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Gayle in MD
12-14-2010, 07:23 AM
http://www.truth-out.org/wilkerson-cheney-bush-aware-guantamamo-detainees-were-innocent58446

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2008/06/15/38773/day-1-americas-prison-for-terrorists.html

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-05-05/how-many-were-tortured-to-death/

Karel Prinsloo / AP Photo For five years as a researcher for Human Rights Watch and reporter, John Sifton helped investigate homicides resulting from the Bush administration's torture policy. His findings include:

• An estimated 100 detainees have died during interrogations, some who were clearly tortured to death.

• The Bush Justice Department failed to investigate and prosecute alleged murders even when the CIA inspector general referred a case.

• Sifton’s request for specific information on cases was rebuffed by the Bush Justice Department, though it was “familiar with the cases.”

• Attorney General Eric Holder must now decide whether to investigate and prosecute homicides, not just cases of torture.
<span style='font-size: 14pt'>
A simple fact is being overlooked in the Bush-era torture scandal: the number of cases in which detainees have been tortured to death. Abuse did not only involve the high-profile cases of smashing detainees into plywood barriers (“walling”), confinement in coffin-like boxes with insects, sleep deprivation, cold, and waterboarding. To date approximately 100 detainees, including CIA-held detainees, have died during U.S. interrogations, and some are known to have been tortured to death</span>.

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2006/09/346251.shtml



<span style='font-size: 14pt'>Another innocent person disappeared and tortured under the Bush administration
author: Glen Greenwald (reposted anonymously)
For the last four years, the United States has been (and still is) a country which kidnaps other countries' innocent citizens (including those of its own allies); brings them to Jordan, Syria and Egypt to be tortured (sometimes for as long as a year); lies to its allies about what it is doing with their citizens; and then, when the innocent citizens are finally released and they go to an American court to try to obtain compensation from the U.S. government for their disappearance and torture, the Bush administration tells the federal judge that the case must be summarily dismissed because national security would be harmed if the administration were held accountable in a court (and the courts then comply).
Here is the "moral authority" of the U.S. under the Bush administration </span><span style='font-size: 14pt'>For the last four years, the United States has been (and still is) a country which kidnaps other countries' innocent citizens (including those of its own allies); brings them to Jordan, Syria and Egypt to be tortured (sometimes for as long as a year); lies to its allies about what it is doing with their citizens; and then, when the innocent citizens are finally released and they go to an American court to try to obtain compensation from the U.S. government for their disappearance and torture, the Bush administration tells the federal judge that the case must be summarily dismissed because national security would be harmed if the administration were held accountable in a court (and the courts then comply). </span><span style='font-size: 14pt'>Do any other counties in the world kidnap civilians who are citizens of other countries and torture them? The case of Maher Arar -- a Canadian citizen abducted by the U.S. and sent to Jordan for a year to be tortured depsite having no terrorist ties of any kind -- is receiving substantial attention today because a Canadian government commission issued a report which "say(s) categorically that there is no evidence to indicate that Mr. Arar has committed any offense or that his activities constituted a threat to the security of Canada." The report also blasts the Bush administration, which abducted Arar during a layover at JFK airport when he was flying home to Canada from a vacation in Tunisia: </span>


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article7092435.ece


George W. Bush 'knew Guantánamo prisoners were innocent'
Tim Reid, Washinton
<span style='font-size: 14pt'>George W. Bush, Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld covered up that hundreds of innocent men were sent to the Guantánamo Bay prison camp because they feared that releasing them would harm the push for war in Iraq and the broader War on Terror, according to a new document obtained by The Times.

The accusations were made by Lawrence Wilkerson, a top aide to Colin Powell, the former Republican Secretary of State, in a signed declaration to support a lawsuit filed by a Guantánamo detainee. It is the first time that such allegations have been made by a senior member of the Bush Administration. </span>Colonel Wilkerson, who was General Powell’s chief of staff when he ran the State Department, was most critical of Mr Cheney and Mr Rumsfeld. He claimed that the former Vice-President and Defence Secretary knew that the majority of the initial 742 detainees sent to Guantánamo in 2002 were innocent but believed that it was “politically impossible to release them”.

General Powell, who left the Bush Administration in 2005, angry about the misinformation that he unwittingly gave the world when he made the case for the invasion of Iraq at the UN, is understood to have backed Colonel Wilkerson’s declaration.

Colonel Wilkerson, a long-time critic of the Bush Administration’s approach to counter-terrorism and the war in Iraq, claimed that the majority of detainees — children as young as 12 and men as old as 93, he said — never saw a US soldier when they were captured. He said that many were turned over by Afghans and Pakistanis for up to $5,000. Little or no evidence was produced as to why they had been taken.

He also claimed that one reason Mr Cheney and Mr Rumsfeld did not want the innocent detainees released was because “the detention efforts would be revealed as the incredibly confused operation that they were”. This was “not acceptable to the Administration and would have been severely detrimental to the leadership at DoD [Mr Rumsfeld at the Defence Department]”.

Referring to Mr Cheney, Colonel Wilkerson, who served 31 years in the US Army, asserted: “He had absolutely no concern that the vast majority of Guantánamo detainees were innocent ... If hundreds of innocent individuals had to suffer in order to detain a handful of hardcore terrorists, so be it.”

He alleged that for Mr Cheney and Mr Rumsfeld “innocent people languishing in Guantánamo for years was justified by the broader War on Terror and the small number of terrorists who were responsible for the September 11 attacks”.

He added: “I discussed the issue of the Guantánamo detainees with Secretary Powell. I learnt that it was his view that it was not just Vice-President Cheney and Secretary Rumsfeld, but also President Bush who was involved in all of the Guantánamo decision making.”

<span style='font-size: 14pt'>Mr Cheney and Mr Rumsfeld, Colonel Wilkerson said, deemed the incarceration of innocent men acceptable if some genuine militants were captured, leading to a better intelligence picture of Iraq at a time when the Bush Administration was desperate to find a link between Saddam Hussein and 9/11, “thus justifying the Administration’s plans for war with that country”.

He signed the declaration in support of Adel Hassan Hamad, a Sudanese man who was held at Guantánamo Bay from March 2003 until December 2007. Mr Hamad claims that he was tortured by US agents while in custody and yesterday filed a damages action against a list of American officials.

Defenders of Guantánamo said that detainees began to be released as early as September 2002, nine months after the first prisoners were sent to the jail at the US naval base in Cuba. By the time Mr Bush left office more than 530 detainees had been freed. </span>A spokesman for Mr Bush said of Colonel Wilkerson’s allegations: “We are not going to have any comment on that.” A former associate to Mr Rumsfeld said that Mr Wilkerson's assertions were completely untrue.

The associate said the former Defence Secretary had worked harder than anyone to get detainees released and worked assiduously to keep the prison population as small as possible. Mr Cheney’s office did not respond.

There are currently about 180 detainees left in the facility.

LWW
12-14-2010, 04:59 PM
Are you also outraged that the claims of torture has went up under Obama?

Are you also outraged that the leading democrooks knew all about the tactics used ... and wanted them to be harsher?

Of course not.

LWW

pooltchr
12-14-2010, 10:02 PM
In her little mind, if Bush did something, it was wrong, but if Obama did the exact same thing, that is wonderful!

She's a joke.

Steve

LWW
12-15-2010, 03:19 AM
I loved Q's response the last time this came up.

After years of believing Al Qaeda's claim that every detainee was tortured ... and don't forget that this required the left redefining the word so that leaving a caterpillar in a thug's cell amounted to "TORTURE" ... his response was "WHY ARE YOU BELIEVING AL QAEDA!" when I demonstrated that the thugs were claiming more torture now than under Bush.

LWW

Qtec
12-15-2010, 05:14 AM
In your little mind you IGNORE her post and point the finger elsewhere. Then you attack the poster that brought you the bad news.

Antway, I'm sure our resident RW guru LWW, the master of debate,<span style="color: #CC0000">[ LOL]</span> [ you are his/her biggest fan ], LWW, shot her down big time.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you also outraged that the claims of torture has went up under Obama?

Are you also outraged that the leading democrooks knew all about the tactics used ... and wanted them to be harsher?

Of course not.

LWW</div></div>

Oh dear, same MO, what a let down.

Q

LWW
12-15-2010, 05:40 AM
I merely asked for balance ... I thought that was what the left always wanted?

Myself, I don't believe that actual torture has occurred under either the Bush or Obama regime.

That's called consistency.

LWW

eg8r
12-15-2010, 08:40 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In your little mind you IGNORE her post and point the finger elsewhere. Then you attack the poster that brought you the bad news.

</div></div>This is exactly what you do to. I was posting about gayle keeping on subject (after she told us to do so) and what you did you post? You posted asking me when I ever stay on point. Hypocrite!

eg8r

Gayle in MD
12-15-2010, 09:17 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In your little mind you IGNORE her post and point the finger elsewhere. Then you attack the poster that brought you the bad news.

Antway, I'm sure our resident RW guru LWW, the master of debate,<span style="color: #CC0000">[ LOL]</span> [ you are his/her biggest fan ], LWW, shot her down big time.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you also outraged that the claims of torture has went up under Obama?

Are you also outraged that the leading democrooks knew all about the tactics used ... and wanted them to be harsher?

Of course not.

LWW</div></div>

Oh dear, same MO, what a let down.

Q </div></div>

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

LWW
12-15-2010, 05:55 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In your little mind you IGNORE her post and point the finger elsewhere.

Q </div></div>

Actually I noticed her Freudian slip by calling it "SAMEFUL" ... quite revealing.

LWW

sack316
12-15-2010, 05:59 PM
lol, I actually had the same thought. 'sameful' things happened under Reagan, 'sameful' things happened under Clinton, and 'sameful' things are continuing under Obama... with some testaments actually claiming it has increased since early '09.

Sack

LWW
12-15-2010, 06:03 PM
If you keep leftists talking they always expose themselves ... this group is especially easy.

LWW

Qtec
12-15-2010, 06:42 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This is exactly what you do to. I was posting about gayle keeping on subject (after she told us to do so) and what you did you post? <span style='font-size: 14pt'>You posted asking me when I ever stay on point. </span>Hypocrite!

eg8r </div></div>


And what exactly does your post have to do with,

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Sameful Legacy Of Bush/Cheney/Torture </div></div>

<span style='font-size: 26pt'>Nothing.</span>

<span style='font-size: 17pt'> Not one of you have addressed the topic.</span>

Case closed.

Q

Qtec
12-15-2010, 06:46 PM
A spelling mistake is not a Freudian Slip.


Q

eg8r
12-15-2010, 08:09 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And what exactly does your post have to do with,

</div></div>You are right, I never pass up an opportunity to prove you are a hypocrite even if it is at the expense of the subject. Glad you recognize yourself. Your response to lww had nothing to do with the subject so I was just following your lead. Hypocrite!

eg8r

LWW
12-16-2010, 02:57 AM
Your refusal to face what has happened in this thread in not anyone's problem but your own.

LWW

Gayle in MD
12-16-2010, 08:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In your little mind you IGNORE her post and point the finger elsewhere. Then you attack the poster that brought you the bad news.

Antway, I'm sure our resident RW guru LWW, the master of debate,<span style="color: #CC0000">[ LOL]</span> [ you are his/her biggest fan ], LWW, shot her down big time.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you also outraged that the claims of torture has went up under Obama?

Are you also outraged that the leading democrooks knew all about the tactics used ... and wanted them to be harsher?

Of course not.

LWW</div></div>

Oh dear, same MO, what a let down.

Q </div></div>

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif </div></div>

What is so interesting is that both of his claims have been proven false.

That's why I don't read his BS!

It's NEVER accurate, then he claims success! LMAO!

A true legend in his own mind. And, If you don't believe it, just ask his flyover buddy, who turns every single post inbnto another..


<span style="color: #000099"> <span style='font-size: 17pt'> GAYLE ATTACK!</span> </span> /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Flaming conservatards....

eg8r
12-16-2010, 10:12 AM
You just love to attack and call people names.

eg8r

pooltchr
12-16-2010, 12:42 PM
That's all she has going these days. She can't defend the left on the issues.

Steve