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sack316
11-28-2009, 12:51 AM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/10438740/Alomar,-Martinez-among-26-on-MLB-Hall-ballot

All listed below (1) indicated first appearance on the ballot.

Roberto Alomar¹
Don Mattingly
Kevin Appier¹
Fred McGriff¹
Harold Baines
Mark McGwire
Bert Blyleven
Jack Morris
Ellis Burks¹
Dale Murphy
Andre Dawson
Dave Parker
Andres Galarraga¹
Tim Raines
Pat Hentgen¹
Shane Reynolds¹
Mike Jackson¹
David Segui¹
Eric Karros¹
Lee Smith
Ray Lankford¹
Alan Trammell
Barry Larkin¹
Robin Ventura¹
Edgar Martinez¹
Todd Zeile¹

Let's say, pick your 3 you'd vote for for fun.

I'm voting:
Mattingly, Lee Smith, and Dawson (tossup between him and Murphy, but I'm a Cubs fan so... yeah I'll be biased this time for sure) /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Sack

LWW
11-28-2009, 05:53 AM
1 - Larkin.

2 - Dawson.

3 - Protest write in vote for Peter Edward Rose.

LWW

wolfdancer
11-28-2009, 02:30 PM
you don't like the "crime dog", nor Bert? I think you have to consider Dave Parker...a tough "out", and if it weren't for the false drug allegations /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Mark is a shoe in.
David, Edger,Andres, and Robin should get some votes, but probably not enough. Jack and Lee had pretty good careers as well.

sack316
11-28-2009, 03:43 PM
Oh I love the crime dog! I think he's a sure hall of famer... just not a first ballot hall of famer.

In fact, I don't think anyone on the list of nominees is without merit to go in at some point (and even gonna agree with LWW about Rose too).

But had to follow my own rule on picking my 3!

So a said Mattingly, don't feel any need to explain him. His tenth time on the ballot, and time he got in. 6 all star games, 9 gold gloves, 3 silver sluggers, and an MVP. Only blemish is no World Series. But not his fault that he was a Yankee in their era of suckdom. With nicknames like Donnie Baseball and The Hitman, how do you not get in? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Lee Smith, because he more or less defined the closer role as it is today. He was just dominant! Career ERA just barely over 3, held the saves record for I think 14 seasons, averages almost a strikeout per inning pitched over his 18 seasons. And got most of his 478 saves with pretty bad teams.

Andre Dawson, because he's the Hawk! He kept Willie Mays from being lonely in the 400HR and 300SB department. With company like that, well you know. Was 10th in history when he retired on the HR and XBH list. And another example of a great player on bad teams. 8 All-star selections, 8 gold gloves, one MVP. Power, speed (early on), solid defender, and a very respectable batting average. Total package player.

On a side note, I think Big Mac should be in too. I mean, cheating in baseball is as old as... well... baseball /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif And they can burn him all they want for juicing... but fact is that the duel between him and Sosa in '98 may have saved baseball after dwindling interest from the '94 strike. He (they) gave it some magic again.

Other side note, this is a very interesting study:
http://steroids-and-baseball.com/
Compares effects of PED's vs. general changing or "juicing" of the ball itself over time. Pretty cool.

Sack

LWW
11-28-2009, 08:21 PM
How can you not put Larkin in ... seriously?

MVP ... 12 time all star ... 3 time GG winner while playing in the same era as Ozzie ... WS ring ... 30 HR season ... 5 consecutive home runs ... 30-30 season ... 50SB season ... only struck out 43 times per season on average ... 9 time silver slugger ... Roberto Clemente Award winner ... 2 time team MVP on a playoff team ... 2 time college all american ... 1984 Olympic team MVP.

If character doesn't matter then Rose belongs in and so does Larkin just from on the field play.

If character does matter then Lark is a no brainer.

LWW

sack316
11-29-2009, 04:11 AM
Spoken like a true Red /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif (much like my picks were spoken like a true Cub)

I think Larkin is in, just not on a first ballot. He's still got 14 more shots after this year he'll be on it. Let the "old guys" in! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

HERE (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/news/2002/01/05/first_ballot_ap/) is a list of first ballot hall of famers... I don't see anyone on the ballot this year that lands in this class, to be brutally honest. Not even my own Cubbies /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif lol

Sack

sack316
11-29-2009, 04:17 AM
BTW, those were just my personal 3 picks. If ya ask me who I think will actually get in this year, I think Dawson and Blyleven will.

Sack

eg8r
11-29-2009, 10:47 PM
Mattingly, Lee Smith, Dale Murphy

eg8r

LWW
11-30-2009, 07:35 AM
Yount had a lower BA and wasn't near the defensive player Lark was ... had really only a tad more power ... and never won a championship.

Koufax only won 165 games ... had 7 years under 15 wins ... 5 with under 10 wins ... and 3 with 5 or fewer wins ... in 12 seasons.

Ozzie absolutely doesn't deserve a 1st round election ... a .262 lifetime BA with 28 TOTAL home runs ... and barely averaged 65 runs scored and 40 RBI's per season.

Seriously ... 1.47 HR's, .262 BA, 41.74 RBI's, 66.16 runs ... that's his AVERAGE SEASON.

Lark's numbers, in comparison, were ... 11 HR's, .295 BA, 53.33 RBI's, 73.83 runs scored.

He had 170 more HR's than Ozzie, 39 more doubles, 7 more triples, 72 more runs scored, 167 more RBI's ... and did it in 1,459 fewer AB's.

Only on defense did Ozzie hold an edge, and it was .978 to .975 in fielding percentage.

In 20 ML seasons Brooks Robinson's averages were ... 13.4 HR's, .267 BA, 61.6 runs scored, and 67.85 RBI's ... with a .049 lower OBP and a .043 lower SPCT than Lark. Brooks also had 351 fewer SB's.

Yaz's numbers, other than HR's, are very close to Lark ... and he had no speed and was far from the defensive player that Lark was.

Being that he played in a small market his entire career Lark probably won't get in on the first round ... but by historic standards he certainly deserves to IMHO.

LWW