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pooltchr
11-07-2010, 04:22 PM
I thought the bill was supposed to make things <u>better</u>.
It seems fitting the the employees of one organization that pushed for passage of this bill would be some of the first to feel the effects.




Obamacare Spurs AARP to Raise Premiums

AARP's endorsement helped secure passage of President Barack Obama's health care overhaul. Now the seniors' lobby is telling its employees their insurance costs will rise partly as a result of the law.

In an e-mail to employees, AARP says health care premiums will increase by 8 percent to 13 percent next year because of rapidly rising medical costs.

And AARP adds that it's changing copayments and deductibles to avoid a 40 percent tax on high-cost health plans that takes effect in 2018 under the law. Aerospace giant Boeing also has cited the tax in asking its workers to pay more. Shifting costs to employees lowers the value of a health care plan and acts like an escape hatch from the tax.

"Most plan co-pays and deductibles have been modified," Jennifer Hodges, AARP's director of compensation and benefits, wrote employees in an Oct. 25 e-mail. "Plan value changes were necessary not only from a cost management standpoint but also to ensure that AARP's plans fall below the threshold for high-cost group plans under health care reform."

LWW
11-08-2010, 12:29 AM
The doublethinkers cannot reply until their "OPINION" is delivered in David Plouffe's AM e-mail.

LWW

Qtec
11-08-2010, 06:18 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I thought the bill was supposed to make things <u>better</u>.
It seems fitting the the employees of one organization that pushed for passage of this bill would be some of the first to feel the effects.




Obamacare Spurs AARP to Raise Premiums

AARP's endorsement helped secure passage of President Barack Obama's health care overhaul. Now the seniors' lobby is telling its employees their insurance costs will rise partly as a result of the law.

In an e-mail to employees, AARP says health care premiums will increase by 8 percent to 13 percent next year because of rapidly rising medical costs.

And AARP adds that it's changing copayments and deductibles to avoid a 40 percent tax on high-cost health plans that takes effect in 2018 under the law. Aerospace giant Boeing also has cited the tax in asking its workers to pay more. Shifting costs to employees lowers the value of a health care plan and acts like an escape hatch from the tax.

"Most plan co-pays and deductibles have been modified," Jennifer Hodges, AARP's director of compensation and benefits, wrote employees in an Oct. 25 e-mail. "Plan value changes were necessary not only from a cost management standpoint but also to ensure that AARP's plans fall below the threshold for high-cost group plans under health care reform."
</div></div>

You missed a bit.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">AARP officials said <u>medical inflation is the main reason employee costs will be going up. The health care law is "a small part,"</u> said David Certner, legislative affairs director. </div></div>

Try reading your own links.


Q

LWW
11-08-2010, 06:49 AM
And dear leader promised the average family health care premium would drop by $2,500.00 a year ... a lie which AARP parroted.

Try fact checking the propaganda put on the spoon for you ...

LWW

pooltchr
11-08-2010, 07:04 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Try reading your own links.


Q </div></div>

I did. Did you catch the meaning of this part?

And AARP adds that it's changing copayments and deductibles to avoid a <span style='font-size: 17pt'>40 percent tax on high-cost health plans that takes effect in 2018 under the law</span>

We were told the law would LOWER insurance costs....and the opposite is what we got.

Steve

Qtec
11-08-2010, 07:12 AM
What part of,

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">AARP officials said medical inflation is the main reason employee costs will be going up. <span style='font-size: 20pt'>The health care law is "a small part,</span>" </div></div>

..didn't you understand?

Q

pooltchr
11-08-2010, 07:19 AM
AARP supported the passage of the law. What part of SPIN don't you understand.

Going up 8 to 13 percent to cover rising costs is one thing. Changing deductables and copays to offset a 40 percent tax on premiums is a separate issue.

8 percent due to increased costs
40 percent coming out of the new law.

Which of these would you consider to be "most"?

If you like your healthcare plan you have with your employer, you will be able to stay with it. Unfortunately, we will make you pay 40 percent more for it, if you employer decides to leave it as is.

Just one of those little details they didn't talk about when they were passing the bill.


Steve

Qtec
11-08-2010, 07:23 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'>medical inflation is the main reason employee costs will be going up</span> </div></div>

Q

pooltchr
11-08-2010, 12:30 PM
Read the whole thing. Yes, that is why employee costs are going up. The reason their copays and deductibles are going up is to circumvent the 40% tax.

Even so, as you so conveniently ignored the question before, Didn't Obama tell us that this bill was going to bring costs down???????????

Steve

Deeman3
11-08-2010, 12:46 PM
The rising costs we are seeing across the country are going to be offset when there are no premiums left to be paid after private plans are dumped by companies looking to avoid the rising costs. They will pay an 8 percent tax and most of us will be forced into a government program.

Perhaps there was a reason the bill had to be over 2,000 pages!

Thanks, Nancy...

pooltchr
11-08-2010, 12:58 PM
Exactly! How anyone can even begin to defend this bill as anything other that destroying our system is unbleievable.

Steve

LWW
11-08-2010, 03:23 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'>medical inflation is the main reason employee costs will be going up</span> </div></div>

Q </div></div>

See if you can find the discrepancy in the quotes below:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">May 3, 2008
OBAMA: I also have a health care plan that would save the average family $2,500 on their premiums.

January 3, 2008
OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna reduce costs an average of $2,500 per family on premiums.

March 14, 2008
OBAMA: And if you've got health care, we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

February 23, 2008
OBAMA: And we will lower premiums for the typical family by $2,500 a year.

June 17, 2007
OBAMA: And cut the cost of health care by up to $2,500 per family.

Campaign Ad
EVAN BAYH: Barack's policies will provide health care cost reductions of about $2,500 for the typical family.

OBAMA: And if you already have health insurance, we will lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

April 22, 2008
OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer through a catastrophic reinsurance plan to lower premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

March 1, 2008
OBAMA: We'll work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad
NARRATOR: Barack Obama will provide rural America with affordable health care, and save the typical American family $2,500 a year.

May 30, 2008
OBAMA: And reduces every family's premiums by as much as $2,500.</div></div>

TRUTH VERSUS TRUTHINESS! (http://freedomeden.blogspot.com/2010/03/obama-20-promises-for-2500.html)

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a247/lww/ONLINE%20ARGUMENTS/Snoopy.jpg

LWW

LWW
11-09-2010, 05:03 AM
C'mon Snoopy ... you can figure this one out.

LWW

Sev
11-09-2010, 07:38 PM
Oh OHHHHHH!!!!!

Over 50,000,000 Americans without health care and climbing.

To bad Obama played politics with the initiation date.

Qtec
11-10-2010, 02:04 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">C'mon Snoopy ... you can figure this one out.

LWW </div></div>

Obviously you can't. Note the dates. 2008? What was he talking about?
No idea?

Let me explain.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Q. I like my current insurance coverage. Will I have to change plans?
A. No, you will not have to change plans. For those who have insurance now, nothing will change under the Obama plan – except that you will pay less. Obama’s plan will save a typical family up to $2,500 on premiums by bringing the health care system into
the 21st century: cutting waste, improving technology, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>expanding coverage to all Americans,</span> and paying for some high-cost cases.</div></div>

The reason why HC companies are hiking their rates is because the HC bill that was passed was the<span style='font-size: 17pt'> GOP HC bill</span>. No Public Option. No universal HC, nowhere near it.

They stalled, they howled, had temper tantrums and got 100's of their own amendments accepted and then voted a a unit against the bill anyway!

In the richest country in the world, 20% of the population Americans still have no HC insurance. That's a disgrace.

The HC companies still have a monopoly. They get together and make deals about how much they can screw their clients for. There is no competition.

Q

LWW
11-10-2010, 04:12 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The reason why HC companies are hiking their rates is because the HC bill that was passed was the<span style='font-size: 17pt'> GOP HC bill</span>.

Q </div></div>
http://forums.azbilliards.com/images/newsmilies/thud.gif http://forums.azbilliards.com/images/newsmilies/thud.gif http://forums.azbilliards.com/images/newsmilies/thud.gif http://forums.azbilliards.com/images/newsmilies/thud.gif http://forums.azbilliards.com/images/newsmilies/thud.gif

No matter how low the bar is set, you find a way beneath it.

LWW

Qtec
11-10-2010, 05:54 AM
You tell me O wise one. If Obama had got his way, how would the HC bill be now?

Q

LWW
11-10-2010, 06:02 AM
Obama would have signed anything that came out of congress called HCR ... what it actually said really made no difference.

And, FTR, "OBAMACARE" is essentially Hillary's plan which candidate Obama said would be disastrous if passed.

LWW

Qtec
11-10-2010, 06:06 AM
ie, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>NO ANSWER.</span>



Q..........yet again LWW fails to meet the bar,

LWW
11-10-2010, 06:09 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ie, <span style='font-size: 20pt'>NO ANSWER.</span>



Q..........yet again LWW fails to meet the bar,

</div></div>

Is there anyone near you fluent in English who can explain to you what you clearly lack the acuity to understand?

LWW

hondo
11-10-2010, 06:57 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">



Q..........yet again LWW fails to meet the bar,

</div></div>

You are close to an epiphany, my friend.

Gayle in MD
11-10-2010, 10:37 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deeman3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The rising costs we are seeing across the country are going to be offset when there are no premiums left to be paid after private plans are dumped by companies looking to avoid the rising costs. They will pay an 8 percent tax and most of us will be forced into a government program.

Perhaps there was a reason the bill had to be over 2,000 pages!

Thanks, Nancy... </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Health Care Law and W-2 Forms
May 26, 2010

Q: Does the new health care law require workers to pay income tax on the value of employer-provided health insurance?

A: No. The value will appear on employees’ W-2 forms for information purposes, but will not be considered taxable income.


FULL QUESTION


I would like to know how accurate the following e-mail claim is:

You really need to read this……starts next year

This is supposed to be part of the new Health Care Bill.

The originator of this notice contacted his Congressman about House bill HR3590 the health care bill, that just passed, and asked for a summary of changes. An aid directed him to go to www: thomas.gov ; enter HR3590 in the search Box and look for summaries.

Starting in 2011 (next year folks) your W 2 tax form sent by your employer Will be increased to show the value of what ever health insurance you are Given by the company. It does not matter if that’s a private concern or Governmental body of some sort. If you’re retired ? So what; your gross Will go up by the amount of insurance you get.

The dollar value (cost of what the company pays for your insurance) will be considered income and added to your gross pay. You will be taxed on the total.

⬐ Click to expand/collapse the full text ⬏

You will be required to pay taxes on a large sum of money that you have never seen.

Take your tax form you just finished and see what $15,000 or $20,000
Additional gross does to your tax debt. That’s what you’ll pay next year.
For many it also puts you into a new higher bracket so it’s even worse.

This is how the government is going to buy insurance for 15 % that don’t
Have insurance and it’s only part of the tax increases.

Not believing this I researched the summaries and here’s what I read:

On page 25 of 29 :

TITLE IX REVENUE PROVISIONS- SUBTITLE A: REVENUE OFFSET PROVISIONS-(sec .
9001 , as modified by sec. 10901)
Sec.9002. "requires employers to include in the W-2 form of each employee the aggregate cost of applicable employer sponsored group health coverage that is excludable from the employees gross income."

Joan Pryde is the senior tax editor for the Kiplinger letters. Go to
Kiplingers and read about 13 tax changes that could affect you. Number 3 is what I just told you about.

Why am I sending you this ?. The same reason I hope you forward this to every single person in your address book.

People have the right to know the truth because an election is coming in November



FULL ANSWER


Here’s another one to add to the list of false claims about the new health care law.

It’s true that the value of employer-paid health insurance will be added as an information item on W-2 forms. But contrary to this widely circulating chain e-mail, it definitely will not be considered taxable income.

Readers who followed the 2008 presidential campaign may recall that it was Republican candidate John McCain who proposed to make the value of employer-sponsored health insurance taxable. Democrats hated that idea; Barack Obama ran an ad claiming, falsely, that it would be the "largest middle-class tax increase in history."

So it is ironic that some of President Obama’s critics now claim that the bill he signed would do what his opponent proposed and he denounced. Ironic, but false.

The e-mail’s author correctly quotes a Congressional Research Service summary of the bill that became law (H.R. 3590), noting that Section 9002 "Requires employers to include in the W-2 form of each employee the aggregate cost of applicable employer-sponsored group health coverage." But the author then goes on to conclude — quite incorrectly — that this amount will be "added to your gross pay" and that "[y]ou will be taxed on the total." The CRS did not say that, and neither does the legislation itself. In fact, the value will continue to be untaxed, just as in the past.

The e-mail’s author also claims that an article written by Joan Pryde, a senior editor of the Kiplinger letters, backs up the claim: "Go to Kiplingers and read about 13 tax changes that could affect you. Number 3 is what I just told you about." But the truth is that the Kiplinger letters actually contradicts the claim.

Pryde’s article is dated April 5 and is headlined "Health Care Reform: Tax Hikes on the Way — Here are 13 changes in the massive overhaul that could impact your tax bill, for better or worse." Among them:

3. A requirement that businesses include the value of the health care benefits they provide to employees on W-2s, beginning with W-2s for 2011. The amount reported is not considered taxable income.

The author of this false e-mail seems to have missed the second sentence in that paragraph — the part that says the amount "is not considered taxable income."

–Brooks Jackson


Sources
Pryde, Joan. "Health Care Reform: Tax Hikes on the Way." Kiplinger letters. 5 Apr 2010.

United States. Cong. Senate. 111th Congress, 2 nd Session. H.R. 3590, "The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act." (Enrolled as Agreed to or Passed by Both House and Senate). accessed 26 May 2010.

</div></div>

http://www.factcheck.org


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
November 5, 2010

CONTACT
AARP Media Relations, media@aarp.org, 202-434-2560

AARP Statement on Employee Health Benefit Changes

WASHINGTON—AARP Legislative Policy Director David Certner issued this statement regarding upcoming changes to AARP’s employee health benefits:

<span style='font-size: 17pt'>“Rising health care costs have been the primary cause of premium increases, including increases in the employees’ share of health care costs.</span>“Like many employers, we are making forward-looking, incremental changes to our own plans to address rising costs and to ensure our employees do not face larger changes in the future, but to be clear, none of AARP’s employee health plans are above the excise tax threshold in the new health care reform law.
<span style='font-size: 14pt'>
“We remain supportive of the health care law because it strengthens guaranteed Medicare benefits and ensures more older Americans not yet eligible for Medicare can get affordable health coverage.”</span>
AARP is a nonprofit, nonpartisan social welfare organization with a membership that helps people 50+ have independence, choice and control in ways that are beneficial and affordable to them and society as a whole. AARP does not endorse candidates for public office or make contributions to either political campaigns or candidates. We produce AARP The Magazine, the definitive voice for 50+ Americans and the world's largest-circulation magazine with over 35.1 million readers; AARP Bulletin, the go-to news source for AARP's millions of members and Americans 50+; AARP VIVA, the only bilingual U.S. publication dedicated exclusively to the 50+ Hispanic community; and our website, AARP.org. AARP Foundation is an affiliated charity that provides security, protection, and empowerment to older persons in need with support from thousands of volunteers, donors, and sponsors. We have staffed offices in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, and the U.S. Virgin Islands.



</div></div>

Just spoke with one of AARP's main media representatives.

I was assured, nothing at all about the Health Care Bill, would impact Employee, or employer, costs....and that rising health care costs, not any impact from the HCB, are the sole cause of any of their policies.

Of course, people can make all sorts of predictions, partisan predictions. That happens every day, but few of us has a ctystal ball, except for Sara, lol.

G.

G.

LWW
11-10-2010, 04:44 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just spoke with one of AARP's main media representatives.

I was assured, nothing at all about the Health Care Bill, would impact Employee, or employer, costs....and that rising health care costs, not any impact from the HCB, are the sole cause of any of their policies.

G.

</div></div>

The problem is that those of us who think remember that we were told something else.

See if you can find the discrepancy between the party's "TRUTH" then and the party's "TRUTH" now:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">May 3, 2008
OBAMA: I also have a health care plan that would save the average family $2,500 on their premiums.

January 3, 2008
OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna reduce costs an average of $2,500 per family on premiums.

March 14, 2008
OBAMA: And if you've got health care, we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

February 23, 2008
OBAMA: And we will lower premiums for the typical family by $2,500 a year.

June 17, 2007
OBAMA: And cut the cost of health care by up to $2,500 per family.

Campaign Ad
EVAN BAYH: Barack's policies will provide health care cost reductions of about $2,500 for the typical family.

OBAMA: And if you already have health insurance, we will lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

April 22, 2008
OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer through a catastrophic reinsurance plan to lower premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

March 1, 2008
OBAMA: We'll work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad
NARRATOR: Barack Obama will provide rural America with affordable health care, and save the typical American family $2,500 a year.

May 30, 2008
OBAMA: And reduces every family's premiums by as much as $2,500.</div></div>

TRUTH VERSUS TRUTHINESS! (http://freedomeden.blogspot.com/2010/03/obama-20-promises-for-2500.html)

LWW