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Qtec
10-08-2007, 05:08 AM
Read this and loved it!
[ QUOTE ]
Long piece by David Brooks in which he attempts to figure out why the Republican party appears to be in shambles:

[ QUOTE ]
To put it bluntly, over the past several years, the G.O.P. has made ideological choices that offend conservatism’s Burkean roots. This may seem like an airy-fairy thing that does nothing more than provoke a few dissenting columns from William F. Buckley, George F. Will and Andrew Sullivan. But suburban, Midwestern and many business voters are dispositional conservatives more than creedal conservatives. They care about order, prudence and balanced budgets more than transformational leadership and perpetual tax cuts. It is among these groups that G.O.P. support is collapsing.

American conservatism will never be just dispositional conservatism. America is a creedal nation. But American conservatism is only successful when it’s in tension — when the ambition of its creeds is retrained by the caution of its Burkean roots.<hr /></blockquote>

Hogwash. If you want to know why the Republican party is in shambles, read this:

Yesterday, in response to a question from a reporter suspicious of why he wasn’t wearing an American flag pin on his lapel, Barack Obama explained his belief that for some, the pins became a substitute for “true patriotism.” The senator said he would instead “try to tell the American people what I believe will make this country great, and hopefully that will be a testimony to my patriotism.”

I didn’t expect leading conservative voices to understand, but I was a little surprised at the ferocity of the response. Jonah Goldberg described Obama’s perspective as “staggeringly stupid,” and “the single dumbest thing I’ve ever heard of him doing.” Another prominent far-right blogger responded this way:
Seriously, you want this for President of these great United States.This is how he catches the attention of a media aligned with the terror force? This useful tool won’t wear an American flag pin? Talk about pandering to the radical base, he ought to run against Ahmadinejad. He is scoring points with Georgie Soros, won’t be waiting long for his on his Soros stipend, I’m sure. What’s Obama Hussein’s new campaign slogan, “America Sucks!” ?

For starters, people got tired of being associated with these drooling retards. Then, when they realized that these drooling retards had ideological allies running the show in the Bush administration and then began to experience their idiotic policies, they moved from disgusted to outright hostile.

Like me. It had nothing to do with Burke, and everything to do with what the party had become. A bunch of bedwetting, loudmouth, corrupt, hypocritical, and incompetent boobs with a mean streak a mile long and no sense of fair play or proportion.

Seriously- what does the current Republican party stand for? Permanent war, fear, the nanny state, big spending, torture, execution on demand, complete paranoia regarding the media, control over your body, denial of evolution and outright rejection of science, AND ZOMG THEY ARE GONNA MAKE US WEAR BURKHAS, all the while demanding that in order to be a good American I have to spend most of every damned day condemning half my fellow Americans as terrorist appeasers.

And that isn’t even getting into the COMPLETE and TOTAL corruption of our political processes at every level. The [censored] is really going to hit the fan after we vote these jackasses out of power in 2008.

Screw them. I got out. They can have their party. I will vote for Democrats and little L libertarians and isolationists until the crazy people aren’t running the GOP. The threat of higher taxes in the short term isn’t enough to keep me from voting out crazy people and voting for sane people with whom I merely disagree regarding policy. Hillarycare doesn’t scare me as much as Frank Gaffney having a line to the person with the nuclear football or Dobson and company crafting domestic policy.

That is why the Republican party is in shambles. The majority of us have decided that the movers and shakers in the GOP and the blogospheric right are certified lunatics who, in a decent and sane society, we would have in controlled environments in rocking chairs under shade trees for most of the day, wheeled in at night for tapioca pudding and some karaoke.

Filed under: Politics, Republican Stupidity | <hr /></blockquote>

Aint that the truth!

[ written by an ex Republican with a conscience. ]

Al /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif web page (http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=8799#comment-397397)

Deeman3
10-08-2007, 01:39 PM
Q,

In many ways this guys is right. The Republican Party has let us down and we will, inturn, pay for it by having a far left candidate elected in 2008 and, as he said, as bad as the taxes and health care will be, it will be better, in the short term, than watching Republicans do the very same thing the Democrats have been criticised for years for doing.

It will be hell to pay but we all deserve this, especially the Republican party. Our only hope is that as we start giving the rest of the store away and removing all restraints to the terrorists, the Jews can handle Iran until a new world player steps up, hopefully, and take the place of America as the world leader/policeman as we blend into the feckless and corrupt umbrella of the UN. As those who would do us harm are released from all accountability and we become completely politically correct and morally inert, perhaps this guy can lead us and give us some better direction in the future. God knows, there is no leadership beyond political posturing and fund raising in either party now. I hope Obama never has to wear a flag pin for doing so would certainly be un-American and show a petty patriotism that is no longer needed. Bring 'em all home, 150K from Iraq, all from Germany, Italy, France and Asia. This can all be better handled by the UN now.

Israel had better find some new friends pretty quick.

Gayle in MD
10-09-2007, 08:13 AM
Good post, Q.

[ QUOTE ]
The majority of us have decided that the movers and shakers in the GOP and the blogospheric right are certified lunatics who, in a decent and sane society, we would have in controlled environments in rocking chairs under shade trees for most of the day, wheeled in at night for tapioca pudding and some karaoke.
<hr /></blockquote>

[ QUOTE ]
Aint that the truth!
<hr /></blockquote>

In a nut shell! The nutty 28%....;)

Gayle in Md.

SKennedy
10-09-2007, 12:53 PM
Hmmmmm! Let's see now.....rocking chair, tapioca pudding, karaoke? Got room under the shade tree for me?

The key words were "lunatic" and "controlled environments." Those who do not agree with you are labeled lunatics and your way to deal with us is to "control" us. You've got a deal if you include all of the above, send Gayle to visit us twice a week, and make it the shade of a magnolia tree.

SKennedy
10-09-2007, 12:55 PM
One more thing....don't forget the pool table....and Deeman wants 2 sets of the automatic chalkers!

Qtec
10-10-2007, 05:17 AM
America has always supported Human Rights and freedom. A beacon of hope for the many people around the world that are oppressed by their Govts.

What do we have now?
The Govt that can,
Search your house when you are not present.
Tap your phone, read your post and email.
Arrest you and throw you in solitary forever.
Torture you while in captivity.

In the film Apocalyse Now, Marlon B tried to make the point that to win you had to be MORE brutal than the enemy! History shows that this method does not work in the long term.

Q

Gayle in MD
10-10-2007, 07:25 AM
I'd be interested in hearing your definition of "Far Left" Deeman. This post of yours certainly frames everything in extremes. No one is for restraints removed from terrorists, just not for imprisoning innocent people, without habeas corpus. Those who have done us harm, without accountability, are bin Laden, and George Bush et al. Since Republicans frame all things Government as bad and evil, we soon shall have just the appearance of a government, with all the workings of it secret from the voters, as we had throughout the Republican majority. Is that really what you want? The right accuses the left of bashing our country, but the truth is that it is the right which has consistently chipped away at all of our rights, our constitution, and our honor. What can be said about a group of people who seek to dictate to all others according to their own personal value system? What can be said about a party which is fine with killing, illegal occupations, illegal spying, but anything that smacks of assistance, and compassion for it's own victims, to old, the ill, and the children, is labeled socialism. If a program has flaws, then hell, throw the whole damned thing out.

As for Isreal, why should our foreign policy be dictated according to Isreal's problems and grudges? I certainly don't see that country as being in the right many times. And, I don't like the idea that a jewish cabal in this country uses Jewish supported think thanks to dictate our foreign policy.

Our government is broken, thanks to seven years of gross Republican corruption and incompetence, and attacks against American principles of open government, humanitarian efforts, and promises kept. Republicans will curse the day they set about removing everything intended by our founders. Some have already left the party due to its attack on American Principles. Some others, the dictatorial, authoritarian types, who lean toward fascist ideals, and religious persecution, will go out and vote for Guiliani, or McCain, and continue the attack on America, from within.

Gayle in Md.

Deeman3
10-10-2007, 07:25 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> America has always supported Human Rights and freedom. A beacon of hope for the many people around the world that are oppressed by their Govts. <font color="blue"> America still stands for this. I don't see boatlaods of people clamering to get into the other countries, do you?</font color>

What do we have now?
The Govt that can,
Search your house when you are not present. <font color="blue"> Your presense is not required when exercising a serarh warrant, I don't think it ever was. </font color>
Tap your phone, read your post and email. <font color="blue"> The courts have decided they can do this with the proper paperwork approved by a judge. We have always had some sort of wire tapping since phones have been in use. </font color>
Arrest you and throw you in solitary forever.
Torture you while in captivity. <font color="blue"> I don't know where we have arrested American citizens and thrown them in jail forever. We have detained terrorist suspects, who i know to you were innocent victims who just happend to be in a gunfight with American soldiers. We also may have arrested a German Islamic man by mistake but, of course, he was not American. </font color>

In the film Apocalyse Now, Marlon B tried to make the point that to win you had to be MORE brutal than the enemy! History shows that this method does not work in the long term. <font color="blue"> I agrre that you don't have to be more brutal than the enemy, I think that's impossible. </font color>

Q <hr /></blockquote>

Gayle in MD
10-10-2007, 07:27 AM
I think Republicans are the controlling party, not Democrats. There is literally a small library available on the subject, much of it written by former Goldwater Conservatives.

Gayle in Md.

Gayle in MD
10-10-2007, 07:33 AM
I think you are minimizing the awful truth, Deeman. Surely you don't still take the word of this administration on these issues? /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

If it isn't illegal, there's no need to hide it. If it's above board, there's no need for lies about it. If it isn't effective, there's no need to do it in the first place, unless one is simply evil.

I surely hope you don't take Guiliani's lies about what this administration has accomplished using torture, as facts.

Gayle in Md.

Gayle in Md.

wolfdancer
10-10-2007, 01:27 PM
Q, there's nothing wrong with the GOP........
that this next election can't cure!!

Deeman3
10-10-2007, 03:22 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Q, there's nothing wrong with the GOP........
that this next election can't cure!! <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> I have to give you that one. I just hope the cure is not worse than the disease.</font color>

hondo
10-10-2007, 07:10 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Q, there's nothing wrong with the GOP........
that this next election can't cure!! <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> I have to give you that one. I just hope the cure is not worse than the disease.</font color> <hr /></blockquote>

How would that be possible?!?!?!?

pooltchr
10-10-2007, 07:31 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote hondo:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Deeman3:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Q, there's nothing wrong with the GOP........
that this next election can't cure!! <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> I have to give you that one. I just hope the cure is not worse than the disease.</font color> <hr /></blockquote>

How would that be possible?!?!?!? <hr /></blockquote>

Can you hold that thought for a couple of years? You may well have your answer.
Steve

wolfdancer
10-10-2007, 09:57 PM
Have no fear...negotiations are underway as we speak, to resolve the Iraq issue.
web page (http://picasaweb.google.com/yuchre/SecretUSAArabTalksOnIraq?authkey=Idh-dylGX9o)

Qtec
10-11-2007, 10:02 AM
America still stands for these rights but does the Govt?

Search warrant? WHO NEEDS A SEARCH WARRANT?
This is NO proper paperwork.!! They can now tap Obama because they think his sixth cousin's, school friend's uncle, AlQ etc, etc.

It,s a FACT that only 7% of Gitmo inmates are terrorists! Most were handed to the US FOR MONEY by unscrupulous people. Its a fact that many innocent people have died in US custody, at least 40 died under torture.

I don't blame the soldiers but I blame the Govt. They gave up their morals for political expedience.

Q

eg8r
10-11-2007, 10:09 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle:</font><hr> This post of yours certainly frames everything in extremes. <hr /></blockquote> Then you should be quite comfortable with his post as this is how you frame every single one of your posts.

eg8r

wolfdancer
10-11-2007, 11:51 AM
I think what's really wrong with the GOP, is that they no longer look out for the avg American family, but instead cater to the wealthy. They have always been the party of big business, in the belief that this promotes jobs, and growth.
This worked well in the past. Now however big business is tax sheltered in foreign countries, and jobs are outsourced. They still want to be known as an American company....they just don't want to pay American wages....
So the Republicans have chosen between supporting the American workers struggling to make ends meet, and the super wealthy companies and individuals that are profiting from all this.
The irony is, that the more money these people earn, the more they begrudge the programs that try to keep the less fortunate afloat.....With every company trying to scale down to Wal-Mart wages, limiting hours, so that benefits do not have to be paid....is it any wonder we have the most people in prison of any country?
Have the Republicans even mentioned the growing numbers of bankruptcies and foreclosures...or are they still bragging about the job growth?...p/t jobs, at low wages....

Gayle in MD
10-11-2007, 12:17 PM
Exactly. If Americans really gave a good damn about this country, they'd know these things. There is no shortage of apathy here, that's for sure.

Gayle in Md.

Bobbyrx
10-11-2007, 01:40 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr>

It,s a FACT that only 7% of Gitmo inmates are terrorists! Most were handed to the US FOR MONEY by unscrupulous people. Its a fact that many innocent people have died in US custody, at least 40 died under torture.
Q

<hr /></blockquote> <font color="red">
I guess the other 93% are "freedom fighters". Please provide sources for these facts. I want so to believe them...

SKennedy
10-11-2007, 01:56 PM
If we disagree we are apathetic? Gayle, you do think very highly of yourself.
Deeman and I commented on our arrogance, but at least we recognize it for what it is.

LWW
10-11-2007, 04:53 PM
The GOP once it assumed power made the fatal decision that they were going to try to get the DNC to "like them" by including them in more than the DNC had done when the GOP was in the minority.

Well, the GOP quickly became the SOS (Same Old Shiite) with a few less scandals.

Now we de facto have a 2 winged 1 party gubmint.

In short, what's wrong is that they were wimps who were afraid to wield power when they had it.

LWW

LWW
10-11-2007, 04:58 PM
[ QUOTE ]
What’s Obama Hussein’s new campaign slogan, “America Sucks!” ?<hr /></blockquote>
That is the official mantra iof a large section of the DNC base and it seems to be growing over time.

LWW

bamadog
10-11-2007, 11:46 PM
Where do you think the jobs come from?
Have you ever been hired by a poor person?
If you want a better job get a better skill-set.

LWW
10-12-2007, 04:30 AM
Smell the coffee bro, as Hillary snuggles up against Hsu and the ChiComs.

The neolibs will dance with joy as the rest of the nation's security is sold out.

We now have China as a world power capable of shooting US sats and hitting us with accurate ICBM's.

They are rapidly dispersing this technology to their client states in NK, Syria, Iran, just as they did in Iraq. Yes, I know you neolibs get all atwitter when actual evidence of what was found in Eye-rack comes up, but it's the truth and needs to be said.

Now, how did China pull this off? Years of research? Heck no. They bought it from LORAL Corp. Wouldn't that be illegal? Of course, unless the POTUS signs off on it.

Well, why would they do that? Simple. LORAL and Trie (On behalf of the ChiComs and before he fled...smarter than Hsu I guess.) dumped buckets of money into the 1996 Clinton camaign.

The neolibs danced with joy...we traded national security for 4 more years.

Now that the chickens have came home to roost who do the neolibs blame? Bush, of course. What do they want to fix it? Another term of hillbilly hijinx of course, but in their defense the DNC has programed the bots to say this and independent thought is beyond most of them. Sad.

LWW

hondo
10-12-2007, 05:45 AM
Meanwhile, Bush borrows billions from China to
finance his dirty little war. It's time we ALL
woke up &amp; smelled the roses. Right, Dubya?

LWW
10-12-2007, 06:43 AM
And the typical Hondo deflection.

I've criticized Bush often for spending. But, you knew that.

LWW

hondo
10-12-2007, 07:40 AM
If you think I'm going to argue politics over here when I quit on AZ! And, furthermore... /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

DickLeonard
10-12-2007, 07:51 AM
Gayle I am not going to throw them a life preserver let them go down with the Titanic. I am a Democratic Consultant following Karl Rove tactics. And it works, when used against them they cry foul,Strange.####

LWW
10-12-2007, 07:58 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Gayle I am not going to throw them a life preserver let them go down with the Titanic. I am a Democratic Consultant following Karl Rove tactics. And it works, when used against them they cry foul,Strange.#### <hr /></blockquote>
Share your brilliance with me oh great DNC swami...what Rovian tactics have you used and how have they worked?

LWW

DickLeonard
10-12-2007, 08:01 AM
Hondo until they get a least a thousand posts they will have to be just a Voice crying out in the Wilderness.####

LWW
10-12-2007, 08:10 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Hondo until they get a least a thousand posts they will have to be just a Voice crying out in the Wilderness.#### <hr /></blockquote>
In other words you have no actual examples, but you hoped it would sound good to your buddies.

Interesting.

LWW

wolfdancer
10-12-2007, 08:17 AM
Dick, I have to agree with you there. Coming over here,and trying to be immediately confrontational is a mistake. At first one should try to get people interested in what they have to say, maybe even to care. But starting off with a blitzkrieg attack.....who wants to read just more rants and raves? Look how long it took Ed to become a board certified *****, and they want to do it in just a few posts.
So, I'm going to take your advice, and wait till their post count hits 1000 before I begin reading them.
Thanks for the time saving tip.

LWW
10-12-2007, 09:17 AM
Spoken as only an ostrich could.

So, if you don't like reality you just click your heels and say "BLAME BUSH-BLAME BUSH-BLAME BUSH" and hope it all goes away.

Pathetic.

HONDO!

You told me the democrats/liberals/progressives, or whatever they are calling themself this week were so much more up on things and so much smarter than the likes of hippie fool and busby spew over here.

Where are they?

I've asked serious questions in serious threads, and with far less sarcasm than I see the left use here, and I can't find ANYONE who will come and defend their supposed principles?

Why do you suppose that is?

LWW

SKennedy
10-12-2007, 09:21 AM
To be honest, this conservative finds it a little offensive that a few from another web site feel compelled to "save the day" for conservatism with the indication that some of us were failing. Don't confuse failure with the fact that we have learned that argueing is a waste of time. My only goal is to read these posts for a few laughs, and answer some of them in a light-hearted way, and get a jab or 2 in on Gayle from time to time as she is the most angry and serious one on here. (Thanks Gayle for being a catalyst and making things fun.)

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 10:01 AM
[ QUOTE ]
If we disagree we are apathetic? <font color="red">This question requires specificity. </font color> Gayle, you do think very highly of yourself. <font color="red">Yes, and of all other living beings, including animals, plants, trees, the earth, and and all things which we are responsible to respect. </font color>
Deeman and I commented on our arrogance, but at least we recognize it for what it is. <font color="red">And it is permissible among males, in your view? Arrogance is a function of believing one is supperior to others. I judge viewpoints, and human actions, as we all do, I would never cast homosexuals, for example, as sinners. That's God's job, not mine, and since my God made them, I will love and accept them as they are, without seeking to degrade them in any way, or deny them all the same rights, of others. It's between them, and their own God, whomever She may be. Just as is abortion.

Organized religion is a far cry from my God. However, I don't seek to force my own spiritual interpretations through political maneuverings, and legal interpretations and organized efforts to capture our courts, and use them as a vehicle to force my own religious beliefs, upon others.

Our constitution has provided guidlines, which include our freedoms, equality in our legal system, free speech, open government subject to pupblic scrutiny, checks and balances in order to preserve that right to scrutinize our government, personal privacy, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. This administration has sought from the start to infringe on those rights, has broken our laws, and agreements, and has hidden much of their illegal activity. Some, do not care about this. this is very apathetic, IMO, and not the american way.

Our treaties, OTOH, have framed those agreements which seek to prevent avoidable invasions of countries which have not invaded us. to prevent the stealing of their land and resources, the killing of their people, prevention of illegal attacks, and to provide guidlines under which we have agreed to operate in the world, in order to provide the greatest insurance against human persecution, and avoid war and oppression, and provide other protections for mankind, such as, our agreement not to torture prisoners. The apathy of which I speak, is the failure of some to speak out against an administration which has sought from the start, to go around our constitution, our laws, invade our privacy, and condemn certain groups of people from exercising their own rights to life and privacy, liberty and that pursuit of happiness, by using fear, lies, and their personal religious beliefs, as their vehicle. Apathy, is not caring when an administration holds itself above our laws, both National, and International, and uses deciet to achieve such an attack against our Constitution, and international agreements, and against their dissenters.

My gripe with organized religion, is that it uses religious interpretations, by men, as the rule of God, and to justifty the presecution of others, such as blacks, women, Jews, believers in other Gods, and homosexuals, in an effort to gain power over them, the power to demonize them, persecute them and otherwise punish them, for being who they are, and for exercising their right to make personal choices, including freedom of personal decisions, and freedom to interpret and form their own ideals in religious, and other matters, and this, is wrong, IMO, and I will preserve my right to say so, as long as I am living, just as you have the right to slander me for doing so. It is a matter of intention, and a matter, as in all things, of degree.

Gayle in Md.</font color>


<hr /></blockquote>

DickLeonard
10-12-2007, 10:09 AM
Wolfdancer I am still waiting for someone to list what GWB has done right or one person he appointed that was capable of handling the JOB. Still looking for the container with the thirteen billion. Just keep appointing Jesus Freaks.####

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 10:11 AM
Hi Hondo,

There you have it my friend. Bush can lie, in order to kill, and steal, break our lwas, our treaties, torture without review or oversight of his illegal torturing, hide his inhumane actions, his evil deeds against his critics, commit treason, put our country at greater risk through his incompetence, and hidden agendas, fail to protect the Constitution, abide by our laws, and pardon himself in advance, but the right is quite apathetic over all those attacks against America, all except for their outrage over their precious money!

They are such idealists! Such salt of the earth, humanitarian Christians./ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 10:12 AM
It isn't!

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 10:19 AM
My dear friend, as I have stated, and after years of watching them minimize gross incompetence, and lies, by Bush, all they have left is slandering those who stand for America, and our troops, against the financial interests of Bush, Cheney, and their corporate fascist friends.

When bin Laden hits Washington D.C., I hope it falls right on the American Enterprise Institute. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif Not on innocent Americans, who didn't vote Republican. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

DickLeonard
10-12-2007, 10:22 AM
Gayle are you saying that the Constitution applies to Homosexuals too. That is perverse thinking. We read a different Constitution than the right wing. Ours begins We the People theirs begins We the Corporations. I think you gave SKenneedy something to reply to. ####

bamadog
10-12-2007, 10:25 AM
Justice Roberts
Justice Alito
General Petraeus
No attacks on American soil since 2001
Freed over 50 million people from savage dictators

How's that for a start?

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 10:27 AM
LMAO, and the 5,000 missing e-mails, /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I'm going to invest in those crayons. I still believe that this nation, will rise up against the fascist movement, with the cross, and demand they prove they can follow the dots on McDonalds childrens menu, /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gifuntil they can see the real picture! /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Love,
Gayle, You're right dick, they can dish it out, but they can't take it. Cowards never can.

LWW
10-12-2007, 10:48 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Dick, I have to agree with you there. Coming over here,and trying to be immediately confrontational is a mistake. At first one should try to get people interested in what they have to say, maybe even to care. But starting off with a blitzkrieg attack.....who wants to read just more rants and raves? Look how long it took Ed to become a board certified *****, and they want to do it in just a few posts.
So, I'm going to take your advice, and wait till their post count hits 1000 before I begin reading them.
Thanks for the time saving tip. <hr /></blockquote>
I am so sorry that I burst your balloon sweetheart.

LWW

LWW
10-12-2007, 10:49 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SKennedy:</font><hr> To be honest, this conservative finds it a little offensive that a few from another web site feel compelled to "save the day" for conservatism with the indication that some of us were failing.<hr /></blockquote>
If you really want to know, Hondo has been using innuendo to challenge me to come here for some time and witness the enlightened neolibs who would straighten me out.

We must be on opposite schedules.

LWW

LWW
10-12-2007, 10:52 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Wolfdancer I am still waiting for someone to list what GWB has done right or one person he appointed that was capable of handling the JOB. Still looking for the container with the thirteen billion. Just keep appointing Jesus Freaks.#### <hr /></blockquote>
1-Lower taxes.
2-Take out Saddam.
3-Take out the Taliban.
4-Samuel Alito.
5-Condi Rice.

Any more questions?

LWW

LWW
10-12-2007, 10:54 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> My dear friend, as I have stated, and after years of watching them minimize gross incompetence, and lies, by Bush, all they have left is slandering those who stand for America, and our troops<hr /></blockquote>
And, who would these people be?

LWW

hondo
10-12-2007, 11:10 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> Dick, I have to agree with you there. Coming over here,and trying to be immediately confrontational is a mistake. At first one should try to get people interested in what they have to say, maybe even to care. But starting off with a blitzkrieg attack.....who wants to read just more rants and raves? Look how long it took Ed to become a board certified *****, and they want to do it in just a few posts.
So, I'm going to take your advice, and wait till their post count hits 1000 before I begin reading them.
Thanks for the time saving tip. <hr /></blockquote>

Ed is board certified??!!??

hondo
10-12-2007, 11:14 AM
Dear LWW, perhaps because we're more civilised over
here??? They put up with Eg because he's board certified.
Try a gentler approach.
After all, everybody on the left quit responding to
you guys on AZ. What does that tell you?

wolfdancer
10-12-2007, 11:35 AM
Dick, they also get the Pledge of Allegiance a little twisted
"...and to the Republicans, for which it stands..."

Gayle in MD
10-12-2007, 11:40 AM
Dick,
He won't respond, I'm sure. Part of their game. They embrace Rovarian tactics in debates. Here are a few examples.

1. Expand a little joke into a discriminatory attack against southerners, christians, and neocons, then deny the statistics.

Example: They have never watched Paula Dean's grease filled recipes.

2. Do not respond to documentation from our own government, and further, deny it completely.

Examples; The GAO documentation that Patreaus is cherry coating the glowing reports of progress in Iraq.

The Talliban has expanded, and original efforts in Afghanistan have failed due to the Bush's rush to war in Iraq.

We are more at risk due to Bush's policies.

Bush's policies have provided a recruiting mechanism for al Qaeda.

Bush's policies have spread terrorist attacks all over the world.

Terrorists attack after years of planning, not because of who our president is.

When Republicans are in office, the rich get richer, and the poor and middle class lose economic power, and suffer lower wages.

Bush has borrowed more money than all former presidents combined over the history of this country.

Iraqis say that they have not been liberated, by Bush, but have been occupied by infidels.

Saudi Arabia, and Isreal, are not on our side in many instances, and Saudi Arabia has supported terrorists.

The U.A.E. supported terrorists, and are still involved in our port operations.

Bush has broken our Army.

No president has ever cut taxes during war time, and increased spending by failing to veto unlimited spending by his own party.

National Security Estimates state that bin Laden is still our greatest threat.

All documentation is denied by neocons if it proves gross failures and incompetence of this administration. All books by Statesmen, Respected Military, and foreign policy experts, are relegated to just some boob trying to sell a book.

All those Americans who attack George Bush's failed policies, lies, and lawbreaking illegal activities, are conceited bigots, who support terrorists.


Bush has expanded the threat of a greater proliferation of nukes.

Bush lied about WMD in Iraq, and connections to 9/11.

Dick,
You know the old saying about getting down in the mud in a pig fight. We patriotic liberals will have to rise above their tactics. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif

wolfdancer
10-12-2007, 12:09 PM
Gayle, I agree with everything that you wrote....and can see that others might disagree.
The adult way to discuss that would be to go over it, point by point....the way Ed would do that is to insult you...and now we have a whole new bunch of Ed clowns...er, clones.
I think I'll just absent myself until they move on over to the next unlucky site

Deeman3
10-12-2007, 12:57 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> I think I'll just absent myself until they move on over to the next unlucky site <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> Same here. Do you think they would take Ed and Gayle with them as a package deal? </font color>

wolfdancer
10-12-2007, 01:31 PM
/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

LWW
10-12-2007, 01:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> Dick,
He won't respond, I'm sure. Part of their game. They embrace Rovarian tactics in debates. Here are a few examples. <font color="blue">Who won't respond to what? I've got a few threads started with numerous questions you have all ran away from?</font color>

1. Expand a little joke into a discriminatory attack against southerners, christians, and neocons, then deny the statistics.

Example: They have never watched Paula Dean's grease filled recipes. <font color="blue">Who is Paula Dean? </font color>

2. Do not respond to documentation from our own government, and further, deny it completely.

Examples; The GAO documentation that Patreaus is cherry coating the glowing reports of progress in Iraq. <font color="blue"> Example? </font color>

The Talliban has expanded, and original efforts in Afghanistan have failed due to the Bush's rush to war in Iraq. <font color="blue">Agreed, except that you ignore the real problem. From 1991 till 2001 the US military was cut to a mere shell of itself. During that we had a hillbilly POTUS firing off cruise missiles like a drunken sailor in a gunstore every time a new scandal broke...all the while ignoring completely WTC attack #1 and other attacks. Then we get into a 2 front war because of 3,000 dead Americans. You go to war with the army you have dear. But, do you blame the peeps who left the nation naked and exposed...and then ran out with the evidence hidden in Sandy Burglar's socks? Apparently not. That would require you to have a clue as to what happened.</font color>

We are more at risk due to Bush's policies. <font color="blue">eVIDENCE? </font color>

Bush's policies have provided a recruiting mechanism for al Qaeda. <font color="blue"> That is ridiculous. </font color>

Bush's policies have spread terrorist attacks all over the world. <font color="blue">Good. It's not here. That's the objective of national defense. D'UH!</font color>

Terrorists attack after years of planning, not because of who our president is. <font color="blue"> That I agree with, but the POTUS sets policy for how aggressively they are pursued.</font color>

When Republicans are in office, the rich get richer, and the poor and middle class lose economic power, and suffer lower wages. <font color="blue"> Evidence? </font color>

Bush has borrowed more money than all former presidents combined over the history of this country. <font color="blue"> A verifiable point and one I am at HUGE odds with the admin over. </font color>

Iraqis say that they have not been liberated, by Bush, but have been occupied by infidels. <font color="blue">Really? Some probably do. The Kurds seem to be doing quite well. </font color>

Saudi Arabia, and Isreal, are not on our side in many instances, and Saudi Arabia has supported terrorists. <font color="blue"> Agreed. And, so what. Our aim is to defend the USA. As to the Saudis, all recent presidents have snuggled up with them and I think they are mostly dirtbags. </font color>

The U.A.E. supported terrorists, and are still involved in our port operations. <font color="blue"> The port deal was stupid.</font color>

Bush has broken our Army. <font color="blue"> Not even close. The war is over by midnight if we wanted it to be.</font color>

No president has ever cut taxes during war time, and increased spending by failing to veto unlimited spending by his own party. <font color="blue"> Neither did this one. Your point? </font color>

National Security Estimates state that bin Laden is still our greatest threat. <font color="blue"> I agree. I would have sent in a division with flamethrowers into Tora Bora. </font color>

All documentation is denied by neocons if it proves gross failures and incompetence of this administration. All books by Statesmen, Respected Military, and foreign policy experts, are relegated to just some boob trying to sell a book. <font color="blue"> I've noticed you paint with an extremely broad brush for someone who complains about others not being tolerant. Why is that?</font color>

All those Americans who attack George Bush's failed policies, lies, and lawbreaking illegal activities, are conceited bigots, who support terrorists. <font color="blue">Your words and not mine. </font color>


Bush has expanded the threat of a greater proliferation of nukes. <font color="blue"> PUH-LEEZE! </font color>

Bush lied about WMD in Iraq, and connections to 9/11. <font color="blue"> So, all the way through the Clinton admin when the NYT was trumping up WMD it was actually Bush pulling the strings? Interesting? BTW, have you ever read the authorization for the war in Iraq? If not, or if so for that matter although I suspect you haven't, please tell me what we said we would find that we didn't find? Please. </font color>

Dick,
You know the old saying about getting down in the mud in a pig fight. We patriotic liberals will have to rise above their tactics. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif <font color="blue"> Madame, that is ridiculous. </font color> <hr /></blockquote>

LWW

Wally_in_Cincy
10-12-2007, 02:23 PM
[ QUOTE ]
The Talliban has expanded, and original efforts in Afghanistan have failed due to the Bush's rush to war in Iraq. <font color="blue">Agreed, except that you ignore the real problem. From 1991 till 2001 the US military was cut to a mere shell of itself. <hr /></blockquote>

[ QUOTE ]
Bush has borrowed more money than all former presidents combined over the history of this country. <font color="blue"> A verifiable point and one I am at HUGE odds with the admin over. </font color> <hr /></blockquote>

Don't forget, Clinton balanced the budget mainly by gutting the military. When he and Saint Albert bragged that they had cut the number of federal employees they failed to mention that virtually all of the cuts were military personnel, uniformed and civilian.

SKennedy
10-12-2007, 02:49 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> &lt;/font&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;font class="small"&gt;Quote:&lt;/font&gt;&lt;hr /&gt;
If we disagree we are apathetic? <font color="red">This question requires specificity. </font color>
You said we were apathetic and I'm asking why you made that statement? Was it because we disagree with you? It must have been....And can you be a little more specific than just responding with "specificity?" Does Hillary know this tactic? I'm sure she would like to use it....

Gayle, you do think very highly of yourself. <font color="red">Yes, and of all other living beings, including animals, plants, trees, the earth, and and all things which we are responsible to respect. </font color>
Yes, but you think you are "Queen!"

Deeman and I commented on our arrogance, but at least we recognize it for what it is. <font color="red">And it is permissible among males, in your view? Arrogance is a function of believing one is supperior to others. I judge viewpoints, and human actions, as we all do, I would never cast homosexuals, for example, as sinners. That's God's job, not mine, and since my God made them, I will love and accept them as they are, without seeking to degrade them in any way, or deny them all the same rights, of others. It's between them, and their own God, whomever She may be. Just as is abortion.

How did this get to be about gender issues and abortion? And did I not say I love my neice. I treat her with respect and have not taken away her rights. The bible, which I believe is the word of God (and yes I know in your world that makes me an idiot) says that homosexuality is a sin. Therefore, in my opinion, it is a sin. Did I not also state that I sin also? Open your eyes and brain for a change and digest what we write before you attack with your same old hack phrases over and over again.

Organized religion is a far cry from my God. However, I don't seek to force my own spiritual interpretations through political maneuverings, and legal interpretations and organized efforts to capture our courts, and use them as a vehicle to force my own religious beliefs, upon others.

Our constitution has provided guidlines, which include our freedoms, equality in our legal system, free speech, open government subject to pupblic scrutiny, checks and balances in order to preserve that right to scrutinize our government, personal privacy, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. This administration has sought from the start to infringe on those rights, has broken our laws, and agreements, and has hidden much of their illegal activity. Some, do not care about this. this is very apathetic, IMO, and not the american way.

Our treaties, OTOH, have framed those agreements which seek to prevent avoidable invasions of countries which have not invaded us. to prevent the stealing of their land and resources, the killing of their people, prevention of illegal attacks, and to provide guidlines under which we have agreed to operate in the world, in order to provide the greatest insurance against human persecution, and avoid war and oppression, and provide other protections for mankind, such as, our agreement not to torture prisoners. The apathy of which I speak, is the failure of some to speak out against an administration which has sought from the start, to go around our constitution, our laws, invade our privacy, and condemn certain groups of people from exercising their own rights to life and privacy, liberty and that pursuit of happiness, by using fear, lies, and their personal religious beliefs, as their vehicle. Apathy, is not caring when an administration holds itself above our laws, both National, and International, and uses deciet to achieve such an attack against our Constitution, and international agreements, and against their dissenters.

My gripe with organized religion, is that it uses religious interpretations, by men, as the rule of God, and to justifty the presecution of others, such as blacks, women, Jews, believers in other Gods, and homosexuals, in an effort to gain power over them, the power to demonize them, persecute them and otherwise punish them, for being who they are, and for exercising their right to make personal choices, including freedom of personal decisions, and freedom to interpret and form their own ideals in religious, and other matters, and this, is wrong, IMO, and I will preserve my right to say so, as long as I am living, just as you have the right to slander me for doing so. It is a matter of intention, and a matter, as in all things, of degree.Gayle in Md.</font color>

The problem does not stem from God, or even your so-called organized religions....the problem stems from "Man"...and by that term I mean men, women, whites, blacks, heteros, homos, etc....all of us.


<hr /></blockquote> <hr /></blockquote>

Bobbyrx
10-14-2007, 08:58 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr>

It,s a FACT that only 7% of Gitmo inmates are terrorists! Most were handed to the US FOR MONEY by unscrupulous people. Its a fact that many innocent people have died in US custody, at least 40 died under torture.
Q
<font color="red">
Still waiting for the sources of this "information" <hr /></blockquote>

bamadog
10-14-2007, 10:05 AM
The currency of liberals is "feelings" not "facts".
They feel they are morally righteous, so therefore are justified in either, creating their own facts, or ignoring the real facts.

LWW
10-14-2007, 11:03 AM
Don't forget he never actually balanced a budget. The neoleft facts that they wish they could sneak out in their socks:

1-The national debt rose every year that Clinton was in office...hence the "surplus" was nothing but smoke and mirrors.

2-Clinton spent for "off budget" be "Executive Order" than every other president combined.

3-The only way it ever became close was by mingling pension funds with company/govt funds...and act that will land you in prison as a private citizen.

4-Clintom swore from 1993-1995 that a balanced budget would ruin the economy.

5-It was the new R congress which passed the budgets which made it close...before they became as corrupted as the D's.

LWW