View Full Version : 128 tournament chart

Harold Acosta

07-18-2006, 02:27 PM

Anyone with an old 128 tournament chart in pdf format?

I'm searching for the chart that was used before they came up with listing all 128 players in numerical order.

Dave was always of great help but he is no longer with us and his website is no longer working.

All I need is the numbering sequence or email to acostaharold@hotmail.com

SPetty

07-18-2006, 02:44 PM

Harold, I think Dave's went only to 64. Please check your email...

Terry

07-18-2006, 02:53 PM

Hi Harold, Try this.http://www.playpool.com/anonftp/pub/tournament_charts/playpool128de.pdf

wolfdancer

07-18-2006, 03:48 PM

Harold, check this out....I haven't tried it though

web page (http://www.8ball.org/tournament_charts.htm)

Bob_Jewett

07-18-2006, 04:23 PM

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Harold Acosta:</font><hr> Anyone with an old 128 tournament chart in pdf format?

I'm searching for the chart that was used before they came up with listing all 128 players in numerical order.... <hr /></blockquote>

Hi Harold,

Do you mean a chart with the numbers that will get the byes in the right order? It looks like none of the suggested charts does that. Here is the pairing order that will get the byes in the right places if they are put in the highest spots.

(For those not familiar with the problem of where to put the byes in an elimination chart (or where to put the seeds), see the article at http://www.sfbilliards.com/articles/2001-12.pdf )

1 128

64 65

33 96

32 97

17 112

48 81

49 80

16 113

9 120

56 73

41 88

24 105

25 104

40 89

57 72

8 121

5 124

60 69

37 92

28 101

21 108

44 85

53 76

12 117

13 116

52 77

45 84

20 109

29 100

36 93

61 68

4 125

3 126

62 67

35 94

30 99

19 110

46 83

51 78

14 115

11 118

54 75

43 86

22 107

27 102

38 91

59 70

6 123

7 122

58 71

39 90

26 103

23 106

42 87

55 74

10 119

15 114

50 79

47 82

18 111

31 98

34 95

63 66

2 127

Harold Acosta

07-18-2006, 05:24 PM

Thanks SPetty, I got that one precisely from Dave.

Harold Acosta

07-18-2006, 05:28 PM

Thanks but everyone seems to have the new format. This is not the one I'm looking for. Again thanks for your effort.

Harold Acosta

07-18-2006, 05:30 PM

Thanks for your response.....but this is not the one......

Harold Acosta

07-18-2006, 05:51 PM

Thanks Bob:

I was under the impression that all manual flow charts had all the odd numbers in top brackets, with the even numbers at the bottom brackets. This is true with brackets for 16, 32 and 64 players.

For 128, I had figured it would be one odd bracket, followed by one even bracket, another odd bracket with a final even bracket. Don't ask me where I got this idea, I just thought it was that way....

Was it ever like I'm saying?

On a 64 player bracket it goes like this

1-33, 17-49, 9-41, 25-57...

2-34, 18-50, 10-42, 26-58...

So I figured that in a 128 bracket it would have started like this:

1-65

2-66

3-67

4-68

5-69

6-70

7-71

but I didn't know how to spread these numbers out....

I had found the spread-out (BD Archives) you posted here but did not seem right and I found your article in the internet, but was a little puzzled by it.

Anyway, I will try this spread-out to see what happens...but can you shed some more light on how these numbers and the order came about?.....

I'll have to put them in this order, right?

1 with 128

64 with 65

33 with 96

32 with 97

17 with 112......

Bob_Jewett

07-19-2006, 10:23 AM

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Harold Acosta:</font><hr> ... Anyway, I will try this spread-out to see what happens...but can you shed some more light on how these numbers and the order came about?.....

I'll have to put them in this order, right?

1 with 128

64 with 65

33 with 96

32 with 97

17 with 112......

<hr /></blockquote>

Yes. This is the standard seeding order. Every match sums to 129, which is one more than the number of players. Further, if you remove all players above 64, the remaining matches will add to 65, one more than the number of players. Also, if byes go into the highest numbers, they will be evenly spread on the chart.

There are several ways to generate such a list of numbers. The way I do it is to start from the chart given in the Billiards Digest article and simply pair each number with a higher number that will give the right sum. There is a best way to arrange the resulting pairs so that the top seeds are on the outsides of the branches of the "tree."

If you need a 64-player list, just take the 128 list and cross off the largest 64 numbers. And so on for smaller charts. Always remove exactly half of the entries when making the chart smaller, and double when making the chart larger.

Snapshot9

07-20-2006, 10:22 AM

Just a little trivia - But isn't it interesting to note that tournament brackets are based along the same lines as computers are based on, 8 bits make 1 byte, so if you know binary code and numbers, it correlates to the numbers used in tournament charts ...

Now, what was the largest all the way double elimination tournament ever held? and where?

Bob_Jewett

07-20-2006, 11:25 AM

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Snapshot9:</font><hr> ... Now, what was the largest all the way double elimination tournament ever held? and where? <hr /></blockquote>

I know a 128-player DE chart was used in the SF Open in 1980. The Richie Florence events in Lake Tahoe might have had 200+ players, but I vaguely recall that they were split onto two charts.

Large charts get hard to use. I think a better solution is to work in smaller groups in the early rounds, such as the round-robin format of the WPC and the IPT.

pooltchr

07-20-2006, 11:40 AM

I played in a Viking national championship event in Lexington KY a few years ago that had over 220 players if I recall correctly.

Steve

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