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View Full Version : Here's Your Real Death Panel



Qtec
10-10-2009, 02:52 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One of the things that you can never anticipate fully before becoming a parent is the absolute ferocity of the instinct to protect your child. It's innate, feral, and so deep that it can actually scare you. I am profoundly grateful every day that my children were born healthy, but I know that should my luck run out and one of my kids develop some sort of life-threatening illness, there is no stone I would leave unturned in my quest to save my child. There is no length I wouldn't go for my babies.

And if all those efforts were in vain, I don't know how I'd survive the loss of my child. I had a miscarriage some years back, and I carried that loss like a huge, gaping wound inside me for so long. And that was for a child with whom I never got a chance to know or develop a real bond.

Now imagine how Hilda Sarkisyan feels. The daughter she bore, raised and nurtured for seventeen years dies just hours before the insurance company she battled finally relented to give her daughter the liver transplant she needed. Can you imagine that grief, that anger at how unnecessary Nataline's death was? All the obstacles placed in their way by a for-profit insurance company in addition to just missing Nataline had to be paralyzing in its pain. </div></div> link (http://crooksandliars.com/nicole-belle/heres-your-real-death-panel-cigna-employees) <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cigna later apologized for the 2008 incident, but it has now become -- unintentionally -- the central element of a lawsuit Sarkisyan and her husband, Grigor, are pressing against the health insurer.

The suit began as a wrongful-death complaint, with the couple contending that Cigna's refusal to cover the transplant led to Nataline's death Dec. 20, 2007, in a case that drew national media attention.

A Los Angeles judge threw out the wrongful-death complaint, saying it was barred by a 1987 U.S. Supreme Court ruling that shields employer-paid healthcare plans from damages over their coverage decisions.

But U.S. District Judge Gary Allen Feess said the Sarkisyans could pursue damages for any emotional distress caused by the Philadelphia incident.

The ruling was bittersweet for the Sarkisyans and patient advocates, who say it points to the need for federal legislation to allow people to sue health insurers for the life-or-death decisions they make.

"They kill a beautiful 17-year-old girl, and I get to go after them for a finger? That's sick," Hilda Sarkisyan said. </div></div>

Real story.
Last Friday my girlfriend/partner [ 25 years] came home with what seemed like the flu. The day after, I got sick as well. Both of us were REALLY sick but after 3 days of fever and misery I felt the worst was over, but not for my girl. She got worse.
In short, she went to the Doc, the Doc sent her straight to hospital and she will be in for at least another week, if not more. She has an infection in both lungs and has real difficulty breathing. She gets checked every 1/2 hour by a nurse and even during the night she is seen by a Doctor every 2 hours. Another problem is she can't keep anything down and they don't know why. She has hardly eaten anything in a week.


At least there is ONE thing I don't have to worry about and that's the cost.
The cost will be zero.
I don't have to fight the insurance Company to get them to pay for recommended treatment. The Doc decides, not somebody trying to make his/her quota and bonus.

Thank God.


In the case above, if I was that girl's father, I would like to see the guy who refused the treatment..wouldn't you?

Q..........


..........actually, I should have been heading off today to sunny Spain! My brother and I had booked an apartment in a lux golf complex, La Torres. Everything is paid including 12 rounds on the best courses in the area, plus car.........can't go. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif Sigh...........oh well..........can't catch a break.....

llotter
10-10-2009, 07:43 AM
Cry me a river. I have my own problems and I don't need someone else's tragedy to further burden my life. And furthermore, I resent strangers that somehow feel they have the right to off-load their problems on me. Why should these strangers get first dibs on my very limited resources over my own sick child? Is it because my sick child get the right to take other strangers resources in the deal? What a wonder scheme this is; give up control of your property and hope others will act in your best interest instead of letting everyone take care of their own best interest. Give me the latter, thanks. Go pedal your utopian crap somewhere else.

I hope you friend recovers soon

Qtec
10-10-2009, 07:46 AM
God bless you.

Q......didn't ask for anything.

sack316
10-10-2009, 09:02 AM
Hope your girl has a speedy recovery and gets well soon.

Sack

llotter
10-10-2009, 09:12 AM
Ok, that last sentence about utopian crap was a bit gratuitous and distracting but don't you think you over reacted?

pooltchr
10-10-2009, 11:03 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> At least there is ONE thing I don't have to worry about and that's the cost.
The cost will be zero.
</div></div>

No, the cost will NOT be zero. Someone is paying for it.

That being said, I sincerely hope things work out for the best and quickly.

Steve

DickLeonard
10-10-2009, 11:15 AM
pooltchr most countries don't waste billions on a rusty war machine. Instead they provide health insurance to their citizens. It all depends on your prioritiea. ####

pooltchr
10-10-2009, 01:26 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DickLeonard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">pooltchr most countries don't waste billions on a rusty war machine. Instead they provide health insurance to their citizens. It all depends on your prioritiea. #### </div></div>

So are you saying that healthcare can be free?

How can someone live on this earth for more than a few years and not understand that NOTHING is free. Maybe it's part of the 60% tax rate that he pays, or taken out of someone elses income, but somebody is paying.

Steve

wolfdancer
10-10-2009, 02:15 PM
I must have missed the line where Dick said health care was free.
Could you quote the line, thanks?

Sev
10-10-2009, 03:24 PM
On the other hand most other countries are not called upon to be the worlds police and humanitarian force.

Now we could cut off all humanitarian and military aid world wide. Which would not be unrealistic if we whish to take care of our own first.
It also would help stimulate a rapid depopulation of many sectors of the world.

Gayle in MD
10-10-2009, 05:43 PM
Q.
I'm really sorry to learn that you and your Lady have been ill.

I hope that you will both have a speedy recovery.

Gayle

wolfdancer
10-11-2009, 01:42 AM
Q, I didn't think your post merited the angry reply that followed. Thought you were just sharing something personal with the entire board.
A few years back, a well liked member, Dave Syrja said goodbye to his friends here, telling us he had only a short time left to live. Later on his wife posted that he had passed on. I wonder what kind of angry replies they would receive here today?

Qtec
10-11-2009, 03:36 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wolfdancer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Q, I didn't think your post merited the angry reply that followed. Thought you were just sharing something personal with the entire board.
A few years back, a well liked member, Dave Syrja said goodbye to his friends here, telling us he had only a short time left to live. Later on his wife posted that he had passed on. I wonder what kind of angry replies they would receive here today? </div></div>

I want to thank those for their kind words and support. [ and PM's.....too right W.] All I did was give my own personal experience with HC here in Holland.........right NOW.

To me its all very simple, you can't put a price on life , but profit based Insurance companies do! I don't know how many times I have shown this.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The film's most interesting scene is an archived White House conversation between then-President Richard Nixon and his aide John Ehrlichman that Moore argues is the starting point of the modern healthcare complex. In the Feb. 7, 1971 recording -- part of the hundreds of hours of Nixon's secret White House tapes -- Ehrlichman explains "health maintenance organizations like Edward Kaiser's Permanente thing." Kaiser Permanente is now the nation's largest HMO.

<span style='font-size: 17pt'>"Edgar Kaiser is running his Permanente deal for profit. ... All the incentives are toward less medical care," Ehrlichman says to Nixon, according to a transcript. "The less care they give them, the more money they make." </span></div></div> check it out (http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Moores_new_movie_traces_healthcare_crisis_0619.htm l) v nbn

...and still?????? people like Steve mindlessly repeat talking points that come direct from the HS industry!
" Govt takeover"
" Socialized medicine"
etc etc


My example was not a one off. The same stories are replayed over and over. Check out ' Real people'. the truth............watch it Steve (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4kEvdyIcBk&feature=related)

The GOP Christian RW goes on and on about abortion and the ' Right to life' but when it comes down to it, they are very selective. Apparently, they think you only have a ' Right to life' if you can afford it.

Q..........

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"There will always be poor people in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your brothers and toward the poor and needy in your land." Deuteronomy 15:11

"For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and lose his own soul? Or what will a man give in exchange for his soul?" Matthew 16:26

"Then Jesus said to his disciples, 'I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.'" Matthew 19:23-24

</div></div>

eg8r
10-12-2009, 08:03 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">At least there is ONE thing I don't have to worry about and that's the cost.
The cost will be zero. </div></div>Are you really that stupid as to believe the cost is zero? You have been paying for this since the very first time you started paying taxes there. Wake up!!! I am positive that if you compare all the taxes you paid to cover this treatment it is a lot more expensive than any deductible that would have been required in the US.

Hope the two of you are feeling better soon.

eg8r

eg8r
10-12-2009, 08:03 AM
Why would anyone now be angry at Dave? He was a great person and sadly missed.

eg8r

eg8r
10-12-2009, 08:06 AM
Sorry Dick but there are zero countries that provide health insurance to anyone. It is the citizens that are paying taxes that are being forced to provide this insurance.

eg8r

LWW
10-12-2009, 08:44 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sev</div><div class="ubbcode-body">On the other hand most other countries are not called upon to be the worlds police and humanitarian force.</div></div>

Agreed ... if the Eurabian socialist democracies didn't live under the protection of US might it would be a race to see if they would collapse financially first or enter into yet another series of wars that would eliminate them from the planet.

For that matter, other than the UK, if their freedom hadn't been bought and paid for with US blood and treasure their socialist democracies wouldn't exist at all.

I have long said it's high time to bring the boys home and let the Euros wallow in their own slop.

LWW

LWW
10-12-2009, 08:45 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry Dick but there are zero countries that provide health insurance to anyone. It is the citizens that are paying taxes that are being forced to provide this insurance.

eg8r </div></div>

Shhh ... you know they don't deal well with reality.

LWW

Gayle in MD
10-12-2009, 07:04 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: llotter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cry me a river. I have my own problems and I don't need someone else's tragedy to further burden my life. And furthermore, I resent strangers that somehow feel they have the right to off-load their problems on me. Why should these strangers get first dibs on my very limited resources over my own sick child? Is it because my sick child get the right to take other strangers resources in the deal? What a wonder scheme this is; give up control of your property and hope others will act in your best interest instead of letting everyone take care of their own best interest. Give me the latter, thanks. Go pedal your utopian crap somewhere else.

I hope you friend recovers soon </div></div>


Nobody forced yu to read Q's post. He has friends here who do care about him. You aren't one of them, but you could just move on, without writing such a nasty post.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cry me a river. I have my own problems and I don't need someone else's tragedy to further burden my life. And furthermore, I resent strangers that somehow feel they have the right to off-load their problems on me. </div></div>

<span style="color: #000066">Typical uncaring, self centered, nasty RW republican point of view. That's why Republicans have the lowest approval ratings of anyone, lower than Nancy Pelosi, who would be in the line of fire as per her job description, BTW, regardless. Boehner and McConnel are under rock bottom. Believe me, the country knows that none of you righties give a **** about anyone, you don't have to jump on here and tell us, and insult Q in the process.</span>

Sid_Vicious
10-12-2009, 08:29 PM
They are simply b@stards Gayle. sid

wolfdancer
10-12-2009, 09:17 PM
Isn't denying needed, necessary health care to those that can't afford it....a de facto death panel? I'm thinking more though about the young ones, doomed to die, because of $$$$.
When I was a Christian, we believed all life was sacred.
I'm still a Christian, just not into the Temple money lenders style Christianity, that seems to have become the vogue.