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dr_dave
11-28-2007, 02:49 PM
It seems like many people like using golf analogies when discussing pool. Maybe it's because many pool players also play and like golf. What about bowling? Don't many pool players also bowl, and doesn't bowling provide just as many direct analogies? In fact, I think some people started playing pool because bowling establishments often provide pool tables (and sometimes even complete pool halls) under the same roof. That's how I started playing pool. I misspent much of my youth in a bowling alley playing pinball (and later video games), playing pool, and bowling. I'm actually almost as avid about bowling as I am pool. I've been in bowling leagues since I could walk, and I've even bowled a perfect game (300) recently.

Why is it that bowling isn't mentioned as much as golf as an analogy or companion to pool? Is there some "bad blood" or "baggage" due to past industry squabbles? Do people think golf is really a much better analogy than bowling for pool? Are there other reasons (e.g., do pool players play golf more than they bowl)?

Here is a list of some of the analogies between the games, with what I consider weak analogies marked with an asterisk (*):

pool...........golf............bowling
CB.............ball............ball
OB............green*.........pin
cue...........club............ball*
grip...........grip............grip
stance........stance........stance at release
stroke........swing..........swing
eyes up......eyes down.....eyes up
..on OB.......on ball.......on arrow target
..during hit..during hit*...during release
pocket........hole...........the "pocket" or pit
swerve.......hook/slice.....curve ball
table..........fairway.........lane
ball slides...ball flies........ball slides
..on surface..thru air*.....on surface
rack of 9......the green*....rack of 10
..or 15 balls..........................pins
rails..........trees and........kick-back plate on walls
.................boundaries*.....& gutter bumpers (if up)
indoors.......outdoors........indoors
.."hall".........course*........."alley"
mental game..mental game..mental game


Concerning the physics of the games, bowling is very much like pool (flat, rectangular playing surface, smooth ball, predictable and fairly consistent sliding and rolling friction, ball hitting balls or pins, etc.). Golf is very different from a physics perspective (club face dynamics, complicated swing mechanics, aerodynamics of flight, etc.).

What do you guys think?

Dave

Rackum_n_Crackum
11-28-2007, 03:33 PM
Call me CRAZY, but I think in most of the games I play there are a lot of consistansies... For the most part, I play Pool and darts in the winter months, and golf, horseshoes, and cornhole in the summer months..They ALL require a strict repetition, good form, and a consistent follow through on whatever motion is regiured in the game ....

I would have to guess that there are a lot of other sports that this is true in as well, so it only stands to reason that people will make anoligies (good or bad) to many other sports..

As always, just my .02 /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

DeadCrab
11-28-2007, 03:44 PM
The marriage between bowling and billiards came about through Brunswick Corporation's dual interest in billiards and bowling equipment. In particular, they had the first automatic pin setting machine, that moved bowling out of the basements of bars.

They had high hopes that moving bowling out of bars, and billiards out of pool halls, would improve the respectability of both. Your call as to whether they succeeded at this.

SKennedy
11-28-2007, 03:57 PM
Did he say "cornhole?"
Sorry about my immaturity...just couldn't resist!

SKennedy
11-28-2007, 04:02 PM
Yes, I agree about the similarities. I use to bowl alot, but not anymore. I bowled a few weeks ago and it was my first time in about 10 years. I use to be a decent league bowler...never bowled a perfect game, but came close on occasion. The other day I did not bowl 100! Not only that, but it liked to have killed me. I decided no more bowling..ever again. Of course the 16 lb fingertip didn't help.

Golf, pool, and bowling???? My grandfather was great at all three. As well as poker, craps, baseball (pro), and who knows what else. Wish I had some of those genetics....

Paul_Mon
11-28-2007, 04:22 PM
I like the analogies Dave. I enjoy all three sports. I have been in the "zone" at pool and bowling, never in golf. IMO, their degree of difficulty would be golf (most difficult) then pool and bowling (least difficult).

wolfdancer
11-28-2007, 04:23 PM
That 300 game doesn't count if the gutter bumpers were up /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Seriously...Congratulations on that; it's a great achievement.
I started a few games off with a 6 bagger, and once had a 265 followed by a 266...but in reality a 180 or below avg. No special balls, no wrist or elbow supporter ...one old Brunswick that I had bought years ago in Cleveland,Ohio
from Newman Stern Sporting Goods, one partner being Paul Newman's Dad. I like to think that Paul drilled the ball for me, but he may have been busy making a movie at the time.
Bowling may not be a good analogy, as it requires one grooved swing, and mastery of just a few shots.
The concentration, good mechanics aiming might be similar, but pool requires constantly changing strategies.....and there's very little defense in bowling.
Say, remind me to stay off them bunny slopes next time I am in Colorado...if that's where the yellow snow is....

wolfdancer
11-28-2007, 04:28 PM
Walter Ray Williams is/was the best at both Horseshoes and Bowling.......HOF, I believe, in both sports.

SKennedy
11-28-2007, 04:42 PM
I agree golf is the most difficult by far....everything about the game is unnatural (at least for me). However, not sure I would agree that bowling is the easiest.

dr_dave
11-28-2007, 05:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DeadCrab:</font><hr>They had high hopes that moving bowling out of bars, and billiards out of pool halls, would improve the respectability of both. Your call as to whether they succeeded at this.<hr /></blockquote>I think the bowling world has progressed much better than the pool world. Bowling has a very well-run and active governing body (USBC - United States Bowling Congress), and the professional bowling tour (PBA - Professional Bowlers Association) has done well in recent years with high-profile TV coverage and good sponsorship. I think the pool world could learn a few things from the bowling world.

Regards,
Dave

dr_dave
11-28-2007, 05:34 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr> I like the analogies Dave. I enjoy all three sports. I have been in the "zone" at pool and bowling, never in golf. IMO, their degree of difficulty would be golf (most difficult) then pool and bowling (least difficult).<hr /></blockquote>I agree with your appraisal. I think golf (at a high level) is much more difficult than pool (at a high level), which is more difficult than bowling (at a high level). I only bowl once a week, and I can still easily maintain a fairly high average and bowl high-level series periodically.

Regards,
Dave

dr_dave
11-28-2007, 05:43 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>That 300 game doesn't count if the gutter bumpers were up /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif<hr /></blockquote>Funny! /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>Seriously...Congratulations on that; it's a great achievement.<hr /></blockquote>Thank you. It was definitely one of the most exciting moments of my life. People watching said I looked so calm and relaxed on the last shot, but I was shaking like a leaf inside, and I could hardly breath. But I did hold strictly to my pre-shot routine, which is definitely just as important in bowling as it is in pool.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>Bowling may not be a good analogy, as it requires one grooved swing, and mastery of just a few shots.<hr /></blockquote>I agree with you here. In bowling, there is very little need for large-range speed control, and there is very little strategy and planning.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>The concentration, good mechanics aiming might be similar<hr /></blockquote>Most definitely!

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>Say, remind me to stay off them bunny slopes next time I am in Colorado...if that's where the yellow snow is....<hr /></blockquote>There's lots' of yellow snow next to the bunny slopes, but none of it spells "Dr. Dave."

Regards,
Dave

dr_dave
11-28-2007, 06:04 PM
I just realized why some pool players like 10-ball so much. The analogy to bowling (with the rack of 10 pins) is so compelling.

(just kidding) /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Dave

Vapros
11-28-2007, 07:58 PM
Bowling has gone bananas. I'm an old timer, from the days of the conventional grip ball and difficult lane conditions, which are determined by the method of applying lane dressing (oil). 200 was a good game and all the 200 averages in the country could be listed on two pages in the back of the yearbook of the National Bowlers Journal and Billiard Review.

Today, the game is all about equipment and lane dressing patterns. Anybody who can hook the ball a little can hit the 1-3 pocket with nearly every shot. Everybody knocks down the five pin, and many high-level tournaments are held to see who can carry the corner pins this week. Big scores that used to be rewarded with a diamond ring from the ABC are now produced in bunches in a single night in the best leagues. Synthetic lane surfaces with a photo of a wooden lane just under the clear finish, and high-tech balls with weight distribution and cover stock made to order for the lanes where you bowl. Automatic machines to dress the lanes every day now cost in the range of $25,000, and make some incredibly delicate patterns. What used to be a 60 foot adventure is now just a matter of getting the speed and rotation and angle right to reach the pocket from the end of the oil pattern - around fifteen feet. Bah, humbug!

Bob_Jewett
11-28-2007, 09:10 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr> I like the analogies Dave. I enjoy all three sports. I have been in the "zone" at pool and bowling, never in golf. IMO, their degree of difficulty would be golf (most difficult) then pool and bowling (least difficult). <hr /></blockquote>
A general way to look at the difficulty of games is to estimate how many different levels of ability there are among people who play fairly regularly. There are only two levels at tic-tac-toe, so that game is easy. A way to define "level" is to say that two players are one level apart if in a two-hour match, the better player will win 2/3 of the time.

At nine ball, the two-hour match would be roughly a race to 15, while at golf, it might be 9 holes. Between the top 8 at the WPC/9B and the typical APA 3, I think there are about 15 to 20 levels. At golf, I guess you would start with Tiger and ask who could beat him 1/3 of the time in 9 holes, and then take another step down, and so on until you get to the 40-handicappers. Someone who knows golf statistics better than I do might be able to figure the odds.

dr_dave
11-30-2007, 11:53 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vapros:</font><hr> Bowling has gone bananas. I'm an old timer, from the days of the conventional grip ball and difficult lane conditions, which are determined by the method of applying lane dressing (oil). 200 was a good game and all the 200 averages in the country could be listed on two pages in the back of the yearbook of the National Bowlers Journal and Billiard Review.<hr /></blockquote>Agreed. Conditions in the past were tougher.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vapros:</font><hr>Today, the game is all about equipment and lane dressing patterns. Anybody who can hook the ball a little can hit the 1-3 pocket with nearly every shot.<hr /></blockquote>I think this is a bit of an exaggeration. Almost everybody in my league hooks the ball, and very few of them hit the pocket on "nearly every shot." Pros are a different story. If they miss the "pocket," that's terrible.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vapros:</font><hr>Everybody knocks down the five pin, and many high-level tournaments are held to see who can carry the corner pins this week.<hr /></blockquote>But there is still significant challenge to finding the right ball, amount of lift, line, and ball speed to give the best carry for given lane conditions. Also, one must be good at knowing how and what to adjust as the lanes "break down" during a match.

<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vapros:</font><hr>Big scores that used to be rewarded with a diamond ring from the ABC are now produced in bunches in a single night in the best leagues. Synthetic lane surfaces with a photo of a wooden lane just under the clear finish, and high-tech balls with weight distribution and cover stock made to order for the lanes where you bowl. Automatic machines to dress the lanes every day now cost in the range of $25,000, and make some incredibly delicate patterns. What used to be a 60 foot adventure is now just a matter of getting the speed and rotation and angle right to reach the pocket from the end of the oil pattern - around fifteen feet. Bah, humbug!<hr /></blockquote>I think I would be as cynical as you if the pros bowled a 300 for many games during a tournament ... but they don't, because the game is still challenging (IMHO).

Regards,
Dave

JPB
11-30-2007, 03:54 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Bob_Jewett:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Paul_Mon:</font><hr> I like the analogies Dave. I enjoy all three sports. I have been in the "zone" at pool and bowling, never in golf. IMO, their degree of difficulty would be golf (most difficult) then pool and bowling (least difficult). <hr /></blockquote>
A general way to look at the difficulty of games is to estimate how many different levels of ability there are among people who play fairly regularly. There are only two levels at tic-tac-toe, so that game is easy. A way to define "level" is to say that two players are one level apart if in a two-hour match, the better player will win 2/3 of the time.

At nine ball, the two-hour match would be roughly a race to 15, while at golf, it might be 9 holes. Between the top 8 at the WPC/9B and the typical APA 3, I think there are about 15 to 20 levels. At golf, I guess you would start with Tiger and ask who could beat him 1/3 of the time in 9 holes, and then take another step down, and so on until you get to the 40-handicappers. Someone who knows golf statistics better than I do might be able to figure the odds. <hr /></blockquote>


Hard to say. The thing is that in golf a player of a higher level can't do anything to affect another player. I'm not talking about psychological factors, like Tiger being intimidating to play against, but factors within the game. A great 9 ball player can make life very difficult for somebody a level below him, playing great safeties, nullifying imperfect but good safety play with great kicks, running a series of racks, etc.... Tiger is on another level from all the other tour pros, but I still think that in 27 holes it is likely that he loses one 9 hole segment to another tour pro. The scoring results for last year show Tiger with a sick 67.79 scoring average and the #2 guy Els having a 69.29 average. That is a big difference, 1.5 shots for 18 holes, or .75 shots for 9. So since the players are within a stroke of one another on 9 holes Ernie figures to win often. I am not a stats guy so can't come up with a good percentage. From Ernie at number 2 a 1.5 shot difference in average brings you to a tie for 86, with Kevin Na, Nick Watney and Charlie Wi. 1.5 shots from there and you are the guy 854th in the world and 213 on the money list. So maybe that is a good definition of levels, not sure. The thing is that the guy who is 213 on the money list is much better than people imagine, and that is harder to define. Probably a wider gulf and more levels between a scratch golfer and 213 on the money list than a 13 handicap to scratch.

JPB
11-30-2007, 04:00 PM
I think the fact you are trying to hit a ball with a stick with precision and repeatability in a competitive event brings up similarities. It seems to come up a lot when the mental game is discussed, and I think there are some similarities there. In some other ways they are not similar.

dr_dave
11-30-2007, 04:42 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JPB:</font><hr> I think the fact you are trying to hit a ball with a stick with precision and repeatability in a competitive event brings up similarities. It seems to come up a lot when the mental game is discussed, and I think there are some similarities there. In some other ways they are not similar.<hr /></blockquote>Good answer; although, I think:

moving a stick in nearly a straight line, over a short distance, with mostly only forearm motion, and hitting the ball with the end of the stick (pool)

is very different from:

rotating the stick over a large range of motion, with lots of knee, hip, shoulder, and wrist motion, and hitting the ball with the side of the stick (golf).

Also, I think there are mental-game similarities among most sports and games.

Regards,
Dave

JPB
11-30-2007, 04:51 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote dr_dave:</font><hr>
Also, I think there are mental-game similarities among most sports and games.

Regards,
Dave <hr /></blockquote>


I think where golf and pool are more similar than some other sports is that in both the ball just sits there and all the power and control is generated by the player. Sure the mental game comes into play in all sports, but IMO it is easier in sports that are reactive to some degree. IOW, in a game like tennis, baseball, badminton you are reacting to a moving object. This makes it easier to get into subconscious or reactive modes I think. When you have to see and react quickly to a target there is less time to think about things and let the mind get in the way.

dr_dave
11-30-2007, 05:05 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote JPB:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote dr_dave:</font><hr>
Also, I think there are mental-game similarities among most sports and games.<hr /></blockquote>
I think where golf and pool are more similar than some other sports is that in both the ball just sits there and all the power and control is generated by the player. Sure the mental game comes into play in all sports, but IMO it is easier in sports that are reactive to some degree. IOW, in a game like tennis, baseball, badminton you are reacting to a moving object. This makes it easier to get into subconscious or reactive modes I think. When you have to see and react quickly to a target there is less time to think about things and let the mind get in the way.<hr /></blockquote>Good point, there is the stationary implement "target" in pool, golf, archery, horseshoes, javelin, shot-put, etc. And pool and golf do involve initial "impact" with an implement instead of "release" of the implement for later impact.

Regards,
Dave

dklong92
12-03-2007, 07:47 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Vapros:</font><hr> Bowling has gone bananas.<hr /></blockquote>

The reason bowling went bananas is because Brunswick made a decision back in the late 60's early 70's. The decision was to push bowling and to leave pool in the bars. That is when Brunswick started pouring money into tournements and bowling alleys. Of course they made a ton of money from it. They could have gone the other way and pool would be a much bigger sport than it is now. Pool is catching up, but we are still about 10 years or so behind bowling.

Qtec
12-03-2007, 11:56 AM
If golf or bowling was played the same way as pool,snooker or billiards, playing against Tiger you might be 10 holes down before you got to play a shot.
Normally, he plays his shot and you play yours.
Lets now say the rules dictate you can continue playing if
a. your tee shot lands on the fairway
b. you complete the hole in regulation.
A par 4 would be a drive to the fairway and a 2nd shot to the green. Miss the green and the other player gets to drive.
Playing like this, how many could beat Tiger if he gets the first shot?



There is more pressure in pool , snooker etc because when you get a chance, you need to perform -you need to play! Even tho you might have been sitting in your chair, watching the OTHER guy play for 1/2 an hour.

Its easy to play an adventurous risky shot in golf because it only costs you 1 stroke if it goes wrong. Making a mistake in pool or snooker can cost you the match.

Pressure, thats the difference. To play top pool or snooker you must have a method of play that withstands pressure. In these situations even easy balls can look difficult.








Q

bobbling
12-03-2007, 02:31 PM
The concepts of bowling may very easily be adapted to a pool table. We have been playing "Bobble Ball Hand Billiard Bowling" games in league here in California now for the past few months. It's a new game with an egg shaped billiard ball which combines the various game concepts of bowling, billiards, shuffleboard, horse shoes, and bocce ball into a fun game which both pool players and non pool players may enjoy. For this game, players roll the balls by hand instead of using a cue stick which is attracting many more people to the pool table because they can test out the "mechanics" of a pool table without having to master the use of a cue stick first. The pool players in the league are having fun because the game is challenging their understanding of angles on the pool table and the non pool players are having fun because they can finally play on a pool table and win!
The game may seem elementary, but it is very challenging. Playing this game has allowed me to improve my pool playing skills because I can practice my angles, speed, and deflections in a fun manner and then put these skills to the test when I move back to "real" pool. Watch the video on bobbleball.com to see how the bowling analogy is no longer an analogy to pool ... it is a reality to pool.

Vapros
12-03-2007, 06:42 PM
Bowling went bananas when the American Bowling Congress relaxed its' specs for dressing the lanes. Up until the period you cited, oil had to be applied evenly, gutter to gutter, for whatever distance you liked. Then, as the evening went along, the bulk of the traffic was near the center of the lane, carrying away the oil in that area, and leaving the outside of the lane still slick. It was difficult to hold your hook ball in the dry area, but you couldn't give it more room to the right because it would find the oil and not come back. That's a tough condition. Many high scores at that time were produced in those centers where the proprietor had a working agreement with the local ABC secretary, who looked the other way as the lane man 'stripped' the lanes, putting extra oil inside the second or third arrow. The ABC finally gave in and allowed such methods of conditioning the lanes, going through a series of changes in their regulations that resulted in higher and higher scores. 'Tapered' oil kills the hook if you pull the ball and brings it back if you sail it out to the right, where the lane is drier. It's a different game now. The strikes are much easier, and the spares become an adventure.

sygfrid
12-04-2007, 12:24 AM
I used to teach &amp; play bowling a lot when I was managing a bowling &amp; billiard hall... then I got hooked on pool /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Pool &amp; bowling share many aspects especially on the fundamentals. A bowling ball may curve on a hook shot caused by the angled positioning of the hand, and, sometimes, by the rotation of the wrist for added spin; while the English can be applied by the angled positioning of the cue as in BHE or parallel alignment of the cue. However that shot requires precision release towards the arrow brought by the PENDULUM SWING of the arm. The spin/hook can be calculated, although faster, based on the lane condition &amp; the properties of the ball just just like the effect of English on the condition of the cloth/table and your familiarity with the properties of your cue. Stance is also crucial as the balance can affect the release and intended path of the ball, so as with a cue.

Sorry I have to cut this short as I have to go now &amp; play pool with a buddy... till later /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

sygfrid
12-04-2007, 07:20 AM
The characteristics of a bowling ball &amp; a cue have effects on their games. Apart from the hand positioning, a bowling ball's spin or hook is also dependent on its type of "core", the kind of surface it has (reactive, proactive, polyester, rubber, etc) and the drilling method used, while a cue's playability, its ability to "transmit" energy, and feel are dependent on the components of the cue such as hardness of the tip, length &amp; type of ferrule, type of joint, type &amp; quality of the woods used, etc. But no matter how powerful, or even awful, an equipment may be, all these are useless if the SKILLS OF THE PLAYER can't utilize the full potential of the equipment...

I believe that the mastery of 3 precision sports mentioned, bowling, pool, &amp; golf, is dependent on only one fundamental in which other "techniques" are dependent on... and that is the PENDULUM SWING: lower arm for pool, entire arm for bowling, and the entire upper body for golf. If the line is true, then the adjustments can now follow.

Anyway, I've just remembered, when I was still very active with bowling, a guy once told me that he thinks that bowling is a boring sport. Unlike pool wherein you get a different pattern or layout each time you break, in bowling the pins are set as they are and all that you have to do is roll the ball &amp; strike it. At the back of my mind I wanted to tell him that if bowling was that simple, then how come the pro's don't make perfect 300's more often in a set even in tournaments like the way the pro pool players run out racks after racks? People like him should realize that getting a perfect game of 300 in bowling is like pocketing a 9 or an 8 on a break, and having a strike is like running out balls. All these sports may look easy, but once you're on the floor, you'll realize that you need both body coordination &amp; mental preparedness to execute the shots and win the game /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

dr_dave
12-04-2007, 10:20 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote sygfrid:</font><hr>... getting a perfect game of 300 in bowling is like pocketing a 9 or an 8 on a break ...<hr /></blockquote>I don't think this is a fair comparison. Anybody can get lucky and make the 9 or 8 on a break. I think a better comparison is winning a 9-ball winner-breaks race to 10 where you break and run 10 racks and your opponent doesn't leave his chair once.

Regards,
Dave

DickLeonard
12-04-2007, 10:45 AM
Skennedy Babe Cranfield was the best all round athelete probably ever. He was a Champion Poolplayer,Scratch Golfer,200+ average Bowler,Tennis, Badmitton what ever game he played he excelled at. His mental powers were amazing, they let him master any game he devoted time to.

One poster would tell of watching him run balls at Holiday Billiards in Syracuse, run 200 balls miss and then run 300 balls. ####

DickLeonard
12-04-2007, 11:12 AM
Dr. Dave Pool is the only game where the good get to shoot all the time. In Golf the worse you are the more practice you get. In pool the worse you are the less practice you get.

In 1974 I read a Golf article by Jim Colbert on concentration and mentally rehearsing the shot your going to play. I switched from looking last at the object ball to looking last at the cueball and mentally rehearsing the shot. The first time I tried it I ran 212 balls using that system. In 1975 I quit playing pool so I never had much eperience using it. What I had proved to me that his golf article and pool worked.####

sygfrid
12-04-2007, 11:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote dr_dave:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote sygfrid:</font><hr>... getting a perfect game of 300 in bowling is like pocketing a 9 or an 8 on a break ...<hr /></blockquote>I don't think this is a fair comparison. Anybody can get lucky and make the 9 or 8 on a break. I think a better comparison is winning a 9-ball winner-breaks race to 10 where you break and run 10 racks and your opponent doesn't leave his chair once.

Regards,
Dave <hr /></blockquote>

Sorry, what I meant was just like a lucky 9 break, scoring a perfect 300 is a once in a blue moon thing /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

SKennedy
12-04-2007, 01:44 PM
I read the recent story about Babe Cranfield in BD. Some guys just got "it."

wolfdancer
12-04-2007, 04:50 PM
While the "Mighty Earl" kept his opponent in the chair for 11 racks...there was at least one 9-ball break in that run.
I think, since even the pros can't control getting a good leave on the lowest ball after a break...a better comparison might be an Accu-stats score of 1000...which allows for safety play, but demands perfect shot-making and great control of the CB.
Running 300 balls in straight pool might also be a good yardstick to judge excellence....
But, cutthroat lawn bowling...now there's a real man's game....

dr_dave
12-04-2007, 05:16 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr>...I think, since even the pros can't control getting a good leave on the lowest ball after a break...a better comparison might be an Accu-stats score of 1000...which allows for safety play, but demands perfect shot-making and great control of the CB.
Running 300 balls in straight pool might also be a good yardstick to judge excellence....<hr /></blockquote>Agreed. 10 straight break-and-runs is probably a little lofty. Maybe 10 straight racks in a competitive match is a little more appropriate.

Dave

Bob_Jewett
12-04-2007, 06:20 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote wolfdancer:</font><hr> While the "Mighty Earl" kept his opponent in the chair for 11 racks...there was at least one 9-ball break in that run.
.. ... <hr /></blockquote>
I think he made five nines on the break in 11 racks. Of course, the Sardo was not in use or he probably would not have made any nines on the break and probably wouldn't have had the 11.