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Qtec
03-17-2011, 03:47 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The sad but true story of wages in America
Lawrence Mishel Heidi Shierholz
March 15, 2011

Read Issue Brief

Recent debates about whether public- or private-sector workers earn more have obscured a larger truth: <span style='font-size: 14pt'>all workers have suffered from decades of stagnating wages despite large gains in productivity.</span> The current public discussion illogically pits state and local government employees against private workers, <u>when both groups have failed to sufficiently benefit from the economic fruits of their labors.</u> This paper examines trends in the compensation of public (state and local government) and private-sector employees relative to the growth of productivity over the past two decades.</div></div>

link (http://www.epi.org/publications/entry/the_sad_but_true_story_of_wages_in_america)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These data underscore that there is a bigger story than public versus private compensation and a more penetrating set of questions to ask than who has more than whom. The ability of the economy to produce more goods and services has not translated into greater compensation for either group of workers. <span style='font-size: 17pt'>Why has pay fared so poorly overall?<span style="color: #3333FF"> <u>Why did the richest 1% of Americans receive 56% of all the income growth between 1989 and 2007,</u> before the recession began <span style="color: #990000">(compared with 16% going to the bottom 90% of households)</span></span>? <span style="color: #3333FF"><u>Why are corporate profits 22% above their pre-recession level</u> while total corporate sector employees’ compensation (reflecting lower employment and meager pay increases) is <u>3% below pre-recession levels</u>?</span> </span>The answers lie in an economy that is designed to work for the well off and not to produce good jobs and improved living standards.1

Essentially, economic policy has not supported good jobs over the last 30 years or so. Rather, the focus has been on policies that were thought to make consumers better off through lower prices: deregulation of industries, privatization of public services, the weakening of labor standards including the minimum wage, erosion of the social safety net, expanding globalization, and the move toward fewer and weaker unions. These policies have served to erode the bargaining power of most workers, widen wage inequality, and deplete access to good jobs. In the last 10 years even workers with a college degree have failed to see any real wage growth. </div></div>


Q

pooltchr
03-17-2011, 06:30 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<u>when both groups have failed to sufficiently benefit from the economic fruits of their labors.</u>

Q </div></div>

And this statement is at the heart of the false assumptions reached in your post.
Government employees are rarely tasked with increasing productivity, and there are no "economic fruits of their labor", since they don't produce anything for the economy anyway. If they do reduce expenses, it is absorbed into other expenses within the particular agency.

I've seen firsthand government agencies work very hard in the 4th quarter of their fiscal year to make sure they SPEND EVERY DOLLAR of their budget so they can argue against any budget cuts in the next year. They will spend everything they have, so there is no expectation of actually trying to generate and productivity increases, or cost cutting. It only happens when they are forced into it by budget cuts, and we all know that our government does not usually actually cut budgets. (They may reduce the amount of budget increases requested, and call it a cut, but when you reduce a 10% increase to a 7% increase, that is not a 3% cut, it's a 7% increase!)

Steve

Qtec
03-17-2011, 07:11 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And this statement is at the heart of the <u>false assumptions </u>reached in your post.
Government employees are rarely tasked with increasing productivity, </div></div>

Really! Any proof of that?

And secondly, its says BOTH GROUPS!!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and there are no "economic fruits of their labor", since they don't produce anything for the economy anyway. </div></div>

Really! A better educated work force isn't good for the country and doesn't generate money?

What does Wall St actually produce?


As usual, you are off topic. Both private and public sector workers have been shafted. Your problem is reading comprehension. I guess you didn't understand this.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><u> all workers </u>have suffered from decades of stagnating wages <u>despite large gains in productivity.</u></div></div>

Or this.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why did the richest 1% of Americans receive 56% of all the income growth between 1989 and 2007, </div></div>

This is the crux of the post.

<span style='font-size: 14pt'>Money has been made.</span> The problem is most of the gains went to a small amount of people.

[ rich ] Americans are doing 'swimmingly', to quote A Coulter . the only problem is, <span style='font-size: 17pt'>the majority , the bottom 95% are now paying the price for it.</span>

Q

Gayle in MD
03-17-2011, 08:22 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And this statement is at the heart of the <u>false assumptions </u>reached in your post.
Government employees are rarely tasked with increasing productivity, </div></div>

Really! Any proof of that?

And secondly, its says BOTH GROUPS!!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and there are no "economic fruits of their labor", since they don't produce anything for the economy anyway. </div></div>

Really! A better educated work force isn't good for the country and doesn't generate money?

What does Wall St actually produce?


As usual, you are off topic. Both private and public sector workers have been shafted. Your problem is reading comprehension. I guess you didn't understand this.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><u> all workers </u>have suffered from decades of stagnating wages <u>despite large gains in productivity.</u></div></div>

Or this.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why did the richest 1% of Americans receive 56% of all the income growth between 1989 and 2007, </div></div>

This is the crux of the post.

<span style='font-size: 14pt'>Money has been made.</span> The problem is most of the gains went to a small amount of people.

[ rich ] Americans are doing 'swimmingly', to quote A Coulter . the only problem is, <span style='font-size: 17pt'>the majority , the bottom 95% are now paying the price for it.</span>

Q </div></div>


And have been paying for it, under failed Republican Policies, and a slanted tax and spend, redistribution of the pie, for decades....

We subsidize greedy, unpatriotic thieves, who outsource our jobs, and use the Republican Loopholes, and redistribution of wealth to the top, to avoid paying taxes.

If they aren't thieves, who are they hiding thheir money in the Cayman Islands? Trillions upon trillions!

The Republican national Ponzi Scheme, now worse tham ever, due to the Fascist RW Activist Supreme court.

Christians, LMAO!

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

pooltchr
03-17-2011, 10:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[

We subsidize greedy, unpatriotic thieves, who outsource our jobs, </div></div>

Right. However, I suspect if we lowered their tax rates to be in line with, oh, say, India's corporate tax rates, they might find it actually less expensive to stay here....providing more jobs...and more tax revenue to the government!

Even it the tax rates were lowered to 10%...that 10% is better than the ZERO rate they collect when a company moves out of the country.

Steve

Sev
03-17-2011, 06:38 PM
There is always going into business for ones self.

LWW
03-18-2011, 03:35 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[

We subsidize greedy, unpatriotic thieves, who outsource our jobs, </div></div>

Right. However, I suspect if we lowered their tax rates to be in line with, oh, say, India's corporate tax rates, they might find it actually less expensive to stay here....providing more jobs...and more tax revenue to the government!

Even it the tax rates were lowered to 10%...that 10% is better than the ZERO rate they collect when a company moves out of the country.

Steve </div></div>

You know the truth makes their collectivist heads hurt.

Qtec
03-18-2011, 06:48 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[

We subsidize greedy, unpatriotic thieves, who outsource our jobs, </div></div>

Right. However, I suspect if we lowered their tax rates to be in line with, oh, say, India's corporate tax rates, they might find it actually less expensive to stay here....providing more jobs...and more tax revenue to the government!

Even it the tax rates were lowered to 10%...that 10% is better than the ZERO rate they collect when a company moves out of the country.

Steve </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...all workers have suffered from decades of stagnating wages despite large gains in productivity.

Why did the richest 1% of Americans receive 56% of all the income growth between 1989 and 2007,

Why are corporate profits 22% above their pre-recession level..

...while total corporate sector employees’ compensation (reflecting lower employment and meager pay increases) <span style='font-size: 17pt'>is 3% below pre-recession levels? </span>

In the last 10 years even workers with a college degree have failed to see any real wage growth. </div></div>

All you can talk about is how the big corporations have it so tough,,,,,,,,,,,even after they all announced record profits <u>this year</u>!

If Corp Tax is so high, how come Exxon, BoA, etc pay no Corp tax at all?

This is smoke and mirrors.

The real problem is that all the wealth has been redistributed from the WC to the super rich. The MC spending has always been the powerhouse behind the US economy. Instead of giving them more money to spend, the GOP wants them to have less. ie the want to bring the country to the brink of another disaster.

Like G says, its <u>The Shock Doctrine</u> all over again. Actually, its more accurate to say that its a perpetual strategy of the RW.



Q

Gayle in MD
03-18-2011, 07:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[

We subsidize greedy, unpatriotic thieves, who outsource our jobs, </div></div>

Right. However, I suspect if we lowered their tax rates to be in line with, oh, say, India's corporate tax rates, they might find it actually less expensive to stay here....providing more jobs...and more tax revenue to the government!

Even it the tax rates were lowered to 10%...that 10% is better than the ZERO rate they collect when a company moves out of the country.

Steve </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...all workers have suffered from decades of stagnating wages despite large gains in productivity.

Why did the richest 1% of Americans receive 56% of all the income growth between 1989 and 2007,

Why are corporate profits 22% above their pre-recession level..

...while total corporate sector employees’ compensation (reflecting lower employment and meager pay increases) <span style='font-size: 17pt'>is 3% below pre-recession levels? </span>

In the last 10 years even workers with a college degree have failed to see any real wage growth. </div></div>

All you can talk about is how the big corporations have it so tough,,,,,,,,,,,even after they all announced record profits <u>this year</u>!

If Corp Tax is so high, how come Exxon, BoA, etc pay no Corp tax at all?

This is smoke and mirrors.

The real problem is that all the wealth has been redistributed from the WC to the super rich. The MC spending has always been the powerhouse behind the US economy. Instead of giving them more money to spend, the GOP wants them to have less. ie the want to bring the country to the brink of another disaster.

Like G says, its <u>The Shock Doctrine</u> all over again. Actually, its more accurate to say that its a perpetual strategy of the RW.



Q </div></div>

Exactly, and now, the RW is the entire Republican Party. They don't even have any moderates anymore, no statesmen, just the radical, anti-constitutional, antiAmerican, fascists.

Every single thing they are doing, is clearly an effort to weaken the Middle Class, dilute their sources for Campaigning purposes, remove their organizations, scams against Acorn, scams against NPR, cutting funding for PBS, outlawing the rights of our Unions, clearly, they seek to put the country back into the deep BUSH hole, from which we have just recently began to see some daylight.


And all just as we were warned, wrapped in the flag, waving a cross.

The ignorance of their Bubbas, and ownership of the media, are their main weapons, other than using GOD, as their cover for their filth.

Poverty for the masses, is their goal.
G.

Qtec
03-18-2011, 08:00 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Poverty for the masses, is their goal.
G. </div></div>

Yes but this is making the MS GOPer nervous.

Q

Gayle in MD
03-18-2011, 08:05 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Poverty for the masses, is their goal.
G. </div></div>

Yes but this is making the MS GOPer nervous.

Q </div></div>

Thank goodness for that!

Guess they didn't factor in, we're not Chile! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

Qtec
03-18-2011, 09:58 AM
For how long can you fool <u>most of the people</u>?

Q

pooltchr
03-18-2011, 10:39 AM
Watching the back and forth between Q and G is like watching two drunks at a bar solving all the world's problems. It rarely has any substance to it, but it can be quite entertaining, all the same.

Steve

Gayle in MD
03-18-2011, 11:04 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For how long can you fool <u>most of the people</u>?

Q </div></div>

Much longer than I would have ever believed! Some, still remain, willfully, in the dark. Easier on their egos, I suppose.

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

They advocate for the very crooks who took them to the cleaners, making space for more of the same.

Go figure!

ugotda7
03-18-2011, 11:31 AM
Liberalism is the philosophy of the terminally stupid.

PO...............?

LWW
03-19-2011, 05:46 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pooltchr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Watching the back and forth between Q and G is like watching two drunks at a bar solving all the world's problems. It rarely has any substance to it, but it can be quite entertaining, all the same.

Steve </div></div>

I see it more like watching midget wrasslin.
http://www.houseofdeception.com/images/Midget%20Wrestler%20Fuzzy%20Cupid.jpghttp://cultblender.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/midget-wrestler-darling-dagmar.jpg
<span style='font-size: 23pt'>MIXED TAG TEAM CHAMPEENS OFTHE WORRRRLD!</span>