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big easy
06-01-2008, 11:34 PM
Has the jump shot taken away from the strategy of the game of pool, where the talent of snookering and getting out of a snooker helped to bring up your skill level

Deeman3
06-02-2008, 08:25 AM
Big Easy,

IMO it has taken much away, especialy from 9 ball. While it takes about 15 minutes to learn to jump with a light jump cue and perhaps a few weeks to become really good with it, knowing the kicking angles for multiple rails takes a lot longer to master. Now, the only safes that are really iron clad are if you are snug up against an object ball. It's not big deal as most everyone has learned to jump but it has made the game a lot easier for lesser skilled players. While some players, Reyes, etc. are some of the finest kickers in history, the average player can't kick as well as players a few years ago.

bmccaslin
06-02-2008, 08:41 AM
Yeah I'm not a fan of the jump shot either; I've seen many great safeties ruined by a jump cue.

I own a Jump/Break cue but have never used the jump shaft, nor do I plan to; I would much rather become proficient at kicking because I think that understanding how to kick and to recognize cue ball paths will make you a much, much better player.

Plus I play more Straight Pool and 8-Ball, so jump shots really don't come into play that often in those disciplines. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

SpiderMan
06-02-2008, 09:37 AM
The recent advent of the 40"-minimum-length rule created an entire new product category, the "jump cue". Prior to this rule, it was perfectly legal to execute a jump shot with just the shaft section of an ordinary two-piece cue. Mike Sigel was well known for this execution.

It's now MUCH easier to "get safe" on your opponent, because he's forced to use a conforming cue if he wants to jump.

In years past, you had to lock the ball up much closer to a blocker because anyone could clear a ball from only 2" away with a shaft-only jump and 15 minutes practice.

The "jump cue" rule has not hurt safety players, nor has it helped jumpers. Just the opposite, in fact. But the cuemakers loved it, because now you had to buy a new product rather than use something already in your case and more suitable to boot /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

SpiderMan

Rich R.
06-03-2008, 07:26 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: big easy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has the jump shot taken away from the strategy of the game of pool, where the talent of snookering and getting out of a snooker helped to bring up your skill level </div></div>
Jump shots have been legal for many years. It is the advent of the jump cue that has made it easier for players to jump.

When considering what the jump shot has done to the strategy of the game, I believe it is a two way street.
On one hand, when you are safed, it is easier to jump and get a good hit, if not make the ball.
On the other hand, it takes more care and skill to play a lock up safety on your opponent. Just getting behind a ball is not good enough any longer.

Deeman3
06-03-2008, 08:01 AM
Spiderman,

I remember the shaft only jump days. You could get as close as a half ball and clear it! In fact, Mike was the one that showed me how to execute this shot. Your point and a couple of others is correct, it is the stick, no the jump shot itself as most of us learned how to jump with our normal cue years ago and considered that more of a challenge.

It does require a better "safe" these days to lock someone up. However, the dowside is that most may get a good hit but still don't make the shot and leave you out, scratch or jump the table. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

SpiderMan
06-03-2008, 08:03 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rich R.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: big easy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has the jump shot taken away from the strategy of the game of pool, where the talent of snookering and getting out of a snooker helped to bring up your skill level </div></div>
Jump shots have been legal for many years. It is the advent of the jump cue that has made it easier for players to jump.

When considering what the jump shot has done to the strategy of the game, I believe it is a two way street.
On one hand, when you are safed, it is easier to jump and get a good hit, if not make the ball.
On the other hand, it takes more care and skill to play a lock up safety on your opponent. Just getting behind a ball is not good enough any longer. </div></div>

Before "jump cues", I used the shaft-only technique and the dart stroke. The advent of the jump cue, and outlawing of shaft jumps, has made the shot harder, not easier, for those who remember the way it was "before".

SpiderMan

Rail Rat
06-03-2008, 08:17 AM
The jump shot is ugly and table banging in many instances. I won't let any of my friends jump on my Simonis when they come over because of that. In some instances the jump can work without damage but a lot of players attempt it when its questionable in stead of employing a kick.

I think pool should stay in two dimensions myself, jumping takes pool into the trick shot arena. Can you imagine the jump allowed in Snooker? The game would lose its appeal as requiring a high skill level, in a way I'm afraid thats whats happening to pool.

Bambu
06-07-2008, 07:16 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SpiderMan</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rich R.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: big easy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has the jump shot taken away from the strategy of the game of pool, where the talent of snookering and getting out of a snooker helped to bring up your skill level </div></div>
Jump shots have been legal for many years. It is the advent of the jump cue that has made it easier for players to jump.

When considering what the jump shot has done to the strategy of the game, I believe it is a two way street.
On one hand, when you are safed, it is easier to jump and get a good hit, if not make the ball.
On the other hand, it takes more care and skill to play a lock up safety on your opponent. Just getting behind a ball is not good enough any longer. </div></div>

Before "jump cues", I used the shaft-only technique and the dart stroke. The advent of the jump cue, and outlawing of shaft jumps, has made the shot harder, not easier, for those who remember the way it was "before".
SpiderMan</div></div>

I never understood why they banned shaft jumping. Not arguing, but how is shaft jumping easier for you? I could see it being useful for short jumps because the cue ball wont fly off the table as easily. But for up or down table shots, I would think a shafts weight would lack the power required to separate the balls for a good/lucky safety.

Rail Rat
06-07-2008, 11:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bambu</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I never understood why they banned shaft jumping. Not arguing, but how is shaft jumping easier for you? I could see it being useful for short jumps because the cue ball wont fly off the table as easily. But for up or down table shots, I would think a shafts weight would lack the power required to separate the balls for a good/lucky safety. </div></div>

To be cynical one could say probably so the cue makers could sell more product. But I suspect that the reason is to keep control over equipment specs. But If they allowed us to only use only our shafts that should accheive that.

Fran Crimi
06-08-2008, 09:28 AM
How does snookering and getting out of a snooker bring up your skill level? I know players who try to snooker their opponents all day long because they can't run out. Does that make them better?

If a player decides to shoot a jump shot, they had either better pocket the ball or make sure they leave their opponent safe, or they are giving up the table. Anybody can jump a ball. It takes a skilled player to pick the right time to jump and the right way to do it.

Players who just learn how to jump a ball and nothing else will get burned because they will always leave an open table for their opponent. Sure, sometimes they will get lucky, but most of the time they won't.

Fran

mike60
06-18-2008, 04:13 AM
Has anyone ever seen Efran Reyes jump a ball?

zombiemodder
07-14-2008, 10:02 AM
I have thought that alot and have made a point of never jumping i don't even have a jump cue.