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View Full Version : Pricking a tip.



cushioncrawler
10-21-2007, 06:50 PM
Recently i bort heaps of 9mm and 10mm and 11mm Blue Diamond tips for $3.50 per 6. Theze are az hard az rock (silicone filler they say), much too hard for me, and i normally like hard tips. Anyhow, i didnt remoov the offending tip (9mm here), i turned it into a soft tip by pricking into the side of the tip with a plain pin.

I notice that pool players often uze a tip-pick to soften a too-hard tip, by pressing the pins into the top of the tip. I dont know how satisfactory this iz.

What i did iz i held the pin (upwards) in a vice, and i placed the qtip (still glued on the cue) on the pin, and hit down with a small hammer, and then uzed the hammer again to lever the cue'n'tip off. I did this 20 to 30 times, all around the tip. I didnt touch the top of the tip. I uzed the thinnest pin i could find, but perhaps thick pinz are ok but would need fewer "holes".

Anyhow, the qtip iz now nice and soft, probably the softest tip i have ever uzed in fact. For the last few years i have been trying to wean myself off hard tips, i allways found Blue Diamonds and Elk Masters were too soft, and i allwayz viced them overnite. Either the (now too hard) BD's are being made in a different factory, or my taste iz changing faster than i thort.

I remember that a long time ago i tryd to soften a tip by hitting a plain pin into the top of the tip, uzing a hammer, similar to what a tip-pick duz i suppoze, but i remember that this woz hard work, and the rezults werent satisfactory (might have been my own fault). Duz a proper tip-pick soften a tip satisfactoryly??? madMac.

craigstevens
10-21-2007, 07:34 PM
Talisman H, if you want to go cheap Triangle, both are the same in hardness, by duromter testing. Hard is best, soft if bad. The worst tip is a elk master.
Don't bort no mo of dem plastic tips, stay with leather. 9 and 10mm, that is for snew-Ka, not pool dude. Most are using 13 to 12.75. I am on ll.50 and there is no need to go below that. My testing shows that is where the performance ends. Z shaft reached the same conclusion. So did Earl.



/ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif :g

cushioncrawler
10-21-2007, 08:01 PM
In my case the 9mm BD on my 8.5mm (brass ferrule) and the 2-piece maple shaft ($60) cue are experimental (i am looking into non-stiff shafts), even tho i am prezently uzing it (the 8.5mm cue) in my matches (12' table and 2-1/16" balls here).

But i do allso uze (previously) an 11.5mm cue (very stiff), with a flattish hardish tip (Triangle??) on it at prezent, and this combo iz great.

My main query woz whether any pool players out there have any experience with pricking a hard tip "in the sides" to soften it. And, whether pricking in the "face" (ie uzing a tip-pick) iz better. From my own experience with side-pricking, there appearz to be little reezon for players (who want a soft tip) to wade throo boxes of tips, dropping them onto a table etc, to weed out the too-hard tips -- just stick any tip on, and prick it if need be. And, no need to whip a too-hard tip off and replace it -- just side-prick it.

Players who want hard tips might still havta wade throo the box to weed-out the softyz. I guess that there iz no good way of hardening a too-soft tip once it iz fixed on the cue. madMac.

Sid_Vicious
10-21-2007, 09:03 PM
"Players who want hard tips might still havta wade throo the box to weed-out the softyz."

Weed out the good and hard ones is more the case. Selecting a tip is as simple as cooking a steak...tip is hard, steak bleeds on the plate when cut. To steer away from those fundamentals jus' dont make cents. sid~~~grills a better steak than plays the game of pool

Sid_Vicious
10-21-2007, 09:05 PM
"Players who want hard tips might still havta wade throo the box to weed-out the softyz."

Weed out the good and hard ones is more the case. Selecting a tip is as simple as cooking a steak...tip is hard, steak bleeds on the plate when cut. To steer away from those fundamentals jus' dont make cents. sid~~~grills a better steak than plays the game of pool

As far as pricking a tip, I lost all of my tip-tools a long time ago, on purpose.

Vapros
10-21-2007, 09:39 PM
Say again?

1Time
10-21-2007, 10:01 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote cushioncrawler:</font><hr> Duz a proper tip-pick soften a tip satisfactoryly??? madMac.
<hr /></blockquote>

It may work, but I doubt it. I have a tip-pick super glued to the back of a tip-tapper, which makes it much easier to use than pressing it into the tip. Works real nice, but as much as I tapped a LePro tip with it to soften it up, it never did to my satisfaction. But then I never used it on the side of the tip and didn't try going too deep for fear of tearing it up.

cushioncrawler
10-21-2007, 11:18 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 1Time:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote cushioncrawler:</font><hr> Duz a proper tip-pick soften a tip satisfactoryly??? madMac.<hr /></blockquote>It may work, but I doubt it. I have a tip-pick super glued to the back of a tip-tapper, which makes it much easier to use than pressing it into the tip. Works real nice, but as much as I tapped a LePro tip with it to soften it up, it never did to my satisfaction. But then I never used it on the side of the tip and didn't try going too deep for fear of tearing it up.<hr /></blockquote>Yeah -- Even sticking a single pin into the top of a tip didnt work for me, it takes lots of force, it iz sort of square to the grain of the tip, whereaz into the sides iz like splitting the grain. Uzing a tip-pick with lots of pinz, each thickish, and by hand (no vice and no hammer) looks like an elephant trying to rape an ant. madMac.

bradb
10-23-2007, 12:47 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote cushioncrawler:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote 1Time:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote cushioncrawler:</font><hr> Duz a proper tip-pick soften a tip satisfactoryly??? madMac.<hr /></blockquote>It may work, but I doubt it. I have a tip-pick super glued to the back of a tip-tapper, which makes it much easier to use than pressing it into the tip. Works real nice, but as much as I tapped a LePro tip with it to soften it up, it never did to my satisfaction. But then I never used it on the side of the tip and didn't try going too deep for fear of tearing it up.<hr /></blockquote>Yeah -- Even sticking a single pin into the top of a tip didnt work for me, it takes lots of force, it iz sort of square to the grain of the tip, whereaz into the sides iz like splitting the grain. Uzing a tip-pick with lots of pinz, each thickish, and by hand (no vice and no hammer) looks like an elephant trying to rape an ant. madMac. <hr /></blockquote>

Max, I have a really hard tip on one of my cues. (don't remember its brand) I tried the pick fornication method but to no avail, after one QB hit its back hard as ever. I tried medium heavy sandpaper and that worked for about 10 hits only. I found that if I could shape it to a nice dome it played better than a mesa top. But it still plays tough. I now use it as my break cue. I found that it smack's em great but if you leave the center its duck for cover. brad

cushioncrawler
10-23-2007, 05:01 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bradb:</font><hr><hr /></blockquote>...Max, I have a really hard tip on one of my cues. (don't remember its brand) I tried the pick fornication method but to no avail, after one QB hit its back hard as ever. I tried medium heavy sandpaper and that worked for about 10 hits only. I found that if I could shape it to a nice dome it played better than a mesa top. But it still plays tough. I now use it as my break cue. I found that it smack's em great but if you leave the center its duck for cover...<hr /></blockquote>Brad -- Uzing a pik (multi-needle) into the top of a tip sounds impossible to me -- u would needta uze a hammer, and u would never get the damned thing out again -- and holes perpinducular to the "grain" wont do az much az holes "tween" the grain i reckon. Why not uze a single pin/needle, into the side(s), 20+ times. madMac.

bradb
10-23-2007, 06:23 PM
Tried the pin in the side but I was indanger of spliting the leather, the pin has to be reasonably thick or it can't be driven with any force. I wonder if a modeling drill would work? I like to build minitures and i have a tiny drill bit, nothing to lose I'm thinking of removing the tip anyway.

cushioncrawler
10-23-2007, 06:55 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bradb:</font><hr> Tried the pin in the side but I was indanger of spliting the leather, the pin has to be reasonably thick or it can't be driven with any force. I wonder if a modeling drill would work? I like to build minitures and i have a tiny drill bit, nothing to lose I'm thinking of removing the tip anyway.<hr /></blockquote>It probably haztabe a thin pin. Stick it in a vice, and tap down onto the qtip with a hammer. Be happy with a little bit of penetration at first, but, then, az u progress around the periphery for the second time it goze in (and out) eezyr and further -- and after a while u can get it all the way in to the center. Be prepared to replace the pin koz it might bend a few times and break, if u are klumzy. I imagin that a thick pin (or drill) might do too much softening. Dont know how this stuff might affekt a layered tip -- i suspekt that my tips (blue-diamond) had only one layer. madMac.

bradb
11-01-2007, 10:03 AM
[/quote madmax] It probably haztabe a thin pin. Stick it in a vice, and tap down onto the qtip with a hammer. Be happy with a little bit of penetration at first, but, then, az u progress around the periphery for the second time it goze in (and out) eezyr and further -- and after a while u can get it all the way in to the center. Be prepared to replace the pin koz it might bend a few times and break, if u are klumzy. I imagin that a thick pin (or drill) might do too much softening. Dont know how this stuff might affekt a layered tip -- i suspekt that my tips (blue-diamond) had only one layer. madMac. <hr /></blockquote>

Mac. (apologies... I've been calling you Max! I've seen to many early Mel Gibson movies!) Well I tried something similar to what you suggested but to no avail. I pulled the tip off and went with a medium hardness Moori which is on my other cues, its the best tip I've ever had.

Someone told me the absolute best tip you can put on your cue is the Tiger Sniper. Its made from boar hide and has some patented vacuuming process.

I just can't find a use in any part of my game for a hard tip, but many players swear by them, I just swear at em! -cheers, brad /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

DickLeonard
11-01-2007, 01:59 PM
MadMac I would use blue diamonds on the house cues I would play with all the house cues when I found one I liked I would harvest it. If the tip was too small for my cue I would play with the house cue. If you don't play in a room I don't know what to tell you.

Try leather softener, pool players had all different means of softening a tip. I am going to google that.####

cushioncrawler
11-01-2007, 05:08 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bradb:</font><hr>...Well I tried something similar to what you suggested but to no avail. I pulled the tip off and went with a medium hardness Moori which is on my other cues, its the best tip I've ever had...<hr /></blockquote>Hmmmm -- Perhaps side-prikking dont work so well on a large layered tip. And, i think that the BD haz silicon filler which might be a faktor here too. madMac.

cushioncrawler
11-01-2007, 05:14 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> MadMac I would use blue diamonds on the house cues I would play with all the house cues when I found one I liked I would harvest it. If the tip was too small for my cue I would play with the house cue. If you don't play in a room I don't know what to tell you. Try leather softener, pool players had all different means of softening a tip. I am going to google that..<hr /></blockquote>Reminds me of John Spencer (old snooker champ). He used to uze old tips that other players were replacing. He would stick them on with 2 of thoze old glue wafers, to keep clearance to the ferrule. madMac.

DickLeonard
11-02-2007, 07:55 AM
MadMac I was told by an old timer who ran a room in the 20s that Willie hoppe when playing an exhibition would ask the room owner if he could hit balls with his house cues and if he found a tip could he take off the house cue. That was how I started doing that myself.

I guess that must have been an accepted practice amongst the older players it seems to have disappeared with the new tips. They last so much longer these days.####

Snapshot9
11-02-2007, 10:41 AM
I have a 12.75mm Hercules layered Medium Hard tip on my cue.
It is 3 years old, and I prick it all the time with a Shadow
TipPik (on my keychain), and have no problems. I prick the angled sides and the top. It is a nickel shaped tip.

I am close to getting a new tip put on though, about 1/8" sidewall left on tip. <font color="green"> </font color>

SpiderMan
11-02-2007, 02:20 PM
I think most people, when they prick the top of the tip, are trying to roughen the surface for holding chalk. By piercing the sides, you are actually "splitting" the leather at several points, making it a little more spongy, without affecting the surface. Yes, it would make it feel softer, or at least "deader".

I'm curious about the blue diamonds, though. They have always seemed very soft to me, and on a 9mm they should feel even softer. I wonder if there is a general trend by manufacturers toward making tips harder overall? I recently bought a box of Le Pros from Atlas, and they are so hard that none of my customers like them. They're like concrete. I'll have to use them on break sticks.

SpiderMan

cushioncrawler
11-02-2007, 05:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SpiderMan:</font><hr> I think most people, when they prick the top of the tip, are trying to roughen the surface for holding chalk. By piercing the sides, you are actually "splitting" the leather at several points, making it a little more spongy, without affecting the surface. Yes, it would make it feel softer, or at least "deader". I'm curious about the blue diamonds, though. They have always seemed very soft to me, and on a 9mm they should feel even softer. I wonder if there is a general trend by manufacturers toward making tips harder overall? I recently bought a box of Le Pros from Atlas, and they are so hard that none of my customers like them. They're like concrete. I'll have to use them on break sticks..<hr /></blockquote>On the snooker forums the players all say that BDs are harder (and allwayz were harder) than ElkMasters. But, nonetheless i allwayz hadta vice any BD or EM, not any more. And a month ago i put on a (brown with red plastic backing) triangle (?), and it woz too hard, took it off.

What i didnt reveal iz that a couple of weeks ago i side-prikked an 11.5mm BD and overdid it, not carefull enuff actually, i sort of klumzyly tore the tip az i prikked, and it looked too spongy, allmost doubled its thickness actually, i played about 4 skrewbacks with it and misscued every time.

Actually one of my teammates showed me one of thoze multi-pin piks a few weeks ago, first time i had ever seen one in the flesh. One of the champs here keeps a small fine file, and he sort of presses this into the top of hiz tip at the start of every match (and after any misscue), but duznt ever uze any sawing action. madMac.

cushioncrawler
11-02-2007, 05:56 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr>MadMac I was told by an old timer who ran a room in the 20s that Willie hoppe when playing an exhibition would ask the room owner if he could hit balls with his house cues and if he found a tip could he take off the house cue. That was how I started doing that myself. I guess that must have been an accepted practice amongst the older players it seems to have disappeared with the new tips. They last so much longer these days..<hr /></blockquote>Dick -- I never could figure how players took BDs off for reuse. Every time i take one off that tip iz history. Must be koz i uze araldite. Oldendayz tips allwayz had a bakelite backing, or at least some very tuff leather. Perhaps today for a BD one could put a home-made backing on it (i have some small steel washers) which would remain on the tip. madMac.

Paul_Mon
11-03-2007, 03:20 PM
Why is it every time I look at this thread I think about some arrogant waiter at a snobby restaurant. Do I want to "tip the prick" even though the service was good and the food great.