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LWW
03-15-2011, 05:39 AM
A recent article about Joe DiMaggio's streak made some references to George Sisler, who held the AL record before Joe.

As an MLB history buff I had always considered Sisler to be among the most underrated members of the MLB Hall of Fame ... largely because he played for what is undoubtedly the worst team in MLB history over an extended period of time.

Anyway, they referenced that at the time of Joe's streak nearly all of the people who had watched the game avidly for the then last 25 years considered Sisler's 1920 season as better than any that either Ruth or Cobb had ever put together.

That lead me to review the 1920 season closer and, even though I don't agree with that assessment exactly ... I also didn't see Sisler play either ... I can see where their argument comes from.

George Sisler's 1920 season;

Batting average - .407 (1st in the league.)

Hits - 257 (1st in the league.)

Home runs - 19 (2nd in the league. Still in the end of the dead ball, start of the modern era.)

Doubles - 49 (2nd in the league.)

Triples - 18 (4th in the league.)

Total bases - 399 (1st in the league. Beat Ruth who hit 59 homers)

RBI - 122 (2nd in the league.)

Runs scored - 137 (2nd in the league.)

Stolen bases - 42 (3rd in the league.)

Fielding pct - .990 (When a glove was little more than an oven mitt.)

On base pct - .449 (2nd in the league.)

In addition he played all 154 games, only struck out an amazing 19 times, pitched one game with 1 scoreless inning with two strikeouts and earned the save, and did it all with no protection in the lineup like Ruth and Cobb always had.

His 1922 season was nearly as good IMHO, and better in a few categories.

OH DEAR! (http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?player_id=122280#sectionType=career&statType=1&season=&gameType='R')

Any other thoughts on what may have been the greatest overall season by a non pitcher?

LWW
03-15-2011, 10:31 AM
As far as best pitching season for the live ball era goes, Bob "HOOT" Gibson's 1968 season gets the nod from me.

Wins - 22 (Including missing a month of the season with a broken shin.)

Losses - 9 (Including a record 5 losses by the score of 1-0.)

ERA - 1.12 (Modern era record low.)

Innings - 304 2/3 (In only 34 starts for an astounding 8.96 IP per start. Knocked out of the game a record zero times.)

268 strikeouts with only 62 walks. Allowed only 5.85 base hits per 9 innings pitched. Opponents batted a measly .184 against him in 1968. 28 complete games, 13 by shutout.

LWW
03-15-2011, 10:35 AM
For pitching in the dead ball era, Jack Chesbro's 1907 season is tough to beat.

Wins - 41.

Complete games - 48 out of 51 starts.

Innings - 454 2/3. I doubt if any team had a two 2 starters who did that in 2010.

Soflasnapper
03-18-2011, 01:44 AM
A major injustice:

A big league pitcher averages over 20 wins a season for more than 20 years, yet never wins the Cy Young Award.

LWW
03-18-2011, 03:57 AM
Well, you can only be discussing either Walter Perry Johnson or Denton True Young ... both of which played before the Cy Young Award was instituted.

Soflasnapper
03-20-2011, 02:36 AM
I was referring to Cy Young. (drum flourish)

LWW
03-20-2011, 03:32 AM
That would be Denton True Young.

DickLeonard
03-20-2011, 02:05 PM
LWW the Greatest pitching Performance I ever saw was Ed Kagnowski in a Fast Pitch softball. He Struck out 102 hitters 108 faced.

Cisero Murphy and Sevs Buddy Billy Costello also pitched fast pitch..

A much harder game than Baseball. In my mind. Dick























































































.

LWW
03-21-2011, 02:26 AM
Ever see Eddie Feigner pitch?

DickLeonard
04-10-2011, 10:10 PM
LWW saw Eddie three times but Kagnowski was better in my oppion. A much bigger person he might have been 6ft4 inches and every pitch was between ninety and 110 miles per hour.Dick

wolfdancer
04-11-2011, 12:39 AM
Dick, I used to be able to cite the differences in reaction time that a fast softball, batter has Vs a ML batter. The King and His Court used to come to my hometown every year. We had a pretty good local pitcher "Peanuts" Lowry. He took away their bats, and Eddie had to play it straight for a few innings. Eventually though Eddie got to put on a show as nobody came out to see the locals win. Eddie used to call out someone, from the stands to take a turn at bat, and announce each pitch in advance, He would also pitch from second base to one batter in the later innings.
There used to be a softball league sponsored by industry. I remember Norm Cash, after he retired from ML ball played on the Championship team, and was noted for his long HRs I think for years Firestone had the best team?.....but my memory ain't too good these days

LWW
04-11-2011, 04:14 AM
Feigner is the best that ever lived.

DickLeonard
04-12-2011, 10:37 PM
LWW this requires a little Investigating. Eastman Kodak had Shifty Gears a Pitcher who pitched lefty and righty. We had a Shortstop who hit the King like he owned him. He was so good the KIng wanted him sa a replacement for any player that was hurt.####

LWW
04-13-2011, 02:18 AM
In 10,000 games as part of a 4 man team ... against 10 man teams ... the King's record was:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">9,743 victories, 141,517 strikeouts, 930 no-hitters and 238 perfect games. </div></div>

I REST MY CASE. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_Feigner)

wolfdancer
04-13-2011, 03:28 AM
Dick, I thought the greatest season ever (for me, a Bosox fan) was the one where the Red Sox, Yankees, and ....Chicago? were involved in a 3 way race that went down to the wire. The entire last month of the race was fan-tastic.
Maybe the season that was decided in a play-off....with Bobby Thompson's "shot heard round the world", winning it for the Giants, who had been way behind the Dodgers in august.

LWW
04-13-2011, 04:21 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wolfdancer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Dick, I thought the greatest season ever (for me, a Bosox fan) was the one where the Red Sox, Yankees, and ....Chicago?</div></div>

What year was that?

If you meant 1967 ... the closest historical fit within your lifetime ... it was the Bosox narrowly beating Minnesota and Detroit on the last day of the season. The Twins and Tigers finished in a second place tie one game back ... while the Chisox finished fourth a whole three games back of Boston.

The Noo Yawk Yankees finished ninth and twenty games in arrears.

wolfdancer
04-13-2011, 11:45 AM
I was winging it....and didn't bother to check before posting.
That was the pennant race that I was trying to remember.
I may be wrong again...but wasn't that the year Yaz won the triple crown?, and did MClain win 30?. 1977 was a Bosox pennant also?
These would all be easy to check, but I like to see if the synapses are still firing, and in the correct sequence

LWW
04-13-2011, 12:23 PM
Yaz won the triple crown, Denny won 31 in 1968 ... some Italian gentlemen quite literally stepped on his foot and ankle to show their displeasure over his slow payment history in 1967, and Yaz had what may have been the best overall last month stretch run.

I was in the 5th grade and we had a teacher from Bawwwws-tun who got a TV set and allowed us to watch the 1967 series during class on the premise that it was a geography lesson. You see, Boston is here on the coast and Saint Louis is here in the middle of the country ... adn, well nobody cared since we got to watch the series.

Good times ... good times.