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View Full Version : To play or not to play



killerstroke
08-29-2007, 10:45 AM
I am not a fan of leagues that count your makes, misses, safes etc. I believe there is a reason for everything and if you are a good player, the safes and makes will only hurt your rank, of coarse. I can not play as a sandbagger so I would never throw a game or miss on pupose knowing my opponent won't have a shot to save my ranking. I don't even like that a player can shoot a shot that is an obvious safe but call a pocket and it is recorded as a miss. That IMO is sandbagging and I hate it. With that being said, I have been invited to play on a team in a TAP league. They will pay all my dues and membership fees. They said I could just be table captain, wanting my advice. Has anyone ever been torn between playing or not and what did you do, and how did it work out for you.

Vapros
08-29-2007, 11:49 AM
I'm fairly sure that any handicapped competition is going to have sandbaggers, or at least someone's suspicion of it. It's built in. People don't play their 'average' game every time out. Your decision will be whether or not you can enjoy the action anyway. Looks to me like the pool teams spend a lot more time watching each other than playing. That turns me off. When I go to the pool room, I want to play - or maybe watch the good guys get it on.

okinawa77
08-29-2007, 11:22 PM
Killerstroke,

Nice name.

If I could get enough action on my own, then I really would need to be in a league. I can usually enter a pool room and find a person to play, but most times...I cannot. They are either already playing with someone, or practicing alone and don't want to be bothered.

I like to shoot by myself sometimes, but it gets boring... fast. I play league to get opportunities to play players that would not play against me otherwise.

Currently, I am an SL7 in APA 8-ball. And the only challenges I face are other SL7's and sandbaggers. I don't mind playing against sandbaggers. I see it as a challenge. If they decide to try and beat me or lay down, it doesn't matter to me.....I will still bring my A game, either way.

I played in Tri-Annuals, and the opposing team put me against an SL2 that shot like and SL4. I still stomped on him...and I enjoyed the victory because he was really trying to beat me. It was a 2 to 7 race, and I beat him 7 to zero. It's a match I will covet, and I wouldn't have created the memory had I not joined the league.

It is frustrating dealing with sandbaggers from a team captain's point of view. My only advice to my players, is to play your best and have fun.

Cydpkt
08-30-2007, 09:17 PM
What gets me is "most" players aren't good enough to sandbag. Isn't it ok for someone to have one of those nights where everything seems to fall and when they miss they leave the opponent safe? I have had a player who shot great one night and couldn't hit the rail the next. I myself have had nights where I have shot several levels above myself. (they don't happen often enough, but they are getting more frequent) I see so many people who shark themselves by thinking someone is sandbagging. I think they are finding or giving themselves a reason to loose. I am not saying that it doesn't happen but I don't think it happens as often as one thinks. Just my 2 cents.

SKennedy
08-31-2007, 09:32 AM
I agree. I do not sandbag, but I do have a tendency, as many do, to shoot according to the skill of my opponent. It is due to my inability to maintain good focus all the time, which results in my inconsistency (I think). There have been times when I shoot like a 3 (or lower), and there are times when I look more like a 6 or 7. I have made some great shots when my opponent thinks he has left me without a shot. I get real focused when he smirks after a shot and his teammates all look real smug. At those times I have a lot of incentive, and my skills seem to improve immediately. I do have quite a bit of knowledge about this game, but can't always execute like I should or use to. My inconsistency may look to some like I sandbag, but those within the league who know me know that's not true. Sometimes I'm just that bad, and at other times I'm just shooting well. That is why I am and will always be an "amateur." My problem is maintaining the focus needed to perform well....including at practice.

Jager85
08-31-2007, 10:31 AM
I don't see why you wouldn't play. If there was no counting misses, safes, etc. there would be no feasible way to keep track of handicaps accurately. If all that was counted was the innings and wins/losses, any 7 can play killer safes to increase the innings to that of a 3 or 4. Either play for the sport and have fun, or join ACS.

Jager

SPetty
08-31-2007, 11:55 AM
It sounds like you want to play. So play. Be the guy they're asking for who helps and coaches other players. You'll enjoy it and you'll get a lot out of it.

You don't even have to consider who's winning or who's playing or how to keep score. The advice from the other poster "to play your best and have fun" is the best. If your team captain will abide by that "rule", then you should be fine. I played for several seasons on a handicapped APA team, and that was my captain's advice as well.

You may not win the season or the tournament or win the free trip to Vegas, but that's not why you're playing in this league, right?

wolfdancer
08-31-2007, 12:28 PM
I'm not sure how the league handicaps are figured...but Gene Starry, the founder of the USPPA system, once told me that the system gave equal weight to safeties and a pocketed ball...and that the players that were extending the games to protect their ratings...were just wasting their time.
Bob Jewett, who posts here, runs a great pool academy in SF, is a former NCAA champion, and the author of many fine articles on pool, etc...developed a somewhat "foolproof" handicapping system...the NPL....you win...your rating does up, you lose it goes down...
If you want to spend time and money to enter enough events to get a sandbag rating....and then enter one of the bigger $$ added tournaments, with the intention of "robbing" it...I believe the TD has the right to jack up your rating .....
Bob gave away the system, and it is doing well...but the USPPA system had been long established, and had the twice annual Reno event...as the "pot of gold at the end of the rainbow"...

Rich R.
08-31-2007, 08:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SPetty:</font><hr> It sounds like you want to play. So play. Be the guy they're asking for who helps and coaches other players. You'll enjoy it and you'll get a lot out of it.

You don't even have to consider who's winning or who's playing or how to keep score. The advice from the other poster "to play your best and have fun" is the best. If your team captain will abide by that "rule", then you should be fine. I played for several seasons on a handicapped APA team, and that was my captain's advice as well.

You may not win the season or the tournament or win the free trip to Vegas, but that's not why you're playing in this league, right?
<hr /></blockquote>This is great advise.
I have played in the APA for several years. I have never been asked to dump a match or do anything else to control my skill level. Neither has anyone else on my team. I go every week and play my best, which varies, and I have a great time. My team usually finishes first or second, in our division, but we have never gotten close to winning the trip to Vegas. That is fine with us. We are having fun and that is what league play is suppose to be about. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

killerstroke
09-01-2007, 08:41 AM
If your not having fun it's your own fault! That is my philosophy in life. In pool I take responsibility for my actions, that is for my makes and/or misses and anything I have no control over, so be it. When I shoot the last ball of my life, which I hope is the last day of my life, all my give and takes will be 50/50, therefore I have no reason to get upset for anything. With that being said I want to thanks to all for your responses.
I think I found my problem with playing in this league. I frequent this club and play these players all the time with great success. The nights they have league I am often there and play on an open table they have and get to see the show. It is a real "bar" atmosphere and that may not be serious enough for me. That is why I like the open and handicap tournements that I play.