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bignick31985
10-14-2007, 11:00 AM
I dont use a jump cue, I actually use my Players regular sized cue with the Le Pro tip to jump. I have great success jumping with this stick and tip combo, but have recently read about phenolic tips being very hard tips. I figured the harder the tip the easier the jump or break.

Is there alot of truth to that? Or should I just what has worked so far?

1Time
10-14-2007, 03:22 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bignick31985:</font><hr> I dont use a jump cue, I actually use my Players regular sized cue with the Le Pro tip to jump. I have great success jumping with this stick and tip combo, but have recently read about phenolic tips being very hard tips. I figured the harder the tip the easier the jump or break.

Is there alot of truth to that? Or should I just what has worked so far? <hr /></blockquote>


If you have a cue stick and tip working well for your jump shots, then you're set. I read recently on this site that phenolic tips are hard and tend to require more of a center ball hit when jumping. I find that is true with hard tips in general. And so I would never switch to a jump cue that limits me so much in how I hit the cue. Of course if a phenolic tipped cue could pull off some shots that I otherwise could not, it would be a handy second jump cue.

BLACKHEART
10-14-2007, 09:09 PM
Jump Qs have a few similar things, that are unique to jumping. VERY hard tips, THICKER &amp; STIFFER than normal shafts. VERY LIGHT weight. SHORTER than a normal 58" Q. The Q you claim to be "GREAT" at jumping with, has none of these. Either you are jumping the balls in an illegal manor(scooping under the ball) or your story makes little sense. Sorry, but I just don't buy it...JER

SKennedy
10-15-2007, 10:09 AM
I got the scooping thing down pat. Unfortunately, I'm not too good at the jumping thing.

underdog
10-16-2007, 10:32 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 1Time:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote bignick31985:</font><hr> I dont use a jump cue, I actually use my Players regular sized cue with the Le Pro tip to jump. I have great success jumping with this stick and tip combo, but have recently read about phenolic tips being very hard tips. I figured the harder the tip the easier the jump or break.

Is there alot of truth to that? Or should I just what has worked so far? <hr /></blockquote>


If you have a cue stick and tip working well for your jump shots, then you're set. I read recently on this site that phenolic tips are hard and tend to require more of a center ball hit when jumping. I find that is true with hard tips in general. And so I would never switch to a jump cue that limits me so much in how I hit the cue. Of course if a phenolic tipped cue could pull off some shots that I otherwise could not, it would be a handy second jump cue. <hr /></blockquote>


I personally cannot jump with a regular playing cue. If you can jump well with one, you're ahead of the game. I need a jump break with a phenolic tip. Just my 2 cents. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

1Time
10-17-2007, 08:04 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote underdog:</font><hr>I personally cannot jump with a regular playing cue. If you can jump well with one, you're ahead of the game. I need a jump break with a phenolic tip. Just my 2 cents. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif <hr /></blockquote>

underdog,

Do you shoot primarily on bar box tables? And with the phenolic tip, are you able to get any action on the CB when jumping?

Bar box tables usually have cue balls that are heavier than the object balls. 9' tables usually have cue balls that are the same or nearly the same weight as the object balls. I've never used a jump cue and have always found it fairly easy to jump balls on a 9' table and get action on the CB, but much harder to impossible on a bar box. Plus, the balls are more inclined to be closer to each other on a 7' table than a 9', which increases the frequency of needing to jump on a 7' table. And so it seems to me a jump cue would be much more beneficial to those playing on bar boxes.

1hit1der
10-17-2007, 09:48 AM
I used to be able to jump ok with a full length Cuetec and LePro tip. I only say "used to" because I haven't pulled it out in a while, and jumping a full ball was difficult.

Phenolic tips definitely make jumping easier, and they're great for getting more velocity for a break shot. But there are also hard leather tips that work well too. They'll also hold chalk well and give a bit more control than the phenolics. The Scorpion jump cue has a leather tip and the Robin Dodson Frog and Tadpole I think have non-phenolic tips. Tiger also makes a hard leather jump tip.

New equipment and technologies can definitely make the game easier. But believe in your technique and skills first.

poolguy123
10-17-2007, 11:52 AM
I bought a jump cue at a BCA event for $25 with a phenolic tip for a friend low on cash, but wanting a jumper. I tried it out on my table when I got home. Impressively easy to jump over a full ball up close(two ball widths away)- i.e. less force needed than with my Bunjee Jumper! I really liked it. Didn't try any off center shots that would test the thought that the hard tip was hard to impart english with- don't know- seems likely though. If I lost mine, I would buy one of these in a heartbeat.

sygfrid
10-17-2007, 02:51 PM
Actually, if I'm not mistaken, you can make the cb jump with any cue and with any tip. HOWEVER, the height and distance of the jump will of course vary depending on the stiffness of the shaft and the hardness of the tip ASSUMING that you have the right speed and stroke.

As for me, I use my custom play cue with med-hard Triangle tip for jumping IF the distance between the cb &amp; the interfering ball is least 2 balls away (approx 4") and the cb is about 2ft away from the rail (of course it's quite difficult to use the short jump cue if the cb is too far away)

On the other hand, I use my custom jump cue w/ phenolic tip if the distance between the cb and the interfering ball is at least a ball away and if the cb is near the rail (less than 2 ft away) for leverage and stroking reasons

bignick31985
10-19-2007, 02:29 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote BLACKHEART:</font><hr> Jump Qs have a few similar things, that are unique to jumping. VERY hard tips, THICKER &amp; STIFFER than normal shafts. VERY LIGHT weight. SHORTER than a normal 58" Q. The Q you claim to be "GREAT" at jumping with, has none of these. Either you are jumping the balls in an illegal manor(scooping under the ball) or your story makes little sense. Sorry, but I just don't buy it...JER <hr /></blockquote>

Well I am not scooping. Absolutely not. It works for me. I can do it consistently and drop balls. I hit center q ball, down on it. I have NEVER scooped the ball, b/c its an illegal shot.

I am gonna keep the Le Pro on it, since its working as well. Maybe in the future I'll try a different tip.

Thanks for your input fellas!!!

craigstevens
10-19-2007, 05:29 PM
Some tips on tips, the LePro is A pos. One of the worst tips you can use, is it also medium soft, you need hard to jump and to have power in pool. So upgrade to a triangle, which is the same hard as the Moori H. I perfer Tailsman which out performs the Moori. Buy the new Talisman XX, which is leather and will always be legal, and is a hard as the illegal plastic.

Yes you can jump with a regular cue. Earl proved this back in the 80's. Hold the cue with just the index and thumb, hit very low on the cue ball, far below center, nip it. If that does not work, throw the cue into the ball. Turn it loose.

You really need a dedicated jump cue, something about 7oz for it to really work right. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

underdog
10-19-2007, 10:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 1Time:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote underdog:</font><hr>I personally cannot jump with a regular playing cue. If you can jump well with one, you're ahead of the game. I need a jump break with a phenolic tip. Just my 2 cents. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif <hr /></blockquote>

underdog,

Do you shoot primarily on bar box tables? And with the phenolic tip, are you able to get any action on the CB when jumping?

Bar box tables usually have cue balls that are heavier than the object balls. 9' tables usually have cue balls that are the same or nearly the same weight as the object balls. I've never used a jump cue and have always found it fairly easy to jump balls on a 9' table and get action on the CB, but much harder to impossible on a bar box. Plus, the balls are more inclined to be closer to each other on a 7' table than a 9', which increases the frequency of needing to jump on a 7' table. And so it seems to me a jump cue would be much more beneficial to those playing on bar boxes. <hr /></blockquote>
The best I have ever done is jumping and drawing the ball about 3/4 or more the length of the table.

http://CueTable.com/P/?@3FRDB2HAOc1IQhj1PWmr3aRDB3acpv3acpv3acpv1kWmr3kQ Er1kbXS1kKjk@3AdWv2BMlX3CUCb1DGIU3EEMS4FWQt4GJax1H MKH2IWmK1PJGu1TJGu3phth1kJGu2kLOM2qWmdNow,_let%

Somthing like that. I can jump and stop or draw the ball fairly well for my skill level.

1Time
10-20-2007, 03:02 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote underdog:</font><hr>
Somthing like that. I can jump and stop or draw the ball fairly well for my skill level. <hr /></blockquote>

I'd say that's great for any skill level. So now I need a jump cue with a phenolic tip.

bignick31985
10-20-2007, 12:47 PM
I use a Moori Quick for my playing tip, but its getting switched to either a Moori Medium or a Talisman Medium. I'm not sure yet.

Sid_Vicious
10-20-2007, 02:32 PM
"I use a Moori Quick for my playing tip, but its getting switched to either a Moori Medium or a Talisman Medium. I'm not sure yet."


Why? sid

Sid_Vicious
10-20-2007, 02:46 PM
Ok, let's talk jumping. Long sticks can make air, but JCs with phenololic tips can be aimed better, and steered(english-draw-follow). Masse effects are easy. jm2c sid...phenolic on the Lucasi the best, a Stealth with a Chris Cass retrofitted phenolic, and owned a Frog and a James Jumper only to sell both, BUT THE CC RETRO GREATLY IMPROVED THE STEALTH, and sid still has it

bignick31985
10-21-2007, 04:46 PM
With the Quick tip I've miscued using severe bottom english. Even with the tip maintenanced and having good chalk on it. I figured a softer tip (Medium) would suit me a little better.

Sid_Vicious
10-21-2007, 05:51 PM
Most fun in this sport is trying new stuff. I have personally tried about every variation in equipment, and in the end, the problems were simply that my stroke was outta whack. I love the Moori Q, and decided a while back to stick with it and adjust. Basically everything there is to miscues is chalk and stroke mechanics. Timing...it is difficult to define timing, but you know "it" when you "find it." You can play with a rock as a tip if hit properly. jmho sid

1Time
10-21-2007, 09:47 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr>
I have personally tried about every variation in equipment, and in the end, the problems were simply that my stroke was outta whack. <hr /></blockquote>

I have not tried a large variety of equipment, but I have obtained better results on several occasions by switching cues, for example, a different bar cue.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> Basically everything there is to miscues is chalk and stroke mechanics. <hr /></blockquote>

Last week I saw very noticeable differences in my pool buddy's game and in my own just by switching cues. And this only took him using 2 different cues and me using 3 different cues. Same strokes, many games, same table, but different cues and different results. With 2 of the cues I was prone to sending the CB flying when trying to draw, but with the 3rd cue I easily drew the cue anywhere I wanted and without fear of miscuing. It was obvious that cue and tip combination made a big difference for me. And so I'm sure it's more likely than not the same could be true with jump cues.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> Timing...it is difficult to define timing, but you know "it" when you "find it." You can play with a rock as a tip if hit properly. <hr /></blockquote>

A better match between the player, cue, tip, and the type of play is far more likely to produce better results than switching to a rock for a tip.

Jager85
10-22-2007, 11:18 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote sygfrid:</font><hr> Actually, if I'm not mistaken, you can make the cb jump with any cue and with any tip. HOWEVER, the height and distance of the jump will of course vary depending on the stiffness of the shaft and the hardness of the tip ASSUMING that you have the right speed and stroke.

As for me, I use my custom play cue with med-hard Triangle tip for jumping IF the distance between the cb &amp; the interfering ball is least 2 balls away (approx 4") and the cb is about 2ft away from the rail (of course it's quite difficult to use the short jump cue if the cb is too far away)

On the other hand, I use my custom jump cue w/ phenolic tip if the distance between the cb and the interfering ball is at least a ball away and if the cb is near the rail (less than 2 ft away) for leverage and stroking reasons <hr /></blockquote>

Exactly. Any tip and any cue can jump a ball, just some combinations are easier. I personally use a Cuetec jump/break with a phoenolic tip. I started with the LePro it came with, went to a triangle, and now am using a phoenolic. I prefer the shorter cue as the stance and stability are better, but the harder the tip the easier it is to get the cue ball in the air. With the phoenolic I can use a full cue, but with the triangle or LePro I need a shorter cue as I can't get the power with the unstability. A softer tip requires more power as alot of the energy is kept in the tip. A harder tip will transfer more energy to the CB, thus making it easier to jump.

bignick31985
10-22-2007, 03:06 PM
With the league tonite I'm gonna give the Q tip another go. I'll see if I can't attempt to correct the mistakes leading to a miscure.

I've just got 2 Mediums, 2 Slows, and a Talisman Medium here, waiting, lol.

Sid_Vicious
10-22-2007, 08:29 PM
"Last week I saw very noticeable differences in my pool buddy's game and in my own just by switching cues. And this only took him using 2 different cues and me using 3 different cues. Same strokes, many games, same table, but different cues and different results. With 2 of the cues I was prone to sending the CB flying when trying to draw, but with the 3rd cue I easily drew the cue anywhere I wanted and without fear of miscuing. It was obvious that cue and tip combination made a big difference for me. And so I'm sure it's more likely than not the same could be true with jump cues"

Sure that you know this...play with the same cue switch for 3 days and see if the "old habits/stroke" don't re-enter. magic fixes are wonderful, yet never last. sid

To add to what you said, "A better match between the player, cue, tip, and the type of play is far more likely to produce better results than switching to a rock for a tip."

if the premier tip is a hard tip, then you are putting off the inevitable by band-aiding the issie with short term fixes. sv