PDA

View Full Version : When and why do you change cues?



L_Vigus
05-06-2010, 10:08 AM
The current cue thread got me to wondering why some people change cues often. Up till recently I have owened 4 cues in my life. Two I sold because I didn't like the way they played, a Palmer( I think it was one of the first import Palmers) and a Meucce. Two that I have keeped for 30 years or so. A Adams and a Scruggs. I don't think there is anything wroung with changing. Just courious why some people change so often.

Deeman3
05-06-2010, 01:43 PM
A) Every 5,000 Miles (highway miles)

B) Only if it really wants to change

C) When the "Custom" slide on tip comes off

D) When "Hope", alone, is just not enough

E) When my opponent notices the WalMart sticker

F) When I can't tell it from my Ping 9 Iron

G) When DeeWoman tells me to

H) Every time Wolfdancer sends me a new golf swing theory

Sorry, I just could not help myself.

I think it is mostly because people want/need some change in their game over a slump or dry spell and they think the cue is the culprit. This is mostly an illusion.

I shoot with a 19 year old Schoen, before that a Meucci for 6 years and prior to that, a 1971 Balabushka alternated with a 1970 Adams I still have all of them; except.....my original cue was a Palmer PB that was destroyed in a terrible incident in Adrian, Texas in 1970. I still mourn that cue. The man did recover much later. Aside from the Palmer which I did not/could not control (It's untimely death) the remainder of my cue changes were my body responses to my changes in "feel." All probably imaginary but mostly affordable in those days. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

cushioncrawler
05-06-2010, 06:28 PM
I used to often change cues, then i started to experiment with changing the cue.
I drilled axially into the butt, to looze wt.
On Sundays i mainly added wt, solder woz best, melt it and pour it in.
On Tuesdays i would drill the solder out again.
Then i started drilling throo the cue nearer the center, to add solder or lead, to make the cue heavyr and to change the balance.
Later i would sandpaper the shaft to make thinner and whippyr.
Later i would uze the angle-grinder to take out a big slice of shaft, on one side only, to help skrews etc.
Later i found the trick of putting bends into my cues, to help me to shoot straight.

In the end i found that i woz getting a full season out of my tips, but my cues were lucky to last till the end of the month.
madMac.

pooltchr
05-06-2010, 06:53 PM
There are probably a lot of different reasons.
Some people just like to have new things. These are the same people that trade in their car every year or two.
Some people are looking for the cue that feels "just right".
Some people just like cues for their design or craftsmanship.
Some people even think a new cue will make them play better.
Some people change cues when they get a new sponsor.
There are probably as many reasons as there are pool players.

Steve

Fran Crimi
05-07-2010, 08:12 AM
I think it's a personality thing. I've always felt that pool imitates life. You can learn a lot about a person just by watching their pool habits, both on and off the table. It's one of the things I study as an instructor. I think that often times people who change cues a lot have a restlessness about them, and you'll probably see it in other aspects of their lives.

Sid_Vicious
05-07-2010, 08:41 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fran Crimi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's a personality thing. I've always felt that pool imitates life. You can learn a lot about a person just by watching their pool habits, both on and off the table. It's one of the things I study as an instructor. I think that often times people who change cues a lot have a restlessness about them, and you'll probably see it in other aspects of their lives. </div></div>

That's an interesting prospective Fran. What does it tell you when players stay with a beat up cue, or mostly choose to just shoot off of the wall? Personally I assume they stay too broke or are hustling. Is there more to it than this, in your opinion? TIA sid

1Time
05-07-2010, 08:50 AM
Why and when do I change cues?

I change cues when I'm not seeing the level of play that I want with my current cue. So I keep trying different cues until I get there.


Why and when do other people change cues?

Other people change cues for various reasons, most of which don't interest me as I'm not in the business of selling cues or doing related market research.


Why and when should players who want to shoot better pool change cues?

Such players should try as many different cues / equipment as is practical and make whatever changes to their game that result in better play. And as long such changes result in better play, anytime such players can afford to do this is when it should be done.

Fran Crimi
05-07-2010, 09:52 AM
I think that players who stay with a beat-up cue are basically resistant to change. There could be many reasons for the resistance, which IMO, is the interesting part in figuring them out. Sometimes it's because of fear of the unknown, or because they're disorganized regarding their ability to put away some money for a new cue, or because they have to put the money to better use regarding paying bills or supporting their families. The list goes on and on...

Regardless, my antannea immediately go up when I encounter a student with a beat-up cue. It many cases, it could be a battle to teach them. Will their minds be open enough to take in new information? Are their priorities somewhere else where they may not have the time nor the inclination to practice?

pooltchr
05-07-2010, 10:12 AM
Fran, from a personal standpoint, that may be an over generalization. I have been shooting with the same cue for nearly 10 years. It's old, certainly not all shiney and clean, but I am very comfortable using it. I just see no reason to change cues. And I think I am fairly serious about pool, and always willing to learn new things.

As I pointed out, there may be a lot of different reasons why someone does or does not change cues. And those reasons may or may not reflect on their dedication to their game.

Just another way of looking at things.

Steve

Deeman3
05-07-2010, 10:23 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1Time</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why and when do I change cues?

I change cues when I'm not seeing the level of play that I want with my current cue. So I keep trying different cues until I get there.


Why and when do other people change cues?

Other people change cues for various reasons, most of which don't interest me as I'm not in the business of selling cues or doing related market research.


Why and when should players who want to shoot better pool change cues?

Such players should try as many different cues / equipment as is practical and make whatever changes to their game that result in better play. And as long such changes result in better play, anytime such players can afford to do this is when it should be done. </div></div>


<span style="color: #FF0000">I quote from a guy who could still give most of us a hundred balls and win, "It ain't the cue!" Dick ##### /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </span>

pooltchr
05-07-2010, 10:49 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deeman3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[<span style="color: #FF0000">I quote from a guy who could still give most of us a hundred balls and win, "It ain't the cue!" Dick ##### /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </span> </div></div>

Dick and I don't always see eye to eye on things, but on this one, I'm behind him 100%

I've often said I could trade cues with Archer, and the result of a match up are still going to be the same.
Steve

Fran Crimi
05-07-2010, 12:49 PM
Steve, I think there's a difference between old well-kept and beat-up. I used the same cue for 10 years myself but it was far from beat-up.

Deeman3
05-07-2010, 02:01 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fran Crimi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Steve, I think there's a difference between old well-kept and beat-up. I used the same cue for 10 years myself but it was far from beat-up. </div></div>

<span style="color: #FF0000">Fran,

I think that was little Sid who said that, not Steve. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif A good question, how does a serious player end up with a banged up and ugly cue. Maybe the answer is they don't! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif Except for slight yellowing of ivory, my old cues look as good as new ones, well, better! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif</span>

Sid_Vicious
05-07-2010, 04:41 PM
Actually Steve referenced an aged cue he plays with in a follow up. My original point to make was about players with old Mali looking cues with the finish worn down near the forearm and area where they grip, kinda like Willie's guitar. I've seen other examples but won't go into those. I actually become attracted when I see an aged cue from a distance, but not the finish worn old Mali looking sticks. There's a difference between a prize cue from decades ago and someone's closet cue his dad maybe got at a yard sale, or from Kmarts. sid

Rich R.
05-07-2010, 07:04 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fran Crimi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's a personality thing. I've always felt that pool imitates life. You can learn a lot about a person just by watching their pool habits, both on and off the table. It's one of the things I study as an instructor. I think that often times people who change cues a lot have a restlessness about them, and you'll probably see it in other aspects of their lives. </div></div>
Fran, I think you hit the nail on the head with this statement. At least concerning me you did.

I don't now, nor have I ever liked repitition. In school I hated memorizing poems or quotes. When I drive to the grocery store, I drive home using a different route. In pool, I hate drills because of the repitition and I switch between 3 or 4 cues on a regular basis.

Hating drills is probably one of the many reasons I will never be a good pool player. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

Pacifist
05-09-2010, 11:51 AM
I have a Predator2 that is very beat up. There are numerous dents and scratches in the butt end of the cue.The leather wrap has tears and is starting to come unglued where it meets after wrapping the butt. The shaft and tip are in good condition though.In someways i liked the dents and scratches, kinda like battle scars, the only thing that was a downside was the cost of refinishing the cue would have equalled the cost of the cue. I recently switched to a McDermott cue. It is a bottom line cue with no wrap and no frills. I switched due to the fact that im rough on cues and McDermott has a good warranty for cue repair.

Fran Crimi
05-09-2010, 02:08 PM
Just curious....Why are you rough on cues? What do you do to them that dents and scratches them up so much?

Pacifist
05-09-2010, 04:03 PM
Sometimes im clumsy. Sometimes I drop below level in my swing and the cue hits the table(I don't do that much anymore). I used to play in bars a lot because that was the only place with tables and a lot of accidents happen in bars. Sometimes I hold my cue so loose that it flies out of my hand when I shoot very hard and the butt strikes the table. There are a lot of reasons why my cue got dinged up I could probably think of more if I tried.

hondo
05-10-2010, 05:57 AM
For one hole I like a cue around 19.2 that doesn't have a real
stiff hit.
For 8 ball and 9 ball I like a 19.8 with a stiffer hit.
For a bar table I like a sneaky pete about 19.5 or so.

When I haven't been playing much and my my stroke is off I go to a slightly heavier, stiffer stick.

Plus, I have alot of cues and I like to give them a chance.

Kinda funny for a guy that shot with a Meucci OLD-1 for years.

Fran Crimi
05-10-2010, 06:05 AM
I've had that loose problem myself with breaking. I've been known to occasionally send my break cue over the table like a javelin, so I bought a rubber grip for my break cue and haven't had a problem since. They really do the trick if you like to hold the cue extra loose.

pooltchr
05-10-2010, 08:59 AM
I couldn't help but laugh at the mental image I just got of your student's scrambling for cover as you were demonstrating breaking technique! LOL

Hope you are doing well.

Steve

Njhustler1
05-10-2010, 04:29 PM
at valley forge i finally bought a new cue after using the same beat up mali for the previous 20 years. i came to the conclusion that the benefit of playing with a better cue far outweighed the sentimental value i was giving up. i wish i made that decision 15 years ago!!! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

hondo
05-10-2010, 04:47 PM
What'd you buy?

Njhustler1
05-10-2010, 07:00 PM
i got a meucci with the black dot shaft. i have such better control of the cueball now. i'm kicking myself for not trading up sooner.

Fran Crimi
05-10-2010, 07:59 PM
I'm doing very well, thanks, Steve. Yes, I must admit I've scared a few people with my flying break shot. I remember once the cue soared right between two people who were standing at the end of the table. That's when I decided to get the rubber wrap. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

DeadCrab
05-11-2010, 08:24 AM
***********************
Regardless, my antannea immediately go up when I encounter a student with a beat-up cue. It many cases, it could be a battle to teach them. Will their minds be open enough to take in new information? Are their priorities somewhere else where they may not have the time nor the inclination to practice?
***************************************

Depends on what you mean by "beat up". Normal wear is different from abuse scars.

I've been playing for 3 years with the same low end McDermott. It has had a few different tips, and some ferrule scratches reflecting same. The ferrule is a nice shade of blue and so is the shaft. It doesn't bother me, and I don't think it affects playability. If nothing else, it shows that I have used it. But, I've never abused it.

Personally, I'm partial to things that show some mileage. I detest the sight of "off road" vehicles that don't have the marks to prove that they have actually been there. Never trust anybody that doesn't have more wear in the knees of their jeans than in the seat. Look for hand dings. That's how to tell who the workers are, and aren't.

I think a playing cue should look like it. I would regard the condition of the tip to be a much better indicator of the user's intent than dirt and minor dings.

Fran Crimi
05-11-2010, 10:14 AM
You mentioned dirt and minor dings. If you are a player who respects your equipment, dirt is not really going to be an issue. If you don't wipe down the cue after playing, then yes, dirt will eventually become an issue. Some players are just plain lazy and it shows in the way they keep their equipment and the way they play as well. I've seen it often enough.

As for minor dings, I would like to know where they are before I feel that it's normal. If they're in the shaft, there's a potential problem. If they're in the butt, then a few are no big deal, a lot are.

L_Vigus
05-25-2010, 06:52 AM
Thanks for the insight guys. I think I have figured out that I was/am just to cheap to buy more sticks after spending a hundred bucks on my Scruggs. Now that I am making my own I hardly get 1/2 way through making one. Before I start thinking what I am going to do differanty on the next one. I started two, one for me, last week and may start two this week. At this rate in about 6 monthes the kids in the neighborhood will start getting cued up.

Bambu
05-25-2010, 08:47 AM
A hundred bucks for a scruggs? Was it warped from a flood or something?

L_Vigus
05-25-2010, 09:51 AM
Nope was stright in 81 when I bought it used and still stright now. Four point, four veneer with two shafts. The shafts were damaged but easily repaired. Neither the seller( He won it off a guy) or I had ever heard of a Scruggs cue and just thought it was a used Joss with someones initials on it, Some Josses back then weren't marked. Explains why I didn't buy anymore cues. Where was I going to find a better cue for 100 bucks. Quit playing a few years latter. Didn't know what I had till the mid 90s.

I think I used up a lot off luck the day I bought this cue. For those that haven't seen a hunderd dollar Scruggs, hear ar afew pics.

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20006.JPG

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/ts%20logo.bmp

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20001.JPG

Larry

Rich R.
05-26-2010, 06:41 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: L_Vigus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Nope was stright in 81 when I bought it used and still stright now. Four point, four veneer with two shafts. The shafts were damaged but easily repaired. Neither the seller( He won it off a guy) or I had ever heard of a Scruggs cue and just thought it was a used Joss with someones initials on it, Some Josses back then weren't marked. Explains why I didn't buy anymore cues. Where was I going to find a better cue for 100 bucks. Quit playing a few years latter. Didn't know what I had till the mid 90s.

I think I used up a lot off luck the day I bought this cue. For those that haven't seen a hunderd dollar Scruggs, hear ar afew pics.

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20006.JPG

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/ts%20logo.bmp

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20001.JPG

Larry </div></div>
If you ever decide to sell that cue, you will get a better return on your initial investment than you would have gotten in the stock market. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

Bambu
05-26-2010, 07:19 AM
Nice deal, bound to triple your money. Weird looking ferrule though, or is that just age and smoke making it yellow?

Deeman3
05-26-2010, 12:27 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hondo</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> a slightly heavier, stiffer stick.

<span style="color: #FF6666">Kinda like your girlfriends... </span>

Plus, I have alot of cues and I like to give them a chance.

<span style="color: #FF0000">Kinda like your girlfriends... </span>

Kinda funny for a guy that shot with a Meucci OLD-1 for years.

<span style="color: #FF6666">Kinda like your friends...

I'm beginning to like this!!!! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif I did leave the one hole part alone.. </span> </div></div>

L_Vigus
05-26-2010, 01:31 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rich R.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: L_Vigus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Nope was stright in 81 when I bought it used and still stright now. Four point, four veneer with two shafts. The shafts were damaged but easily repaired. Neither the seller( He won it off a guy) or I had ever heard of a Scruggs cue and just thought it was a used Joss with someones initials on it, Some Josses back then weren't marked. Explains why I didn't buy anymore cues. Where was I going to find a better cue for 100 bucks. Quit playing a few years latter. Didn't know what I had till the mid 90s.

I think I used up a lot off luck the day I bought this cue. For those that haven't seen a hunderd dollar Scruggs, hear ar afew pics.

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20006.JPG

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/ts%20logo.bmp

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20001.JPG

Larry </div></div>
If you ever decide to sell that cue, you will get a better return on your initial investment than you would have gotten in the stock market. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
</div></div>

I don't know. Hundered bucks in Microsoft it 1981 could buy alot of Scruggs in 2010!

Larry

hondo
05-26-2010, 07:22 PM
I have 2 Scruggs.
One is an unwrapped 1/1 I paid $1100 for
and the other is an older sneaky pete in great shape that I paid under $300 for.

hondo
05-26-2010, 07:23 PM
LOL! And don't even mention wrong hole.

Rich R.
05-27-2010, 06:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: L_Vigus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rich R.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: L_Vigus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Nope was stright in 81 when I bought it used and still stright now. Four point, four veneer with two shafts. The shafts were damaged but easily repaired. Neither the seller( He won it off a guy) or I had ever heard of a Scruggs cue and just thought it was a used Joss with someones initials on it, Some Josses back then weren't marked. Explains why I didn't buy anymore cues. Where was I going to find a better cue for 100 bucks. Quit playing a few years latter. Didn't know what I had till the mid 90s.

I think I used up a lot off luck the day I bought this cue. For those that haven't seen a hunderd dollar Scruggs, hear ar afew pics.

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20006.JPG

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/ts%20logo.bmp

http://www.thefroginator.co.uk/fm-pix/albums/userpics/Srcggs%20joint%20001.JPG

Larry </div></div>
If you ever decide to sell that cue, you will get a better return on your initial investment than you would have gotten in the stock market. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
</div></div>

I don't know. Hundered bucks in Microsoft it 1981 could buy alot of Scruggs in 2010!

Larry </div></div>
I'm not sure about the Microsoft return, but IF you could order a four point, four veneer, two shaft Scruggs now, it would cost you around $1900 or more. Your cue may even be worth more on the collector market. I'm not a collecto, so I'm not sure about that.
You did well. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Deeman3
05-27-2010, 09:55 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hondo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LOL! And don't even mention wrong hole. </div></div>

<span style="color: #FF0000"> I give up! I can't get a fight started with you these days. That about losing my touch! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif We must be friends...

We need to hold each other to being at the Derby next year. I have plot to overthrow the present big time gamblers and I'll need your devious input. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif</span>

hondo
05-27-2010, 01:43 PM
I'm really hoping to go.

wolfdancer
05-31-2010, 05:02 PM
not sure when to change cues....but I remembered Grady's old line about Jimmy Reid changing GFs.....
"Jimmy would put an orange and a 5 ball on top of the nite stand...and as soon as his latest GF could tell the difference between the two...she was outta there."

hondo
05-31-2010, 07:25 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wolfdancer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure when to change cues....but I remembered Grady's old line about Jimmy Reid changing GFs.....
"Jimmy would put an orange and a 5 ball on top of the nite stand...and as soon as his latest GF could tell the difference between the two...she was outta there." </div></div>


/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif