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bradb
10-28-2007, 07:57 PM
Its your shot in 8 ball and you have 2 balls left, your opponent has the 8B over the corner and unless you pocket a ball or play safe he's out.

The safety looks the best bet.. its easy, all you have to do is tap the 5B to the rail and its a hook behind the 3. But is it a good hook? Your opponent can 2 rail or 3 out and kick the 8B fairly easy and leave you are in deeper trouble because both of your balls are on the rail down table with no shot.

Example 2 shows a harder hit driving the 5B past mid table, of course this will require precise cuing or you bump the 3 out, or leave the QB short.

Example 3 shows the result. The QB is up against the 3 leaving your opponent a much tougher kick. Plus you have put the 5 down on his end so that even if he does hit the 8 you will have a possible shot on that ball.

You will need to practice this shot so that you get a feeling for pace, if you can lay it down you can repeat this in many other situations.

Its amazing how many good players will try and bank out of this situation, when all it takes is a simple hook to win the game. -Brad
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee236/brad1943/table-1.jpg http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee236/brad1943/table-2copy.jpg http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee236/brad1943/table-3.jpg

Bob_Jewett
10-28-2007, 09:02 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bradb:</font><hr>

Its your shot in 8 ball and you have 2 balls left, your opponent has the 8B over the corner and unless you pocket a ball or play safe he's out.... <hr /></blockquote>
It depends on exactly how the balls are sitting, but it may also be possible to play slightly on the right side of the five, roll to the back of the three and have the five come off the cushion and freeze to the cue ball. I have been working recently on hitting a ball, going to the cushion with the cue ball and then freezing to the same ball. Useful at one pocket.

bradb
10-29-2007, 08:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Bob_Jewett:</font><hr>

It depends on exactly how the balls are sitting, but it may also be possible to play slightly on the right side of the five, roll to the back of the three and have the five come off the cushion and freeze to the cue ball. I have been working recently on hitting a ball, going to the cushion with the cue ball and then freezing to the same ball. Useful at one pocket. <hr /></blockquote>

Yes, that would be a deadly hook!... It would require some real knuckle biting control as you don't want to rub the 3 over, but a very good shot to practice.

In the sequence shown the QB is probably to straight on but if there was room I think I would try that.

Hitting the OB with pace but slow rolling the QB forward is a good practice regimen, Its a matter of gauging the amount of top spin with the distance needed. Very useful in tight safety's and position play. -brad

Snapshot9
10-30-2007, 10:36 AM
Good idea, but you didn't take it far enough. A good player would bank the 5B to come off the long rail and knock the 8B over to the uptable end rail, and leave the cue ball behind the 3, maybe not frozen, but it wouldn't have to be.

Because the 5B would be hanging close to the corner pocket, and even hitting the 8B with a kick would almost guarantee an easy 5 ball shot, and easily get shape on the 3 ball.

Even after kicking the 8B, perhaps harder than what you expected and left the cue ball on the long rail and perhaps not have a shootable 5B, you would still have the 3 down table for a good shot, and get shape back on the 5 uptable.

Bob_Jewett
10-30-2007, 11:15 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Snapshot9:</font><hr> Good idea, but you didn't take it far enough. A good player would bank the 5B to come off the long rail and knock the 8B over to the uptable end rail, and leave the cue ball behind the 3,... <hr /></blockquote>
Maybe, but I feel I don't have enough control to keep the five from going in on a ticky or maybe ending up close to the eight with no easy shot or maybe even pocketing the eight. If I were in dead one-pocket punch, then maybe I'd try it. If you're going to try to freeze behind the 3, you better not make the five.

SpiderMan
10-30-2007, 02:21 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Bob_Jewett:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Snapshot9:</font><hr> Good idea, but you didn't take it far enough. A good player would bank the 5B to come off the long rail and knock the 8B over to the uptable end rail, and leave the cue ball behind the 3,... <hr /></blockquote>
Maybe, but I feel I don't have enough control to keep the five from going in on a ticky or maybe ending up close to the eight with no easy shot or maybe even pocketing the eight. If I were in dead one-pocket punch, then maybe I'd try it. If you're going to try to freeze behind the 3, you better not make the five. <hr /></blockquote>

I don't see anything to be gained by trying to re-position the 8-ball. As Bob said, you could wind up pocketing the 5 (not really a big deal, but still undesirable), you could tie up the 5 and 8, or you could compromize your safety against the 3. You could also accidentally roll the 8 to a more favorable position (nearer the pocket) if you hit it on the wrong side, or, heaven forbid, you could even make the 8. Leave the 8 alone - where it is, your opponent may scratch off it if he's lucky enough to hit it.

With the balls positioned as shown, freezing the cueball should be #1 priority, and leaving the 5 easy as insurance should be #2. Making the 5 is not a major disaster, because if you freeze on the 3 you'll likely get ball in hand anyway (or at least a reasonable shot), but why take the chance?

SpiderMan

bradb
10-30-2007, 03:12 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote SpiderMan:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Bob_Jewett:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Snapshot9:</font><hr> Good idea, but you didn't take it far enough. A good player would bank the 5B to come off the long rail and knock the 8B over to the uptable end rail, and leave the cue ball behind the 3,... <hr /></blockquote>
Maybe, but I feel I don't have enough control to keep the five from going in on a ticky or maybe ending up close to the eight with no easy shot or maybe even pocketing the eight. If I were in dead one-pocket punch, then maybe I'd try it. If you're going to try to freeze behind the 3, you better not make the five. <hr /></blockquote>

I don't see anything to be gained by trying to re-position the 8-ball. As Bob said, you could wind up pocketing the 5 (not really a big deal, but still undesirable), you could tie up the 5 and 8, or you could compromize your safety against the 3. You could also accidentally roll the 8 to a more favorable position (nearer the pocket) if you hit it on the wrong side, or, heaven forbid, you could even make the 8. Leave the 8 alone - where it is, your opponent may scratch off it if he's lucky enough to hit it.

With the balls positioned as shown, freezing the cueball should be #1 priority, and leaving the 5 easy as insurance should be #2. Making the 5 is not a major disaster, because if you freeze on the 3 you'll likely get ball in hand anyway (or at least a reasonable shot), but why take the chance?

SpiderMan <hr /></blockquote>

Yes this is exactly correct. The idea is to win the game, so there is no need to take unneccessary risk.

1Time
10-30-2007, 09:00 PM
I use this type of safety all the time, one of my favorites.

bradb
10-31-2007, 09:32 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 1Time:</font><hr> I use this type of safety all the time, one of my favorites. <hr /></blockquote>

Yes mine too. There's also a variation where you might find the 3 ahead of the 5... here you could drive the 5 down table and stun back the QB to freeze on the 3 to achieve the same results.

This is a situation that takes a lot of practice as it comes up rarely in a game, but when it does its nice to know you can execute it. -brad