PDA

View Full Version : Capitalism



Qtec
04-09-2010, 05:49 AM
<span style='font-size: 20pt'> = Profits before people.</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"If anything happens to me, I'll be looking down from heaven at you all. I love you. Take care of my baby. Tell her that daddy loves her, she's beautiful, she's funny. Just take care of my baby girl."

Those were the chilling words in a note from Josh Napper, a West Virginia coal miner who was killed in the Massey mine explosion on Monday.

The note was written to Napper's girlfriend, Jennifer, over Easter weekend -- <span style='font-size: 20pt'>just days before his fears were realized.</span> It was described to CNN's John Roberts by Pam Napper, Josh's mother. </div></div>

link (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691)

Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a mine if they didn't have to.
Wonder how many of the Wall St rich kids would be prepared to work down a mine for a year? You know, the guys who are now complaining about how much TAX they have to pay!
They wouldn't do it for a Million Dollars. Poor people who have no choice do it year in, year out for a lot less.

Capitalism.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691 </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The West Virginia coal mine where an explosion killed 25 workers and left another four unaccounted for in the worst mining disaster since 1984 had amassed scores of citations from mining safety officials, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>including 57 infractions just last month for violations that included repeatedly failing to develop and follow a ventilation plan.</span> </div></div>


Q

ugotda7
04-09-2010, 06:14 AM
A Liberal Guide to Debating Conservatives
Mar 31, 2010 Author Scot Cerullo

Liberals have long since learned that debating Conservatives can be a challenging endeavor, since Conservatives have a penchant for fortifying their arguments with facts, statistics, history and other elements that create convincing and thoughtful arguments.

Not to worry. The following are several tips Liberals can use right away to begin defeating Conservatives in every debate, every time.

Lib Tip # 1: Drop the Race Card: The moment your Conservative opponent begins crafting a cogent, air-tight argument buttressed in fact, drop the race card. This technique is designed to stifle further discussion, impugns your opponent and puts him on the defensive. Often, this is enough of a distraction to direct attention away from your lack of qualitative, quantitative evidence.

Lib Tip # 2: Impugn the Source: When debating a Conservative, content is less important than character. When your Conservative opponent states a compelling argument, do not address the argument and instead attack the Conservative personally. Since we are all sinners, it shouldn’t take long to find something wrong with your opponent. Use it.

Lib Tip # 3: Social Justice Trumps Logic: Argue every issue from a “Social Justice” or “Moral” high-ground. The Conservative will attempt to show that your ideas are unworkable, unsustainable or downright illogical. Don’t worry about any of that. Just stay on message by arguing from the moral, social justice perspective.

Lib Tip # 4: Exploit the Weakest Link: Define your opponent by his weakest link. If 10,000 Tea Partiers hold a rally, and one guy has a placard that is inappropriate, that is all you need to characterize the entire group as radical, racist militants. See how that works? It’s simple and fun and, most importantly, deflects all those awkward facts and articulate points away from the discussion and leaves the Conservative in a defensive mode.

Lib Tip # 5: Use “New Speak”: If health care is not a right according to the Constitution, and you want it to be a right, claim it is and then raise your voice. Raising your voice is always the best course of action in lieu of a good argument. Redefine words to suit your needs, and always be on guard for any stray, powerful fact or statistic the Conservative may use to support their position.

Lib Tip # 6: State the Opposite of what you believe: If you are in favor of taking money from producers and giving it to non-producers, that’s fine, but make sure your wording is a bit more obtuse than that. Try saying you are in favor of moral and social justice, and characterize everyone who earns a good living as somehow having won the lottery in life, and all those who want as being desperately hard-working folks who have an almost allergic reaction to hand-outs. Never imply or point out in any way that people can change their situation simply by making better decisions.

Lib Tip # 7: Define America by it’s Errors, not its Successes: Taking a cue from Lib Tip # 4, it is important to characterize America by it’s errors in judgement and misdeeds. It is critical that you completely overlook the good things America has done, and the manner in which it has beaten back one dictatorship after another. In fact, you must go to some lengths to divert people from the notion that without America, the world would be a far more dangerous, hostile, sad place. So talk about Indians and Slaves.

Lib Tip # 8: Blame talk radio and FOX news for fanning hate and racism: Avoid at all costs the fact that both talk radio and FOX news stand in defiant refutation of an otherwise fully agreeable media that presents only one template, a liberal template. Also, attempt to divert attention should someone ask why Conservative Talk Radio and FOX news is growing exponentially, while traditional, liberal media is closing offices, thinning their employees and running deficits like, you know, the government.

Lib Tip # 9: Government is Good: Insist that a massive expansion of government is a good thing. Assert that it is our patriotic duty to pay ever more in taxes so that a centralized government comprised of east and west coast Liberal elites can decide what is best for the unwashed masses, since it would be sheer lunacy to allow individuals the right to make decisions for themselves. If you run into problems, see Tips 1-8.

Lib Tip # 10: Assign Blame away from Yourself: Always assign blame to the other guy, preferably a Conservative. This may require rewriting history so that people may one day believe that Reagan did NOT usher in 25 years of prosperity, or it may require still more retooling of the content of public school text books. But over time we’ll get there.

Remember: The ends justify the means. No matter how cruel and violating the means may be, if it results in a mediocre society where all citizens ultimately suck off the the government for their most meager needs, it will all be worthwhile.

There is of course the small matter of where all the money for all these programs will come from. Right now, they come from spirited entrepreneurs, dreamers with drive and other people whose passion poses a direct threat to the new world we want to usher in.

But first things first. Learn the ten tips to squelch free speech, hurt your opponent with the intellectual equivelant of a kick to the groin and avoid facts, statistics and studies altogether, as those will get you in trouble.

Good luck Liberals! Battle on and remember what Dennis Prager said: The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen. Oh wait, no. You don’t want to remember that. My bad. Here, try this: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs. Yeah, that’s the one. Whew!

LWW
04-09-2010, 06:37 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'> = Profits before people.</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"If anything happens to me, I'll be looking down from heaven at you all. I love you. Take care of my baby. Tell her that daddy loves her, she's beautiful, she's funny. Just take care of my baby girl."

Those were the chilling words in a note from Josh Napper, a West Virginia coal miner who was killed in the Massey mine explosion on Monday.

The note was written to Napper's girlfriend, Jennifer, over Easter weekend -- <span style='font-size: 20pt'>just days before his fears were realized.</span> It was described to CNN's John Roberts by Pam Napper, Josh's mother. </div></div>

link (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691)

Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a mine if they didn't have to.
Wonder how many of the Wall St rich kids would be prepared to work down a mine for a year? You know, the guys who are now complaining about how much TAX they have to pay!
They wouldn't do it for a Million Dollars. Poor people who have no choice do it year in, year out for a lot less.

Capitalism.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691 </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The West Virginia coal mine where an explosion killed 25 workers and left another four unaccounted for in the worst mining disaster since 1984 had amassed scores of citations from mining safety officials, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>including 57 infractions just last month for violations that included repeatedly failing to develop and follow a ventilation plan.</span> </div></div>


Q </div></div>

Actually ... miners are very well paid and there are waiting lists to get hired.

LWW

Qtec
04-09-2010, 07:54 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'> = Profits before people.</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"If anything happens to me, I'll be looking down from heaven at you all. I love you. Take care of my baby. Tell her that daddy loves her, she's beautiful, she's funny. Just take care of my baby girl."

Those were the chilling words in a note from Josh Napper, a West Virginia coal miner who was killed in the Massey mine explosion on Monday.

The note was written to Napper's girlfriend, Jennifer, over Easter weekend -- <span style='font-size: 20pt'>just days before his fears were realized.</span> It was described to CNN's John Roberts by Pam Napper, Josh's mother. </div></div>

link (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691)

Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a mine if they didn't have to.
Wonder how many of the Wall St rich kids would be prepared to work down a mine for a year? You know, the guys who are now complaining about how much TAX they have to pay!
They wouldn't do it for a Million Dollars. Poor people who have no choice do it year in, year out for a lot less.

Capitalism.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691 </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The West Virginia coal mine where an explosion killed 25 workers and left another four unaccounted for in the worst mining disaster since 1984 had amassed scores of citations from mining safety officials, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>including 57 infractions just last month for violations that included repeatedly failing to develop and follow a ventilation plan.</span> </div></div>


Q </div></div>

Actually ... miners are very well paid and there are waiting lists to get hired.

LWW </div></div>

You are such an idiot that you made my point for me.

This guy went to work everyday thinking he was going to die, but he still went! He had no choice.

Q

LWW
04-09-2010, 08:55 AM
Sure he did. Move to where he could get a job not in the mines.

I was raised in mine country. I never worked in a mine. I earned more than UMW members make.

And ... why the hate speech?

Why can't you ever discuss things like an adult?

LWW

Deeman3
04-09-2010, 09:26 AM
[quote=Qtec
Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a mine if they didn't have to.
Wonder how many of the Wall St rich kids would be prepared to work down a mine for a year? You know, the guys who are now complaining about how much TAX they have to pay!
They wouldn't do it for a Million Dollars. Poor people who have no choice do it year in, year out for a lot less.

Capitalism.



Q [/quote]

<span style="color: #FF0000"> Duh! Don't the communists work in mines? Were the Chinese miners, who are only paid starvation "wages" of meager food and housing, victims of capitolism as well? Gee, how do the communists get the coal out fo the ground? Hope and Change machines.

At least the WV Minors can select to work at 7/11! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif</span>

LWW
04-09-2010, 10:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deeman3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]</span>

And your point exposes another of the pillars of far left ideology.

It is criminal to allow a citizen to risk their life in an effort to lift the living standards of their family.

It is expected of the citizen to be willing to die in subservience to the state.

LWW

cushioncrawler
04-09-2010, 06:26 PM
Injuries, Illnesses, and Fatalities FONT SIZE: PRINT: IIF Injuries, Illnesses, and FatalitiesIIF HomepageIIF OverviewIIF FAQContact IIF
Fact Sheet | Coal Mining | April 2010
Injuries, Illnesses, and Fatalities in the Coal Mining Industry
Coal mining is a relatively dangerous industry. Employees in coal mining are more likely to be killed or to incur a non-fatal injury or illness, and their injuries are more likely to be severe than workers in private industry as a whole, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Coal mining is part of the Mining sector along with other mining and extractive industries such as oil and gas. Coal mining is further divided into Bituminous coal underground mining, Bituminous coal and lignite surface mining, and Anthracite mining. Bituminous coal underground mining employs slightly more than half of all coal mining industry workers, but experiences a higher share of occupational injuries, illnesses, and fatalities.

The rate of fatal injuries in the coal mining industry in 2007 was 24.8 per 100,000 fulltime equivalent workers, nearly six times the rate for all private industry. This represents a 57 percent decrease from the 2006 rate of 58.1 fatalities per 100,000 fulltime equivalent workers. Fatal injuries in 2006 included the Sago mine disaster.

Rates of fatal occupational injury in 2007:

Total private industry: 4.3 cases per 100,000 full-time equivalent workers
Coal mining: 24.8 per 100,000 full-time equivalent workers
There were 28 fatal injuries in coal mining in 2007, down from an average of 31 fatalities per year from 2003 to 2006. In 2007, 20 fatalities (or 71 percent of all fatalities in coal mining) were in bituminous coal underground mining. Contact with objects and equipment and transportation incidents were the most frequent fatal events with 18 and 5 fatal injuries respectively.

The rate of nonfatal injuries and illnesses in coal mining in 2008 was 4.4 cases per 100 full-time workers, 13 percent higher than for total private industry. In bituminous coal underground mining, the rate of nonfatal injuries and illnesses was 66 percent higher than that of all private industry. Bituminous and lignite surface mining had a rate that was 49 percent lower than all private industry. Anthracite had a rate 59 percent higher than all private industry, but a very small number of cases.

Total nonfatal injury and illness incidence rates in 2008:

Total private industry: 3.9 cases per 100 full-time workers
Coal mining: 4.4 per 100 full-time workers
Bituminous coal underground mining: 6.5 per 100 full-time workers
Bituminous coal and lignite surface mining: 2.0 per 100 full-time workers
Anthracite mining: 6.2 per 100 full-time workers
More serious injuries and illnesses require days away from work to recuperate. In coal mining, the rate of injuries and illnesses with days away from work was 2.6 per 100 full-time workers in 2008, more than twice the rate for the private sector as a whole. The bituminous coal underground mining rate was 3.9 per 100 full-time workers, more than three times the total private industry rate.

Rates of injuries and illnesses with days away from work in 2008:

Total private industry: 1.1 cases per 100 full-time workers
Coal mining: 2.6 per 100 full-time workers
Bituminous coal underground mining: 3.9 per 100 full-time workers
Bituminous coal and lignite surface mining: 1.2 per 100 full-time workers
Anthracite mining: 4.7 per 100 full-time workers
The number of median days away from work is a measure of the severity of injuries and illnesses. Workers in coal mining and bituminous coal underground mining were away from work due to occupational injuries or illnesses longer than the 8 median days experienced by all private industry workers. Fractures, which frequently require long recuperations, account for 19 percent of all injuries and illnesses in coal mining, compared to 8 percent in all private industry.

Median days away from work in 2008:

Total private industry: 8 median days away from work
Coal mining: 31 days
Bituminous coal underground mining: 34 days
Fractures, all private industry: 28 days

LWW
04-10-2010, 01:30 AM
Nobody questions that it's dangerous work ... that's why it pays so well.

Now ... how about if we compare US mine safety with the rest of the world?

LWW

Qtec
04-10-2010, 04:15 AM
You missed the point.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">CEO Don Blankenship, who was with the families when they learned the miners were dead, has strongly defended the company's record and disputed accusations from miners that he puts coal profits ahead of safety.

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>Federal regulators issued evacuation orders for all or parts of the mine <u>more than 60 times since the start of 2009,</u> according to inspection records.</span>

In 2007, the mine met criteria to be declared by the Mine Safety and Health Administration as <span style='font-size: 20pt'>a pattern violator</span>, which would have allowed for stricter oversight, including the potential shutdown of the mine. But Massey was able to reduce the number of the most serious violations and avoid it. </div></div>

The guy took a risk with other people's lives. He put profit before the safety of his workers. Pure Capitalism.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pam Napper, whose 25-year-old son Josh died, said <span style='font-size: 20pt'>he had been sent home early the Friday before the explosion because of concerns about ventilation in the mine.</span> Before that, apparently over Easter weekend, he wrote a letter to his mother, his fiancee and his 19-month-old daughter, telling them that he would be looking down from heaven if anything happened to him.

"I just knew that Josh in his heart knew that something was going to happen," Pam Napper said. </div></div>

BTW, workers from all countries have been exploited- its still happening, even in America.

Q

LWW
04-10-2010, 04:35 AM
If it turns out to be true, he should be jailed.

LWW

Gayle in MD
04-10-2010, 06:51 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deeman3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]</span>

pooltchr
04-10-2010, 09:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[]Duh! WTF does that have to do with Americans being exploited by corporate pigs in this country?

</div></div>

Exploited??????

I lived and worked in mining country for a year. I worked for a company that paid well above average wages, but nothing near what the mining companies paid. And NOBODY was forced to work in the mines. They chose to do so for the money.
That doesn't sound like they are being exploited. It sounds like they are making a choice in exchange for very good wages.

Steve

Under
04-10-2010, 09:37 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Colonialism became a dirty word in part because of occasional excesses by the colonizers themselves, but mostly as the result of the theorizing of Lenin, whose most influential book was called Imperialism: The Final Stage of Capitalism. Lenin’s thesis was that the capitalist nations became stagnant as the result of the inherent deficiencies of their system and that they would then rely on colonialism as the only means of creating a market to consume the glut that the proletariat were overproducing. That thesis captivated the minds of the intellectuals, and the canard was loosed that the only interest colonial powers could possibly have in their overseas territories was to serve themselves economically.

Years have gone by since Lenin wrote his book (1917), during which the developing science of statistics, demonstrated that the principal so-called colonial powers – France, Belgium, Portugal, England, the United States – were getting less out of their territories than they pumped into them, and in fact were concentrating their overseas investments not in the territories they were allegedly bent of exploiting, but in other advanced nations. The Marxist hypothesis was exploded. But the smear stuck, and stuck even to this day, so that even the average Western conservative has got on the bandwagon. And what happens, in more cased than not, is that said nations revert to a state of nationalist primitivism, a sort of coca-colonized totalitarianism.

Wm F Buckley </div></div>

LWW
04-10-2010, 01:39 PM
PT ... Under ... why are you introducing reality to people who live off of emotion, propaganda, and hatred?

LWW

Qtec
04-10-2010, 09:47 PM
So what you are saying is that If I am unemployed and on SS and I am offered a job by the mine, I don't have to take it?


Again, my point is that to mine coal you will need to put people underground. Its dangerous enough without the mine risking peoples lives in order to satisfy the investors.

Q

pooltchr
04-11-2010, 07:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So what you are saying is that If I am unemployed and on SS and I am offered a job by the mine, I don't have to take it?


Again, my point is that to mine coal you will need to put people underground. Its dangerous enough without the mine risking peoples lives in order to satisfy the investors.

Q </div></div>

Actually, no you don't have to take it. Of course, if you are living on unemployment and refuse work, you risk losing your handout, but it's your option.

Yes, minimg is a dangerous job. So is driving a race car. Actually, the most dangerous job around is being a commercial fisherman. The point is, there are a lot of dangerous jobs, and nobody is forced to do any of them. People balance the risk with the reward, and make a choice.

Steve

Gayle in MD
04-11-2010, 08:49 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So what you are saying is that If I am unemployed and on SS and I am offered a job by the mine, I don't have to take it?


Again, my point is that to mine coal you will need to put people underground. Its dangerous enough without the mine risking peoples lives in order to satisfy the investors.

Q </div></div>

Their GOD is money. The right has no appreciation for safety regulations. It never occurs to these geniuses that their homes could blow up if there were no oversight of natural gas, or that their kids could be poisoned is there were no oversight of our food, water, air.

How about Real Estate, don't most of us buy Real Estate. Suppose there were no guildlines, no laws, to regulate Real Estate? No recourse when some idiot doctor sews up a patient with is scalpal inside? No recourse when their boss fails to replace a faulty roof, and it caves down on top of them? No assurance that you can go to your bank, and withdraw your money on any given day?

Commonplace rules which any business, and particularly a dangerous operation, must abide by, are beyond their limited comprehension. If it doesn't make some irresponsible CEO wealthy, they don't want it. It never occurs to them that they, too are consumers.

Just let one of them jump into a company truck, and head down one of their rural winding roads, and find they have no brakes, and they would be the first ones sueing their company.

How stunningly ignorant for someone to suggest that because one takes a job, their employer has absolutely no responsibility to provide a safe workplace.

Amazing! Their gross ignorance never fails to amaze! It was people who think like them, and share the same lack of appreciation for human life, who were responsible for hundreds of women, and children, who were burned alive in a clothing factory in New York City.

Pointless to try to reason with the ignorant.

G.

sack316
04-11-2010, 09:28 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Their GOD is money. The right has no appreciation for safety regulations. It never occurs to these geniuses that their homes could blow up if there were no oversight of natural gas, or that their kids could be poisoned is there were no oversight of our food, water, air. </div></div>

How did that oversight work out in the case of this mining tragedy? I don't even know what the final tally of violations was, but safe to say several hundred at least? Oversight caught the violations, yes. But did it enforce or impose anything to fix it? Apparently not.

Now hopefully the oversight, and documentation of such inspections and data will give these families some recourse against the company. But without the greed of the owner and the impotent job of gov't "oversight" the tragedy probably would not have occurred in the first place.

Oversight is pointless if there is no real punishment or enforcement once it catches violations.

Sack

Gayle in MD
04-11-2010, 09:32 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sack316</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Their GOD is money. The right has no appreciation for safety regulations. It never occurs to these geniuses that their homes could blow up if there were no oversight of natural gas, or that their kids could be poisoned is there were no oversight of our food, water, air. </div></div>

How did that oversight work out in the case of this mining tragedy? I don't even know what the final tally of violations was, but safe to say several hundred at least? Oversight caught the violations, yes. But did it enforce or impose anything to fix it? Apparently not.

Now hopefully the oversight, and documentation of such inspections and data will give these families some recourse against the company. But without the greed of the owner and the impotent job of gov't "oversight" the tragedy probably would not have occurred in the first place.

Oversight is pointless if there is no real punishment or enforcement once it catches violations.

Sack


</div></div>

We are very fortunate that we currently have a president who has demanded a complete study and report on how this tragedy could have come about, without tighter restrictions.

He will continue to tighten restrictions which cause the loss of life and limb.

Unlike Bush, who appointed the very lobbyists of each industry, to direct government oversight of them.

G.

pooltchr
04-11-2010, 09:41 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
We are very fortunate that we currently have a president who has demanded a complete study and report on how this tragedy could have come about, without tighter restrictions.

He will continue to tighten restrictions which cause the loss of life and limb.

Unlike Bush, who appointed the very lobbyists of each industry, to direct government oversight of them.

G. </div></div>

Get real. This is not the first time something like this has happened in this country, and every time it does, whoever is president launches an investigation. If this were the first accident of it's kind, you might be on to something, but it's not. They will push some paper, create study committees, and we will still have more accidents. That's why they are called accidents!

I do like your choice of the word "restrictions" as opposed to "regulation" It really points out how you support the idea that government should limit or even stop business.

Finally, I would have been disappointed, had you not turned the blame of the accident to Bush. We already know you believe every bad thing that happens is somehow his fault.

Steve

sack316
04-11-2010, 09:42 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
We are very fortunate that we currently have a president who has demanded a complete study and report on how this tragedy could have come about, without tighter restrictions.

He will continue to tighten restrictions which cause the loss of life and limb.

Unlike Bush, who appointed the very lobbyists of each industry, to direct government oversight of them.

G. </div></div>

The restrictions are all there, the enforcement is lacking.

We don't need a study to determine the cause of the blast. We've known for well over a century that too high of levels of methane equals "boom".

Now we need accountability, and an example made, to hopefully decrease the chances of something similar happening again.

Sack

Gayle in MD
04-11-2010, 09:45 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sack316</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
We are very fortunate that we currently have a president who has demanded a complete study and report on how this tragedy could have come about, without tighter restrictions.

He will continue to tighten restrictions which cause the loss of life and limb.

Unlike Bush, who appointed the very lobbyists of each industry, to direct government oversight of them.

G. </div></div>

The restrictions are all there, the enforcement is lacking.

We don't need a study to determine the cause of the blast. We've known for well over a century that too high of levels of methane equals "boom".

Now we need accountability, and an example made, to hopefully decrease the chances of something similar happening again.

Sack </div></div>

Yes, that's what I said....guess I wasn't clear enough. I believe the report will be studied by the President, and addressed in terms of creating tighter oversight,, and that some heads will roll.

G.

Gayle in MD
04-11-2010, 09:56 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'> = Profits before people.</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"If anything happens to me, I'll be looking down from heaven at you all. I love you. Take care of my baby. Tell her that daddy loves her, she's beautiful, she's funny. Just take care of my baby girl."

Those were the chilling words in a note from Josh Napper, a West Virginia coal miner who was killed in the Massey mine explosion on Monday.

The note was written to Napper's girlfriend, Jennifer, over Easter weekend -- <span style='font-size: 20pt'>just days before his fears were realized.</span> It was described to CNN's John Roberts by Pam Napper, Josh's mother. </div></div>

link (http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691)

Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a mine if they didn't have to.
Wonder how many of the Wall St rich kids would be prepared to work down a mine for a year? You know, the guys who are now complaining about how much TAX they have to pay!
They wouldn't do it for a Million Dollars. Poor people who have no choice do it year in, year out for a lot less.

Capitalism.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/west-va-coal-company-deadly-explosion-fined-millions/story?id=10293691 </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The West Virginia coal mine where an explosion killed 25 workers and left another four unaccounted for in the worst mining disaster since 1984 had amassed scores of citations from mining safety officials, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>including 57 infractions just last month for violations that included repeatedly failing to develop and follow a ventilation plan.</span> </div></div>


Q </div></div>

Actually ... miners are very well paid and there are waiting lists to get hired.

LWW </div></div>

You are such an idiot that you made my point for me.

This guy went to work everyday thinking he was going to die, but he still went! He had no choice.

Q </div></div>

If they haven't learned the lessons of unregulated Capitalism by now, after what we have seen on Wall Street, they never will.

The Republican Policies of subsidizing the same corporations which outsource our jobs, and gouge the American consumer, and encourage the hiring of illegals, looking the other way for the corporate exploitation of cheap labor, and working to destroy the unions, are at the crux of the demise of the Middle Class, which has lost wages throughout every single Republican Administration.

Americans are not lazy, they are hard workers, the hardest in the world. I think they deserve a safe workplace, and CEO's running the show who give a damn about the dangers under which they work.

It's the constant rightwing support of the exploitation of the American Workers which I find most offensive about their ideology. It started with Reagan, who was all for big business, and only cared about the fat guys at the top, who only care about their bottom line, and nothing else, even when they are in the process of destroying the economy. Republicans have always been against the American Workers, and it has worsened since Reagan with every Republican who followed him.

Trickle down doesn't work, and that has been proven over and over again. Even Bush Two, called it Voodoo Economics.

G.

LWW
04-11-2010, 10:05 AM
What amazes me is that the left couldn't wait to bleat <span style='font-size: 26pt'>B-B-B-BUT B-B-B-BOOOOSH!!!!</span> over then last mine accident because it happened while he was POTUS ... yet today they can't wait to bleat <span style='font-size: 26pt'>B-B-B-BUT B-B-B-BOOOOSH!!!!</span> because it happened while Obama was POTUS.

Here's the bottom line to all thinking people ... the POTUS neither causes nor ceases industrial accidents.

LWW

pooltchr
04-11-2010, 02:55 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Here's the bottom line to all thinking people ... the POTUS neither causes nor ceases industrial accidents.

LWW </div></div>

That is where your thinking is all screwed up. All good things are the direct result of the president. All bad things are the fault of the last president.

Why can't you get this straight???
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
Steve

Under
04-11-2010, 04:28 PM
Bad habits die slowly.

My feeling is that if the lurkers and some of the posters hear something positive, it may alter their rote responses. The concept of reality is like a virus and may degrade the emotion, propaganda and hatred that is being spewed out.

It is a kind of science test. Besides, I need the practice.

LWW
04-11-2010, 05:33 PM
You really should read "198" because we have most of the characters at work here.

H would fit O'Brien perfectly. He will argue indignantly that 2+2=5 an 2+2=3 at the same time, and cheer with glee as the party issues "A BOOT STOMPING IN THE FACE OF HUMANITY FOREVER" to enforce obedience to the point of believing as O'Brien did.

G would be Ampleforth who wiles away their time rewriting history to fit the current "TRUTH" as handed down by the party ... living in a deathly fear that the slightest deviation from party dogma would be their undoing.

W would be Parson, who behaved in an uber obedient manner to whatever the party told him to do.

Emmanuel Goldstein would be a mixture of Limbaugh and Beck ... the leader of the resistance who told what was going on and the party used all possible means in an effort to destroy them.

Big Brother is Obama.

You, Steve, UGOT, JohnnyD, myself, and a few others would be a good fit for the character of Winston Smith.

I wish I could get hondo to read it also ... I think it would help him out.

LWW