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View Full Version : Hillary knows about predatory lending.



bamadog
02-16-2008, 07:53 PM
There's nothing like experience when dealing with those predatory lenders.

The Whitewater scam, a la Clinton:

"But the Clintons and McDougall did things differently. When customers wanted to buy a lot, they signed a simple purchase agreement. Bu this was no ordinary real estate contract. The small print at the bottom read: "In the event the default continues for 30 days...payments made by the purchaser SHALL BE CONSIDERED AS RENT for the use of the premises." In other words, the buyers did not actually take ownership of their property until the final payment was made. If a buyer missed just one monthly payment, all their previous payments would be classified as rent and they would have no equity in the land at all.

This sort of contract was illegal in many other states, because it was considered exploitative of the poor and uneducated. One look at the experience of those who bought into Whitewater and you can see why.

Clyde Soapes was a grain-elevator operator from Texas who heard about the lots in early 1980 and jumped at the chance to invest. He put $3,000 down and began making payments of $244.69 per month. He made THIRTY-FIVE payments in all--totaling $11,564.15, just short of the $14,000 price for the lot. Then he suddenly fell ill with diabetes and missed a payment, then two. The Clintons informed him that he had lost the land and all of his money. There was no court proceeding or compensation. Months later they resold his property to a couple from Nevada for $16,500. After they too missed a payment, the Clintons resold it yet again.

Soapes and the couple from Nevada were not alone. MORE THAN HALF of the people who bought lots in Whitewater...made payments, missed one or two, and then lost their land without getting a dime of their equity back. According to Whitewater records, at least sixteen different buyers paid more than $50,000 and never received a property deed. The Clintons continued this approach up until the 1992 electrion, when they tried to quietly get out of the investment."

Taken from "Do As I Say" by Peter Schweizer

bamadog
02-18-2008, 11:00 AM
If you think that Hillary and Bill were only investors in Whitewater, think again. Payment checks were sent to Whitewater Development Corporation, C/O Hillary Rodham Clinton.

DickLeonard
02-18-2008, 07:17 PM
Bush's grandfather was Hitlers Banker, nobody cares about that. Hilliary killed her boyfriend that dumped her by running a stop sign and crashing into his car. Nobody cares about that. Nobody cares about WhiteWater either.####

pooltchr
02-18-2008, 07:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Nobody cares about WhiteWater either.#### <hr /></blockquote>

I would imagine those who got ripped off by their scam probably do.
Steve

Qtec
02-18-2008, 07:39 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr> There's nothing like experience when dealing with those predatory lenders.

The Whitewater scam, a la Clinton:

"But the Clintons and McDougall did things differently. When customers wanted to buy a lot, they signed a simple purchase agreement. Bu this was no ordinary real estate contract. The small print at the bottom read: "In the event the default continues for 30 days...payments made by the purchaser SHALL BE CONSIDERED AS RENT for the use of the premises." In other words, the buyers did not actually take ownership of their property until the final payment was made. If a buyer missed just one monthly payment, all their previous payments would be classified as rent and they would have no equity in the land at all.

This sort of contract was illegal in many other states, because it was considered exploitative of the poor and uneducated. One look at the experience of those who bought into Whitewater and you can see why.

Clyde Soapes was a grain-elevator operator from Texas who heard about the lots in early 1980 and jumped at the chance to invest. He put $3,000 down and began making payments of $244.69 per month. He made THIRTY-FIVE payments in all--totaling $11,564.15, just short of the $14,000 price for the lot. Then he suddenly fell ill with diabetes and missed a payment, then two. The Clintons informed him that he had lost the land and all of his money. There was no court proceeding or compensation. Months later they resold his property to a couple from Nevada for $16,500. After they too missed a payment, the Clintons resold it yet again.

Soapes and the couple from Nevada were not alone. MORE THAN HALF of the people who bought lots in Whitewater...made payments, missed one or two, and then lost their land without getting a dime of their equity back. According to Whitewater records, at least sixteen different buyers paid more than $50,000 and never received a property deed. The Clintons continued this approach up until the 1992 electrion, when they tried to quietly get out of the investment."

Taken from "Do As I Say" by Peter Schweizer

<hr /></blockquote>

This was what? 20 years ago? Did it amount to a hill of beans?

You guys need to get some therapy.
Its over.
Bill is no longer Pres.

Q............its pathetic.

The Govt took the US to war under false pretences.
Kenny boy [ Enron] was causing black-outs in Ca just to make more money.
Haliburton which has been shown [ many times] to be ripping off the taxpayer gets even more no-bid contracts.
The company that made sub-standard helmets for soldiers gets fined and gets a new contract?

etc etc etc ....I could go on all day but YOU guys can't get over the fact that despite 73 mil spent on trying to bring down the Clintons , it all amounted to a hill of beans. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif

pooltchr
02-18-2008, 07:47 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr>
Its over.
Bill is no longer Pres.

Q
<hr /></blockquote>

But Hillary wants to be...and her hands are just as dirty on this one as Bills....if not dirtier. After all, Gayle says Hillary is a genius...so cooking up a scam like Whitewater should have been a breeze for her.

I know you don't live in this country, but the fact is, some of us do, and we would like to try to keep the crooks out of Washington...not send more back there.
Steve

Qtec
02-18-2008, 08:12 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote pooltchr:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr>
Its over.
Bill is no longer Pres.

Q
<hr /></blockquote>

But Hillary wants to be...and her hands are just as dirty on this one as Bills....if not dirtier. After all, Gayle says Hillary is a genius...so cooking up a scam like Whitewater should have been a breeze for her.

I know you don't live in this country, but the fact is, some of us do, and we would like to try to keep the crooks out of Washington...not send more back there.
Steve <hr /></blockquote>

Hillary has been convicted of ...................exactly what?

Q

bamadog
02-18-2008, 08:16 PM
Sorry Q, but we are not talking about the war here. From the book, "This sort of contract was illegal in many other states, because it was considered exploitative of the poor and uneducated. One look at the experience of those who bought into Whitewater and you can see why."

This type of contract was legal in Arkansas at the time.
Bill and Hillary are both lawyers.
In fact Bill was the Attorney General.
But was it moral?
This con artist in running for President on the platform that she will be a champion for the little people. But her history tells a different story.

Qtec
02-18-2008, 09:39 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr> Sorry Q, but we are not talking about the war here. From the book, "This sort of contract was illegal in many other states, because it was considered exploitative of the poor and uneducated. One look at the experience of those who bought into Whitewater and you can see why."

This type of contract was legal in Arkansas at the time.
Bill and Hillary are both lawyers.
In fact Bill was the Attorney General.
But was it moral?
This con artist in running for President on the platform that she will be a champion for the little people. But her history tells a different story. <hr /></blockquote>

Was it moral?

Are you aware that at the same time the GOP was castigating BC that those most vociferous were having affairs and engaging in foot tapping?

Q

bamadog
02-18-2008, 10:20 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Qtec:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr> Sorry Q, but we are not talking about the war here. From the book, "This sort of contract was illegal in many other states, because it was considered exploitative of the poor and uneducated. One look at the experience of those who bought into Whitewater and you can see why."

This type of contract was legal in Arkansas at the time.
Bill and Hillary are both lawyers.
In fact Bill was the Attorney General.
But was it moral?
This con artist in running for President on the platform that she will be a champion for the little people. But her history tells a different story. <hr /></blockquote>

Was it moral?

Are you aware that at the same time the GOP was castigating BC that those most vociferous were having affairs and engaging in foot tapping?

Q <hr /></blockquote>

I know this is hard for you, but could you please try to stay on subject.
Do you believe that these kinds of lending practices are moral?

eg8r
02-18-2008, 10:51 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Hillary has been convicted of ...................exactly what? <hr /></blockquote> Why is conviction so important to you when Hillary is being referred to, but when we talk about that secretary you don't care about conviction?

LOL, Hillary is not guilty because she was never convicted but Cheney and all are totally guilty even though they also were never convicted.

eg8r

eg8r
02-18-2008, 10:55 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Hilliary killed her boyfriend that dumped her by running a stop sign and crashing into his car. Nobody cares about that. <hr /></blockquote> Your brain is failing you lately. I am beginning to think this is common among aging leftists. Gayle forgetting she is the one who outed herself and now you forgetting to type the correct name in your post.

[ QUOTE ]
Nobody cares about that. Nobody cares about WhiteWater either.#### <hr /></blockquote> LOL, Laura was never running for President. For some reason this simple fact escapes a partisan leftist as yourself. Clinton has not seen the last of her foils. If she is nominated all her dirty laundry will be coming out once again. I just wished Rove was still running the game because he would show all the trash of Hillary Clinton, the biggest lying First Lady of all time.

eg8r

LWW
02-19-2008, 04:56 AM
You know the answer ... he's a partisan lapdog.

LWW

Deeman3
02-19-2008, 08:17 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Hilliary killed her boyfriend that dumped her by running a stop sign and crashing into his car. Nobody cares about that. <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> I care, but I have never heard that one on Hillary. The worst she has ever been accused of is offing Vince Foster which is probably not true. Spreading unfounded rumors is not nice.</font color>

Gayle in MD
02-19-2008, 10:20 AM
Unless they're Republilcan Crooks. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Nothing the Clinton's did back then was illegal. That's already been proven. Bill lied about his sex life. Big deal! Scooter Libby lied about Cheney and Bush's involvement in outing a CIA covert agent. No problemo. Laura Bush crashed into her ex boyfriend's car on a moonlite night, and was never called into court. No problemo! Bush lied us into an un-necessary war. No problemo! Thousand of e-mails, missing, from the weeks surrounding the treasonist outing of a covert agent. No problemo. Bush's grandfather was in bed with Hitler! No problemo. Bush was involved in insider trading. So what? Bush has us burried in trillions of dollars of debt. Awe. So what? McCain is now running for president when everyone on Capital Hill knows he's a maniac. Who cares? /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Gayle in MD
02-19-2008, 10:21 AM
We know Richard Clarke isn't a terrorist. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Gayle in MD
02-19-2008, 10:24 AM
Because Three Federal judges, and the Special Prosecutor have stated that the White House used Scooter Libby to take the fall for their treason, that's why. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

bamadog
02-19-2008, 10:40 AM
That's right Gayle, hijack the thread for another one of your delusional hate-filled rants.
Have you got a comment on the morality of Bill and Hill's lending practices?

DickLeonard
02-19-2008, 11:10 AM
Deeman I am sorry for my first mistake. It was Laura Bush that Whacked her boyfriend that dumped her. From my understanding this case remains open if the State of Texas can find sufficent evidence to prove homicide she could be tried for murder. The only one who knows was her girlfriend who was riding with her and she is not talking. ####

LWW
02-19-2008, 12:10 PM
Prove it.

LWW

LWW
02-19-2008, 12:12 PM
We all know her answer to that Dawg ...

... B-B-B-BUT B-B-B-BOOOOSH!

lww

Deeman3
02-19-2008, 01:35 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote DickLeonard:</font><hr> Deeman I am sorry for my first mistake. It was Laura Bush that Whacked her boyfriend that dumped her. From my understanding this case remains open if the State of Texas can find sufficent evidence to prove homicide she could be tried for murder. The only one who knows was her girlfriend who was riding with her and she is not talking. #### <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> That's o.k. Dick. I just wanted to make sure you were not jumping on the "Get Hillary" bandwagon. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif Looks like she has her hands full discrediting Obama right now although it seems she may run away with Wisconsin now as she steps up her attacks. That would just put her Texas or Ohio away from getting to the convention where she can really sell her soul for all to see. This is gonna be pretty....</font color>

LWW
02-19-2008, 02:11 PM
It obviously is part of the Bush strategery.

LWW

eg8r
02-19-2008, 02:22 PM
[ QUOTE ]
No problemo. Laura Bush crashed into her ex boyfriend's car on a moonlite night, and was never called into court. No problemo! <hr /></blockquote> Can someone explain why Laura is constantly brought up as getting off scott free and you refuse to mention Uncle Ted and his mishap one moonlit night? I mean, come on, Laura is not even running for office, why bring her up?

eg8r

eg8r
02-19-2008, 02:26 PM
No one is guilty over the outing of Plame. You can get all the judges you want to say whatever you want them to say but in the end everyone is innocent. That is the law.

Now, back to topic, why aren't you talking about the actual subject of this post which is the lending practices of the Clintons. You are in an uproar about the banks and financial institutions right now but you seem to be OK with the "theft" of the clintons with respect to Whitewater. The Clinton's scammed the innocent dummies that you seem to want to protect now but you could care less about them 20 years ago. Why has your "care" for these victims changed so much over the years?

eg8r

eg8r
02-19-2008, 02:35 PM
The other thing we know is that I did not shoot from the hip and threaten to sue someone over my own mistake.

LWW
02-19-2008, 03:02 PM
You know the answer to that...

...Gayle, Wolfie, Dick, Hondo, SONoma, are all partisan lapdogs who would excuse extermination camps as long as they were marked "THESE FACILITIES SUPPLIED BY THE DNC", and yes we all know it's true.

LWW

wolfdancer
02-19-2008, 03:34 PM
What we do know is that you that shouldn't be allowed to surf the net without supervision.
Is there some reason that you continue to bring me up in your posts long after I wrote you off as a f**king loser???

LWW
02-19-2008, 04:34 PM
Because you are a partisan whiner.

LWW

Qtec
02-20-2008, 03:09 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bamadog:</font><hr>
I know this is hard for you, but could you please try to stay on subject.
Do you believe that these kinds of lending practices are moral? <hr /></blockquote>

The article is totally misleading. This type of purchase agreement was not only legal but STANDARD practice at the time. The Clintons were passive partners- they were not involved in the running of the company- and Clyde Soaps may have lost his investment but he didn't lose his home.

[ QUOTE ]
Clyde Soapes was a grain-elevator operator from Texas who heard about the lots in early 1980 and jumped at the chance to invest. He put $3,000 down and began making payments of $244.69 per month. He made THIRTY-FIVE payments in all--totaling $11,564.15, just short of the $14,000 price for the lot. Then he suddenly fell ill with diabetes and missed a payment, then two. The Clintons informed him that he had lost the land and all of his money.<hr /></blockquote>
The Clintons never informed him of anything. James McDougal was running the company.
[ QUOTE ]
There was no court proceeding or compensation.<hr /></blockquote>

Why would there be? The author has already said that NO CRIME had been committed but now he insinuates that something possibly illegal has occured.

[ QUOTE ]
!Months later they resold his property to a couple from Nevada for $16,500. After they too missed a payment, the Clintons resold it yet again. <hr /></blockquote>

Geez, now he implies that the Clintons must have been making a fortune! When if FACT the company went bust and the Clintons LOST money!!!!

How did it all start?

[ QUOTE ]
The research into Whitewater is interesting because of the roles of several prominent Arkansas Republicans in the financial mis-dealings of James McDougal and David Hale. In addition, it appears that the really large Arkansas S&amp;Ls, the ones that failed at costs of over a billion dollars to the American taxpayer all had Republican connections. I guess it was just luck that these S&amp;Ls were not examined in a criminal investigation. This is kind of strange because these S&amp;Ls were specifically identified by the Little Rock FBI office as being good candidates for investigation and possible criminal prosecution. The Bush S&amp;L regulatory agencies ignored the recommendations of the Little Rock FBI office, and the Bush FBI took no further action. When the Resolution Trust Corporation closed its doors in December 1995, the last possible legal case against these S&amp;Ls disappeared. There were concerns in 1993 that the Clinton administration would put its own people into the S&amp;L regulatory agencies. A preemptive strike was needed and a preemptive strike was launched.

In the summer of 1993, Federal authorities were moving to indict David Hale, an Arkansas judge and the owner of a lending company authorized to make Small Business Administration loans. It seems Judge Hale defrauded the SBA (and the American people) of $3.4 million dollars. Turned down by the Federal attorney in Little Rock on a plea bargain, Hale, for the first time, accused President Clinton of pressuring him in 1986 to make a $300,000 SBA loan to Susan McDougal. This accusation was the basis for the appointing of a Whitewater Special Prosecutor in early 1994. <hr /></blockquote>
web page (http://www.netmagic.net/~franklin/GW1.html)
web page (http://www.netmagic.net/~franklin/MR1.html)

A hill of beans.

Q

bamadog
02-20-2008, 10:54 AM
And, of course, you dodge the one and only question I asked about this scam, "was it moral?". We already know it was legal in Arkansas at the time, but was illegal in other states.
Concentrate.
Are these the gutter morals we want in a President?

eg8r
02-20-2008, 12:20 PM
[ QUOTE ]
And, of course, you dodge the one and only question I asked about this scam, "was it moral?". We already know it was legal in Arkansas at the time, but was illegal in other states.
<hr /></blockquote> The question of the morality is definitely worthy given the left is in such and "uproar" over the perfectly legal lending practices currently in question but seem to ignore the legal "shady" lending practices of the Clintons from 20+ years ago.

eg8r

eg8r
02-20-2008, 12:22 PM
Isn't it hilarious to listen to Hillary tell everyone she has been helping the little guy for the past 35 years while knowing that during Whitewater she was legally "stealing" from the little guy 20+ years ago.

eg8r

wolfdancer
02-20-2008, 12:46 PM
How dare you sir....accusing a United States Senator of stealing....
What is this country coming to?

Gayle in MD
02-20-2008, 01:23 PM
Ted had to go to court. How bout Laura? /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Deeman3
02-20-2008, 01:31 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> Ted had to go to court. How bout Laura? /ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif <hr /></blockquote>

<font color="blue"> She's a whole lot smarter than Ted? </font color>

Gayle in MD
02-20-2008, 01:34 PM
No charges were ever even filed against Hillary Clinton. There were no obstruction of justice convictions, either, by any of her associates. Don't try to compare Hillary, to Libby's cover up, what the hell do you think obstruction of justice, means, anyway? The case couldn't be made, because Libby took the fall. Got it? Do you think the judge and prosecutor, and even the jurors, who spoke about the case, all lied, or what?

You know what they did Ed, you just like to annoy others with your hair splitting.

Have at it. Who cares? We all know that you refues to acknowledge the carnage this country has been through because of George Bush. None of it came to light because some left wing operative of Democrats was out to get Bush, Cheney and their crooked aides, it came out because the CIA requested an investigation into those responsible for outing Plame. The cloud remains over the Whtie HOuse, and refute it all you like, the rest of the country knows what they did, and it was much more horrible than anything the Clinton's were ever investigated for doing, with no criminal charges even filed. Kenneth Starr showed his ass, Newt made a complete fool of himself, along with many other guilty Republicans, who were doing the same, and worse, all of Europe was laughing at the Republicans, and people are leaving the Republican party by the hundreds of thousands. End of story.
/ccboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Gayle

LWW
02-20-2008, 01:40 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Gayle in MD:</font><hr> No charges were ever even filed against Hillary Clinton. There were no obstruction of justice convictions, either, by any of her associates.

Gayle<hr /></blockquote>
Sorry sweetheart, but the hypocxrisy from you over "NO CHARGES" is amazing.

BTW, and not that you care, but quite a few peeps have been indicted, jailed, fined, and even dead following business dealings with the Clintonistas.

LWW

bamadog
02-20-2008, 02:30 PM
That's the thing about the Libs, El Dub, it's never about morality, it's about "legality". That's why their heroes are lawyers.
The fact that Gayle can't condemn this despicable behavior by Billary, tells us all we need to know about her moral compass.

eg8r
02-20-2008, 02:56 PM
I thought I typed it out as legally "stealing"?

eg8r

eg8r
02-20-2008, 02:57 PM
Once again...Is Laura running for office?

eg8r

eg8r
02-20-2008, 03:02 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Don't try to compare Hillary, to Libby's cover up <hr /></blockquote> The comparison is not those two at all. If you take a quick second and comprehend what is being asked, I am comparing QTECs reaction to those two different issues. Why is this simple comprehension so advanced for you?

On top of you screwing that up you also thought I was referring to Libby which proves once again you don't comprehend what you read. I feel like I need to talk to you like you are a 3rd grader and I need to spell everything out.

eg8r

Qtec
02-24-2008, 09:02 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bamadog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And, of course, you dodge the one and only question I asked about this scam, "was it moral?". We already know it was legal in Arkansas at the time, but was illegal in other states.
Concentrate.
Are these the gutter morals we want in a President? </div></div>

How can it be a scam? If you made the payments you got the land!
If you were sensible and bought the land with money loaned from a bank, you would still get back most of your money if you defaulted because you would own the land.

Was it moral?
[ I'm not even sure that is a proper sentence. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif ]
It would all depend on the meaning of 'it' LOL /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif and what you define as moral.
Is there any morality in Capitalism?
Isn't the bottom line making money?

If the only thing you have got to show how immoral Hillary is that she was a silent partner in a company that used a totally standard and legal contract...............?

I don't like Hillary. I'm not defending her.

Q

Qtec
02-24-2008, 09:38 PM
[quote=eg8r] <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Hillary has been convicted of ...................exactly what? &lt;hr /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt; Why is conviction so important to you when Hillary is being referred to, but when we talk about that secretary you don't care about conviction?

LOL, Hillary is not guilty because she was never convicted but Cheney and all are totally guilty even though they also were never convicted.

eg8r </div></div>

You are a nitwit. Gasp..... I was being sarcastic!!!!!!!!!!!
I was parroting YOU.

By 1999 after an investigation into EVERYTHING the Clintons had ever done [ unprecedented ] had cost $70 million .
The SP investigating the Plame leak got no further than Libby at a cost of $700,0000.

The investigation into the Plame leak has been frozen. There is no final report that proclaims that Cheney, Rove etc are INNOCENT! Anyone who can read and takes the trouble to find out the facts knows that they were both involved . They are still very much under suspicion.

In the case of the Clintons , they have been put under the microscope, as no other Pres couple ever, and guess what, they were declared innocent.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hale, a former Arkansas judge and banker, is serving 28 months in jail for mail fraud and conspiracy. He has previously predicted that Hillary Clinton will be indicted by Starr. His key allegation against the president -- that Clinton participated in a conversation about an illegal $300,000 loan -- has reportedly been corroborated recently by James McDougal, another convicted Whitewater figure and Clinton's former business partner.

In the AP interview, Hale described a coordinated effort among Clinton associates in 1992 to obscure their involvement in questionable transactions. "I had a number of conversations in which Clinton allies described how the problem was being handled -- files being gathered so that investigators wouldn't find them later," he said.

Neither Hale nor McDougal are viewed as reliable witnesses, however. Responding to Hale, Clinton lawyer David told AP, "David Hale lied repeatedly when he perpetrated his many frauds, and he even lied to the judge who sentenced him for a few of his felonies. The pattern continues. His inventive and ever-changing fabrications are not worthy of further comment."</div></div>

Q

eg8r
02-24-2008, 11:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The investigation into the Plame leak has been frozen. There is no final report that proclaims that Cheney, Rove etc are INNOCENT! </div></div> Hey nitwit in the US, no matter how hard the left try to get around this rule, you are INNOCENT until proven guilty. Now crawl back in that little hole of yours and dream the fantasy dream you and gayle so sadly dream about.

The Plame outing did not even amount to a hill of beans. No matter how much you "think", and I use that word very loose with you, you know what you are talking about it still does not amount to a hill of beans.

eg8r

bamadog
02-24-2008, 11:42 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bamadog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And, of course, you dodge the one and only question I asked about this scam, "was it moral?". We already know it was legal in Arkansas at the time, but was illegal in other states.
Concentrate.
Are these the gutter morals we want in a President? </div></div>

How can it be a scam? If you made the payments you got the land!
If you were sensible and bought the land with money loaned from a bank, you would still get back most of your money if you defaulted because you would own the land.

Was it moral?
[ I'm not even sure that is a proper sentence. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif ]
It would all depend on the meaning of 'it' LOL /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif and what you define as moral.
Is there any morality in Capitalism?
Isn't the bottom line making money?

If the only thing you have got to show how immoral Hillary is that she was a silent partner in a company that used a totally standard and legal contract...............?

I don't like Hillary. I'm not defending her.

Q </div></div>

So, if that is the case then you would have no problem with the so called "predatory lending practices" of the mortgage companies. You know, the ones that Hillary and Obama are screaming about. After all, they are legal also.
Btw, have you ever bought a home? Have you ever heard of a mortgage contract where, if you miss a couple of payments, you lose all your equity?
That is what the Clintons were engaged in.
Do you understand the meaning of moral?
You seem to be having a tough time grasping the concept.

Qtec
02-25-2008, 08:07 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">no matter how hard the left try to get around this rule, you are INNOCENT until proven guilty. </div></div>

Like Bill? Or Hillary?

Oh PLEASE. Don't give me that crap - its a myth.
Remember the so called 'dirty bomber'?
How about OBL.
How about those in Gitmo? Are they also innocent?
Are you allowed within US law to torture people who are deemed to be innocent?

YOU have constantly hammered on BC and HC, but its a LOAD of crap!

Before Novak's story came out, Libby, Rove and others were talking to the press about Wilson's wife. They were ACTIVELY spreading info to the press that was AGAINST the common interest of the country.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> you are INNOCENT until proven guilty.</div></div>

So why bring up the Cliton's past record when after an exhaustive investigatiopn they were never charged with anything!

eg8r speak with forked tongue! eg8r has one standard for some and another for the rest.

Q

bamadog
02-25-2008, 10:45 PM
What were Rove and Cheney charged with?

eg8r
02-26-2008, 07:59 AM
It gets so tiresome trying to have a discussion with you because you try so hard to act like an idiot. Maybe I am wrong, maybe it is just ignorance on my part thinking you probably are not really an idiot. Anyways, the US laws and such cover US citizens and those in the US. Now, when I post "innocent until proven guilty" this does not apply to OBL but I am sure you were not dumb enough to not understand this. It is sad to have to point this out to a grown man who acts like he knows something.

billary deserve all the harping they get. It is nice to see the voting democrats still agree that the clintons are no good for the US and voting as such against hillary. As far as your question about billary's guilt...Yes I believe they are innocent until proven guilty. This is the law of the land here in the US. That is the legal side, on a personal side you know as well as I do that they are guilty of everything they have been accused of. This is just like OJ. Under the law of the land he is innocent, but personally we all know he did the crime.

Now with that all cleared up, quit trying to act like an argumentative nitwit every time you make a post.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So why bring up the Cliton's past record when after an exhaustive investigatiopn they were never charged with anything!
</div></div> Why, you continue to bring up plame and no one was charged with outing her. Case closed and it never amounted to a hill of beans.

eg8r

Qtec
02-27-2008, 09:08 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It gets so tiresome trying to have a discussion with you because </div></div> Ditto.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you try so hard to act like an idiot. </div></div>
Somehow I don't get the impression YOU have to try! I think its just comes natural to you. LOL

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> As far as your question about billary's guilt...Yes I believe they are innocent until proven guilty. This is the law of the land here in the US. That is the legal side, on a personal side you know as well as I do that they are guilty of everything they have been accused of.
eg8r </div></div>

...and you believe this DESPITE the TOTAL LACK of evidence and after a thorough $70 million investigation into every aspect of their private life!!!!!

Isn't it true that if tommorrow Karl Rove would say that the Clintons roasted babies on a spit you would believe it?

All I get from you is wild accusations and bizare theories with no actual facts to back them up. You are just like one of these guys at Hyde Park Corner in London who stand on soapboxes and say the first thing that comes into their head- no matter how ridiculous it is.

Q

eg8r
02-27-2008, 10:48 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...and you believe this DESPITE the TOTAL LACK of evidence and after a thorough $70 million investigation into every aspect of their private life!!!!!</div></div> This is the same TOTAL LACK of evidence that we have observed in the secretary case.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Isn't it true that if tommorrow Karl Rove would say that the Clintons roasted babies on a spit you would believe it?</div></div> That would be true in your mind. I like to live in reality, I just wish you did.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All I get from you is wild accusations and bizare theories with no actual facts to back them up. You are just like one of these guys at Hyde Park Corner in London who stand on soapboxes and say the first thing that comes into their head- no matter how ridiculous it is.</div></div> Well then pat yourself on the back for being just a great role model. Your picture sits right next to this definition.

eg8r

Qtec
02-29-2008, 11:31 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...and you believe this DESPITE the TOTAL LACK of evidence and after a thorough $70 million investigation into every aspect of their private life!!!!!</div></div> This is the same TOTAL LACK of evidence that we have observed in the secretary case.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Isn't it true that if tommorrow Karl Rove would say that the Clintons roasted babies on a spit you would believe it?</div></div> That would be true in your mind. I like to live in reality, I just wish you did.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All I get from you is wild accusations and bizare theories with no actual facts to back them up. You are just like one of these guys at Hyde Park Corner in London who stand on soapboxes and say the first thing that comes into their head- no matter how ridiculous it is.</div></div> Well then pat yourself on the back for being just a great role model. Your picture sits right next to this definition.

eg8r </div></div>

eg8r's facts-"its a hill of beans".

Q. FACT. Everybody knows that Libby was spreading Plame's status and connection to Wilson around town, BEFORE the Novak article came out.

Do you see the difference? You are just blabbing. I at least provide links, articles, vids and Docs to support my argument. I base my opinion on the known facts, not my own personal bias.

Actually, this is pointless. I keep forgetting that it is impossible for reason to penetrate that 'granite like skull'.

The outing of Plame destroyed her career. Did she deserve that, after 22 years in the CIA, from her own CIC?
She was identified as a covert CIA WMD specialist but did the Govt care about her safety?
After all, they had just said to every Islamist terrorist on the planet "HERE SHE IS".

...............and GW says, "vote for me. I will protect you"!

Q