PDA

View Full Version : A Pro Tapered Shaft or a Parabolic Tapered Shaft?



1Time
03-09-2008, 10:05 PM
I bought a couple cues on eBay recently, one with a pro tapered shaft and the other with a parabolic tapered shaft. Having used cues with pro tapered shafts for over 25 years, I fully expected not to like the cue with the parabolic tapered shaft. However, to my surprise I found I prefer the cue with the parabolic tapered shaft.

Anyone else have a parabolic tapered shaft on their main stick?

cushioncrawler
03-10-2008, 03:38 AM
What iz the difference, in play, for u????? madMac.

1Time
03-10-2008, 04:18 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What iz the difference, in play, for u????? madMac. </div></div>
The cue ball goes where I want it to go with more precision and with less effort.

I assume the main reason for this is less deflection. I apply what first seems to be the right amount of English and it works, no second guessing or adapting. The cue seems to be a good match for me.

The other reason has to do with how I use the side of the shaft to help me aim and imagine the shot. For the longest I preferred a pro taper so I could use the shaft's straight edge for this. And so it seems unexplainably weird how I am now not negatively affected by the sloped edge of the parabolic tapered shaft.

One thing that's not right yet though is I can't get enough draw on the cue ball. But I attribute that to its crappy "5th Avenue" 5 layer tip. I can shoot follow with it quite well, but drawing the ball is well below par. Can't wait to get a new tip on it, a Talisman Pro if I can.

cushioncrawler
03-10-2008, 05:02 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1Time</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What iz the difference, in play, for u????? madMac. </div></div>
The cue ball goes where I want it to go with more precision and with less effort.

I assume the main reason for this is less deflection. I apply what first seems to be the right amount of English and it works, no second guessing or adapting. The cue seems to be a good match for me.

The other reason has to do with how I use the side of the shaft to help me aim and imagine the shot. For the longest I preferred a pro taper so I could use the shaft's straight edge for this. And so it seems unexplainably weird how I am now not negatively affected by the sloped edge of the parabolic tapered shaft.

One thing that's not right yet though is I can't get enough draw on the cue ball. But I attribute that to its crappy "5th Avenue" 5 layer tip. I can shoot follow with it quite well, but drawing the ball is well below par. Can't wait to get a new tip on it, a Talisman Pro if I can. </div></div>Re "less draw", i reckon that koz of the taper the qtip iz actually going up a bit, throo the qball, this will rob some draw. This iz koz the cue iz supported on the bottom of your loop (or vee). In effekt u will be hitting higher on the qball than u think, perhaps not a higher "contact" relativ to the bedcloth, but higher "line", if u see what i mean.

Re the "aim-line", if u uze the left edge of the cue for aim, and if the cue haz a (larger) taper, and haz less "deflexion", then i reckon that i would expekt to overcut shots when uzing left-english, and undercut shots when uzing right-hand-english. Unless u had the habit of pushing the cue shaft to the left into your loop (or vee), in which case the taper would affekt the qtip line here allso. madMac.

Bob_Jewett
03-10-2008, 05:28 PM
I wonder how they define "parabolic taper". I saw one on-line description that mentions that there is no straight section in the taper, but there are lots of ways to construct a parabola, and there are lots of curves that at first glance may resemble parabolas but are not.

av84fun
03-11-2008, 12:48 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1Time</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What iz the difference, in play, for u????? madMac. </div></div>
The cue ball goes where I want it to go with more precision and with less effort.

I assume the main reason for this is less deflection. I apply what first seems to be the right amount of English and it works, no second guessing or adapting. The cue seems to be a good match for me.

The other reason has to do with how I use the side of the shaft to help me aim and imagine the shot. For the longest I preferred a pro taper so I could use the shaft's straight edge for this. And so it seems unexplainably weird how I am now not negatively affected by the sloped edge of the parabolic tapered shaft.

One thing that's not right yet though is I can't get enough draw on the cue ball. But I attribute that to its crappy "5th Avenue" 5 layer tip. I can shoot follow with it quite well, but drawing the ball is well below par. Can't wait to get a new tip on it, a Talisman Pro if I can. </div></div>Re "less draw", i reckon that koz of the taper the qtip iz actually going up a bit, throo the qball, this will rob some draw. This iz koz the cue iz supported on the bottom of your loop (or vee). In effekt u will be hitting higher on the qball than u think, perhaps not a higher "contact" relativ to the bedcloth, but higher "line", if u see what i mean.

Re the "aim-line", if u uze the left edge of the cue for aim, and if the cue haz a (larger) taper, and haz less "deflexion", then i reckon that i would expekt to overcut shots when uzing left-english, and undercut shots when uzing right-hand-english. Unless u had the habit of pushing the cue shaft to the left into your loop (or vee), in which case the taper would affekt the qtip line here allso. madMac. </div></div>

Right. It is the same reason that the cue tip rises when you use a cue extender instead of a bridge. As the shaft thickens (beyond the pro taper) but your bridge height remains the same, the tip must rise.

It may help to use a dime radius tip shape (which allows a slightly lower hit) and stroke the draw shots like the Philipinos with the tip ALMOST dragging on the cloth before cb impact.

Regards,
Jim

1Time
03-12-2008, 04:06 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Re "less draw", i reckon that koz of the taper the qtip iz actually going up a bit, throo the qball, this will rob some draw. This iz koz the cue iz supported on the bottom of your loop (or vee). In effekt u will be hitting higher on the qball than u think, perhaps not a higher "contact" relativ to the bedcloth, but higher "line", if u see what i mean. </div></div>
Yes, that's a given. Didn't think to mention it as a factor. I've got my hopes on a better tip solving the problem. It's a very gradual taper.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cushioncrawler</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Re the "aim-line", if u uze the left edge of the cue for aim, and if the cue haz a (larger) taper, and haz less "deflexion", then i reckon that i would expekt to overcut shots when uzing left-english, and undercut shots when uzing right-hand-english. Unless u had the habit of pushing the cue shaft to the left into your loop (or vee), in which case the taper would affekt the qtip line here allso. madMac. </div></div>
The cue had a larger and odd taper to begin with, was stiffer and had less deflection (a cheap cue). But I took it to a custom cue maker and he smoothed out the taper and the whole shaft out pretty nice. As far as aiming the shaft seems to work better than any pro tapered shaft I've used. For me the less I have to adapt to the cue the better, and the more automatic my aiming and shooting is. And that makes pool really fun for me.

1Time
03-12-2008, 04:22 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bob_Jewett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wonder how they define "parabolic taper". I saw one on-line description that mentions that there is no straight section in the taper, but there are lots of ways to construct a parabola, and there are lots of curves that at first glance may resemble parabolas but are not. </div></div>
I think "parabolic taper" has been used to describe a curved taper, as opposed to a pro taper which has a constant diameter, or a conical taper which increases in diameter at a constant rate. I'm sure there are shapes other than "parabolic" used in shafts, but I know of no other name that better describes them.

Bob_Jewett
03-12-2008, 06:48 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1Time</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... I'm sure there are shapes other than "parabolic" used in shafts, but I know of no other name that better describes them. </div></div>
A characteristic of a parabola is that the slope increases at a constant rate. I doubt that the taper of a so-called "parabolic" shaft increases uniformly, but I suppose it could. I suspect that a better description would be "hyperbolic" since a hyperbola approaches a straight line on each end while a parabola never approaches a straight line. It would be useful if someone actually profiled their tapers, which I did for my own cue a long time ago. The closest I see to useful info is a description of the various tapers Schuler provides at http://www.billiardwarehouse.com/cueobsessions/schuler/schuler_shaft.htm

1Time
03-16-2008, 09:08 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bob_Jewett</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1Time</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... I'm sure there are shapes other than "parabolic" used in shafts, but I know of no other name that better describes them. </div></div>
A characteristic of a parabola is that the slope increases at a constant rate. I doubt that the taper of a so-called "parabolic" shaft increases uniformly, but I suppose it could. I suspect that a better description would be "hyperbolic" since a hyperbola approaches a straight line on each end while a parabola never approaches a straight line. It would be useful if someone actually profiled their tapers, which I did for my own cue a long time ago. The closest I see to useful info is a description of the various tapers Schuler provides at http://www.billiardwarehouse.com/cueobsessions/schuler/schuler_shaft.htm </div></div>

I agree. Parabolic definitely does not apply. Seems to me it might as well be referred to in general as a curved or sloped taper.

And, that's some good info from that site, which I quote as follows:

"Schuler Shafts: The ultimate in selection

Super X (29 in. x 13 mm) A shaft specifically designed to be forgiving in play. Shaft is flexible, and yields a soft hit.
Hit classification: soft.

Super Pro (29 in. x 13 mm) Gives a softer hit and maximum comfort through the fingers due to the insignificant growth of the shaft in a long stroking area. This shaft is more flexible than our Pro shafts, and produces a "softer" hit.
Hit classification: medium-soft.

Professional (29 in. x 13 mm) Our original "Pro" taper. Designed along the lines of the early "masters" such as Herman Rambow, Harvey Martin and George Balabushka. Minor taper in the stroking area allows for comfort while still providing some "spine".
Hit classification: medium-firm.

Schuler Pro (28.5 in. x 12.75 mm) Similar to the Professional™, but has increased diameter in the back half of the shaft. This combination forces the flex point further forward, giving a firmer hit. Very good for improving cue ball control.
Hit classification: firm.

American (28 in. x 12.5 mm) Back half of shaft is similar to the European™, with the front half of the shaft similar to the Professional™. This configuration produces a firm shaft with exceptional characteristics for control games, such straight pool, one-pocket, and 9-ball.
Hit classification: very firm.

European (27.5 in. x 12 mm) Also called Ceulemans' Taper. Grows quickly from the ferrule, with even faster growth at the midsection of the shaft. Provides maximum "spine" while giving some relief for the fingers. Excellent control, power, consistency.
Hit classification: stiff/very stiff.

Constant (27.5 in. x 12 mm) Tapers constantly (wedge shape) from the ferrule to the joint. Hit is similar to European.
Hit classification: stiff/very stiff.

Super Constant (27.5 in. x 12mm) Elliptical arcs combine to produce this powerhouse.
Hit classification: stiff/very stiff."