction between Declassification of Information in the interest of the American People, LOL, and leaking sensitive intelligence in order to buff their false calims for the need for war. This entire matter is an expose' of the cherry picking of intelligence, and the low down status quo of this administration to ruin lives in order to maintain their many falsehoods. It is the Hallmark, of Rove, Cheney, and Bush. They ONLY declassified the information which supported their case for war!!!! CHERRY PICKING!!!

There was so much ridiculous spin coming out of McClellan yesterday, I was looking to the western sky, expecting to see this White House spinning into space, and finally arriving precisely where it has belonged all along, In The Land Of Oz, aka, The Land Of Ugh! One could almost see the Wizard behind the Green Curtain, talking into the echo chamber, pulling imaginary strings, and BSing the ignorant Naive' lost souls of (The Right) Dorothy, Tin Man, Lion and Scarecrow!

IMO, regardless of how they re-arrange the legal facts, most people will see through all of this, and realize that the declassified info was revealed in order to support their original intentionally trumped up claims of Yellow Cake, and WMD's, and to discredit and destroy the lives and careers of Joe Wilson and his wife, BUT was absent of any of the dissenting opinions coming out of the State Department, CIA, NSA, etc. Their down and dirty overall intentions are undeniably clear to those who understand that this has long been the way they operate across the board, and there are many whistle blowers, and patriots, who can attest to that!


The rhetoric and denial of die hard Bush supporters, at this point, has become laughable, and dispicable, at once. Bush, in the coming months, will long for these wonderful days of 36% approval ratings. Already, 55% are saying that they will vote for democrats in the coming elections, and that democrats, would do a better job, here and abroad, and all the indictments haven't even gone out yet on the Abramoff scandal.

More Scientific information is emerging everyday, which supports the urgent circumstances of global warming, another pressing issue which has been totally pooh poohed by George Bush, along with the theory of evolution, lol. Just this week, more support for the evolutionary process has emerged, won't get into that now, but it certainly isn't a plus in the minds of thinking people that we have a president who places Intelligent Design on the same level with the Theory Of Evolution. Just another case for not putting those who use religion to get elected in charge of the country since they have nothing to lose anyway, considering the coming Armagedden, LMAO!

Also notable, how those from the right, are still harrassing people like Q. for simply having an opinion, and daring to state it! Amazing.... the continuous efforts of those from the right, and their on-going and inappropriate efforts to dictate what others may say! INCREDIBLE!! especially in the face of their own on-going state of ignorance and denial of the facts!!!LMAO!!!

As for impeachment, Delay is already out there threatening voters that if Democrats win the majority in the up-coming election, they will impeach the right's lovable, truthful, competent resident White House Chimp, OH HORRORS, AH HA HA HA, we can't let THAT happen! This is almost like a jury trying to decide which is the best punishment, to give the death sentence to a horrible murderrer, or let him spend the rest of his life in jail, which would be worse, impeach Bush and let him out of the misery of having to cope with the collosal mess he has produced in the middle east, or impeach him, and let him hand off the whole mess to his successor, which his recent statements suggest has been his devious intention from the start! After all, "I'll start a war, be a war president, insure re-election as a war president, get Saddam for daddy, Dick and I will make a fortune in Arab pay backs, Halliburton will send us billions in paybacks, after we're out of office, of course, and I can scare the people into letting me spy on all my enemies while I'm ruining lives, and killing off innocent people. Yeah! That's the ticket, fun and games for eight years, and I get to do my G I JOE costume changes for the cameras, too!"

Bottom line, impeachment or not, official leak or not, people can no longer deny that he is a liar, incompetent, bad for the country, a sneak and a law breaker! Just as it cannot be denied that the republican party is wrought with pompus, bribe taking, law breaking crooks who hit the communion rail every sunday!

So much for the pious religious right, and their ability to run this country! And as for Iraq, the civil war continues, still no ratified constitution, levees are still not prepared for the coming season, most trailors are still not in use, we have lost over 2300 of our very bravest and best, deficits still climbing, but never fear, Armagedden is on the way~!

Gayle in Md.
SO Proud I Didn't Vote For George Bush!!!!

heater451
04-08-2006, 07:55 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr> . . .I stated at the last election that I felt like I was voting for the lesser of two evils. Looks like the next election, they will be lowering the bar even further! /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Steve <hr /></blockquote>I think the ladder of voting-zeal went something like this:

People once voted for the candidate they liked most.

Eventually, it became about voting for the one that was dis-liked least.

Now, it's about voting against the guy hated most.


At least, that's roughly how I've seen it described, although I feel that there was a fourth case. I wish I could recall the source, where I originally saw this.


==============================

moblsv
04-08-2006, 08:38 AM
hehe

Now they expect us to believe that technically it wasn't leaked since it was declassified by the President because it was in the public's interest.

Who's going to stand up and say they buy this one?

Sid_Vicious
04-08-2006, 09:37 AM
I heard a good question on NPR the other day. What if a president, during the cold war, gave the Russian's all of the nuclear secrets under this same premise of on the spot declassification? Whether it be selling out a CIA operative or nuclear secrets...it is still a travesty to the system in place, and a downright crime, treason in my mind. Also, this administration spent millions in the probe for seeking the leak so that right there is another crime since Bush himself was the source....sid

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 10:48 AM
I don't know, Jack, maybe the very best message we can send to the world is that Americans don't stand behind liars who trump up their intelligence to support illegal pre-determined personal agendas, do not abide by the rules of war, cannot be trusted to be meticulously honest when approaching to rest of the world in regard to so serious an act as war, and are brave enough to maintain the principles of our Constitution regardless of who the self proclaimed King in the White House may be.

IMO, the most redeeming action we as Americans can take, is to devote ourselves to exposing and punishing George Bush for his many war crimes, his attack on our constitution, our rights as citizens, his illegal pre-emptive strike against a country which did not attack America, and his mismanaging of the entire war effort.

I think that impeachment would make the statement, not that America isn't strong as a country, but IS strong, and above all other countries, due to its committment to its Constitution, in it's laws, rules of war, and is ready and able to extract any President, regardless of his money connections, when he endeavors to weaken our rights, our laws, and our quest to avoid war unless it is a last resort.

This is what is so unfortunate, Bush has destroyed our reputation and credibility in the world as a peace loving nation, a nurturing nation, which will stand against tyrants, for the benefit of mankind, but will be right and correct in our assertions, above board in our motives, and with the respect of many allies which will stand with us, and trust our declaration, not against imagined evils, not against possible future threats, but against any dictator, any country, any nation which is actually a threat to our national security, and that we as a nation, will not lie to the world over such drastic act as launching war.

If ever, in the history of our country, any man, any president, any administration, deserved impeachment, deserved shame, deserved exposure, deserved punishment, deserved banishment, this is the time.

Gayle in Md.
So proud I Didn't Vote For George Bush!

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 11:07 AM
HA HA HA...sad part is, some will buy it out of desparation, and to avoid being shown up for having poor political judgement in their choice of presidential candidates.

Gore, was the only candidate in 2000 who understood that the most pressing threat to our national security, was global warming.

Kerry, was the man who said all along, that this was (is) the wrong war, in the wrong place, at the wrong time, man oh man, what prophetic genius that turned out to be....

The good news, no, the great news, is that Joe Biden is going to run for the presidency! Twenty-nine years as a U.S.Senator, immaculate reputation, straight shooter, speaks the english language, not right wing double spin, very intelligent, and has the admiration of most everyone inside the Beltway. I am hoping that he asks Barach Obomha to be his running mate, what a fabulous combination that would be! But, there are so many intelligent, honest and unindicted Democrats, /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif there will surely be many more to emerge...

Have you noticed how ridiculous the right wing press suddenly sounds when they critisize democrats, LMAO!!!!

Gayle in Md.
So Proud That I Did Not Vote For George Bush!!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 11:18 AM
AH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HE HE HE HE HE HE EH BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA AH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HE HE HE HE HE HA HA HA AH HA HA HA HA AH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA AH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 11:29 AM
Have you noticed, also, .... if the information exposes law breaking by the Bush aministration, it's a leak, and a threat to National Security, if the information is given out by the Bush administration, and the end result is the outing of a CIA Covert Agent, the trashing of a former Ambasador's reputation, or the cherry picking of intelligence to support an illegal, immoral war, then it is just de-classification of intelligence, for the good of the American People, LMAO! This bunch gets funnier every day, and their supporters, sound even dumber than they always have in the past!


The Gig Is Up!!!

Bush sounds more ridiculous everyday, looks even dumber than ever, and has only begun the dive to the bottom!

This is just the tip, more to come this week!!!!

Gayle in Md.
So Proud That I Did Not Vote For George Bush!!! /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

pooltchr
04-08-2006, 05:56 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> Joe Biden... has the admiration of most everyone inside the Beltway. <hr /></blockquote>

Sorry Gayle, but I hardly consider that to be much of an endorsement.

Steve --Doesn't think much of those "inside the beltway".

Gayle in MD
04-08-2006, 06:04 PM
Yeah, that could be true, since the one we have now, and his vice president, are both considered beltway insiders. Biden is the only Senator I know of who drives himself back home. he's a good man, and very intelligent, which would be a HUGE contrast to what we've been dealing with for the last five years~!

Gayle in Md.
So proud I didn't vote for George Bush!!

pooltchr
04-09-2006, 05:19 AM
Gayle,
It's not just the white house gang. It seems like you can send a good person to Washington, and within 6 months, they all fall victim to the system of pandering for votes, working on re-election, and supporting whatever party line they happen to be affiliated with. I would love to see single term limits for congress. If they stay there any longer, they seem to become power hungary. And if they weren't concerned with getting re-elected, maybe they could actually accomplish something productive.
JMHO
Steve

moblsv
04-09-2006, 10:53 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr>
It's not just the white house gang. It seems like you can send a good person to Washington, and within 6 months, they all fall victim to the system of pandering for votes, working on re-election, and supporting whatever party line they happen to be affiliated with.<hr /></blockquote>

I don't buy this prelude to a "the democrats are just as bad" argument. History doesn't support it. Do you really think Gore or Kerry would have been this bad? I certainly don't.

Clinton was a gift from God compared to these clowns.

DickLeonard
04-09-2006, 02:05 PM
Pooltchr yes but when you send a Gonnif see what you get.####

pooltchr
04-09-2006, 04:23 PM
I believe Gore and Kerry would have been worse for this country, although in different ways. And I stand by my statement. Many honest men have gone to Washington, but I think very few have left the same way.
Steve

eg8r
04-10-2006, 05:40 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Gore, was the only candidate in 2000 who understood that the most pressing threat to our national security, was global warming. <hr /></blockquote> Which is exactly why that buffoon is not the President. I wonder if he still wears them tight jeans? They almost swayed every female watching MTV to vote for him. How about that for a political platform. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

eg8r

eg8r
04-10-2006, 05:44 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I don't buy this prelude to a "the democrats are just as bad" argument. History doesn't support it. Do you really think Gore or Kerry would have been this bad? I certainly don't. <hr /></blockquote> To be honest, if Gore had become President there would not have been a Kerry (never should have been a Kerry but the Dems were not interested in winning the election anyways) and we would probably be answering to the UN or the Taliban for advice. Gore is an appeaser and he would have fallen to their demands. While we are at it, Saddam and his children would still be raping and murdering Iraqis at a higher rate than any have been hurt since this war began.

eg8r

Gayle in MD
04-10-2006, 10:38 AM
Steve, what you're saying is very true, but I really don't think this country has much chance of surviving as the country we all have loved and cherished unless we as Americans insist on true campaign reform.

Our representatives are bought and paid for before they ever arrive in Washington. Corporate interests, greedy, wealthy, crooked CEO's, and billionaires, and their huge lobbying platform, from the U.S., and all over the world, run this country.

Government financed campaign reform is our only hope, IMO. As long as the rich pull the strings, the negative consequences of curruption will continue.

JMO....

Gayle in Md.

Gayle in MD
04-10-2006, 11:38 AM
BRAVO...You are right...the last two times in history we have had this many government people indicted was during Nixon and Reagan's administrations. Reagan's was the worst! This is the whole reason why the republicans have made such an effort to paint themselves as the voice of the religious right. If people really understood all that is behind this whole so called Christian Movement...they would vote a lot differently, not that it would matter much, anymore, since the republicans have learned how to steal elections, and have stolen the last two. Exit poles haven't matched results in either of the last two presidential elections.


The extremist movement on the right has hijacked the Christian Reconstruction Movement. If one looks into the Constitution Restoration Act, one would better understand the destruction of where this religious right is trying to take this country. Already our laws are being degraded, and our rights, ha ha ha, well, take a good look at what Bush is doing, there are no rights anymore, we have no privacy, they can invade our homes, for no reason, they can spy on our phone conversations, read our mail, our e-mail, and not even have to tell anyone about what they are doing or why they are doing it. Bush say's,...."Trust me." AH HA HA HA, that's a good one, I'd sooner trust The Boston Strangler.

There is a very good book ... several of them, can't recall all the authors names right now, as some I haven't found yet...but only read excerpts,

"With God On Their Side"

"Ultimate Sacrifice" Tom Hartmen

"Devine Destruction"

"Fooled Again ...How the Right Stole the 2004 Election and How They;ll Do It Again" ....Mark Crispen Miller

"The Bush Dyslexicon" Mark Crispen Miller

"Kingdom Coming"

How The Pro Choice Movement Saved America"

"Cruel and Unusual, Bush/Cheney's New World Order"

All those who wrote and approved the memos to justify torture, have been promoted to judgeships, and Gonzales, who wrote the language for torture, is the Attorney General!!!??? Bush promoted the offenders, gave medals to the incompetent, and continues to break the law to this day. This is a unitary presidency, whatever congress says, I have the right to ignore congress, and the courts, and the Constitution. The President admits he is breaking the law, and Congress promises to watch him while he's breaking it???? WTF!!!

He's whole administration has been about subverting and diminishing the power of the Congress and the Courts. This is a dictatorship! The signing statements alone, which he has added to such things as the McCain Torture Bill, and The Patriot Act, for example, he waits until everybody leaves the room, and then writes signing statements, the likes of which have never been used before by ANY president, which basically say, he will not abide by what he just signed.

Jefferson said, "The Price Of Freedom Is Eternal Vigilence."

The things which this administration is doing to this country, our rights, our laws, our elections, our protections of privacy, provided by our Constitution, not to mention our standing among other countries, and our massive debt....and we still have people who defend his illegal actions???

For me, atleast, the realization that we now have a Christian Political Movement, rallying around the effort to subvert our laws and Constitutional rights, and willing to look the other way over a proven liar, and his law breaking, regardless of how much destruction he creates, economically, legally, constitutionally, and internationally, and at the same time people are whining about those who are talking about it!!!!!

GIVE ME A BREAK!

As far as I'm concerned, there are only two kinds of people in this country, those dumb enough to support George Bush, and those smart enough to see through him. A true patriot would never support a president who breaks the law. Clinton was a prince compared to Bush, Nixon or Reagan!



Markcrispenmiller.com



Read The Conyers Report, on the 2004 election

wolfdancer
04-10-2006, 01:51 PM
Is impeachment now a reality????????????????
NO.........................
It's now
a
necessity !!!

Gayle in MD
04-10-2006, 08:38 PM
LOL...did you see his speech today? (Monday) What a pathological liar! This isn't over yet! Sooner or later that prosecutor is going to get both Cheney and Bush on the stand. They're painting themselves into a corner.

Judith Miller already said that most of her conversation with Libby was Libby telling her about Joe Wilson and his wife Valarie, trying to discredit him and his information about Niger, not National Security Estimates information, as Bush is trying to say. Anyway, the parts Bush LEAKED, and it was a leak, too, didn't include the information which stated that most of the National Security people in the CIA, and other agencies had already dispelled the information about Yellow Cake and the Alumminum tubes, and also that the Birtish had exaggerated their information. It's in the report to the Senate Intelligence Committee...IOW, he only de-classified the same misinformation that he lied to everybody about in the first place. He made me ill today, trying to say that when he "De-Classified the information, he was trying to give the American People what they deserved, AH HA HA HA...what we deserve is not to have a liar like him running this country! He won't be satisfied until he gets us all blown up!

Three retired Generals are now calling for Rumsfeld's resignation! Powell said today that their failure to take the advice of experienced people and send enough troops at the outset, was the reason why the insurgency grew as it has. Today Bush gave a total different report on the conditions in Iraq than his own commanders on the ground in Iraq.

I believe this new story that three in the war command intend to step down if he doesn't drop threatening language to Iran with keeping all options on the table with Iran, IOW Nukes. For heavens sake, they could use our own pre-emptive actions in Iraq to justify doing exactly the same thing to us. This president is an idiot!

Rove told Cooper that Valarie was fair game! She was a covert agent, there is no question about that anymore. Why isn't bush firing Rove? This whole CIA outing of Valarie Plame will be the very thing that brings this crooked bunch down, and it won't be a moment too soon!

Gayle in Md.

BTW, This Joe DiGenoa, and his idiot wife, are as compulsive liars as Bush! Two right wing liars, Washington is full of them these days!

Qtec
04-11-2006, 05:55 AM
2 weeks before the NIE was 'officialy' de-classified, Libby was talking to Miller and others. This would be a leak but the spin now is that Doc was already de-classified.!
My question is - if, as GW claims, the info was de-classified in the public interest, why did they wait 2 weeks before telling the public- or anyone else.
The inconsistencies in the lies are piling up.

Hers a good short report.

video Shuster wmv (http://movies.crooksandliars.com/Hardball-Shuster-President-leaks-04-10-06.wmv)

Q

Gayle in MD
04-12-2006, 07:49 AM
Libby leaked the information before the documents were de-classified, and so did Karl Rove, and possibly Dick Cheney. The manner in which they de-classfied the information, was not in the usual fashion, and without the usual pre-requisites of de-classification. We still don't know who Robert Novak's second aource was, but he has stated that the President knows who it was, and Novak's article outed Valarie, whom it has since been proven, WAS, in fact, a covert agent operative at the time of the article. The Special Prosecutor indicated that the person who gave that information to Novak, broke the law, and that Libby's original lies on the stand, have obstructed Justice of convicting the person who did so, for breaking that law, outing a covert agent.

Gayle in Md.

Sid_Vicious
04-12-2006, 10:07 AM
Isn't it rediculous that we have to continually battle with these people over this, WHEN Bill C. was hounded with just the simple infidelity squirm, and impeached. I'd be damned embarrassed if I was on the other side with these nuckleheads...sid

eg8r
04-12-2006, 10:20 AM
Here is an interesting article about all this "new" news about Bush declassifying the information. It is all old news that the media is trying to drum up. Anyways, read the article (I especially like the section where they remind the reader that the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence concluded unanimously that it was Mr. Wilson who was lying). /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Link to Article (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2006/04/media_selectively_recycles_old.html)

[ QUOTE ]
We journalists are environmentally friendly. We recycle. We've been recycling old news all weekend, without, of course, telling you it's old news.

"A senior administration official confirmed for the first time on Sunday that President Bush had ordered the declassification of parts of a prewar intelligence report on Iraq in an effort to rebut critics who said the administration had exaggerated the nuclear threat posed by Saddam Hussein," reported David Sanger and David Johnston in the New York Times Monday.

For the first time? Here's the AP's Tom Raum on July 20, 2003: "The White House declassified portions of an October, 2002 intelligence report to demonstrate that President Bush had ample reason to believe Iraq was reconstituting a nuclear weapons program."

<hr /></blockquote> There is more, read if you would like. If you are a Lib, understand before reading, it might not suit your agenda. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

eg8r

Qtec
04-12-2006, 07:18 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Here is an interesting article about all this "new" news about Bush declassifying the information. <font color="blue"> When did GW say he de-classified the the NIE? [ I'll save you a brain burn-out and tell you] HE REFUSED TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION.
Thats right, he wont say when he de-classified! We all know that officialy the doc was released 18 July but Libby talked to Miller 8 July. Libby claims the Pres had de-classified the info when he talked to Miller.
Now do see the problem?
If the docs were de-classified in the public interest on July 8, why wait 10 days before telling the public? </font color> It is all old news that the media is trying to drum up. Anyways, read the article (I especially like the section where they remind the reader that the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence concluded unanimously that it was Mr. Wilson who was lying). <font color="blue">Lying about what? </font color>
<hr /></blockquote>


The Govt leaked SELECTIVE parts from a classified doc [ a doc that Congress didnt even get to see] to a reporter in order to boost support for the war. If they had released the WHOLE doc you would have seen this.

[ QUOTE ]
State/INR Alternative View of Iraq's Nuclear Program

The Assistant Secretary of State for Intelligence and Research (INR) believes that Saddam continues to want nuclear weapons and that available evidence indicates that Baghdad is pursuing at least a limited effort to maintain and acquire nuclear weapon-related capabilities. The activities we have detected do not, however, add up to a compelling case that Iraq is currently pursuing what INR would consider to be an integrated and comprehensive approach to acquire nuclear weapons. Iraq may be doing so, but INR considers the available evidence inadequate to support such a judgment. <font color="blue"> The Govt claimed many times to have 'clear and compelling'evidence!!!!!!!!!!!! </font color> Lacking persuasive evidence that Baghdad has launched a coherent effort to reconstitute its nuclear weapons program, INR is unwilling to speculate that such an effort began soon after the departure of UN inspectors or to project a timeline for the completion of activities it does not now see happening. As a result, INR is unable to predict when Iraq could acquire a nuclear device or weapon.

In INR's view Iraq's efforts to acquire aluminum tubes is central to the argument that Baghdad is reconstituting its nuclear weapons program, but INR is not persuaded that the tubes in question are intended for use as centrifuge rotors. INR accepts the judgment of technical experts at the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) who have concluded that the tubes Iraq seeks to acquire are poorly suited for use in gas centrifuges to be used for uranium enrichment and finds unpersuasive the arguments advanced by others to make the case that they are intended for that purpose. INR considers it far more likely that the tubes are intended for another purpose, most likely the production of artillery rockets. The very large quantities being sought, the way the tubes were tested by the Iraqis, and the atypical lack of attention to operational security in the procurement efforts are among the factors, in addition to the DOE assessment, that lead INR to concluded that the tubes are not intended for use in Iraq's nuclear weapon program.
<hr /></blockquote>

Your article is so full of lies and BS. He even repeats the lie that Wilson's wife sent him to Niger. Libby is up for perjury, GW, Cheney said he they didnt know anything about the leak and now it turns out it started from GW himself? And YOU have the cheek to question Wilson's integrity?

Wow.

Q

Drop1
04-12-2006, 08:37 PM
OK so Bush is your hero,and he never told a lie,and the war in Iraq never happened,and we live in the best of all possible worlds,and we are not spending money,and there is no deficit,and there are no jobs leaving the Country,and everyone has a retirement plan,and all people can count on President Bush,and God to keep the world safe for Democracy.Please list anything left out of the world you live in.

eg8r
04-13-2006, 05:22 AM
[ QUOTE ]
OK so Bush is your hero <hr /></blockquote> I never said that, but since I don't just follow along your lines you feel this way. Grow up. I have from day one said the world is not as gloomy as you try to say. Not everything is W's fault, even though you would not be called a good lib if you didn't try and pin it on him anyway. Actually the link has nothing to do about praising Bush or calling him hero. It is to wake up the minions and let them know that just because the leftist media has a fire up their butt about something does not mean it is not old news. All this "to-do" about Bush declassifying documents is old news and was reported on 2 years ago. Why all the buzz right now? My goodness you are being herded like cattle.

The rest of your rambling is garbage. Lord knows I have called W on his spending since the beginning, but maybe all that reading is just too much for you. Don't bother to actually try and make any sense or be honest just spout whatever trash comes to your mind.

eg8r

eg8r
04-13-2006, 05:26 AM
[ QUOTE ]
When did GW say he de-classified the the NIE? [ I'll save you a brain burn-out and tell you] HE REFUSED TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION.
<hr /></blockquote> The article was merely posted to show this is all old news. Everything that is being reported about the declassification of the documents was reported 2 years ago.

eg8r

Qtec
04-13-2006, 06:46 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote eg8r:</font><hr> &lt;/font&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;font class="small"&gt;Quote:&lt;/font&gt;&lt;hr /&gt;
When did GW say he de-classified the the NIE? [ I'll save you a brain burn-out and tell you] HE REFUSED TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION.
<hr /></blockquote> The article was merely posted to show this is all old news. Everything that is being reported about the declassification of the documents was reported 2 years ago.

eg8r <hr /></blockquote>

If this is old news, can you tell me-
When was the info was de-classified?
Simple , yes?
Q

Gayle in MD
04-13-2006, 08:24 AM
HA HA HA...Q. don't you think it's funny how someone on this forum, someone who quotes FOX news all the time, and obviously only gets his information from right wing pundits, is the one who is always telling other peopole to grow up!???? yet is always so obviously ill informed, and at the same time twisiting everything anyone else writes, which IS accurate, into some right wing jabber, while accusing others of being pertisan, LMAO, /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

McClellen, and hence Fox, are playing up this "Old News" BS, hence SOMEONE chimes in with the exact same language, lol, no exposure at all to the other REASONABLE take on the matter.

The rest of us know that George Bush stated that if anybody leaked classified information, they'd be fired. HELLO, Bush leaked it, gave the go ahead to leak it, then de-classified the info at a later date, atleast ten days later, after he had already put his bull dogs on the scent to attack Joe Wilson. Must have been an afterthought, since this vicious bunch in the White House is always hot on the trigger to slander people, or bomb people, they are always in the obvious position of having gone off half cocked, (WMD"S in Iraq, CIA Plame Outing, broken FISA laws, just to name a few) and then adjusting to justify what they f-ed up, at a later date! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif Hence, WMD's, become WAR ON TERROR, and WAR ON TERROR, becomes SPREADING DEMOCRACY, and LEAKS, become -DECLASSIFIED INFORMATION, ....

I'm still working on my RE-BONICS dictionary, so we Americans can stay on top of these crooks!

Gayle in Md.

DickLeonard
04-13-2006, 11:15 AM
Gayle I don't know who is dumber the Pres/Vice Pres or the people they hire to mismanage things.####

Gayle in MD
04-13-2006, 11:30 AM
Nor do I, but the complaints about all of them are the same from all the people surrounding them. They won't listen to experts, they won't change course once it is obvious their judgement was off, they cherry pick fact to support their misjudgements, use personal attacks to punish those who don't go along with their failed policies and lies, and they go around the law at every impasse.

Here we have four or five retired career generals coming out with the same exact complaints we heard from people in the CIA years ago, about dealing with this incompetent administration, and they still don't listen, or alter their unrealistic, failed policies. Ignorant bull headed elitists, who think they can run rough shod over the world. If ever there has been a bunch of pompus idiots running things, who suffer from extreme power mongering, this is the time. I just hope we all don't end up blown to smitherines because of it.

We need to reinstitute the draft immediately. I do think, though, because so much has been now realized about their failed administration and incompetence, poor decision making, inneffective operations and policy, that there will be more Generals, and former Secretaries of State, and Defense who will speak up, and work against faulty foreign policies. Imagine, refusing to TALK to foreign leaders in the interest of diplomacy!

Did you see Cheney's pitch on the field, LMAO....
Pretty soon Bush will retreat back into his shell once he reailzes the American Public are tired of being condescended to by an arrogant jerk who can't even SAY NUCLEAR!!! They just keep on keeping on, implementing policy that doesn't work, and then lying and glorifying the failed results. PAHLEEZE, Americans aren't stupid! The definition of insanity...."Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result." Good description of Bush's administration!

Love,
Gayle....So Proud I Didn't Vote For George Bush!!!!