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nAz
05-01-2006, 01:30 PM
My man has been pretty much on the mark on this issue over the last few years. amazing that no one really paid attention till the last month or so but even MORE amazing no one wants to call the majority of these protesters what they really are illegal immigrants.

Dobbs: Radical groups taking control of immigrant movement

By Lou Dobbs
CNN

Monday, May 1, 2006; Posted: 3:29 p.m. EDT (19:29 GMT)


NEW YORK (CNN) -- We all awoke to headlines in our nation's most important newspapers reminding us that this is "A Day Without Immigrants." Not illegal immigrants, mind you, but immigrants.

USA Today headlined today's demonstrations and boycott "On Immigration's Front Lines." The New York Times headlines its story "With Calls for Boycott by Immigrants, Employers Gird for Unknown." The Washington Post and The Los Angeles Times are both calling its coverage "The Immigration Debate."

These major newspapers obviously don't want to disturb their readers with the information that today's demonstrations and boycott are about illegal immigration and amnesty for illegal aliens.

CNN and Fox News are both using a banner calling their coverage "A Day Without Immigrants," while MSNBC is titling its coverage "Immigrant Anger."

Most of the mainstream media has been absolutely co-opted by the open borders and illegal immigration advocates. I'm not opposed to demonstrations and protests of any kind, even by those who are not citizens of this country, because one way or another, demonstrations and protests enrich and invigorate the national debate and raise the public consciousness of truth.

But only one newspaper, to its credit, reported that illegal aliens and their supporters' boycott of the national economy on the First of May is clear evidence that radical elements have seized control of the movement. The Washington Post, alone among national papers, reported that ANSWER (Act Now to Stop War and End Racism) has become an active promoter of the national boycott.

Some illegal immigration and open borders activists in the Hispanic community are deeply concerned about the involvement of the left-wing radical group. But others, like Juan Jose Gutierrez, whom I've interviewed a number of times over the past several months, manages to be both director of Latino Movement USA and a representative of ANSWER.

As Gutierrez told us on my show, "The time has come...where we need to stand up and make a statement. We need to do what the American people did when they pulled away from the British crown. And I am sure that back in those days many people were concerned that was radical action."

Just how significant is the impact of leftists within the illegal immigration movement? It is no accident that they chose May 1 as their day of demonstration and boycott. It is the worldwide day of commemorative demonstrations by various socialist, communist, and even anarchic organizations.

Supporters of the boycott have made no secret of their determination to try to shut down schools, businesses and entire cities. Much of Los Angeles' 7th Street produce market, which supplies thousands of local restaurants and markets, is closed today. Many meat-packing companies like Cargill and Tyson are also closing many of their plants.

"The meat packers are confirming what we know," says University of Maryland economics professor Peter Morici, "and that is that this large group of illegal aliens in the United States is lowering the wage rate of semiskilled workers, people who are high school dropouts or high school graduates with minimal training."

In fact, a meat-packing job paid $19 an hour in 1980, but today that same job pays closer to $9 an hour, according to the Labor Department. That's entirely consistent with what we've been reporting -- that illegal aliens depress wages for U.S. workers by as much as $200 billion a year in addition to placing a tremendous burden on hospitals, schools and other social services.


Radicalism is not confined to Gutierrez and Latino Movement USA. Ernesto Nevarez of the L.A. Port Collective is promising to shut down the Port of Los Angeles today: "[Transportation and commerce] will come to a grinding halt. ...They are going to put a wall along the border with Mexico. We're going to put a wall between us and the ocean. And those containers ain't going to move."

No matter which flag demonstrators and protestors carry today, their leadership is showing its true colors to all who will see.

Gayle in MD
05-01-2006, 01:40 PM
Hey Naz, Lou is my favorite, also Russert, Sheiffer, and Chris Mathews, even though I know he's a rightie, but he does show some interest in the truth.

Lou Dobbs has been way ahead on many of our country's problems....and has great interviewing skills.

Gayle in Md.

pooltchr
05-01-2006, 04:48 PM
I heard an interesting view of the situation on the radio today. Having the illegals band together to protest the laws against illegal immigration is about like having all the convicted drunk drivers getting together to DEMAND that we change the laws against drunk driving! Drunks contribute to the economy, they have jobs, they spend their money, they have POWER!!
Since when do the CRIMINALS have any say in how the laws they are breaking will be enforced??????? And even worse, Why are the lawmakers LISTENING to them??????????????
Steve

Drop1
05-01-2006, 05:56 PM
nAz,if you want to change something,you go where the support is. Remember Harry Bridges was a Communist,and head of the Long Shoremans'Union,on the West Coast. When Congressman Dies pushed for a committee to investigate unAmerican activities,he went to the people,and the result was the destruction of hundredes of lives,by Mc Carthy. I think more radical agendas will be pushed on to the illegals,and we can reach the point of riots,like I saw in 65,and I think 92. Who speaks for the illegals? Someone will come forward with the messsage "Feedom is just a word for nothing else to lose" If you were illegal,with nothing else to lose,what would you do? Ideas change the world-too bad we ran out.

nAz
05-01-2006, 09:20 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr> I heard an interesting view of the situation on the radio today. Having the illegals band together to protest the laws against illegal immigration is about like having all the convicted drunk drivers getting together to DEMAND that we change the laws against drunk driving! Drunks contribute to the economy, they have jobs, they spend their money, they have POWER!!


dude i cannot agree with the above analogy that is too extreme,
However I am in total agreement with you on the statement below...

"Since when do the CRIMINALS have any say in how the laws they are breaking will be enforced??????? And even worse, Why are the lawmakers LISTENING to them??????????????"
Steve <hr /></blockquote>

nAz
05-01-2006, 09:35 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Drop1:</font><hr> I think more radical agendas will be pushed on to the illegals,and we can reach the point of riots,like I saw in 65,and I think 92. Who speaks for the illegals? Someone will come forward with the messsage "Feedom is just a word for nothing else to lose"

Ya I think it will come to that we will have some level of rioting and you know what I welcome it... a little rioting just might shake up things for the best.

If you were illegal,with nothing else to lose,what would you do?

I'd try my best to become a good standing US citizen and hope that America would welcome me with open arms... however i would not think that too likely to happen if there are another 20 million plus illegals behind me. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif



BTW I found the imperfect solution to this mess... heavily fine that small and large business that hire the Illegal immigrants.

nAz
05-01-2006, 09:43 PM
question if ILLEGAL immigrants work in our under ground economy that means they don't pay taxes right? so how do they actually contribute to our economy when they send a large % of their monies back to their home land, while using services that are paid for by our taxes? services such as police, firemen, hospital, food stamps and probably another dozen things i can not think of at the moment.

Gayle in MD
05-02-2006, 04:20 AM
It's gonna snow, Steve, another post of yours that I agree with, lol. I think our unemployed citizens should have a march, holding up the flag in one hand, and the industry in which they want work, at the former pre-illegal wage, such as "Meat Packing" "Landscaping"...I'm really disgusted with the "Jobs Americans won't do" BS being repeated over and over. It's time for citizens in our country who want the law to come first to show up!

Gayle....

pooltchr
05-02-2006, 04:54 AM
nAz
Why do you think it's an extreme comparison? In both cases we have people breaking the law, and then protesting that the law should be changed to suit them.

Can you name any other country in the world where people who are in the country illegally could go out in public and protest the laws they broke to be there, and not be immediately arrested and deported?
Steve

Vagabond
05-02-2006, 05:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr> My man has been pretty much on the mark on this issue over the last few years. amazing that no one really paid attention till the last month or so but even MORE amazing no one wants to call the majority of these protesters what they really are illegal immigrants.

Dobbs: Radical groups taking control of immigrant movement

By Lou Dobbs
CNN
Hi nAz,
Dobbs is soft pedalling.
They are not immigrants.They are criminals.All these processions are congregation of criminals.That is nothing to do with the racism.how can u call it a racism? latinos are CAUCASIANS.One can go to library and read ANTHROPOLOGY books and learn about the races.Where is the racism here.if one wants to talk about racism one has to talk about a cop pulling a black kid for broken tail lamp and beating him up or some times even killing him under the pretest of resisting arrest.






<hr /></blockquote>

Gayle in MD
05-02-2006, 05:26 AM
The ONLY contribution they make is in sales tax, which falls way short of what they cost us in declining wages for the blue collar, and agricultural and restraurant/food industries, not to mention their mooching in on emergency room visits, and other social services. Personally, I think they have tremendous nerve to be demanding ANYTHING! It should shine the light of irresponsibility right on our representatives for ignorring the problem for so long. Our policy should be to send them back, seek them out over a period of time, and send them back. We know what industries they work in. We need hefty fines for the employers, and adherence to our laws by ILLEGAL ALIENS! That is what they are, law breakers, period.

Gayle

Gayle in MD
05-02-2006, 06:09 AM
Hi,
Whenever I watch Lou, he is very careful to always refer to them as illegal aliens, I think that's what Naz probably meant to write. In fact, he often stops those he is interviewing to correct them on their use of the word, immigrant Lou Dobbs doesn't soft pedal, really, and he's the champion of the middle class people in this country. He is also the most outspoken critic of the exporting of American Jobs, a subject which he has also been way ahead of others on, in terms of getting the true information out to the public of how damaging, and what future consequences we will face, due to our loss of industry, jobs, the trade deficits, and why we have them, etc.

Gayle in Md.

9 Ball Girl
05-02-2006, 06:48 AM
I think the point that people are missing is this:

This movement is already a backlash--against decades of anti-immigrant, scapegoating and hysteria in Washington. Congress ignores this cry for recognition at our country's peril.

nAz
05-02-2006, 08:38 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr> nAz
Why do you think it's an extreme comparison? In both cases we have people breaking the law, and then protesting that the law should be changed to suit them.

I know it's breaking the Law But to compare driving Drunk and possibly killing a person by doing so is a bit more then crossing a sovereign nations boarder illegally and demanding rights and recognition.

Can you name any other country in the world where people who are in the country illegally could go out in public and protest the laws they broke to be there, and not be immediately arrested and deported?


Steve <hr /></blockquote>

DUH of course I can't, well maybe France.

nAz
05-02-2006, 08:44 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vagabond:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr> My man has been pretty much on the mark on this issue over the last few years. amazing that no one really paid attention till the last month or so but even MORE amazing no one wants to call the majority of these protesters what they really are illegal immigrants.

Dobbs: Radical groups taking control of immigrant movement

By Lou Dobbs
CNN
Hi nAz,
Dobbs is soft pedalling.
They are not immigrants.They are criminals.All these processions are congregation of criminals.That is nothing to do with the racism.how can u call it a racism? latinos are CAUCASIANS.One can go to library and read ANTHROPOLOGY books and learn about the races.Where is the racism here.if one wants to talk about racism one has to talk about a cop pulling a black kid for broken tail lamp and beating him up or some times even killing him under the pretest of resisting arrest.
<hr /></blockquote> <hr /></blockquote>

I'm sure there is some racism but it is totally wrong and should be kept out of the Illegal alien problem, all it will do is make things worse and harder on our government to implement real change.
As for me I may joke about the Mexicans and other Immigrants but it is only to harass Wendy, I know how much it annoys her. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

nAz
05-02-2006, 08:50 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 9 Ball Girl:</font><hr> I think the point that people are missing is this:

This movement is already a backlash--against decades of anti-immigrant, scapegoating and hysteria in Washington. Congress ignores this cry for recognition at our country's peril. <hr /></blockquote>

What would happen to this country if say 70% of Illegals were deported immediately, and what would happen to this country if we used any freed up resources to help the poor Americans in our country?

Wendy i do not see it as scapegoating... the only Scapegoating i see is on the part of the Governments of the countries were the Illegal immigrants out coming from.

wolfdancer
05-02-2006, 09:47 AM
I'd have to disagree with you about Harry Bridges being a true Communist.....he did, as many labor unions did, enlist the help of the communists....to me, Harry Bridges is a hero of the labor union movement. I may be a little biased having lived in SF,worked on the docks for awhile,on the great lakes,and am a former member of the M.E.B.A.

9 Ball Girl
05-02-2006, 09:53 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr> As for me I may joke about the Mexicans and other Immigrants but it is only to harass Wendy, I know how much it annoys her. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif<hr /></blockquote>You joke. Others on here show their true ignorant colors and don't joke.

9 Ball Girl
05-02-2006, 10:47 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr>What would happen to this country if say 70% of Illegals were deported immediately<hr /></blockquote>Then maybe 70% of lazy Americans would get up off their a$$es and fill in the now vacant jobs. Perhaps if we stopped hiring "illegal immigrants" for cheap labor, they just might stop coming over. Maybe if we stopped buying video games and dvd's our own kids might get off the couch and mow the lawn instead of us paying some "illegal immigrant" to do it. God forbid we may have to pick our own strawberries every May - July.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr>and what would happen to this country if we used any freed up resources to help the poor Americans in our country?<hr /></blockquote>I'm always for helping out our own here in this country. And a good place to start, and you know this, is by perhaps spending some of the $$$ being put into a senseless war overseas and maybe put the $$$ into its own country.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr>Wendy i do not see it as scapegoating... the only Scapegoating i see is on the part of the Governments of the countries were the Illegal immigrants out coming from. <hr /></blockquote>I hear ya but I have to ask, do we not have to bare some responsibility for being cheap ass Americans who want something for next to nothing?

JPB
05-02-2006, 10:53 AM
a while back I predicted (not here, but in conversations) that immigration was going to be a big issue. I also predicted the people who would be hurt the worst are people just trying to come make a living. Businesses that employ illegals probably won't get hurt too bad. And of course we will still have a porous border that allows the Hezbollah guys to come here, which they have done and there has been some press about recently. Somehow we need a system that allows a reasonably free flow of people across the border to work and live here legally. We need a very strong security presense at the border. Not to get some people who want to earn a living, but to stop the real threat to our nation. We also have a huge drug market here. That means that there is a very large financial incentive to have an efficient smuggling operation. One that can be used for worse things than drugs. Our policy in this regard also makes it so that condions in Mexico are worse and there is more incentive to come here illegally.

So how come any Saudi can get a visa by paying money to a travel agent, and Mexicans who want to work can't easily get a work permit? (at least pre 9/11, I hope things have tightened up since but i am not sure) It is because the State Department has a hands off approach with Saudi Arabia because of oil and will not enforce existing law. So the 9/11 hijackers can come here and some dude who just wants to work his ass off to feed a family can't.

True immigration reform would be nice. My guess is that whatever comes out of this whole mess will be either the same as the status quo or worse. Likely worse. We have a basically irrational government now.

Drop1
05-02-2006, 08:11 PM
Did you know his secretary Dorthy Healy,she was the head of the Communist Party in Los Angeles. I knew her,and had many conversations about the politics of Harry Bridges,and I think you might be on to something in the distinction between a good Communist,and a bad Communist. I lived on the corner of Post,and Taylor,and on Russian Hill,and the St.Charles Hotel,right at the mouth of the Stockton Tunnel.Once in awhile,if I was sober,I would get work on the docks. Well that was another time,and a different life.What I say about Harry Bridges is he was a noble man,and we won't see the likes of him for some time. To paraphrase Shakespear "How stale flat and weary seem the leaders of this world to me"

nAz
05-03-2006, 12:53 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 9 Ball Girl:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr> As for me I may joke about the Mexicans and other Immigrants but it is only to harass Wendy, I know how much it annoys her. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif<hr /></blockquote>You joke. Others on here show their true ignorant colors and don't joke. <hr /></blockquote>

what are you talking about? i missed it, who ,when where?


Anyway I think this one of the reasons ROME fell the BARBARIAN INVASION
/ccboard/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Qtec
05-03-2006, 01:25 AM
Wendy, the immigration issue is being used by the Govt for one purpose only and just reading the posts here shows that their plan is working.
68% of Americans disaprove of the job Bush is doing. If an election was held tommorow, the Reps would lose-thats why they want to divide the 68% and immigration is an easy way to do it. The other themes that they also use for the same purpose are abortion and gays.
GW knows their is no chance for amnesty for illegal immigrants because in the average Rep voter's mind, that would be just 'appeasing' the 'criminals' and would just encourage other 'criminals' to also enter the US illegaly.



Q

Gayle in MD
05-03-2006, 03:37 AM
Q, good description of republican campaign tactics, divide and conquer, and the division becomes even more damaging when we have a man at the top, with no leadership ability.

I think reducing the problem down to the lowest common demonimator would suggest that laws, must be enforced, regardless, and any society which would have to absorb a huge influx of uneducated, illegal aliens would be left with all kinds of human rights issues, economic issues, discrimination issues, etc. Abiding by our laws, is what makes us a civilized society, unfortunately, there has been a tremendous assault on many of our laws for the last five years.

Gayle in Md.

9 Ball Girl
05-03-2006, 07:14 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote nAz:</font><hr>what are you talking about? i missed it, who ,when where?<hr /></blockquote>Oh stop it. We talked about it on the phone and you agreed with me. /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif