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Qtec
03-04-2010, 06:13 AM
Just sfter eg8r tries to lecture me that the Dems are fear mongering because one Dem dares to state a fact about how some Americans are so poor and hurting right now they are prepared to wear their dead sister's dentures..........this pops up!


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Exclusive: <span style='font-size: 23pt'>RNC document mocks donors, plays on 'fear'</span><span style="color: #CC0000">LOL</span>
By: Ben Smith

March 3, 2010 04:23 PM EST

The Republican National Committee plans to raise money this election cycle <span style='font-size: 20pt'>through an aggressive campaign capitalizing on “fear” of President Barack Obama and a promise to "save the country from trending toward socialism."</span><span style="color: #CC0000">LOL</span>

The strategy was detailed in a confidential party fundraising presentation, obtained by POLITICO, which also outlines how “ego-driven” wealthy donors can be tapped with offers of access and “tchochkes.”

The presentation was delivered by RNC Finance Director Rob Bickhart to top donors and fundraisers at a party retreat in Boca Grande, Florida on February 18, a source at the gathering said.

In neat PowerPoint pages, it lifts the curtain on the often-cynical terms of political marketing, displaying an air of disdain for the party’s donors that is usually confined to the barroom conversations of political operatives.

The presentation explains the Republican fundraising in simple terms.

"What can you sell when you do not have the White House, the House, or the Senate...?" it asks.

The answer: "Save the country from trending toward Socialism!”<span style="color: #CC0000">LOL</span>

Manipulating donors with crude caricatures and playing on their fears is hardly unique to Republicans or to the RNC – Democrats raised millions off George W. Bush in similar terms – but rarely is it practiced in such cartoonish terms.

One page, headed “The Evil Empire,” pictures Obama as the Joker from Batman, while House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Majority Leaders Harry Reid are depicted as Cruella DeVille and Scooby Doo, respectively.<span style="color: #CC0000">LMAO........Ha</span>

The document, which two Republican sources said was prepared by the party’s finance staff, comes as Chairman Michael Steele struggles to retain the trust and allegiance of major donors, who can give as much as $30,400 a year to the party.

Under Steele, the RNC has shifted toward a reliance on small donors, but the document reveals extensive, confidential details of the strategy for luring wealthy checkwriters, which range from luxury retreats in California wine country to tickets to a professional fight in Las Vegas.

The 72-page document was provided to POLITICO by a Democrat, who said a hard copy had been left in the hotel hosting the $2,500-a-head retreat, the Gasparilla Inn & Club. Sources at the event said the presentation was delivered by Bickhart and by the RNC Finance Chairman, Peter Terpeluk, a former ambassador to Luxembourg under President George W. Bush.

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>The RNC reacted with alarm to a question about it Wednesday, emailing major donors to warn them of a reporter’s question, and distancing Steele from its contents </span></div></div>



There is a God. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Q link (http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=25812D01-18FE-70B2-A811B1EBD2A3A5EF)

LWW
03-04-2010, 06:17 AM
Are you denying that Obama is advancing a socialist agenda?

LWW

pooltchr
03-04-2010, 07:14 AM
I think Americans have every right to fear the destruction that the present administration is creating.

Quite frankly, Obama scares the Hell out of me!!!

Steve

Qtec
03-04-2010, 07:38 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think Americans have every right to fear the destruction that the present administration is creating.

Quite frankly, Obama scares the Hell out of me!!!

Steve </div></div>

What destruction. Be specific. If you can't give ONE example will you stop repeating this falsehood/GOP talking point?

Q

pooltchr
03-04-2010, 09:37 AM
Continuing to expand government and record pork spending bills, driving our economy further and further toward a meltdown.

Now, when are you going to quit with the Dem talking point about the supposed "surplus" that Bush inherited?????????????

Steve

Qtec
03-04-2010, 09:52 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Continuing to expand government</div></div>
Geez.......Bush expanded Govt on a huge scale.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and record pork spending bills,</div></div>

Ditto.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">driving our economy further and further toward <u>a meltdown.</u></div></div>

Bush actually achieved that!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, when are you going to quit with the Dem talking point about the <u>supposed "surplus" </u>that Bush inherited?????????????

Steve </div></div>

OMG. How many times do we have to go through this?


The country in in the state its in because of Bush and his spend spend spend supporters who have now turned defict hawks....just like you.


Q

LWW
03-04-2010, 11:31 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think Americans have every right to fear the destruction that the present administration is creating.

Quite frankly, Obama scares the Hell out of me!!!

Steve </div></div>

What destruction. Be specific. If you can't give ONE example will you stop repeating this falsehood/GOP talking point?

Q </div></div>

Step #1 is for you to pull your head from the sand.

LWW

pooltchr
03-04-2010, 11:54 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[
The country in in the state its in because of Bush and his spend spend spend supporters who have now turned defict hawks....just like you.


Q </div></div>

Bush was taking us in the wrong direction, and Obama is continuing at an even faster pace. So that makes what Obama is doing alright with you??????????

You have nothing to stand on when trying to defend Obama, and "But Bush" doesn't get it!

Steve

Gayle in MD
03-04-2010, 12:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Continuing to expand government</div></div>
Geez.......Bush expanded Govt on a huge scale.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and record pork spending bills,</div></div>

Ditto.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">driving our economy further and further toward <u>a meltdown.</u></div></div>

Bush actually achieved that!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, when are you going to quit with the Dem talking point about the <u>supposed "surplus" </u>that Bush inherited?????????????

Steve </div></div>

OMG. How many times do we have to go through this?


The country in in the state its in because of Bush and his spend spend spend supporters who have now turned defict hawks....just like you.


Q </div></div>

How right you are!

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3036

BTW, Rachael Maddow showed a deficit graph on her program last night, but I can't seem to find it. Maybe you can assist me in that.

It compared the spending deficits of the Bush era (Tax cuts and pharma) deficits which he pushed through using reconciliation, (:/lol,) to the savings predicted from the current Health Care Bill.

What a mind blower!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

pooltchr
03-04-2010, 12:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> (:/lol,) to the savings predicted from the current Health Care Bill.

What a mind blower!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif </div></div>

the mind blower is that anyone with more than a 7th grad education actually believes that any government program of this magnitude could possibly result in savings.

By their own estimates, it over a trillion dollars in spending. And since government programs usually come in at about 2.5 times their original estimate, where exactly will this "savings" come from? Cuts in Medicare? Eliminating waste? LMAO!

Steve

wolfdancer
03-04-2010, 12:40 PM
Gayle, a few years back???, when i was in H.S.,.....if somebody screwed up....the teacher made us write out a 500 word essay on "how to grow hair on a doorknob".....we would try to make these look and read serious, as though we had some real expertise on the subject....
Every time I read one of tchr's instructional missives....I get that feeling of deja vu .....

DickLeonard
03-04-2010, 12:44 PM
Gayle I see that Karl Rove admitted that Iraq was a mistake. I feel vindicated I hope you do to Gayle. I know it doesn't go here but I think I will put it in all my POsts. Ala LWW posts####

pooltchr
03-04-2010, 12:46 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wolfdancer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gayle, a few years back???, when i was in H.S.,.....if somebody screwed up....the teacher made us write out a 500 word essay on "how to grow hair on a doorknob".....we would try to make these look and read serious, as though we had some real expertise on the subject....
Every time I read one of tchr's instructional missives....I get that feeling of deja vu ..... </div></div>

I am not surprised that you would pretend you had real expertise on the subject of growing hair on a doorknob. Seems that same ability to pretend you know something you don't has remained with you all these years!
Congratulations. It would seem you did actually learn something in high school.

Steve

Gayle in MD
03-04-2010, 01:12 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DickLeonard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gayle I see that Karl Rove admitted that Iraq was a mistake. I feel vindicated I hope you do to Gayle. I know it doesn't go here but I think I will put it in all my POsts. Ala LWW posts#### </div></div>

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

Yeah, he's out there lying still!!! Just like Cheney! I guess the Republican fascists of the Bush Administration realize that none of their base, watched the televised British Investigation into the Iraq Invasion, where live testimony, proved over and over again, they all lied, Bush, Cheney, Rice, and all of their high ranking WH Vangaurds!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thu Mar. 4, 2010 2:00 AM PST
With his soon-to-be-released book, Karl Rove is trying to mount something of a rear-guard action in the war over George W. Bush's legacy. According to the AP, which has obtained a copy of the book, Rove

blames himself for not pushing back against claims that President George W. Bush had taken the country to war under false pretenses, calling it one of the worst mistakes he made during the Bush presidency. The president, he adds, did not knowingly mislead the American public about the existence of [weapons of mass destruction].

And The New York Times reports that in the book, which will hit stores on Tuesday, Rove writes that his failure to counter the narrative that "Bush lied" was "one of the biggest mistakes of the Bush years." Rove adds, "did Bush lie us into war? Absolutely not."

Here we go again: Did Bush grease the way to war with lies? Having written two books on the subject—The Lies of George W. Bush and (with Michael Isikoff) Hubris: The Inside Story of Spin, Scandal, and the Selling of the Iraq War—I have some skin in this game.

Let's cut to the bottom line: prior to the Iraq war, US intelligence generally produced faulty information overstating Saddam Hussein's WMD capabilities, which were actually nonexistent. But Bush and his crew purposefully and callously overstated these overstatements—and made dramatic and untrue assertions unconnected to the flawed intelligence—in order to whip up popular support for the invasion of Iraq. Mother Jones has produced a timeline that lists the false Bush administration assertions. And to remind Rove—and book reviewers—here's a limited sampling of notable whoppers, reported in my books and elsewhere.

When Bush issued his ultimatum to Saddam Hussein on March 17, 2003, he declared, "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised." But there was doubt—and plenty of it. Intelligence analysts had registered uncertainty regarding key elements of Bush's case for war—such as whether Iraq had attempted to obtain uranium in Niger, and whether it had purchased aluminum tubes for an enrichment process to make material for nuclear weapons. Moreover, the doubters were correct.
Seven months earlier, Vice President Dick Cheney similarly said in a speech, "Simply stated, there's no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction. There is no doubt he is amassing them to use against our friends, against our allies, and against us." <span style='font-size: 14pt'>But there was no intelligence suggesting that Saddam's intention was to beef up his WMD arsenal so he could deploy it against the United States—which would have been a suicidal act. In fact, the existing intelligence indicated Saddam was not interested in a WMD showdown with the United States. </span>During an October 7, 2003, speech in Cincinnati, Bush declared that UN inspectors had "concluded" that Iraq in the 1990s had actually produced "two to four times" the 30,000 liters of anthrax and other deadly biological agents than it had acknowledged making. Bush went on: "This is a massive stockpile of biological weapons that has never been accounted for, and capable of killing millions." But UN inspectors had concluded no such thing. They had reported destroying key facilities Iraq had used to develop chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons. The inspectors had encountered discrepancies in the accounting of Iraq's weapons and WMD material and had noted that Iraq could have produced more weapons than the inspectors had uncovered. Bush was misstating the facts to turn a possible stockpile of WMDs into an actual arsenal.
Throughout the fall of 2002 and the winter of 2003, Bush and his aides insisted Iraq was loaded with WMDs. At one point, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld huffed, "There's no debate in the world as to whether they have those weapons...We all know that. A trained ape knows that." On January 7, 2003, Rumsfeld declared, "They currently have chemical and biological weapons." Yet a September 2002 report by the Defense Intelligence Agency said, "There is no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing or stockpiling chemical weapons, or where Iraq has—or will—establish its chemical warfare agent production facilities." A national intelligence estimate produced about that time did assert, "Baghdad has chemical and biological weapons." <span style='font-size: 14pt'>The point is that contradictory information existed, yet Bush and his crew chose to ignore any data that undermined their contention that Saddam was up to his neck in WMDs. </span><span style='font-size: 14pt'>At a September 7, 2002, joint news conference with British Prime Minister Tony Blair, Bush said that a 1998 International Atomic Energy Agency report had found that Iraq was "six months away from developing a [nuclear] weapon. I don't know what more evidence we need." But there was no such IAEA report. And in 1998, the IAEA had reported there were "no indications" that Iraq was producing nuclear weapons. Bush had concocted a nonexistent report to bolster the case for war.</span>
On November 7, 2002, Bush said Saddam "is a threat because he's dealing with Al Qaeda." Yet as the 9/11 Commission later noted, there had been no intelligence confirming contacts between Iraq and Al Qaeda that added up to an operational relationship. (On September 26, 2002, Rumsfeld said that he had "bullet-proof" evidence that Saddam was tied to Osama bin Laden. He never produced that evidence. In March 2003, Cheney claimed Saddam had a "long-standing relationship" with Al Qaeda. He didn't.)
At a December 31, 2003, press conference, Bush asserted, "We don't know whether or not [Saddam] has a nuclear weapon." But there was no intelligence at the time suggesting that the Iraqi dictator might already possess nuclear weapons. The faulty national intelligence estimate produced in October 2002 had errantly declared that Iraq was "reconstituting" its nuclear weapons program but it had also concluded Iraq had no nuclear weapons and would not be able to produce one for years. Bush had no basis for suggesting Saddam could already be nuclear-armed. Yet he did so.
I could go on. Remember Colin Powell's lengthy UN presentation? Practically every relevant fact in it proved to be false. Rove can argue that in the run-up to the war, Bush and the others believed what they were saying about Iraq's WMDs. But Bush and his crowd demonstrated a profound disinterest in sorting out the truth. They made no effort to distinguish between known facts and convenient suppositions. They exaggerated. They trumped up unconfirmed pieces of information. They presented rosy assumptions. They overlooked or discounted data that didn't advance the cause.

It was a PR campaign girded with misrepresentations and false statements. Rove contends that his old boss did not knowingly bamboozle the public. (Bush, though, did in a January 2003 meeting with Tony Blair raise the idea of staging an incident—in which US reconnaissance planes painted in UN colors would fly over Iraq and try to draw fire—to provoke an excuse for war.) But Bush, Cheney, and other administration aides exercised a thoroughly reckless disregard for the truth, as they pushed an utterly phony and over-the-top case for invading Iraq.

As Rove makes the rounds on his book tour, he ought to be pressed on all this. There is no doubt that the Bush posse mischaracterized what was known and not known about WMDs in Iraq. It was easy—and useful—for them to do so, for they didn't care to get this right. (After all, as Rove writes, the Iraq war would have likely not occurred without the WMD argument: "Congress was very unlikely to have supported the use-of-force resolution without the WMD threat.") Bush and his aides, Rove included, were not looking to lead an informed debate based on the best information available; they were aiming to start a war. Almost by any means necessary. They spun the nation into Iraq—and now Rove is spinning to cover that up.

David Corn is Mother Jones' Washington bureau chief. For more of his stories, click here. He's also on Twitter.

</div></div>

But, as you well know, Republican lies and corruption, like Republican deficits, don't count, even when they kill thousands upon thousands of people, and bury the country in massive debts!

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Gayle in MD
03-04-2010, 01:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oath Keepers, the group featured in our cover story, would seem the classic case in point. Its members are cops, sheriffs, and military men and women determined to resist the tyrannical orders they believe are imminent from the Obama administration. The fantasies they spin—a "globalist" leadership intent on declaring martial law, putting God-fearing Americans in detention camps, and asking UN blue helmets to keep order while it imposes health care reform and who knows what else—replicate almost exactly the fears far-right cranks have peddled for generations. Replace "socialism" with "communism" and you are pretty much back to 1964 (or 1934 or 1884, for that matter).
</div></div>

http://motherjones.com/politics/2010/03/editors-note

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eg8r
03-05-2010, 01:15 PM
Well, I am sure you will give the RNC the same benefit of doubt as you give the Dems. Probably not though, hypocrisy is your MO.

eg8r &lt;~~~never said the RNC does not use fear. I just like to point out the hypocritical left when they do it after chastising the Reps.

eg8r
03-05-2010, 01:20 PM
Here is some destruction...The healthcare bill is going to cost well over a trillion dollars by current estimates. Given the track record of the idiots that have been estimating (ex. unemployment) lately lets be safe and double that number. Now we have foolish Dems who pass a bill that says they will not pass any bills that raise the US debt. They say they will find a way to reduce spending elsewhere to cover the new policy.

Tell me, which destruction do you think will take place, the destruction of other agencies currently looking to spend that $2 trillion (I prefer we start with the arts) or will it be the destruction of our country as we completely hand over the bank accounts to the Chinese because people like you are willing to ignore the Pay Go policy.

eg8r

Gayle in MD
03-05-2010, 01:24 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, I am sure you will give the RNC the same benefit of doubt as you give the Dems. Probably not though, hypocrisy is your MO.

eg8r &lt;~~~never said the RNC does not use fear.

<span style="color: #000066">I never heard you admit that they did, either. </span>



I just like to point out the hypocritical left when they do it after chastising the Reps. </div></div>

<span style="color: #000066">How is this administration using fear? Do you deny there is a health crisis?

Do you deny that when this president took office, this country was in the worst shape since the great depression?

Do you deny that people are dying because they are dropped when they are ill?

Tell me, Ed, do you think that you are above ever being in an automobile crash, that could keep you hospitalized for long months, if some jerk ran into you, heaven forbid?

Do you think that you and your family is exempt from developing a serious illness?

Do you think your job is jpromised to you for the rest of your career, and you have some insurance that you will never need, or be dropped, by your health insurance provider?

Do you think that SS and Medicare will not go bankrupt is health reform is not addressed?

Is there a crises in our health care costs in this country, or not?

How does this president, and this congress, use fear? I'd really like to know your answer to that question.

Was Bush forcing his tax cuts and his prescription drug giveaway on everyone else through reconciliation?

Do you think that using emergency funding, and not using pay-go is ever appropriate? Is it possible that pay-go is the aim, but there should be emergency exceptions?

G. </span>

eg8r
03-05-2010, 01:30 PM
Is this it...

graph (http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4407203486_9cd4a3a587.jpg)

Doesn't really show much. My question is this, after all the pathetic attempts at estimates and projections by this current admin, why do you take things like this at face value?

eg8r

pooltchr
03-05-2010, 03:58 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD
<span style="color: #000066">How is this administration using fear?
[color:#CC0000</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> You, the media, and the administration, every time the refer to the problems in the insurance industry as a healthcare "crisis"</span>

Do you deny there is a health crisis?
<span style="color: #FF0000"> I agree there are problems with the insurance industry, but I don't believe it is a legitimate "crisis". But, we mush have a crisis in order to pass our agenda, don't we?</span>

Do you deny that when this president took office, this country was in the worst shape since the great depression?
<span style="color: #FF0000">It wasn't great. But we've been through rougher times. Obama campaigned saying he could turn the economy around, and cap unemployment at 8%. He has done neither. He just took things from bad to worse. </span>


Do you think that SS and Medicare will not go bankrupt is health reform is not addressed?

<span style="color: #FF0000"> Both were well on their way to bankruptcy long before now. Obama's plan is not going to fix the problem. He is going to cut into Medicare financing, but that is taking money from a program that doesn't have any to begin with.</span>

Is there a crises in our health care costs in this country, or not?
<span style="color: #FF0000">Not. </span>

How does this president, and this congress, use fear?
<span style="color: #FF0000">Does suggesting that if we don't pass his healthcare bill, the economy can't recover count as using fear? </span>

G.

</div></div>

Don't bother. I don't expect a reply from you....unless it's "But Bush".

Steve

Gayle in MD
03-05-2010, 04:03 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is this it...

<span style="color: #000066">Yes, that's it. Thanks. </span>

graph (http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4407203486_9cd4a3a587.jpg)

Doesn't really show much. <span style="color: #000066">LMAO! Denial again? </span> My question is this, after all the pathetic attempts at estimates and projections by this current admin, why do you take things like this at face value?

eg8r </div></div>

<span style="color: #000066">This chart is not from the administration, Ed, it's from the Congressional Budget office, and why wouldn't you believe them? They are the non partisan accounting of all our financial information. Do you think they made this up?

Further, why were Republicans, and all of your righties, fine with using reconciliation for those big red deficits you see on there, not even a mention of how they would be paid for, (and none of it was) but hyporcitical enough to make a big huge deal out of Obama using it when he will reduce the deficit, and save money?

Oh, and why did you take Bush's deficits through reconciliation, at face value, without a murmer?

G.</span>

Gayle in MD
03-05-2010, 04:19 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Continuing to expand government</div></div>
Geez.......Bush expanded Govt on a huge scale.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and record pork spending bills,</div></div>

Ditto.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">driving our economy further and further toward <u>a meltdown.</u></div></div>

Bush actually achieved that!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, when are you going to quit with the Dem talking point about the <u>supposed "surplus" </u>that Bush inherited?????????????

Steve </div></div>

OMG. How many times do we have to go through this?


The country in in the state its in because of Bush and his spend spend spend supporters who have now turned defict hawks....just like you.


Q </div></div>

Whoopie!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

Check this out, don't know if you saw it.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4407203486_9cd4a3a587.jpg

pooltchr
03-05-2010, 04:30 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Continuing to expand government</div></div>
Geez.......Bush expanded Govt on a huge scale.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and record pork spending bills,</div></div>

Ditto.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">driving our economy further and further toward <u>a meltdown.</u></div></div>

Bush actually achieved that!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, when are you going to quit with the Dem talking point about the <u>supposed "surplus" </u>that Bush inherited?????????????

Steve </div></div>

OMG. How many times do we have to go through this?


The country in in the state its in because of Bush and his spend spend spend supporters who have now turned defict hawks....just like you.


Q </div></div>

Whoopie!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

Check this out, don't know if you saw it.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4407203486_9cd4a3a587.jpg

</div></div>

Thank you Gayle, for finally proving what we all knew all along. Everything Obama is doing, you believe Bush was doing the same things. Yet you think Bush was wrong and Obama is right.

At least some of us were outspoken about Bush's fiscal policies when he was in office. You just can't bring yourself to admit that Obama is doing the same things, only faster.

Steve

Gayle in MD
03-05-2010, 04:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wolfdancer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gayle, a few years back???, when i was in H.S.,.....if somebody screwed up....the teacher made us write out a 500 word essay on "how to grow hair on a doorknob".....we would try to make these look and read serious, as though we had some real expertise on the subject....
Every time I read one of tchr's instructional missives....I get that feeling of deja vu ..... </div></div>

<span style="color: #000066">LOL, the denial is so thick you could cut it with a knife.

BTW, check this out:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4407203486_9cd4a3a587.jpg

BTW, do you recall who it was around here who said that the debts, under Bush of course, didn't matter????</span> /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

pooltchr
03-05-2010, 05:03 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[BTW, do you recall who is was around here who said that the debts, under Bush of course, didn't matter????[/color] /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif </div></div>

Probably not the same person who said they would never vote for Obama because he was a former cocaine user!

Steve

Qtec
03-05-2010, 06:35 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Here is some destruction...The healthcare bill is going to cost well over a trillion dollars by current estimates.</div></div>

Over what timespan?

Q

Qtec
03-05-2010, 06:55 PM
<span style='font-size: 20pt'>ONE Senator</span>

relates that

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>ONE constituent</span> was s poor she wore her dead sisters dentures.

Explain to me why that is fear mongering.

A few days ago, a trainer at sea world was killed by an Orca.

Am I fear mongering?

If I said that all Orcas are vicious killers............without having any proof to back it up........would I be fear mongering?

Fear mongering.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"What can you sell when you do not have the White House, the House, or the Senate...?" it asks.

The answer: "Save the country from trending toward Socialism!” </div></div>

Head for the hills.

Q

Did you know that the North has been subsidising the South for years?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Federal Taxing and Spending Benefit Some States, Leave Others Paying Bill

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>New Mexico gets $2 for every dollar in taxes, New Jersey only 61 cents</span>

For more information, contact: Nate Bailey at (202) 464-5102.

WASHINGTON, D.C., October 9, 2007-Some states feast at the expense of others, according to the Tax Foundation's latest annual analysis of federal taxing and spending patterns.

Using newly released Fiscal Year 2005 spending data from the Census Bureau's annual Consolidated Federal Funds Report, the Tax Foundation compared the federal tax burden in each state with the amount of federal spending in each state. The result is a ranking of which states got the best deal in 2005 from Uncle Sam's tax and spending policies.

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>"All taxpayers know that the federal government uses tax and spending policy to redistribute income from citizens with high incomes to those who make little,"</span> said study author Curtis Dubay, a Tax Foundation economist. "Citizens are less aware of geographically based income redistribution."

Dubay continued, "High-income states cannot hope to receive back from the federal government more than they send in federal taxes because of <span style='font-size: 20pt'>the progressive nature of the federal income tax.</span> Since the tax structure is unlikely to change, and federal spending is largely on auto-pilot, donor states are almost certain to keep sending more to Washington than they get in return."

Some states' high ratios have a clear spending-related cause. The large number of retirees collecting Social Security in Florida increases the flow of federal funds. An even bigger difference is created by the disproportionately large federal grants funneled to Alaska and the District of Columbia. Virginia and Maryland benefit greatly from their proximity to the capital in salaried federal employment. Alaska, Hawaii and New Mexico also receive disproportionately large sums in this category.

During fiscal 2005, <span style='font-size: 17pt'>taxpayers in New Mexico benefited the most from the give-and-take with Uncle Sam, receiving $2.03 in federal outlays for every $1.00 the state's taxpayers sent to Washington. This first-place finish is nothing new in New Mexico which has perched atop this list for many years. Other big winners in 2005 were Mississippi ($2.02), Alaska ($1.84), Louisiana ($1.78), and West Virginia</span> ($1.76).

2005's biggest loser was New Jersey, which received 61 cents in outlays per tax dollar. Other low ranking states included Nevada (65 cents), Connecticut (69 cents), New Hampshire (71 cents), and Minnesota (72 cents). </div></div>

For years, the Southern states have benefited from wealth distribution<span style='font-size: 23pt'> ie, Socialism </span>and never even squeaked about how unfair it was.

pooltchr
03-05-2010, 07:09 PM
Hey, Q.

New Mexico is not considered part of the South in this country!

Steve

Qtec
03-05-2010, 07:16 PM
You stole it from Mexico!!!!!!!!

As C Powell says, "you break it you own it." /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Q

sack316
03-06-2010, 10:10 AM
Yes, fear mongering, as defined: "the use of fear to influence the opinions and actions of others towards some specific end. The feared object or subject is sometimes exaggerated, and the pattern of fear mongering is usually one of repetition, in order to continuously reinforce the intended effects of this tactic, sometimes in the form of a vicious circle."

Something both parties have been quite guilty of.

Second, look into reasons why the north has been subsidizing the south. Does the north enjoy affordable prices for it's cotton clothing? Does the north enjoy receiving fruits and veggies that may actually grow down this way in march, but far less likely to grow in the snow storms the upper states are seeing? And if they do like those foods, would they prefer to pay fair market cost? Or the adjusted affordable cost that is possible due to subsidies? (that is just given for example, would gladly provide more if you wish)

Sack

Gayle in MD
03-06-2010, 11:01 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Something both parties have been quite guilty of.
</div></div>

Which party is fear mongering right now, Sack?

pooltchr
03-06-2010, 11:14 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Something both parties have been quite guilty of.
</div></div>

Which party is fear mongering right now, Sack? </div></div>

Both of them. Open your eyes!

Steve

sack316
03-06-2010, 02:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Something both parties have been quite guilty of.
</div></div>

Which party is fear mongering right now, Sack? </div></div>

By definition, both.

Sack

moblsv
03-06-2010, 11:05 PM
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0310/RNC_Fallout_Ashamed_donor_says_he_wont_give.html

Chairman Michael Steele
Republican National Committee
310 First Street SE
Washington, DC 20003

Dear Mr. Chairman:

Like many Republicans today, I am ashamed of the fundraising presentation given by RNC Finance Director Rob Bickhart at last month’s GOP gathering in Boca Grande, Florida. The depictions of President Obama, Speaker Pelosi and Majority Leader Harry Reid were shameful, immature and uncivil, at best. While I realize your office made steps to distance you from this presentation I’m afraid the presentation is representative of a culture and mindset within the Republican National Committee; consequently, I will no longer contribute to any fundraising entity of our Party—but will contribute only to individual candidates I choose to support.

I have been a member of the Republican Eagles on a number of occasions in the past, including the 2008 cycle. I have been constantly solicited by the RNC, the NRSC and the NRCC, among other GOP organizations and efforts. Recently I was visited in my office by Lynn Westmoreland, who shared with me the redistricting efforts he is leading in the House. He was requesting funds for this initiative (without the sort of nonsense presented recently by your Finance Director) and I was considering contributing to the project. I will not consider doing so now, with apologies to Congressman Westmoreland

Mr. Chairman, I love giving money to candidates at every level who I believe in and want to see elected. But it is becoming increasingly difficult to consider making a contribution to the Party itself. The sort of behavior displayed in Boca Grande only contributes to the widespread cynicism of politics in general and our Party in particular. It is, in my opinion, indefensible and destructive.

Sincerely,

Mark DeMoss

President, The DeMoss Group

Founder, CivilityProject.org

eg8r
03-07-2010, 06:59 AM
The dems are, didn't you hear about shared tooth lady? This will happen to everyone if Obama's bill is not passed.

eg8r

LWW
03-07-2010, 08:40 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You stole it from Mexico!!!!!!!!

As C Powell says, "you break it you own it." /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Q </div></div>

REALLY?

When did this happen?

LWW

Gayle in MD
03-07-2010, 09:55 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sack316</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Something both parties have been quite guilty of.
</div></div>

Which party is fear mongering right now, Sack? </div></div>

By definition, both.

Sack </div></div>

What specifically do you think Democratics are doing, that falls under the heading of Fear Mongering?

G.

Gayle in MD
03-07-2010, 10:00 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moblsv</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0310/RNC_Fallout_Ashamed_donor_says_he_wont_give.html

Chairman Michael Steele
Republican National Committee
310 First Street SE
Washington, DC 20003

Dear Mr. Chairman:

Like many Republicans today, I am ashamed of the fundraising presentation given by RNC Finance Director Rob Bickhart at last month’s GOP gathering in Boca Grande, Florida. The depictions of President Obama, Speaker Pelosi and Majority Leader Harry Reid were shameful, immature and uncivil, at best. While I realize your office made steps to distance you from this presentation I’m afraid the presentation is representative of a culture and mindset within the Republican National Committee; consequently, I will no longer contribute to any fundraising entity of our Party—but will contribute only to individual candidates I choose to support.

I have been a member of the Republican Eagles on a number of occasions in the past, including the 2008 cycle. I have been constantly solicited by the RNC, the NRSC and the NRCC, among other GOP organizations and efforts. Recently I was visited in my office by Lynn Westmoreland, who shared with me the redistricting efforts he is leading in the House. He was requesting funds for this initiative (without the sort of nonsense presented recently by your Finance Director) and I was considering contributing to the project. I will not consider doing so now, with apologies to Congressman Westmoreland

Mr. Chairman, I love giving money to candidates at every level who I believe in and want to see elected. But it is becoming increasingly difficult to consider making a contribution to the Party itself. The sort of behavior displayed in Boca Grande only contributes to the widespread cynicism of politics in general and our Party in particular. It is, in my opinion, indefensible and destructive.

Sincerely,

Mark DeMoss

President, The DeMoss Group

Founder, CivilityProject.org </div></div>

Whoopie!!! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif I dare say, this won't be the only one to refuse to send money to such a disgraceful bunch.

I expected the radical dangerous right, would eventually take over the Party, and they did. Bachmann, Boehner, Mcconnell, are paying the price for standing right up there in front of the radicals with their disgraceful signage and unamerican rhetoric, and then using it in their own fundraising events.

Disgraceful!

G.

Gayle in MD
03-07-2010, 10:01 AM
Giving an example of a real and true fact, is not fear mongering, Ed.

G.

LWW
03-07-2010, 03:13 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sack316</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Something both parties have been quite guilty of.
</div></div>

Which party is fear mongering right now, Sack? </div></div>

By definition, both.

Sack </div></div>
Read your own posts.

LWW
What specifically do you think Democratics are doing, that falls under the heading of Fear Mongering?

G. </div></div>

eg8r
03-08-2010, 01:57 PM
The fact that they had to go to extreme's to give an example is proof of their fear mongering.

eg8r

Gayle in MD
03-08-2010, 02:24 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The fact that they had to go to extreme's to give an example is proof of their fear mongering.

eg8r </div></div>

As I told you, this story is not a story of extreme. Seniors who need medications have told many, many stories over these last fourteen months, and before, of having to choose between buying their medicin, or buying food.

I don't think you watch, nor listen, to ANY of the sad stories about what health care costs, and insruance costs, are doing to our people's lives. It is a moral issue, which the right doesn't care about.

G.

eg8r
03-08-2010, 02:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As I told you, this story is not a story of extreme.</div></div>You can tell me till you are blue in the face but you don't see middle to lower America. This is where I live.

eg8r

hondo
03-08-2010, 05:42 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As I told you, this story is not a story of extreme.</div></div>You can tell me till you are blue in the face but you don't see middle to lower America. This is where I live.

eg8r </div></div>


WADR,hard to believe, my friend. This is where I live also.
And I certainly see the tragedy of no health care.

eg8r
03-08-2010, 08:02 PM
I did not say I don't see any trajedy, but 9/10 most people have a hard time are not sharing teeth.

eg8r

hondo
03-08-2010, 10:01 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I did not say I don't see any trajedy, but 9/10 most people have a hard time are not sharing teeth.

eg8r </div></div>


Well, that's probably true. ( I hope) /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Gayle in MD
03-09-2010, 05:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I did not say I don't see any trajedy, but 9/10 most people have a hard time are not sharing teeth.

eg8r </div></div>

One of them is, and telling that sotry does not constitute fear mongering.

I can give you some examples of fear mongering. just so you'll know:

Cheney: "There is no doubt that Saddam has Weapons of mass destuction."

Rumsfeld: (on the location of the WMD's) "We know where they are, they're hidden in the....blah blah blah part of Iraq, up near the blah blah blah!"

Bush: "We cannot wait for the smoking gun to come in the form of a Mushroom Cloud."

Bush: "British Intelligence informs us that Saddam Heussein has sought to reconstitute his WMD program. He has sought to acquire Yellow Cake from, Niger."

The Republicans, like Palin, and others:

"Death panels will determine whether our seniors live or die."


"Obama is a terrorist!"

"Obama is not a citizen of the United States!"


"Socialism! Socialism! Socialism!"

Now, there you go, there is some genuine fear mongering, since you are confused about what it is, when you hear it, and when you aren't hearing it, you can use this as a guide. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif!

No problem, you're welcome!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

G.

Gayle in MD
03-09-2010, 05:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As I told you, this story is not a story of extreme.</div></div>You can tell me till you are blue in the face but you don't see middle to lower America. This is where I live.

eg8r </div></div>

Huh? I have so many friends who live in Florida, and all over the southern states. What makes you think I don't know what is going on around the country? Even my relatives are scattered all around the country, and the globe, up and down the East and West Coasts, and all the way from Florida to Europe!

give one example of how bad it is for one particularly individual, is not fear mongering! Most seniors probably already have their false teeth if they're going to need them! LOL...

You can deny it till you're blue in the fact, but giving one specific example, is not fear mongering.

Now if they had followed this story up by saying, many of our seniors are sharing teeth, then that might be fear mongering. It was not presented as being par for the course.

Not Fear Mongering At All!

G.

pooltchr
03-09-2010, 07:59 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Cheney: "There is no doubt that Saddam has Weapons of mass destuction."
<span style="color: #FF0000"> He did. And he even had a history of using them on his own people.</span>

Rumsfeld: (on the location of the WMD's) "We know where they are, they're hidden in the....blah blah blah part of Iraq, up near the blah blah blah!"
<span style="color: #FF0000">Nice quote. Couldn't even be bothered to find the exact words???? </span>

Bush: "We cannot wait for the smoking gun to come in the form of a Mushroom Cloud."
<span style="color: #FF0000">Had we done so, you would have been screaming that he had plenty of warning and did nothing!! </span>

Bush: "British Intelligence informs us that Saddam Heussein has sought to reconstitute his WMD program. He has sought to acquire Yellow Cake from, Niger."
<span style="color: #FF0000">That is exactly what British Intelligence told us. </span>

The Republicans, like Palin, and others:

"Death panels will determine whether our seniors live or die."
<span style="color: #FF0000">I will admit that the term "death panels" is a bit over the top, but the idea behind it was, in fact, provided in the bill they were working on </span>


"Obama is a terrorist!"
<span style="color: #FF0000">My parents taught me we are known by the company we keep. </span>

"Obama is not a citizen of the United States!"
<span style="color: #FF0000">Probably a stretch, but there are still unanswered questions. Why are so many records of Obama's "accomplishments" and history not available? </span>


"Socialism! Socialism! Socialism!"
<span style="color: #FF0000">Exactly what the left is trying to accomplish. They just call it redistribution of wealth. </span>


G. </div></div>

<span style="color: #FF0000"> You're welcome!
Steve</span>

eg8r
03-09-2010, 07:48 PM
Sure it is but because it is your guy you will give him a pass.

eg8r

eg8r
03-09-2010, 07:49 PM
I am glad you consider socialism a fear. Now if you would have only figured that out before you voted for Obama.

eg8r

wolfdancer
03-09-2010, 09:13 PM
If it was Steve, I wouldn't remember...he's, how can I say it, politely....forgettable...and that,shortly after one reads his "educational" posts.